Maybe I should have said "busy-ness" and not business, but just wondering 
if anyone knew of any websites that detailed how busy trains are coming in 
to central London from suburbs?

I am thinking of moving further outward but wondering, aside from actually 
waiting at various train platforms in the rush-hour, as to how full trains 
are on their approach to London?

For people looking for a longer commuter from more rural areas, I would 
have thought "getting a seat on the train" is paramount, and I would have 
thought there'd be some sort of resource to help with this somewhere on the 
web?

Thanks in advance for any information !
Richard

On Jul 6, 3:48 pm, Richard Dixon  wrote:
> Maybe I should have said "busy-ness" and not business, but just wondering
> if anyone knew of any websites that detailed how busy trains are coming in
> to central London from suburbs?
>
> I am thinking of moving further outward but wondering, aside from actually
> waiting at various train platforms in the rush-hour, as to how full trains
> are on their approach to London?

This group (and uk.railway) is probably as good a resource as any - if
you indicate which direction away from London you're thinking of,
there's bound to be someone on here who's done it/currently does it...

[uk.r added]

Richard Dixon  wrote in
news:Xns9AD3A0DC876A7rdngemailyahoocouk@69.16.176.253: 

> Maybe I should have said "busy-ness" and not business, but just
> wondering if anyone knew of any websites that detailed how busy trains
> are coming in to central London from suburbs?
> 
> I am thinking of moving further outward but wondering, aside from
> actually waiting at various train platforms in the rush-hour, as to
> how full trains are on their approach to London?
> 
> For people looking for a longer commuter from more rural areas, I
> would have thought "getting a seat on the train" is paramount, and I
> would have thought there'd be some sort of resource to help with this
> somewhere on the web?
> 
> Thanks in advance for any information !
> Richard

It certainly used to be the case that longer distance commuters had more 
chance of getting a seat, but things are now changing.  There is enourmous 
variation by route and your precise journey (it's much easier to get a seat 
at Waterloo or Liverpool Street than Clapham Junction or Stratford for 
example).

Neither is distance a guarantee of a seat - I understand that people are 
regularly standing between Waterloo and Winchester...

Which part of London do you have to get to (if you are planning a long 
distance commuter that last thing you want is a long journey from your 
London terminal)?

David

David Jackman <pleasereplytogroup> wrote in
news:Xns9AD3B3887AD03309E3129replytogroup@216.196.109.145: 

> Neither is distance a guarantee of a seat - I understand that people
> are regularly standing between Waterloo and Winchester...
> 
> Which part of London do you have to get to (if you are planning a long
> distance commuter that last thing you want is a long journey from your
> London terminal)?

Thanks for the reply

Seeing as I work "in the city" then I was looking at commuting to Liverpool 
Street or Fenchurch Street - purely overland with no second "stage" to my 
commute post London terminal.

Broxbourne appealed as it is very close to some nice rural villages and yet 
has an excellent train service (29 mins to Liv Street) but absolutely no 
way of telling how full trains will be (coming from Stanstead Airport, 
Cambridge or Kings Lynn).

Cheers
Richard

In message , at 
18:16:32 on Sun, 6 Jul 2008, Richard Dixon  
remarked:
>Broxbourne appealed as it is very close to some nice rural villages and yet
>has an excellent train service (29 mins to Liv Street) but absolutely no
>way of telling how full trains will be (coming from Stanstead Airport,
>Cambridge or Kings Lynn).

That line has the second most overcrowded train in the country (7.18 
Cambridge to Liverpool St). 85% overcapacity. [2007 figures].
-- 
Roland Perry

Richard Dixon  wrote in
news:Xns9AD3C415DB4DArdngemailyahoocouk@69.16.176.253: 

> David Jackman <pleasereplytogroup> wrote in
> news:Xns9AD3B3887AD03309E3129replytogroup@216.196.109.145: 
> 
>> Neither is distance a guarantee of a seat - I understand that people
>> are regularly standing between Waterloo and Winchester...
>> 
>> Which part of London do you have to get to (if you are planning a
>> long distance commuter that last thing you want is a long journey
>> from your London terminal)?
> 
> Thanks for the reply
> 
> Seeing as I work "in the city" then I was looking at commuting to
> Liverpool Street or Fenchurch Street - purely overland with no second
> "stage" to my commute post London terminal.
> 
> Broxbourne appealed as it is very close to some nice rural villages
> and yet has an excellent train service (29 mins to Liv Street) but
> absolutely no way of telling how full trains will be (coming from
> Stanstead Airport, Cambridge or Kings Lynn).
> 
> Cheers
> Richard
> 

