As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!

BT seem to have finally hit rock bottom, their Indian billing call centre is
a nightmare, and the UK based operation is only marginally better.

So, I want to leave them.

I need BB (max speed I can get is about 3 Mb) and an all-in-one call package
offering unlimited UK calls to geographic numbers.  Low mobile call rates
would be a bonus.

I waited 19 minutes to speak to Sky Talk - only to be told by their Indian
call centre that I had to also buy Sky TV.

Don't want Sky TV - so the hunt goes on.

Any recommendations?

Thanks

smithie  wrote:
> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!

Please don't multipost. Crossposting if you need to, by all means, though.

Why? It leads to separate discussions where you find some people start
independently repeating what others have said, and you may even find
you get *fewer* responses because people find your posting in several
places and get annoyed.

Thanks
Chris

"Chris Davies"  wrote in message 
news:a7e2r5xuin.ln2@news.roaima.co.uk...
> smithie  wrote:
>> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
>> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>
> Please don't multipost. Crossposting if you need to, by all means, 
> though.<<

---

Ah - there is obviously something wrong with my keyboard.

I *thought* that I was asking for some help in choosing a BB/Phone package - 
what I *actually* appear to have requested is a lecture on Usenet etiquette 
from a passing control freak.

My bad - and thank you for fulfilling my request - even if it was an error 
on my part.

smithie wrote:

> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>
> BT seem to have finally hit rock bottom, their Indian billing call centre is
> a nightmare, and the UK based operation is only marginally better.
>
> So, I want to leave them.
>
> I need BB (max speed I can get is about 3 Mb) and an all-in-one call package
> offering unlimited UK calls to geographic numbers.  Low mobile call rates
> would be a bonus.

All-in-one packages are usually a bad choice. Tiscali's cheap bur fairly crappy
and their support people LIE to you. It took my neighbour TWO MONTHS to get it
working without regular losses in phone and ADSL and even then it was only 2
Mbps. Finally after getting over that hurdle got them to speed it up to 6Mbps,
so they were mis-selling to begin with. On my line next door I can get 1 Mbps
more btw, so I half suspect they're still throttling it.

Graham

"Eeyore"  wrote in message 
news:48DE88D3.4FEAF694@hotmail.com...
>
>
> smithie wrote:
>
>> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
>> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>>
>> BT seem to have finally hit rock bottom, their Indian billing call centre 
>> is
>> a nightmare, and the UK based operation is only marginally better.
>>
>> So, I want to leave them.
>>
>> I need BB (max speed I can get is about 3 Mb) and an all-in-one call 
>> package
>> offering unlimited UK calls to geographic numbers.  Low mobile call rates
>> would be a bonus.
>
> All-in-one packages are usually a bad choice. Tiscali's cheap bur fairly 
> crappy
> and their support people LIE to you. It took my neighbour TWO MONTHS to 
> get it
> working without regular losses in phone and ADSL and even then it was only 
> 2
> Mbps. Finally after getting over that hurdle got them to speed it up to 
> 6Mbps,
> so they were mis-selling to begin with. On my line next door I can get 1 
> Mbps
> more btw, so I half suspect they're still throttling it.
>
> Graham


Thanks for the advice (and thanks even more for resisting the urge to 
lecture me ;)

It does seem hard to get a package that give, both, a good phone service 
*and* a good BB service.

I'd considered Orange - until I read opinions on the BB service.

Virgin I won't have because of Phorm - Tiscali I have heard bad things about 
for a long time, where *to* place my money?, that's the problem.

"smithie"  wrote in message 
news:6k76n4F6c8arU1@mid.individual.net...
> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>
> BT seem to have finally hit rock bottom, their Indian billing call centre 
> is
> a nightmare, and the UK based operation is only marginally better.
>
> So, I want to leave them.
>
> I need BB (max speed I can get is about 3 Mb) and an all-in-one call 
> package
> offering unlimited UK calls to geographic numbers.  Low mobile call rates
> would be a bonus.
>
> I waited 19 minutes to speak to Sky Talk - only to be told by their Indian
> call centre that I had to also buy Sky TV.
>
> Don't want Sky TV - so the hunt goes on.
>
> Any recommendations?
>
> Thanks
>
I'm with PlusNet.
They seem as satisfactory as any and they have a UK call centre
They do a combined package but I only have experience of their broadband
But! They are a wholly owned subsidiary of BT although at present they seem 
to be independent.

B.

