Cars before people now?

"Firgrove Court, a small estate of 28 maisonettes, social housing, is
earmarked for demolition for a car park for a superstore, part of the
unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough being carried out by
KPI (a Kuwaiti-financed front-company of St Modwen).

A couple of weeks, hoarding started to be erected around the estate,
giving the impression that all the tenants had finally been forced out
of their homes and demolition was about to begin. Demolition of some
of the garages had already taken place a couple of months ago.

It came as some surprise therefore to learn that half a dozen tenants
were still there. An even bigger surprise to the demolition crew who
had been led to believe all the tenants had moved out...."

"...As one elderly tenant said, she could understand if they were
being forced out of their homes for a hospital, but for a car
park!..."

More with pics:

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2008/06/401760.html

--
UK Radical Campaigns
www.zing.icom43.net
One man's democracy is another man's regime.

On 24 Jun, 06:46, Doug  wrote:
> Cars before people now?
>
> "Firgrove Court, a small estate of 28 maisonettes, social housing, is
> earmarked for demolition for a car park for a superstore, part of the
> unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough being carried out by
> KPI (a Kuwaiti-financed front-company of St Modwen).
>
> A couple of weeks, hoarding started to be erected around the estate,
> giving the impression that all the tenants had finally been forced out
> of their homes and demolition was about to begin. Demolition of some
> of the garages had already taken place a couple of months ago.
>
> It came as some surprise therefore to learn that half a dozen tenants
> were still there. An even bigger surprise to the demolition crew who
> had been led to believe all the tenants had moved out...."
>
> "...As one elderly tenant said, she could understand if they were
> being forced out of their homes for a hospital, but for a car
> park!..."
>
> More with pics:
>
> http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2008/06/401760.html
>
> --
> UK Radical Campaignswww.zing.icom43.net
> One man's democracy is another man's regime.

That's good news, a chav estate removed to make space for some
urgently needed parking, about time, let's see more of this, I like to
see my extorted VED spent on motorists instead of benefits.
NM

"Doug"  wrote in message 
news:b52ba1a5-a04c-45f2-a78f-025848ace298@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> Cars before people now?
>
> "Firgrove Court, a small estate of 28 maisonettes, social housing, is
> earmarked for demolition for a car park for a superstore, part of the
> unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough being carried out by
> KPI (a Kuwaiti-financed front-company of St Modwen)....

It looks like a typical c50 year old council housing development, many of 
which are now being cleared because the poor quality of construction means 
they are well past their useful life. As they would need massive amounts of 
work to bring them up to modern standards, which would still only result in 
them being repaired, badly constructed buildings, with high energy costs, 
they are usually better gone.

In this case, the demolition is not just to create a car park. It is part of 
a major redevelopment of the area, which includes a requirement for 20% 
affordable housing, new public open spaces, improvements to the Shopmobility 
scheme and new recycling facilities, which oddly enough, the article you 
quoted seemed to have overlooked.. It is also a condition of the planning 
consent, which has gone to the Secretary of State for approval, that the 
residents of Firgrove Court be re-housed in modern dwellings, which means 
that their energy consumption and hence their carbon footprint, will be 
significantly reduced, which you should welcome.

Colin Bignell

Doug wrote:
> Cars before people now?
>
So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live in and 
the land reused for the benefit of the community?

On Jun 24, 9:23 am, "Brimstone"  wrote:
> Doug wrote:
> > Cars before people now?
>
> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live in and
> the land reused for the benefit of the community?

Doug seemingly wants a return to the slums of the past with crowded
living.

Fod

On 24 Jun, 09:23, "Brimstone"  wrote:
> Doug wrote:
> > Cars before people now?
>
> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live in and
> the land reused for the benefit of the community?

No I am against the dominance of the car cult in our society and am
taking into account the stress of moving house particularly for the
elderly. From the photographs the houses don't look too bad and could
easily be brought up to standard if the wretched car park wasn't given
top priority.

--
World Carfree Network
http://www.worldcarfree.net/
Help for your car-addicted friends in the U.K.

On 24 Jun, 06:46, Doug  wrote:
> Cars before people now?
>
> "Firgrove Court, a small estate of 28 maisonettes, social housing, is
> earmarked for demolition for a car park for a superstore, part of the
> unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough being carried out by
> KPI (a Kuwaiti-financed front-company of St Modwen).

Sounds great.  I can think of at least one house in Catford that I'd
like to see demolished to make a car park.  Particularly if the
resident was inside the house at the time ...