Without any real knowledge whatsoever it's a fair bet to say that the 
Cambridge and Kings Lynn starters will be heaving (at the height of the 
peak the question is probably more "can I get on" rather than "can I get a 
seat") - though many will alight at Tottenham Hale for the Victoria line.  
The Hertford starters ought to offer something towards the back.  (The best 
advice here is of course to wait until September when everybody is back at 
work, get up early, fork out £9.70 and find out for yourself!)

On the GE mainline I'm told Chelmsford is becoming an absolute nightmare - 
so you would need to go further out than that (unless you fancy Brentwood 
where the service is dire but you do, at least, get a seat).

Out towards Southend (on either line) would be another possibility but 
isn't really "rural village" territory.

David

On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 20:00:23 +0100, Roland Perry 
wrote:


>That line has the second most overcrowded train in the country (7.18 
>Cambridge to Liverpool St). 85% overcapacity. [2007 figures].

I can't remember what, but there was something wrong with that
'statistic'. Train was only four cars that dfay, or something.

Trains from Cambridge are just about full by Broxbourne during the
meorning peak. Of course, getting a seat on the way home requires
turning up a few minutes before departure.

But I would imagine that trains from Hertford East have space, and
there are some peak hour services that start at Broxbourne.

In general trains from Stansted Airport (there's no second bloody A in
Stansted!) do not stop at Broxbourne other than the Stratford service.

Ken at Birchanger  wrote in 
news:sa7274thk0a7iuv752li7qm4ee0h11pitd@4ax.com:

> But I would imagine that trains from Hertford East have space, and
> there are some peak hour services that start at Broxbourne.

I presume you mean "have space" as in "have seats"? Standing space is all 
very well, but not for 35 minutes every day - maybe I've led a charmed 
commuter life so far.

Regarding the peak hour services, checking the Hertford East to Broxbourne 
timetable, there are trains that "appear" to start at Broxbourne:

http://www.nationalexpresseastanglia.com/content/download/8985/84230/file/T
able+4+Hertford+East+to+Liverpool+Street.pdf

For example at 0804, 0818 and 0835 - but checking other timetables, these 
appear to start at Kings Lynn, Cambridge and Cambridge again, respectively, 
so I can't seem to find these mystery ones that start at Broxbourne (that 
would be like gold dust for a commute!!)
 
> In general trains from Stansted Airport do not stop at Broxbourne other 
> than the Stratford service.

Good point, I'd not noticed this, thanks.

Richard

David Jackman <pleasereplytogroup> wrote in
news:Xns9AD3CE56CF25C309E3129replytogroup@216.196.109.145: 

> (The best advice here is of course to wait until September
> when everybody is back at work, get up early, fork out £9.70 and find
> out for yourself!) 

Thanks for all the feedback. I plan to do just this in the next week or 
two. If trains do indeed start at Broxbourne (not that I can find any on 
the timetables) then that would be a boon !

Richard

Richard Dixon  wrote in
news:Xns9AD3D68971C37rdngemailyahoocouk@69.16.176.253: 

> Ken at Birchanger  wrote in 
> news:sa7274thk0a7iuv752li7qm4ee0h11pitd@4ax.com:
> 
>> But I would imagine that trains from Hertford East have space, and
>> there are some peak hour services that start at Broxbourne.
> 
> I presume you mean "have space" as in "have seats"? Standing space is
> all very well, but not for 35 minutes every day - maybe I've led a
> charmed commuter life so far.
> 
> Regarding the peak hour services, checking the Hertford East to
> Broxbourne timetable, there are trains that "appear" to start at
> Broxbourne: 
> 
> http://www.nationalexpresseastanglia.com/content/download/8985/84230/fi
> le/T able+4+Hertford+East+to+Liverpool+Street.pdf
> 
> For example at 0804, 0818 and 0835 - but checking other timetables,
> these appear to start at Kings Lynn, Cambridge and Cambridge again,
> respectively, so I can't seem to find these mystery ones that start at
> Broxbourne (that would be like gold dust for a commute!!)
>  
>> In general trains from Stansted Airport do not stop at Broxbourne
>> other than the Stratford service.
> 
> Good point, I'd not noticed this, thanks.
> 
> Richard

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%
20documents/eNRT/May08/timetables/Table22.pdf 

gives the full picture (the url will wrap and need sticking back together 
again).

