On 6 Sep, 14:16, "William Black"  wrote:
> "tim....."  wrote in message
>
> news:5ka3onF2qiltU1@mid.individual.net...
>
>
>
> > "William Black"  wrote in message
> >news:fbog7p$vs7$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> >> You must live in the USA.
>
> > Nope, the UK.
>
> >> When travelling from the Far East to Europe you take what's there.
>
> > I can travel everywhere that I want to from London so I
> > suppose that I am being a bit unfair.
>
> > I have a bitch of a 3 hour journey by PT to the London airport
> > that I need to get to, but I never have a long wait for that
> > connection.
>
> You live within striking distance of the largest international hub in the
> world.
>
> I don't.
>
> I'd have to catch at least three trains to get to Heathrow
>
> The alternative is a shuttle flight down from a provincial airport.
>
> If I'm flying a long way this will almost invariably include at least a two
> hour wait at Heathrow,  and in the recent security farce I had a three hour
> wait and only just managed to get my flight because at Heathrow I had to
> reclaim my luggage,  go through check-in AGAIN,  go through two security
> checks and get to the gate somewhere near Reading out at the extreme end of
> Terminal 3.
>
> --
> William Black
>
> I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
> Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
> I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
> All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
> Time for tea.

dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to go
anywhere :)

Make credence recognised that on Thu, 6 Sep 2007 21:43:26 +0100,
"William Black"  has scripted:

>
>"Jugdish"  wrote in message 
>news:1189107576.450663.64380@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>> On 6 Sep, 20:40, "William Black"  wrote:
>>> "Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>
>>> news:1189083451.114574.110300@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>> > dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to go
>>> > anywhere :)
>>>
>>> I keep hearing this 'peak oil' nonsense.
>>>
>> so it will last forever ??
>>
>> thats a relief.....
>>
>
>I imagine it'll see us both out.
>
>I also imagine they'll develop a system that doesn't use oil in the 
>meantime,  walking to work is a great driver of ideas...

I'll ride my horse instead.

BTW, there is no substitute for oil, and there won't be. Sorry.
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:05:42 +0100,
"William Black"  has scripted:

>
>"Jugdish"  wrote in message 
>news:1189151918.793735.150650@r29g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...

>> imagine being the operative word
>>
>
>So we're all going to die?
>
>I put more faith in human ingenuity than that.

Did hope work as a strategy in developing the internal combustion
engine?
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:07:51 +0100,
"William Black"  has scripted:

>
>"Jugdish"  wrote in message 
>news:1189152226.707271.102320@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>> On 6 Sep, 22:49, Iceman  wrote:
>>> On Sep 6, 3:39 pm, Jugdish  wrote:
>>>
>>> > On 6 Sep, 20:40, "William Black"  wrote:> 
>>> > "Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>
>>> > >news:1189083451.114574.110300@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>> > > > dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to 
>>> > > > go
>>> > > > anywhere :)
>>>
>>> > > I keep hearing this 'peak oil' nonsense.
>>>
>>> > so it will last forever ??
>>>
>>> > thats a relief.....
>>>
>>> The opponents of the peak oil theory don't think that oil will last
>>> forever - only that there is unlikely to be a supply crunch in the
>>> next few decades at roughly current rates of usage.  Obviously oil is
>>> a finite resource.
>>
>> you bet
>> http://www.hubbertpeak.com/summary.htm
>>
>
>As always,  suspect figures,  no account taken of the increase of 
>sustainable energy meaning ta drop in oil use.

Sustainable energy? That's what oil was for the last century.
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

Make credence recognised that on Thu, 6 Sep 2007 19:40:49 +0100,
"William Black"  has scripted:

>
>"Jugdish"  wrote in message 
>news:1189083451.114574.110300@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
>> dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to go
>> anywhere :)
>>
>
>I keep hearing this 'peak oil' nonsense.
>
>We've been here before,  in 1973,  before which it wasn't economic to 
>extract North Sea Oil.

