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date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 21:36:51 +0100,
group: uk.transport.air
back
Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
William Black writes:
> Can't be
>
> It denies free will.
>
> With no free will there can be no sin.
It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but the
individual does not.
Actually, those, all of these theories are handicapped by their failure to
recognize that a supreme being might well be independent of time, in which
case the whole question of fate, predestination, etc., is moot.
For example, Zeno's paradox really isn't a paradox when you realize that a
supreme being is likely to be independent of time.
date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 21:36:51 +0100
author: Mxsmanic
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
news:mg0ap39d239ep29n1o9svmq5h81q9tplfd@4ax.com...
> William Black writes:
>
>> Can't be
>>
>> It denies free will.
>>
>> With no free will there can be no sin.
>
> It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but the
> individual does not.
We cannot know what God knows.
However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
than us about the future.
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:20:37 +0530
author: William Black
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
"William Black" wrote:
>
> "Mxsmanic" wrote:
>>
>> William Black writes:
>>
>>> Can't be
>>>
>>> It denies free will.
>>>
>>> With no free will there can be no sin.
>>
>> It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but the
>> individual does not.
>
> We cannot know what God knows.
>
> However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
> man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
> than us about the future.
Unless you are an adherent of predestination:
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12378a.htm
date: 22 Jan 2008 13:05:57 GMT
author: James Robinson
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
"James Robinson" wrote in message
news:Xns9A2D52629A974wascana212com@66.250.146.128...
> "William Black" wrote:
>>
>> "Mxsmanic" wrote:
>>>
>>> William Black writes:
>>>
>>>> Can't be
>>>>
>>>> It denies free will.
>>>>
>>>> With no free will there can be no sin.
>>>
>>> It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but the
>>> individual does not.
>>
>> We cannot know what God knows.
>>
>> However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
>> man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
>> than us about the future.
>
> Unless you are an adherent of predestination:
>
> http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12378a.htm
As your source says, it's a heresy, Mixi will burn in hell for believing
it.
Every cloud...
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 19:19:30 +0530
author: William Black
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
William Black writes:
> We cannot know what God knows.
Since God is omniscient, anything we know is necessarily also something that
God knows, which invalidates your assertion.
> However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
> man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
> than us about the future.
The Bible essentially portrays the supreme being as an old man afflicted by
just about every imaginable human vice, even though none of these would have
any meaning for a supreme being. It's an extreme case of projection.
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 17:54:37 +0100
author: Mxsmanic
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
news:vr7cp3prgs89cbq3t2u16krj7merhumk6l@4ax.com...
> William Black writes:
>
>> We cannot know what God knows.
>
> Since God is omniscient, anything we know is necessarily also something
> that
> God knows, which invalidates your assertion.
>
>> However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
>> man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
>> than us about the future.
>
> The Bible essentially portrays the supreme being as an old man
I don't have a problem with that
You're still gonna burn in Hell for your belief in predestination.
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 23:52:47 +0530
author: William Black
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
On Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:20:37 +0530, "William Black"
wrote:
>
>"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
>news:mg0ap39d239ep29n1o9svmq5h81q9tplfd@4ax.com...
>> William Black writes:
>>
>>> Can't be
>>>
>>> It denies free will.
>>>
>>> With no free will there can be no sin.
>>
>> It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but the
>> individual does not.
>
>We cannot know what God knows.
>
>However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
>man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
>than us about the future.
He is, apparently, easily amused, though.
--
************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 11:32:05 -0700
author: Hatunen
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
William Black writes:
> You're still gonna burn in Hell for your belief in predestination.
I don't recall describing my belief.
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 19:32:07 +0100
author: Mxsmanic
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
news:okdcp3lsmv6fr2hcdlvq6tbjiefiebfkn4@4ax.com...
> William Black writes:
>
>> You're still gonna burn in Hell for your belief in predestination.
>
> I don't recall describing my belief.
It doesn't matter.
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.
date: Wed, 23 Jan 2008 00:32:08 +0530
author: William Black
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
"Hatunen" wrote in message
news:dkdcp39q7pju18ru7k9g36cr8suhbn3m1a@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:20:37 +0530, "William Black"
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
>>news:mg0ap39d239ep29n1o9svmq5h81q9tplfd@4ax.com...
>>> William Black writes:
>>>
>>>> Can't be
>>>>
>>>> It denies free will.
>>>>
>>>> With no free will there can be no sin.
>>>
>>> It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but the
>>> individual does not.
>>
>>We cannot know what God knows.
>>
>>However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
>>man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
>>than us about the future.
>
> He is, apparently, easily amused, though.
Of course, we are made in his image...
He IS an elderly gentleman with a rather odd sense of humour.
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.
date: Wed, 23 Jan 2008 00:33:30 +0530
author: William Black
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 00:33:30 +0530, "William Black"
wrote:
>
>"Hatunen" wrote in message
>news:dkdcp39q7pju18ru7k9g36cr8suhbn3m1a@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:20:37 +0530, "William Black"
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
>>>news:mg0ap39d239ep29n1o9svmq5h81q9tplfd@4ax.com...
>>>> William Black writes:
>>>>
>>>>> Can't be
>>>>>
>>>>> It denies free will.
>>>>>
>>>>> With no free will there can be no sin.
>>>>
>>>> It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but the
>>>> individual does not.
>>>
>>>We cannot know what God knows.
>>>
>>>However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
>>>man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
>>>than us about the future.
>>
>> He is, apparently, easily amused, though.
>
>Of course, we are made in his image...
>
>He IS an elderly gentleman with a rather odd sense of humour.
HE IS just a figment of someone's imagination many many years ago
and I do wish that person had kept his mouth shut by telling this
fairy story the person has indirectly had many many thousands of
people murdered . These murders are still taking place day after day
in the name of religion you only need to see what is happening to the
Palestinian peoples thanks to the " God fearing" Jews .
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 19:46:15 GMT
author: unknown
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
William Black writes:
> It doesn't matter.
I agree, but you're the one who brought it up.
date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 21:31:44 +0100
author: Mxsmanic
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Re: Daylight flight between LHR and LAX
wrote in message
news:jhhcp3pfda5ov30mhutu0r0fut0bbqo7pe@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 00:33:30 +0530, "William Black"
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Hatunen" wrote in message
>>news:dkdcp39q7pju18ru7k9g36cr8suhbn3m1a@4ax.com...
>>> On Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:20:37 +0530, "William Black"
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
>>>>news:mg0ap39d239ep29n1o9svmq5h81q9tplfd@4ax.com...
>>>>> William Black writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Can't be
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It denies free will.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With no free will there can be no sin.
>>>>>
>>>>> It does not conflict with free well. God may know the outcome, but
>>>>> the
>>>>> individual does not.
>>>>
>>>>We cannot know what God knows.
>>>>
>>>>However as the bible refers to God being both pleased and displeased at
>>>>man's actions at various times it is reasonable to assume He is no wiser
>>>>than us about the future.
>>>
>>> He is, apparently, easily amused, though.
>>
>>Of course, we are made in his image...
>>
>>He IS an elderly gentleman with a rather odd sense of humour.
>
> HE IS just a figment of someone's imagination many many years ago
> and I do wish that person had kept his mouth shut by telling this
> fairy story the person has indirectly had many many thousands of
> people murdered . These murders are still taking place day after day
> in the name of religion you only need to see what is happening to the
> Palestinian peoples thanks to the " God fearing" Jews .
Humourless bugger.
Wars are NOT about religion, they're about economics.
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.
date: Wed, 23 Jan 2008 12:57:30 +0530
author: William Black
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