"Retired"  wrote in message 
news:HJKdna5T4rUCA0PVnZ2dnUVZ8q2dnZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>
> "smithie"  wrote in message 
> news:6k76n4F6c8arU1@mid.individual.net...
>> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
>> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>>
>> BT seem to have finally hit rock bottom, their Indian billing call centre 
>> is
>> a nightmare, and the UK based operation is only marginally better.
>>
>> So, I want to leave them.
>>
>> I need BB (max speed I can get is about 3 Mb) and an all-in-one call 
>> package
>> offering unlimited UK calls to geographic numbers.  Low mobile call rates
>> would be a bonus.
>>
>> I waited 19 minutes to speak to Sky Talk - only to be told by their 
>> Indian
>> call centre that I had to also buy Sky TV.
>>
>> Don't want Sky TV - so the hunt goes on.
>>
>> Any recommendations?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
> I'm with PlusNet.
> They seem as satisfactory as any and they have a UK call centre
> They do a combined package but I only have experience of their broadband
> But! They are a wholly owned subsidiary of BT although at present they 
> seem to be independent.


Thanks - does the BT connection (no pun) mean that PlusNet implement Phorm?

On 27/09/2008 22:00, smithie wrote:

> does the BT connection (no pun) mean that PlusNet implement Phorm? 

 From http://phormwatch.blogspot.com/

	'Neil Armstrong, Products Director of PlusNet sent me an email
	with an official company statement: "We have not trialled Phorm
	and have no plans to do so."'

They'll lose this satisfied customer if they ever change their tune.

smithie wrote:
>
> I *thought* that I was asking for some help in choosing a BB/Phone package - 
> what I *actually* appear to have requested is a lecture on Usenet etiquette 
> from a passing control freak.

Its a free world - if you screw up your postings, expect to get it 
pointed out to you. By the way unlike yourself Chris was very polite.

> My bad - and thank you for fulfilling my request - even if it was an error 
> on my part. 

You could always shout down a well if you need the exercise?

"Mark McIntyre"  wrote in message 
news:eVyDk.60472$wc2.22604@en-nntp-01.am2.easynews.com...
> smithie wrote:
>>
>> I *thought* that I was asking for some help in choosing a BB/Phone 
>> package - what I *actually* appear to have requested is a lecture on 
>> Usenet etiquette from a passing control freak.
>
> Its a free world - if you screw up your postings, expect to get it pointed 
> out to you. By the way unlike yourself Chris was very polite.<<


Ah, well, I'm not polite - and that's why I'm telling you to go and fuck 
yourself.

-----------

>
>> My bad - and thank you for fulfilling my request - even if it was an 
>> error on my part.
>
> You could always shout down a well if you need the exercise?<<


Nah - I'd rather tell tossers like you to, er, go and fuck themselves. (it's 
more fun, and avoids lichen stains on clothing)

Eeyore wrote:
> 
> It took my neighbour TWO MONTHS to get it
> working without regular losses in phone and ADSL and even then it was only 2
> Mbps. 

To be fair to the support people, the problem was most likely the line 
going to your neighbour's house and/or his in-house wiring. Its a bit 
gratuitous to blame Tiscali for that (not that I'd touch them with a 
bargepole myself but...).

> more btw, so I half suspect they're still throttling it.

Golly, you do like conspiracy theories, don't you?

Chris Davies wrote:

> smithie  wrote:
> > As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
> > BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>
> Please don't multipost.

Where did he multipost btw ?

Graham

smithie wrote:

> "Mark McIntyre" wrote
> > smithie wrote:
> >>
> >> I *thought* that I was asking for some help in choosing a BB/Phone
> >> package - what I *actually* appear to have requested is a lecture on
> >> Usenet etiquette from a passing control freak.
> >
> > Its a free world - if you screw up your postings, expect to get it pointed
> > out to you. By the way unlike yourself Chris was very polite.<<
>
> Ah, well, I'm not polite - and that's why I'm telling you to go and fuck
> yourself.

Don't worry. Mark normally deserves it.

Graham

smithie wrote:

> "Eeyore"  wrote in message
> > smithie wrote:
> >
> >> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
> >> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
> >>
> >> BT seem to have finally hit rock bottom, their Indian billing call centre
> >> is a nightmare, and the UK based operation is only marginally better.
> >>
> >> So, I want to leave them.
> >>
> >> I need BB (max speed I can get is about 3 Mb) and an all-in-one call
> >> package offering unlimited UK calls to geographic numbers.  Low mobile call
> rates
> >> would be a bonus.
> >
> > All-in-one packages are usually a bad choice. Tiscali's cheap bur fairly
> > crappy and their support people LIE to you. It took my neighbour TWO MONTHS
> to
> > get it working without regular losses in phone and ADSL and even then it was
> only
> > 2 Mbps. Finally after getting over that hurdle got them to speed it up to
> > 6Mbps, so they were mis-selling to begin with. On my line next door I can
> get 1
> > Mbps more btw, so I half suspect they're still throttling it.
> >
> > Graham
>
> Thanks for the advice (and thanks even more for resisting the urge to
> lecture me ;)
>
> It does seem hard to get a package that give, both, a good phone service
> *and* a good BB service.
>
> I'd considered Orange - until I read opinions on the BB service.
>
> Virgin I won't have because of Phorm - Tiscali I have heard bad things about
> for a long time, where *to* place my money?, that's the problem.

Almost invariably, the companies offering 'all-in one' packages are the scum of
the bunch. Sky, funnily enough tends to get good reviews, but if you don't want
the TV, that's not much help.

What are your download requirements btw ? There are some inexpensive deals out
there for light users. Plusnet comes to mind.

You can get cheap or near free calls from companies like 1899 anyway. That's
what I do. Free calls in the UK after the connection charge and 1p a minute to
the States even (mobile or fixed).

Graham

Mark McIntyre wrote:

> Eeyore wrote:
> >
> > It took my neighbour TWO MONTHS to get it
> > working without regular losses in phone and ADSL and even then it was only 2
> > Mbps.
>
> To be fair to the support people, the problem was most likely the line
> going to your neighbour's house and/or his in-house wiring.

IT WASN'T, MR FUCKING KNOW ALL. No-one tech ever once entered the house (except me
to check for obvious faults and minimise the possibilities).

It was the change to LLU that buggered it. He'd had Tiscali BB for several years
on a line with BT without a hitch before Tiscali took his line over. Totally
incompetent bunch of cnuts. And they NEVER ring back despite being so assured many
tens of times. My poor neighbour was 'utterly desperate' at one point at the
appalling level of non-service. It cost hima fortune on his mobile too since that
was his only was to contact what they laughingly call 'support'.

Graham

smithie wrote:

> "Retired"  wrote
> >>
> > I'm with PlusNet.
> > They seem as satisfactory as any and they have a UK call centre
> > They do a combined package but I only have experience of their broadband
> > But! They are a wholly owned subsidiary of BT although at present they
> > seem to be independent.
>
> Thanks - does the BT connection (no pun) mean that PlusNet implement Phorm?

It seems not but I had a horrid 2 months when Plusnet teamed up with Tiscali,
LLU'd me without my knowledge or consent, and couldn't or wouldn't address the
resulting fault i.e. call out a BT engineer.

That caused me to leave them and join Idnet, since at the time very few ISPs
accepted free transfers from LLU'd lines (they charged a new connection fee).
Idnet had a BT engineer on the premises PDQ and he found and fixed the basic
fault within 15 mins.

Beware of being tied into long deals too with combined services, they have you
over a barrel. Idnet however requires only one month's notice. It does cost a
little bit more but is a truly premium service. Just see the reviews at
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ or http://www.dslzoneuk.net/. But they don't do
phones. None of the good ISPs do AFAIK.

Graham

Eeyore wrote:

> smithie wrote:
>
> > "Retired"  wrote
> > >>
> > > I'm with PlusNet.
> > > They seem as satisfactory as any and they have a UK call centre
> > > They do a combined package but I only have experience of their broadband
> > > But! They are a wholly owned subsidiary of BT although at present they
> > > seem to be independent.
> >
> > Thanks - does the BT connection (no pun) mean that PlusNet implement Phorm?
>
> It seems not but I had a horrid 2 months when Plusnet teamed up with Tiscali,
> LLU'd me without my knowledge or consent, and couldn't or wouldn't address the
> resulting fault i.e. call out a BT engineer.
>
> That caused me to leave them and join Idnet, since at the time very few ISPs
> accepted free transfers from LLU'd lines (they charged a new connection fee).
> Idnet had a BT engineer on the premises PDQ and he found and fixed the basic
> fault within 15 mins.
>
> Beware of being tied into long deals too with combined services, they have you
> over a barrel. Idnet however requires only one month's notice. It does cost a
> little bit more but is a truly premium service. Just see the reviews at
> http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ or http://www.dslzoneuk.net/. But they don't do
> phones. None of the good ISPs do AFAIK.

http://www.dslzoneuk.net/isp_ratings.php#
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/isp/compare.html?isp_16=1&isp_13=1&isp_77=1&isp_21=1&isp_23=1&commit=Compare