The only Broxbourne starters in the current timetable go to Stratford.

Incidentally the Stansted express has a long tradition of making extra 
stops in the peaks - though I hadn't realized just how many extra stops the 
07.00 and 07.30 from Stansted had gained!

David

David Jackman <pleasereplytogroup> wrote in
news:Xns9AD3E3407F1BA309E3129replytogroup@216.196.109.145: 

> The only Broxbourne starters in the current timetable go to Stratford.
> 
> Incidentally the Stansted express has a long tradition of making extra
> stops in the peaks - though I hadn't realized just how many extra
> stops the 07.00 and 07.30 from Stansted had gained!

Thank you Dave, looks like it's packed trains if I want a fast option in to 
Liverpool Street, although maybe the 07.52 from Stansted (only stop Bishops 
Stortford before Broxbourne) might be a less busy option - although I'm 
sure many in Bishops Stortford will have cottoned on to this !

Regards
Richard

On 6 Jul, 21:07, Richard Dixon  wrote:
> David Jackman <pleasereplytogroup> wrote innews:Xns9AD3CE56CF25C309E3129replytogroup@216.196.109.145:
>
> > (The best advice here is of course to wait until September
> > when everybody is back at work, get up early, fork out £9.70 and find
> > out for yourself!)
>
> Thanks for all the feedback. I plan to do just this in the next week or
> two. If trains do indeed start at Broxbourne (not that I can find any on
> the timetables) then that would be a boon !
>

I have been catching peak trains between Cambridge and Liverpool
Street about two or three times a week for the past seven years. They
all stop at Broxbourne. Since I always get a seat at Cambridge I tend
not to pay too much attention to how crowded they get in the morning,
but my general impression is that although it is almost certain you
would need to stand from Broxbourne, the trains are not "heaving" and
only have a few people standing per carriage. A lot of people get off
at Tottenham Hale, so you may be able to get a seat from there to
Liverpool Street (which is about half the journey time).

In the evening, you have a good chance of getting a seat on a train to
Cambridge (e.g. the 1758). They normally only become crowded at
Tottenham Hale.

The West Anglia timetable was completely reorganised a couple of years
ago. The biggest change was to add extra stops to the Stansted Express
(many more of them now call at Harlow Town), which seems to have had a
big impact on reducing overcrowding on trains to and from Cambridge.
Another big change was to make every Cambridge train stop at
Broxbourne.

However if you're seriously planning moving to Broxbourne, the best
thing is to spend a few days there and try out the commute for
yourself.

PaulO

In message , David 
Jackman <pleasereplytogroup@?.?.invalid> writes
>On the GE mainline I'm told Chelmsford is becoming an absolute nightmare -
>so you would need to go further out than that (unless you fancy Brentwood
>where the service is dire but you do, at least, get a seat).

Brentwood: A train every 10 minutes off peak (until past 9pm in both 
directions), depending on the direction), and a more frequent service 
during the peak, "dire"?  Also, given that it is the first station to 
just have an all stopping train in the London-bound direction, I 
strongly suspect (though do not know) that the chances of getting a seat 
are quite or very good.  40 minutes into London with around 10 stops.

-- 
Paul G
Typing from Barking

Paul Oter  wrote in
news:13c24346-c14c-4f58-bd12-6bdcd443b964@59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com: 

> I have been catching peak trains between Cambridge and Liverpool
> Street about two or three times a week for the past seven years. They
> all stop at Broxbourne. Since I always get a seat at Cambridge I tend
> not to pay too much attention to how crowded they get in the morning,
> but my general impression is that although it is almost certain you
> would need to stand from Broxbourne, the trains are not "heaving" and
> only have a few people standing per carriage. A lot of people get off
> at Tottenham Hale, so you may be able to get a seat from there to
> Liverpool Street (which is about half the journey time).

