Have just reread a ludicrous article in this weeks Sunday Times by Tony 
Kikham the head arborist,or whatever he's called about the death of our 
native British trees due to (you've guessed it) 'climate change '.
He starts off by saying ,'a short time ago seasons used to be almost equal 
periods ,winter and summer were quite well balanced,which is what you would 
associate with a temperate climate like ours.Now you can't predict when ones 
going to start and anothers going to finish'.
He then goes on to say 'For the last five years in the southeast we have 
been in drought conditions,blah blah ,there's been a shortage of rain in the 
winter,blah blah plus the summers have been very dry as well'.
There's much much more along similar lines,which made me think I was reading 
the Express or worse still,the Mail !.
Presumably nobody will bother to challenge him,as this sort of nonsense is 
now engrained into the publics psyche,summers like this one and the last are 
ignored because that don't fit into the tropcal model we are told is 
becoming the norm. Our rainfall will continue to fluctuate as much as it's 
ever done,and I shall continue to rant in the corner whilst the 'experts' 
predict even more dire conditions for my grandchildren.
Apparently I am not a 'denialist' but a 'sceptic',perhaps I wll let them put 
that on my tombstone.....

RonB

On Aug 5, 7:29 pm, "ronaldbutton"  wrote:
>
> Have just reread a ludicrous article in this week's Sunday Times by Tony
> Kikham the head arborist, or whatever he's called, about the death of our
> native British trees due to (you've guessed it) 'climate change '.
>
> He starts off by saying:
> 'a short time ago seasons used to be almost equal
> periods, winter and summer were quite well balanced, which is what you would
> associate with a temperate climate like ours.Now you can't predict when one's
> going to start and anothers going to finish'.
>
> He then goes on to say 'For the last five years in the southeast we have
> been in drought conditions...
> there's been a shortage of rain in the winter...
> plus the summers have been very dry as well'.
>
> Presumably nobody will bother to challenge him, as this sort of nonsense is
> now engrained into the public psyche,.
>
> Summers like this one and the last are
> ignored because that don't fit into the tropcal model we are told is
> becoming the norm.
>
> Our rainfall will continue to fluctuate as much as it's
> ever done and I shall continue to rant in the corner whilst the 'experts'
> predict even more dire conditions for my grandchildren.
>
> Apparently I am not a 'denialist' but a 'sceptic', perhaps I wll let them put
> that on my tombstone.....

Apart from his suposition he is correct.

It may be down to your innate biggotry that the supposition is
rendered incorrectly. But since you had the foresight not to include a
link, we will not find out until someone m,ore rational buys the paper/
reads the article online.

He is evidentally talking about a region he is familiar with and is
out in almost every day and not just to read the meter too neither.

He is concerned with several species of vegetable and they are under
assault. If he is a fool he should be removed from office.

The supposition he bases his regrets on is climate change. But the
death of British trees is or was World War One not 'climate change'.

Something is damaging his trees and it has damaged his environment.
Something is causing stress in large vegetables. Judging by the levels
of stress indicated by the violence of the 20th century, vegetables
are not the only victims.

On Aug 6, 1:13 am, Weatherlawyer  wrote:
> On Aug 5, 7:29 pm, "ronaldbutton"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Have just reread a ludicrous article in this week's Sunday Times by Tony
> > Kikham the head arborist, or whatever he's called, about the death of our
> > native British trees due to (you've guessed it) 'climate change '.
>
> > He starts off by saying:
> > 'a short time ago seasons used to be almost equal
> > periods, winter and summer were quite well balanced, which is what you would
> > associate with a temperate climate like ours.Now you can't predict when one's
> > going to start and anothers going to finish'.
>
> > He then goes on to say 'For the last five years in the southeast we have
> > been in drought conditions...
> > there's been a shortage of rain in the winter...
> > plus the summers have been very dry as well'.
>
> > Presumably nobody will bother to challenge him, as this sort of nonsense is
> > now engrained into the public psyche,.
>
> > Summers like this one and the last are
> > ignored because that don't fit into the tropcal model we are told is
> > becoming the norm.
>
> > Our rainfall will continue to fluctuate as much as it's
> > ever done and I shall continue to rant in the corner whilst the 'experts'
> > predict even more dire conditions for my grandchildren.
>
> > Apparently I am not a 'denialist' but a 'sceptic', perhaps I wll let them put
> > that on my tombstone.....
>
> Apart from his suposition he is correct.
>
> It may be down to your innate biggotry that the supposition is
> rendered incorrectly. But since you had the foresight not to include a
> link, we will not find out until someone m,ore rational buys the paper/
> reads the article online.
>
> He is evidentally talking about a region he is familiar with and is
> out in almost every day and not just to read the meter too neither.
>
> He is concerned with several species of vegetable and they are under
> assault. If he is a fool he should be removed from office.
>
> The supposition he bases his regrets on is climate change. But the
> death of British trees is or was World War One not 'climate change'.
>
> Something is damaging his trees and it has damaged his environment.
> Something is causing stress in large vegetables. Judging by the levels
> of stress indicated by the violence of the 20th century, vegetables
> are not the only victims.

Presumably this is the article Ron is referring to: "Oak and ash in
retreat as UK hots up"
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article4449530.ece

The article mentions the the Beech Avenue at Kingston Lacy.  See:
http://www.whitemill.org/z0003.htm
Its fate is discussed here:
http://www.tree-care.info/uktc/archive/2008/msg02754

Its seems to depend more on protecting gas-guzzling motorists from
falling branches caused by the ravages of old age rather than the
stresses caused by climate change.

Cheers, Alastair.