Doug wrote:
> On 24 Jun, 09:23, "Brimstone"  wrote:
>> Doug wrote:
>>> Cars before people now?
>>
>> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live
>> in and the land reused for the benefit of the community?
>
> No I am against the dominance of the car cult in our society and am
> taking into account the stress of moving house particularly for the
> elderly. From the photographs the houses don't look too bad

A general shot of a few houses gives no indication of their internal and 
structural condition. If the houses are in poor condition that leads to 
health problems for the occupiers. So which is worse, a few days aggro that 
comes from moving home, or the long term ill health that arises from living 
in unsound houses?

> and could
> easily be brought up to standard

How do you know that they could "easily be brought up to standard", have you 
visited and had a competent person make an assessment?

Why are you in favour of pensioners and others liable to ill health living 
in houses that are damp and falling down?

> if the wretched car park wasn't given
> top priority.

If it was a hospital being built on that site would you be equally unhappy? 
Why should the community at large not benefit from the new buildings that 
are being put up on that site?

"Brimstone"  gurgled happily, sounding much
like they were saying:

> If it was a hospital being built on that site would you be equally
> unhappy?

Of course he would. The drugs would have been tested on animals.

"Doug"  wrote in message 
news:0d8b8622-653d-4024-9c95-5e33759726e2@x41g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On 24 Jun, 09:23, "Brimstone"  wrote:
>> Doug wrote:
>> > Cars before people now?
>>
>> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live in 
>> and
>> the land reused for the benefit of the community?
>
> No I am against the dominance of the car cult in our society and am
> taking into account the stress of moving house particularly for the
> elderly.

Presumably, you therefore are also the new public open space, improved 
Shopmobility scheme, new recycling facilities and new affordable housing 
that are all part of the overall development, of which this is only a tiny 
part.

> From the photographs the houses don't look too bad and could
> easily be brought up to standard if the wretched car park wasn't given
> top priority.

From the photographs, they look like typical Council-built housing, which 
are being replaced in many parts of the country because the initial build 
quality was poor. A little research shows that they houses are suffering 
from leaks, rotten window frames and other, similar problems that support 
that conclusion. However, even you would prefer people to live in repaired, 
poorly built housing to new, energy efficient homes, Rushmoor Borough 
Council doesn't.

Colin Bignell

Doug  wrote:

> part of the unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough

Unwanted by whom? Certainly not unwanted by the people who live in
Farnborough. The centre is in dire need of renaovation combining as it
does the worst features of 60s and 70s excess and poor construction. The
main shopping area is a concrete and rotting wood cladding canyon down
which the wind blows hurling grit and fast food wrappers into the faces
of anyoen stupid enough to venture out to shop.

And no Duhg, it's nothing to do with the motor car. The centre of
Farnborough is designed for pedestrians and pedal cyclists with cars
being lead around the edge of the centre to car parks from which people
are encouraged to walk "some distance" to the shops.

On 24 Jun, 22:26, %ste...@malloc.co.uk (Steve Firth) wrote:
> Doug  wrote:
> > part of the unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough
>
> Unwanted by whom? Certainly not unwanted by the people who live in
> Farnborough. The centre is in dire need of renaovation combining as it
> does the worst features of 60s and 70s excess and poor construction. The
> main shopping area is a concrete and rotting wood cladding canyon down
> which the wind blows hurling grit and fast food wrappers into the faces
> of anyoen stupid enough to venture out to shop.
>
It appears that small shopkeepers have been forced out by huge rent
rises imposed by a foreign financed property developer which has
exacerbated the decline.
>
> And no Duhg, it's nothing to do with the motor car. The centre of
> Farnborough is designed for pedestrians and pedal cyclists with cars
> being lead around the edge of the centre to car parks from which people
> are encouraged to walk "some distance" to the shops.
>
Looking at a Google map of the place the first thing that springs to
view is the massive amount of car parking already there and the
redevelopment intends to sacrifice social housing and chuck people out
of their homes to make way for even more.

--
UK Radical Campaigns
www.zing.icom43.net
One man's democracy is another man's regime.

"Doug"  wrote in message 
news:89fff558-4bed-4e04-95cd-e694f5771d85@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> On 24 Jun, 22:26, %ste...@malloc.co.uk (Steve Firth) wrote:
>> Doug  wrote:
>> > part of the unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough
>>
>> Unwanted by whom? Certainly not unwanted by the people who live in
>> Farnborough. The centre is in dire need of renaovation combining as it
>> does the worst features of 60s and 70s excess and poor construction. The
>> main shopping area is a concrete and rotting wood cladding canyon down
>> which the wind blows hurling grit and fast food wrappers into the faces
>> of anyoen stupid enough to venture out to shop.
>>
> It appears that small shopkeepers have been forced out by huge rent
> rises imposed by a foreign financed property developer which has
> exacerbated the decline.