Paul - thanks for the feedback - good to hear from someone who actually 
uses that line. I hadn't realised that half the journey was the section 
post-Tottenham Hale, so that would make things more bearable (I currently 
have generally a 20-minute stand with my current commute).

What time are you typically getting on at Cambridge?

Many thanks,
Richard

Paul G  wrote in
news:oVD4u4B5zbcIFwuX@speedsix.demon.co.uk: 

> In message ,
> David Jackman <pleasereplytogroup@?.?.invalid> writes
>>On the GE mainline I'm told Chelmsford is becoming an absolute
>>nightmare - so you would need to go further out than that (unless you
>>fancy Brentwood where the service is dire but you do, at least, get a
>>seat). 
> 
> Brentwood: A train every 10 minutes off peak (until past 9pm in both 
> directions), depending on the direction), and a more frequent service 
> during the peak, "dire"?  Also, given that it is the first station to 
> just have an all stopping train in the London-bound direction, I 
> strongly suspect (though do not know) that the chances of getting a
> seat are quite or very good.  40 minutes into London with around 10
> stops. 
> 

The problem with Brentwood is that it is in the wrong place :-)

Despite being on a fast main line to London every train is pretty much 
all stations so it will always take 35-40 minutes and it's one stop 
beyond boundary zone six, which makes an annual travelcard £2,500 
instead of £1,784.  The service isn't terribly reliable - in the event 
of disruption trains are turned round before they reach Brentwood - and 
the 315s are known for often having no heating in Winter and for a few 
years had windows that barely opened so it got very hot in summer.  
(This was to stop the yobs throwing the seat cushions out of the 
windows; the recent "refurbishment" saw a redesign to allow more 
ventilation).

Crossrail - if it ever happens - will improve matters but the all 
stations nature will always make it a slow and tendious journey.

It just isn't a railhead I would ever suggest for long distance 
commuting.

David

In message , at 
14:32:05 on Mon, 7 Jul 2008, David Jackman 
<pleasereplytogroup@?.?.invalid> remarked:

>>>On the GE mainline I'm told Chelmsford is becoming an absolute
>>>nightmare - so you would need to go further out than that (unless you
>>>fancy Brentwood where the service is dire but you do, at least, get a
>>>seat).
>>
>> Brentwood: A train every 10 minutes off peak (until past 9pm in both
>> directions), depending on the direction), and a more frequent service
>> during the peak, "dire"?  Also, given that it is the first station to
>> just have an all stopping train in the London-bound direction, I
>> strongly suspect (though do not know) that the chances of getting a
>> seat are quite or very good.  40 minutes into London with around 10
>> stops.
>>
>The problem with Brentwood is that it is in the wrong place :-)
>
>Despite being on a fast main line to London every train is pretty much
>all stations so it will always take 35-40 minutes and it's one stop
>beyond boundary zone six, which makes an annual travelcard £2,500
>instead of £1,784.

And a Brentwood-Harold Wood season is more than £716? Makes the 
Travelcard look like absurdly good value for money.

>  The service isn't terribly reliable - in the event of disruption 
>trains are turned round before they reach Brentwood - and the 315s

I remember when the 321's were brand new. I suppose they aren't used on 
stoppers any more.

>It just isn't a railhead I would ever suggest for long distance
>commuting.

I wouldn't call London 'long distance' from Brentwood :) But my 
travelling experience dates from when it was 27 minutes on a semifast. 
But that was the same time as from Chelmsford, so the choice of where to 
live was more about house prices vs residential ambience.
-- 
Roland Perry

On 7 Jul, 10:07, Richard Dixon  wrote:
> Paul Oter  wrote innews:13c24346-c14c-4f58-bd12-6bdcd443b964@59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:
>
> > I have been catching peak trains between Cambridge and Liverpool
> > Street about two or three times a week for the past seven years. They
> > all stop at Broxbourne. Since I always get a seat at Cambridge I tend
> > not to pay too much attention to how crowded they get in the morning,
> > but my general impression is that although it is almost certain you
> > would need to stand from Broxbourne, the trains are not "heaving" and
> > only have a few people standing per carriage. A lot of people get off
> > at Tottenham Hale, so you may be able to get a seat from there to
> > Liverpool Street (which is about half the journey time).
>
> Paul - thanks for the feedback - good to hear from someone who actually
> uses that line. I hadn't realised that half the journey was the section
> post-Tottenham Hale, so that would make things more bearable (I currently
> have generally a 20-minute stand with my current commute).
>
> What time are you typically getting on at Cambridge?
>

Typically 0748 or later, which arrives at Liverpool Street at 0905 or
so (and to my desk at 0915).  Just to be clear: this is a busy train,
with all seats taken and people standing by the time it calls at
Broxbourne. It's 15 minutes from there to Tottenham Hale, where a lot
of people get off, then a further 15 mins to Liverpool Street. I still
see people standing after Tottenham but the turnover of seats means
you probably have a chance of being able to grab a seat there if you
need to.