FYI

Graham

"Eeyore"  wrote in message 
news:48DF345C.82382CFF@hotmail.com...
>
>
> smithie wrote:
>
>> "Retired"  wrote
>> >>
>> > I'm with PlusNet.
>> > They seem as satisfactory as any and they have a UK call centre
>> > They do a combined package but I only have experience of their 
>> > broadband
>> > But! They are a wholly owned subsidiary of BT although at present they
>> > seem to be independent.
>>
>> Thanks - does the BT connection (no pun) mean that PlusNet implement 
>> Phorm?
>
> It seems not but I had a horrid 2 months when Plusnet teamed up with 
> Tiscali,
> LLU'd me without my knowledge or consent, and couldn't or wouldn't address 
> the
> resulting fault i.e. call out a BT engineer.
>
> That caused me to leave them and join Idnet, since at the time very few 
> ISPs
> accepted free transfers from LLU'd lines (they charged a new connection 
> fee).
> Idnet had a BT engineer on the premises PDQ and he found and fixed the 
> basic
> fault within 15 mins.
>
> Beware of being tied into long deals too with combined services, they have 
> you
> over a barrel. Idnet however requires only one month's notice. It does 
> cost a
> little bit more but is a truly premium service. Just see the reviews at
> http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ or http://www.dslzoneuk.net/. But they 
> don't do
> phones. None of the good ISPs do AFAIK.
>
> Graham
>

O2 seem to have a good rating see http://www.dslzoneuk.net/isp_ratings.php
Trevor Smith

"Eeyore"  wrote in message 
news:48DF320B.6F087B63@hotmail.com...
>
>
> Chris Davies wrote:
>
>> smithie  wrote:
>> > As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
>> > BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>>
>> Please don't multipost.
>
> Where did he multipost btw ?
>
> Graham

-------


I think I might have overreacted a bit - but I am *so* weary of bored anal 
retentive's who appear to have nothing better to do than patrol Usenet 
looking infringements of etiquette, real or imagined.

I haven't participated in newsgroups for ages - and I remember, now, why I 
gave it up ;)

Unless conventions have altered lately, X-posting was considered to be *the* 
no-no - not posting the same civil question on two groups.

All I can say is, it's lucky for me that I didn't top-post! - the etiquette 
Nazi's would have ordered my immediate execution.

(bet he calls 'Godwin's' now....)

"smithie"  wrote in message 
news:6k76n4F6c8arU1@mid.individual.net...
> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!
>
> BT seem to have finally hit rock bottom, their Indian billing call centre 
> is
> a nightmare, and the UK based operation is only marginally better.
>
> So, I want to leave them.
>
> I need BB (max speed I can get is about 3 Mb) and an all-in-one call 
> package
> offering unlimited UK calls to geographic numbers.  Low mobile call rates
> would be a bonus.
>
> I waited 19 minutes to speak to Sky Talk - only to be told by their Indian
> call centre that I had to also buy Sky TV.

Even the most useless contributor to this group is likely to give better 
advice, even if they respond at random...

Incidentally when the $ky SMC was in Glasgow it was actually worse.

Tip - always send everything to $ky in writing by recorded delivery...

>
> Don't want Sky TV - so the hunt goes on.
>
> Any recommendations?
>
> Thanks
>

smithie wrote:
> As per the title - I'd appreciate some input about choosing a decent
> BB/Phone deal - preferably with a UK based billing centre!

Well, not sure of the advantages associated with UK billing but one 
report that goes beyond subjective customer satisfaction (which may be 
open to manipulation since who directs people to the ratings sites?) is 
available at http://www.samknows.com/broadband/pm/PM_Summer_08.pdf.

I do not feel qualified to judge the methodology but Sam Crawford 
certainly seems to know what he is doing.  Summary:

"- In the majority of metrics there was little discernable difference 
between most
ISPs;
- Zen Internet offered the fewest failures across all metrics;
- Virgin Media’s cable services and Be/O2’s services provided a 
consistently low latency throughout, whilst Virgin.Net (Virgin’s ADSL 
service) performed poorly;
- BT provided the fastest throughput when measured as a percentage of 
implied line speed (an estimate of the potential maximum speed of the line);
- Be/O2 and Virgin Media produced the greatest raw throughput (in 
megabits per second), which can likely be attributed to the nature of 
their products;
- Virgin Media’s cable throughput remained consistent on their 2, 4 and
10Mbps products, but was quite variable on their 20Mbps product;
- Testing highlighted the use of traffic shaping in the networks of BT 
and PlusNet, which resulted in certain classes of traffic slowing 
significantly during peak hours."

Chris