Scott Adams said that any predicted doom will never happen.

That said, do you really think oil will cost the same as bottled water
in 30 years?
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
message news:g853e3p17mevh8f16dgjfr1aunj2ql99qs@4ax.com...
> Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:05:42 +0100,
> "William Black"  has scripted:
>
>>
>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>news:1189151918.793735.150650@r29g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
>>> imagine being the operative word
>>>
>>
>>So we're all going to die?
>>
>>I put more faith in human ingenuity than that.
>
> Did hope work as a strategy in developing the internal combustion
> engine?

The first internal combustion engined vehicle was stolen by a joy rider.

-- 
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
message news:8553e3tl5cp9e5eocqo8nbsl3o6ojpojcj@4ax.com...
> Make credence recognised that on Thu, 6 Sep 2007 21:43:26 +0100,
> "William Black"  has scripted:
>
>>
>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>news:1189107576.450663.64380@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>>> On 6 Sep, 20:40, "William Black"  wrote:
>>>> "Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>>
>>>> news:1189083451.114574.110300@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>>>>
>>>> > dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to 
>>>> > go
>>>> > anywhere :)
>>>>
>>>> I keep hearing this 'peak oil' nonsense.
>>>>
>>> so it will last forever ??
>>>
>>> thats a relief.....
>>>
>>
>>I imagine it'll see us both out.
>>
>>I also imagine they'll develop a system that doesn't use oil in the
>>meantime,  walking to work is a great driver of ideas...
>
> I'll ride my horse instead.
>
> BTW, there is no substitute for oil, and there won't be. Sorry.

You faith in human kind is noted...

In the end there's always a substitute for just about everything.

You can runs cars,  and just about everything else, on methane,  hydrogen or 
alcohol.

-- 
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

"Mr Travel"  wrote in message 
news:46e1a019$0$18990$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
> William Black wrote:
>
>
>>
>> You can runs cars,  and just about everything else, on methane,  hydrogen 
>> or alcohol.
>>
>
> Or electricity, if there is an efficient clean way of generating it.

Well no.

You couldn't run a large aircraft on electricity without some sort of major 
scientific breakthrough.

-- 
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
message news:ck43e3lg5srhs5t5g22aifo6d9ga4ej1eq@4ax.com...
> Make credence recognised that on Thu, 6 Sep 2007 19:40:49 +0100,
> "William Black"  has scripted:
>
>>
>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>news:1189083451.114574.110300@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to go
>>> anywhere :)
>>>
>>
>>I keep hearing this 'peak oil' nonsense.
>>
>>We've been here before,  in 1973,  before which it wasn't economic to
>>extract North Sea Oil.
>
> Scott Adams said that any predicted doom will never happen.
>
> That said, do you really think oil will cost the same as bottled water
> in 30 years?

that depends how much the mugs will pay for water :-)

tim

Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 19:45:34 +0100,
"William Black"  has scripted:

>
>"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
>message news:8553e3tl5cp9e5eocqo8nbsl3o6ojpojcj@4ax.com...
>> Make credence recognised that on Thu, 6 Sep 2007 21:43:26 +0100,
>> "William Black"  has scripted:
>>
>>>
>>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>news:1189107576.450663.64380@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>>>> On 6 Sep, 20:40, "William Black"  wrote:
>>>>> "Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>>>
>>>>> news:1189083451.114574.110300@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>
>>>>> > dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to 
>>>>> > go
>>>>> > anywhere :)
>>>>>
>>>>> I keep hearing this 'peak oil' nonsense.
>>>>>
>>>> so it will last forever ??
>>>>
>>>> thats a relief.....
>>>>
>>>
>>>I imagine it'll see us both out.
>>>
>>>I also imagine they'll develop a system that doesn't use oil in the
>>>meantime,  walking to work is a great driver of ideas...
>>
>> I'll ride my horse instead.
>>
>> BTW, there is no substitute for oil, and there won't be. Sorry.
>
>You faith in human kind is noted...