As other have mentioned, in 2006 a DfT report once named the 0802
Cambridge to Liverpool Street train (which no longer runs) as the
busest in the country. See http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4830370.stm
However I used to travel on that exact train on numerous occasions and
so know that this was nonsense. Apparently the researchers visited on
an unusual day when a preceding service had been cancelled.

On the way home the 1758 Liverpool Street to King's Lynn usually has
free seats in the front carriage of this eight-car train (despite
people standing at the back) , though I would recommend not leaving it
until the very last minute to board. The reason why this train is
rarely full is that it doesn't stop at Harlow Town and is immediately
preceded by a Stansted Express which calls at Harlow Town and Bishop's
Stortford.

PaulO

In message 
, at 
05:58:30 on Tue, 8 Jul 2008, Paul Oter  
remarked:
>As other have mentioned, in 2006 a DfT report once named the 0802
>Cambridge to Liverpool Street train (which no longer runs) as the
>busest in the country. See http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4830370.stm
>However I used to travel on that exact train on numerous occasions and
>so know that this was nonsense. Apparently the researchers visited on
>an unusual day when a preceding service had been cancelled.

The train I was referring to (2nd most crowded, not most crowded) is the 
7.18 from Cambridge in 2007, and it would be extraordinary for the ToC 
to trot out the same excuse two years running.
-- 
Roland Perry

Paul Oter wrote:
> On 7 Jul, 10:07, Richard Dixon  wrote:
>> Paul Oter  wrote
>> innews:13c24346-c14c-4f58-bd12-6bdcd443b964@59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:
>>
>>> I have been catching peak trains between Cambridge and Liverpool
>>> Street about two or three times a week for the past seven years.
>>> They all stop at Broxbourne. Since I always get a seat at Cambridge
>>> I tend not to pay too much attention to how crowded they get in the
>>> morning, but my general impression is that although it is almost
>>> certain you would need to stand from Broxbourne, the trains are not
>>> "heaving" and only have a few people standing per carriage. A lot
>>> of people get off at Tottenham Hale, so you may be able to get a
>>> seat from there to Liverpool Street (which is about half the
>>> journey time).
>>
>> Paul - thanks for the feedback - good to hear from someone who
>> actually
>> uses that line. I hadn't realised that half the journey was the
>> section
>> post-Tottenham Hale, so that would make things more bearable (I
>> currently
>> have generally a 20-minute stand with my current commute).
>>
>> What time are you typically getting on at Cambridge?
>>
>
> Typically 0748 or later, which arrives at Liverpool Street at 0905 or
> so (and to my desk at 0915).  Just to be clear: this is a busy train,
> with all seats taken and people standing by the time it calls at
> Broxbourne. It's 15 minutes from there to Tottenham Hale, where a lot
> of people get off, then a further 15 mins to Liverpool Street. I still
> see people standing after Tottenham but the turnover of seats means
> you probably have a chance of being able to grab a seat there if you
> need to.
>
> As other have mentioned, in 2006 a DfT report once named the 0802
> Cambridge to Liverpool Street train (which no longer runs) as the
> busest in the country. See
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4830370.stm However I used
> to travel on that exact train on numerous occasions and
> so know that this was nonsense. Apparently the researchers visited on
> an unusual day when a preceding service had been cancelled.
>
> On the way home the 1758 Liverpool Street to King's Lynn usually has
> free seats in the front carriage of this eight-car train (despite
> people standing at the back) , though I would recommend not leaving it
> until the very last minute to board. The reason why this train is
> rarely full is that it doesn't stop at Harlow Town and is immediately
> preceded by a Stansted Express which calls at Harlow Town and Bishop's
> Stortford.
>

Another relevant point seems to be that of all the routes around London, 
there seems reasonable evidence of serious increases in rolling stock during 
the next timetable year for the Lea Valley. Cascaded 321s ex LM, and an 
order for new units for the Stansted Express (although that has gone a 
little quiet).