Small shopkeepers everywhere are being forced out by high rents. It is an 
inherent problem of the economics of the small shop in the modern property 
market.

>> And no Duhg, it's nothing to do with the motor car. The centre of
>> Farnborough is designed for pedestrians and pedal cyclists with cars
>> being lead around the edge of the centre to car parks from which people
>> are encouraged to walk "some distance" to the shops.
>>
> Looking at a Google map of the place the first thing that springs to
> view is the massive amount of car parking already there

The whole are is being redeveloped, so what you see now is not what will be 
there when the work ends.

> and the
> redevelopment intends to sacrifice social housing and chuck people out
> of their homes to make way for even more.

It is a condition of the planning permission for the overall development 
that it includes 20% affordable housing and that 24 out of one development 
of 30 new build properties are set aside for the people currently living in 
these houses, or that an equivalent provision be made for them.

Colin Bignell

Doug wrote:
> On 24 Jun, 22:26, %ste...@malloc.co.uk (Steve Firth) wrote:
>> Doug  wrote:
>>> part of the unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough
>>
>> Unwanted by whom? Certainly not unwanted by the people who live in
>> Farnborough. The centre is in dire need of renaovation combining as
>> it does the worst features of 60s and 70s excess and poor
>> construction. The main shopping area is a concrete and rotting wood
>> cladding canyon down which the wind blows hurling grit and fast food
>> wrappers into the faces of anyoen stupid enough to venture out to
>> shop.
>>
> It appears that small shopkeepers have been forced out by huge rent
> rises imposed by a foreign financed property developer which has
> exacerbated the decline.
>>
>> And no Duhg, it's nothing to do with the motor car. The centre of
>> Farnborough is designed for pedestrians and pedal cyclists with cars
>> being lead around the edge of the centre to car parks from which
>> people are encouraged to walk "some distance" to the shops.
>>
> Looking at a Google map of the place the first thing that springs to
> view is the massive amount of car parking already there and the
> redevelopment intends to sacrifice social housing and chuck people out
> of their homes to make way for even more.

Why do you think people in social housing should have to tolerate decrepit 
sub-standard properties?

On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:25:36 -0700 (PDT), Doug 
wrote:

>On 24 Jun, 09:23, "Brimstone"  wrote:
>> Doug wrote:
>> > Cars before people now?
>>
>> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live in and
>> the land reused for the benefit of the community?
>
>No I am against the dominance of the car cult in our society and am
>taking into account the stress of moving house particularly for the
>elderly. From the photographs the houses don't look too bad and could
>easily be brought up to standard if the wretched car park wasn't given
>top priority.

Look on it as a positive thing - cars will undoubtedly be parked in
the car park - thus freeing the streets up for pedestrians and
cyclists.
-- 
Only some ghastly, dehumanised moron would want to get rid of the Routemaster.
Ken Livingstone 2001.

PeterT - "Reply to" address is a spam trap - all replies to the group please

Peter Thomas wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:25:36 -0700 (PDT), Doug 
> wrote:
>
>> On 24 Jun, 09:23, "Brimstone"  wrote:
>>> Doug wrote:
>>>> Cars before people now?
>>>
>>> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live
>>> in and the land reused for the benefit of the community?
>>
>> No I am against the dominance of the car cult in our society and am
>> taking into account the stress of moving house particularly for the
>> elderly. From the photographs the houses don't look too bad and could
>> easily be brought up to standard if the wretched car park wasn't
>> given top priority.
>
> Look on it as a positive thing - cars will undoubtedly be parked in
> the car park - thus freeing the streets up for pedestrians and
> cyclists.

Doug doesn't do positive.