I rate humans up there with gout, but that's no secret.

>In the end there's always a substitute for just about everything.
>
>You can runs cars,  and just about everything else, on methane,  hydrogen or 
>alcohol.

None of which have the properties of petrol, or petroleum-base
comparatives, sorry.

Oil's a wonder juice that has been millenniums in the making. Please
don't fall for thinking it can be readily replaced, coz it can't.
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 19:39:43 +0100,
"William Black"  has scripted:

>
>"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
>message news:g853e3p17mevh8f16dgjfr1aunj2ql99qs@4ax.com...
>> Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:05:42 +0100,
>> "William Black"  has scripted:
>>
>>>
>>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>news:1189151918.793735.150650@r29g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>>> imagine being the operative word
>>>>
>>>
>>>So we're all going to die?
>>>
>>>I put more faith in human ingenuity than that.
>>
>> Did hope work as a strategy in developing the internal combustion
>> engine?
>
>The first internal combustion engined vehicle was stolen by a joy rider.

Is anyone alive to confirm this?
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

Doesn't Frequently Mop wrote:

> Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 19:39:43 +0100,
> "William Black"  has scripted:
> 
> 
>>"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
>>message news:g853e3p17mevh8f16dgjfr1aunj2ql99qs@4ax.com...
>>
>>>Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 09:05:42 +0100,
>>>"William Black"  has scripted:
>>>
>>>
>>>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>>news:1189151918.793735.150650@r29g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>>>
>>>>>imagine being the operative word
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>So we're all going to die?
>>>>
>>>>I put more faith in human ingenuity than that.
>>>
>>>Did hope work as a strategy in developing the internal combustion
>>>engine?
>>
>>The first internal combustion engined vehicle was stolen by a joy rider.
> 
> 
> Is anyone alive to confirm this?

http://snopes.com

This historical even led to the invention of the LoJack

:)

"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
message news:7vd3e3dakoteu71bkp6dlra32anqqvia7e@4ax.com...

>>In the end there's always a substitute for just about everything.
>>
>>You can runs cars,  and just about everything else, on methane,  hydrogen 
>>or
>>alcohol.
>
> None of which have the properties of petrol, or petroleum-base
> comparatives, sorry.

So what?

They'll make it work.

My money is on human ingenuity.

-- 
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

Doesn't Frequently Mop wrote:

> Make credence recognised that on Thu, 6 Sep 2007 21:43:26 +0100,
> "William Black"  has scripted:
> 
> 
>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message 
>>news:1189107576.450663.64380@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>>On 6 Sep, 20:40, "William Black"  wrote:
>>>
>>>>"Jugdish"  wrote in message
>>>>
>>>>news:1189083451.114574.110300@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>dont worry, peak oil has already happened, soon you wont be able to go
>>>>>anywhere :)
>>>>
>>>>I keep hearing this 'peak oil' nonsense.
>>>>
>>>
>>>so it will last forever ??
>>>
>>>thats a relief.....
>>>
>>
>>I imagine it'll see us both out.
>>
>>I also imagine they'll develop a system that doesn't use oil in the 
>>meantime,  walking to work is a great driver of ideas...
> 
> 
> I'll ride my horse instead.
> 
> BTW, there is no substitute for oil, and there won't be. Sorry.

There are so few good lubricants and feed stocks.

"TMOliver" <tmoliverjrFIX@hot.rr.comFIX> wrote in message 
news:46e2b055$0$4059$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>
> "William Black"  wrote in message 
> news:fbu4bn$p1q$1@registered.motzarella.org...
>>
>> "TMOliver" <tmoliverjrFIX@hot.rr.comFIX> wrote in message 
>> news:46e1d231$0$4110$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
>>
>> and if my
>>> ship comes in grandly, I promise to rent appropriate quarters and hold a 
>>> grotesque display of food and drink in some London area dining room, 
>>> there to summon a handful of intelligent well-read, better spoken and 
>>> written UKians known to me by their occasional witty, once in a while 
>>> wise and not too often ridiculous posts.   I do so swear and affirm!
>>
>> That's very handsome of you.
>>
>> Depending on your new income it'll either be the Cafe Royal for cocktails 
>> or The Blind Beggar for a pint of mild...
>>
>> Both establishments are notable more for their clientele than their 
>> booze, and  both serve excellent booze.
>>
> The Blind Beggar sounds a good choice.  Sharpen your quill and mark that 
> down on my ledger...
>