Paul S

In message , at 14:31:28 on Tue, 8 Jul 
2008, Paul Scott  remarked:
>and an order for new units for the Stansted Express (although that has 
>gone a little quiet).

East Midlands news today crowing about a Bombardier order for South 
Africa that they've just started to deliver; also mentioned they were 
building new trains for London "for the Olympics". What line are they 
for (not Crossrail or Javelin, obviously).
-- 
Roland Perry

On Tue, 8 Jul 2008, Roland Perry wrote:

> In message , at 14:31:28 on Tue, 8 Jul 2008, 
> Paul Scott  remarked:
>
>> and an order for new units for the Stansted Express (although that has 
>> gone a little quiet).
>
> East Midlands news today crowing about a Bombardier order for South 
> Africa that they've just started to deliver; also mentioned they were 
> building new trains for London "for the Olympics". What line are they 
> for (not Crossrail or Javelin, obviously).

No, no - they're for the 500 metre train pull.

tom

-- 
The glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

"Roland Perry"  wrote in message 
news:RcD1i3q2F3cIFAZS@perry.co.uk...
> In message , at 14:31:28 on Tue, 8 Jul 
> 2008, Paul Scott  remarked:
>>and an order for new units for the Stansted Express (although that has 
>>gone a little quiet).
>
> East Midlands news today crowing about a Bombardier order for South Africa 
> that they've just started to deliver; also mentioned they were building 
> new trains for London "for the Olympics". What line are they for (not 
> Crossrail or Javelin, obviously).

Probably referring to the NLL/ELL 'overground' trains, the 378s. Anything 
new in London seems to have a games role, however spurious, but these trains 
really will deliver pax to Stratford...

However would they have happened without the Olympics, or would the 313s etc 
have been given an overhaul and relivery for a few years more use?

Paul S

Roland Perry  wrote:
> In message , at 
> 14:32:05 on Mon, 7 Jul 2008, David Jackman 
> <pleasereplytogroup@?.?.invalid> remarked:
> >Despite being on a fast main line to London every train is pretty much
> >all stations so it will always take 35-40 minutes and it's one stop
> >beyond boundary zone six, which makes an annual travelcard ?2,500
> >instead of ?1,784.
> 
> And a Brentwood-Harold Wood season is more than ?716? Makes the 
> Travelcard look like absurdly good value for money.

I thought that, so looked it up.  720 pounds.  SDR is 5.80.  So no loophole
there.

Theo

In article ,
Tom Anderson   wrote:
>On Tue, 8 Jul 2008, Roland Perry wrote:
>
>> In message , at 14:31:28 on Tue, 8 Jul 2008, 
>> Paul Scott  remarked:
>>
>>> and an order for new units for the Stansted Express (although that has 
>>> gone a little quiet).
>>
>> East Midlands news today crowing about a Bombardier order for South 
>> Africa that they've just started to deliver; also mentioned they were 
>> building new trains for London "for the Olympics". What line are they 
>> for (not Crossrail or Javelin, obviously).
>
>No, no - they're for the 500 metre train pull.

This being the DfT's latest plan for how trains should propel themselves
in the event of power failure :)

Nick
-- 
Serendipity: http://www.leverton.org/blosxom (last update 6th June 2008)
        "The Internet, a sort of ersatz counterfeit of real life"
                -- Janet Street-Porter, BBC2, 19th March 1996

On 8 Jul, 14:17, Roland Perry  wrote:
> In message
> , at
> 05:58:30 on Tue, 8 Jul 2008, Paul Oter 
> remarked:
>
> >As other have mentioned, in 2006 a DfT report once named the 0802
> >Cambridge to Liverpool Street train (which no longer runs) as the
> >busest in the country. Seehttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4830370.stm
> >However I used to travel on that exact train on numerous occasions and
> >so know that this was nonsense. Apparently the researchers visited on
> >an unusual day when a preceding service had been cancelled.
>
> The train I was referring to (2nd most crowded, not most crowded) is the
> 7.18 from Cambridge in 2007, and it would be extraordinary for the ToC
> to trot out the same excuse two years running.