On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 10:06:14 +0100, "Brimstone"
 wrote:

>Peter Thomas wrote:
>> On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:25:36 -0700 (PDT), Doug 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 24 Jun, 09:23, "Brimstone"  wrote:
>>>> Doug wrote:
>>>>> Cars before people now?
>>>>
>>>> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to live
>>>> in and the land reused for the benefit of the community?
>>>
>>> No I am against the dominance of the car cult in our society and am
>>> taking into account the stress of moving house particularly for the
>>> elderly. From the photographs the houses don't look too bad and could
>>> easily be brought up to standard if the wretched car park wasn't
>>> given top priority.
>>
>> Look on it as a positive thing - cars will undoubtedly be parked in
>> the car park - thus freeing the streets up for pedestrians and
>> cyclists.
>
>Doug doesn't do positive. 
>

Exactly what does duhng do? - answers on a pinhead please
-- 
Peter Thomas
Researching: Hone - Oxfordshire & Glamorgan; Samuel(s) - Swansea & Llanelli & Gower;
Thomas - Morriston & Clydach; Harris - Aberdare & Gloucester, Pope - Shropshire; Parker, Shropshire;
Broome - Shropshire.

Peter Thomas wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 10:06:14 +0100, "Brimstone"
>  wrote:
>
>> Peter Thomas wrote:
>>> On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:25:36 -0700 (PDT), Doug 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 24 Jun, 09:23, "Brimstone" 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Doug wrote:
>>>>>> Cars before people now?
>>>>>
>>>>> So are you against people being provided with decent houses to
>>>>> live in and the land reused for the benefit of the community?
>>>>
>>>> No I am against the dominance of the car cult in our society and am
>>>> taking into account the stress of moving house particularly for the
>>>> elderly. From the photographs the houses don't look too bad and
>>>> could easily be brought up to standard if the wretched car park
>>>> wasn't given top priority.
>>>
>>> Look on it as a positive thing - cars will undoubtedly be parked in
>>> the car park - thus freeing the streets up for pedestrians and
>>> cyclists.
>>
>> Doug doesn't do positive.
>>
>
> Exactly what does duhng do? - answers on a pinhead please

Crtcse.

Doug  wrote:

> On 24 Jun, 22:26, %ste...@malloc.co.uk (Steve Firth) wrote:
> > Doug  wrote:
> > > part of the unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough
> >
> > Unwanted by whom? Certainly not unwanted by the people who live in
> > Farnborough. The centre is in dire need of renaovation combining as it
> > does the worst features of 60s and 70s excess and poor construction. The
> > main shopping area is a concrete and rotting wood cladding canyon down
> > which the wind blows hurling grit and fast food wrappers into the faces
> > of anyoen stupid enough to venture out to shop.
> >
> It appears that small shopkeepers have been forced out by huge rent
> rises imposed by a foreign financed property developer which has
> exacerbated the decline.

Bullshit, again. T~he centre has been in serious decloine since the
early 1980s.

> > And no Duhg, it's nothing to do with the motor car. The centre of
> > Farnborough is designed for pedestrians and pedal cyclists with cars
> > being lead around the edge of the centre to car parks from which people
> > are encouraged to walk "some distance" to the shops.
> >
> Looking at a Google map of the place the first thing that springs to
> view is the massive amount of car parking already there and the
> redevelopment intends to sacrifice social housing and chuck people out
> of their homes to make way for even more.

I suspect that you are looking at the car parking on the nearby
industrial estate. Or given your usual powers of observation the car
parking, trade stand area and runways of Farnborough.

Doug  wrote:

> On 24 Jun, 22:26, %ste...@malloc.co.uk (Steve Firth) wrote:
> > Doug  wrote:
> > > part of the unwanted town centre redevelopment in Farnborough
> >
> > Unwanted by whom? Certainly not unwanted by the people who live in
> > Farnborough. The centre is in dire need of renaovation combining as it
> > does the worst features of 60s and 70s excess and poor construction. The
> > main shopping area is a concrete and rotting wood cladding canyon down
> > which the wind blows hurling grit and fast food wrappers into the faces
> > of anyoen stupid enough to venture out to shop.
> >
> It appears that small shopkeepers have been forced out by huge rent
> rises imposed by a foreign financed property developer which has
> exacerbated the decline.
> >
> > And no Duhg, it's nothing to do with the motor car. The centre of
> > Farnborough is designed for pedestrians and pedal cyclists with cars
> > being lead around the edge of the centre to car parks from which people
> > are encouraged to walk "some distance" to the shops.
> >
> Looking at a Google map of the place the first thing that springs to
> view is the massive amount of car parking already there and the
> redevelopment intends to sacrifice social housing and chuck people out
> of their homes to make way for even more.
> 
have you been there? google earth really doesn't cut it.

i've only been though the town center once though i have friends further
out that i stay with from time to time, but it does seem to be as steve
suggests.

> --


roger
-- 
www.rogermerriman.com