It's got the most 'over the top' web site intro I've ever seen,  but it's 
also a place where you'll run into all sorts,  just don't call anyone 'a big 
fat pouf...'

http://www.theblindbeggar.com/


-- 
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 22:55:52 +0100,
"William Black"  has scripted:

>
>"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
>message news:7vd3e3dakoteu71bkp6dlra32anqqvia7e@4ax.com...
>
>>>In the end there's always a substitute for just about everything.
>>>
>>>You can runs cars,  and just about everything else, on methane,  hydrogen 
>>>or
>>>alcohol.
>>
>> None of which have the properties of petrol, or petroleum-base
>> comparatives, sorry.
>
>So what?
>
>They'll make it work.
>
>My money is on human ingenuity.

That would be the 'hope' strategy then. OK, I'll go with that given
there's not much else on offer.
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

Make credence recognised that on Sat, 08 Sep 2007 14:04:51 -0700,
Iceman  has scripted:

>On Sep 8, 3:10 pm, Doesn't Frequently Mop
><deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote:
>> Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 22:55:52 +0100,

>> That would be the 'hope' strategy then. OK, I'll go with that given
>> there's not much else on offer.
>
>
>Although I'm not completely persuaded of the peak oil theory, I think
>it's definitely reasonable to prepare for oil scarcity just in case
>rather than expect unseen technologies to bail us out.

It's not the scarcity that will be the problem, it will be the rise in
cost. Just what can we expect if (when?) it's five times the price it
is now?

Of course we then have to question whether the taxes will continue to
be applied as a percentage, in which case the governments will make an
absolute shitload of money from the increase in price. Will taxes ever
be reduced on fuel if the prices shoot up? It hasn't happened yet.
-- 
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

"Doesn't Frequently Mop" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote in 
message news:oec7e3t595nls8k911brp912pmadvfq1dc@4ax.com...
> Make credence recognised that on Sat, 08 Sep 2007 14:04:51 -0700,
> Iceman  has scripted:
>
>>On Sep 8, 3:10 pm, Doesn't Frequently Mop
>><deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote:
>>> Make credence recognised that on Fri, 7 Sep 2007 22:55:52 +0100,
>
>>> That would be the 'hope' strategy then. OK, I'll go with that given
>>> there's not much else on offer.
>>
>>
>>Although I'm not completely persuaded of the peak oil theory, I think
>>it's definitely reasonable to prepare for oil scarcity just in case
>>rather than expect unseen technologies to bail us out.
>
> It's not the scarcity that will be the problem, it will be the rise in
> cost. Just what can we expect if (when?) it's five times the price it
> is now?

This is supply and demand working.  As the price goes
up people will look to doing things without using so much

The problem that we have now, is that we waste oil because
it *is* too cheap.

As Iceman says, we should be taking the steps now, to
legisilate wasteful use out of the system, if we don't do so we'll
just run out sooner.

tim

In message , at 10:46:27 on 
Sun, 9 Sep 2007, Doesn't Frequently Mop 
<deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> remarked:
>>Although I'm not completely persuaded of the peak oil theory, I think
>>it's definitely reasonable to prepare for oil scarcity just in case
>>rather than expect unseen technologies to bail us out.
>
>It's not the scarcity that will be the problem, it will be the rise in
>cost. Just what can we expect if (when?) it's five times the price it
>is now?
>
>Of course we then have to question whether the taxes will continue to
>be applied as a percentage,

In the UK it's a lump sum plus a small percentage

-- 
Roland Perry