Thank you for the clarification: I didn't know that.

PaulO

"Richard Dixon"  wrote in message 
news:Xns9AD3A0DC876A7rdngemailyahoocouk@69.16.176.253...
> Maybe I should have said "busy-ness" and not business, but just wondering
> if anyone knew of any websites that detailed how busy trains are coming in
> to central London from suburbs?
>
> I am thinking of moving further outward but wondering, aside from actually
> waiting at various train platforms in the rush-hour, as to how full trains
> are on their approach to London?
>
> For people looking for a longer commuter from more rural areas, I would
> have thought "getting a seat on the train" is paramount, and I would have
> thought there'd be some sort of resource to help with this somewhere on 
> the
> web?
>
> Thanks in advance for any information !
> Richard

You might consider life south of the river. Southern/FCC routes through East 
Croydon offer direct trains to/from Victoria, London Bridge and the 
Thameslink route. Some South Eastern routes give a choice of direct trains 
to/from London Bridge/Cannon Street, Charing Cross and Victoria. I don't 
think any other route can give you anything like this level of choice (I'm 
sure someone will be along to dispute this!). The downside is that you might 
have to look a *long* way out from London in order to be sure of a seat in 
the morning. From the Sussex coast you might find people having to stand 
from Preston Park or Hove, for example. I commute between Brighton and 
Victoria. I *always* get a seat in both directions (this involves getting to 
Victoria promptly in the evening), and a forthcoming attraction is a 
doubling of the peak-hour service frequency (quarter-hourly) from the 
December timetable later this year.

I would be wary of over reliance on the FCC/Thameslink route because major 
disruption is likely for the next 10 years or so.

D A Stocks

On 10 Jul, 14:36, "David A Stocks"  wrote:

> You might consider life south of the river.
> I would be wary of over reliance on the FCC/Thameslink route because major
> disruption is likely for the next 10 years or so.

Thanks - I am currently south of the river (indeed I grew up in
Orpington) but fancied, well, a change and seeing as I'm looking at
Broxbourne on the Herts/Essex border and I have a number of friends in
Herts/Essex it seemed like a sensible choice, especially with my work
so close to Liverpool Street. I guess another option would be trains
coming in to Moorgate from Herts.

Regards
Richard

On 8 Jul, 15:49, Tom Anderson  wrote:

> > East Midlands news today crowing about a Bombardier order for South
> > Africa that they've just started to deliver; also mentioned they were
> > building new trains for London "for the Olympics". What line are they
> > for (not Crossrail or Javelin, obviously).
>
> No, no - they're for the 500 metre trainpull.

The Olympic white-water rafting up in Broxbourne, perchance? (yes, the
Olympics is stretching out that far from London...)

Richard

Roland Perry wrote:
> In message , at 14:31:28 on Tue, 8 Jul 
> 2008, Paul Scott  remarked:
>> and an order for new units for the Stansted Express (although that has 
>> gone a little quiet).
> 
> East Midlands news today crowing about a Bombardier order for South 
> Africa that they've just started to deliver; also mentioned they were 
> building new trains for London "for the Olympics". What line are they 
> for (not Crossrail or Javelin, obviously).

Presumably a reference to the Victoria line stock, Sub-Surface trains, 
and the NLL/ELL Electrostars.

The South African trains are Electrostars with a pointy front end stuck on.
-- 
Arthur Figgis               Surrey, UK

In message <a_mdnd9L0JwlDevVnZ2dnUVZ8tfinZ2d@posted.plusnet>, at 
23:44:15 on Thu, 10 Jul 2008, Arthur Figgis 
<afiggis@example.com.invalid> remarked:
>>  East Midlands news today crowing about a Bombardier order for South 
>>Africa that they've just started to deliver; also mentioned they were 
>>building new trains for London "for the Olympics". What line are they 
>>for (not Crossrail or Javelin, obviously).
>
>Presumably a reference to the Victoria line stock, Sub-Surface trains, 
>and the NLL/ELL Electrostars.
>
>The South African trains are Electrostars with a pointy front end stuck on.

I noticed they had 2+3 seating, and the two gents being interviewed (one 
from Derby and one from South Africa) pretty much filled a set of three 
seats between the two of them :)
-- 
Roland Perry