On Aug 6, 1:23 pm, Alastair  wrote:
> On Aug 6, 1:13 am, Weatherlawyer  wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Aug 5, 7:29 pm, "ronaldbutton"  wrote:
>
> > > Have just reread a ludicrous article in this week's Sunday Times by Tony
> > > Kikham the head arborist, or whatever he's called, about the death of our
> > > native British trees due to (you've guessed it) 'climate change '.
>
> > > He starts off by saying:
> > > 'a short time ago seasons used to be almost equal
> > > periods, winter and summer were quite well balanced, which is what you would
> > > associate with a temperate climate like ours.Now you can't predict when one's
> > > going to start and anothers going to finish'.
>
> > > He then goes on to say 'For the last five years in the southeast we have
> > > been in drought conditions...
> > > there's been a shortage of rain in the winter...
> > > plus the summers have been very dry as well'.
>
> > > Presumably nobody will bother to challenge him, as this sort of nonsense is
> > > now engrained into the public psyche,.
>
> > > Summers like this one and the last are
> > > ignored because that don't fit into the tropcal model we are told is
> > > becoming the norm.
>
> > > Our rainfall will continue to fluctuate as much as it's
> > > ever done and I shall continue to rant in the corner whilst the 'experts'
> > > predict even more dire conditions for my grandchildren.
>
> > > Apparently I am not a 'denialist' but a 'sceptic', perhaps I wll let them put
> > > that on my tombstone.....
>
> > Apart from his suposition he is correct.
>
> > It may be down to your innate biggotry that the supposition is
> > rendered incorrectly. But since you had the foresight not to include a
> > link, we will not find out until someone m,ore rational buys the paper/
> > reads the article online.
>
> > He is evidentally talking about a region he is familiar with and is
> > out in almost every day and not just to read the meter too neither.
>
> > He is concerned with several species of vegetable and they are under
> > assault. If he is a fool he should be removed from office.
>
> > The supposition he bases his regrets on is climate change. But the
> > death of British trees is or was World War One not 'climate change'.
>
> > Something is damaging his trees and it has damaged his environment.
> > Something is causing stress in large vegetables. Judging by the levels
> > of stress indicated by the violence of the 20th century, vegetables
> > are not the only victims.
>
> Presumably this is the article Ron is referring to: "Oak and ash in
> retreat as UK hots up"http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article4449530.ece

I doubt it. The article there is fair, balanced and well written.

"Scientists are cautious about making exact predictions about how the
climate will alter, partly because there is uncertainty over how the
global temperature rise of 2C-3C generally forecast by 2050 will
affect Britain.

Some experts believe that Britain should protect its woodlands by
planting varieties better able to cope."

What is wrong with that sort of remark?

> The article mentions the the Beech Avenue at Kingston Lacy.  See:http://www.whitemill.org/z0003.htm
> Its fate is discussed here:http://www.tree-care.info/uktc/archive/2008/msg02754
>
> Its seems to depend more on protecting gas-guzzling motorists from
> falling branches caused by the ravages of old age rather than the
> stresses caused by climate change.

"The National Trust is launching a celebration of the avenue in
anticipation
of its gradual removal at http://tiny.cc/4xmAz . At current rates it
will be
virtually gone in 20 years and will have lost its majestic avenue
effect much
much sooner."

Most people these days don't realise that with WW I the pressure to
get the last bean out of each field that was put on farmers turned
into the beurocracy thet put farming intyhe parlus state of play it is
in now.

With a blockade in place and a desperate need for timber in France,
uprooting trees became a major force for the military. fterwards
horses began to be replaced and humanity went with them. There was a
premium on uprooting hedges until recently and the use of pesticides
coupled with bad forest management all combined to ruin the rural
ecology.

Trees are not equipped to take a lot of pressure because they are no
longer a crop. We keep them past their sell by date because of a
misguided attitude towards them.

That and the short-sightedness that failed to plant their replacements
a long time ago. They were still uprooting hedges for cash when those
trees needed replacing. Or at least some preparation for the
inevitable.

You can't expect a mature broadleaf to cope so well with fairly dry
seasons when the run off is geared to drain the land immediately. No
proof of glowballs was offered. The fact is that drained land and
large trees don't mix.

And finally;
We know so little about fungi that comments -even by garden experts,
tree surgeons and the like, can not be taken as  the last word on the
subject. Far from it.

The fact that some fungi are getting out of control speaks more of
poor husbandry than it does of burning oil.

never
"Weatherlawyer"  wrote in message 
news:2a4e87fd-4a85-4caf-b343-708fb1c500e5@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 6, 1:23 pm, Alastair  wrote:
>> On Aug 6, 1:13 am, Weatherlawyer  wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Aug 5, 7:29 pm, "ronaldbutton"  wrote:
>>
>> > > Have just reread a ludicrous article in this week's Sunday Times by 
>> > > Tony
>> > > Kikham the head arborist, or whatever he's called, about the death of 
>> > > our
>> > > native British trees due to (you've guessed it) 'climate change '.
>>
>> > > He starts off by saying:
>> > > 'a short time ago seasons used to be almost equal
>> > > periods, winter and summer were quite well balanced, which is what 
>> > > you would
>> > > associate with a temperate climate like ours.Now you can't predict 
>> > > when one's
>> > > going to start and anothers going to finish'.
>>
>> > > He then goes on to say 'For the last five years in the southeast we 
>> > > have
>> > > been in drought conditions...
>> > > there's been a shortage of rain in the winter...
>> > > plus the summers have been very dry as well'.
>>
>> > > Presumably nobody will bother to challenge him, as this sort of 
>> > > nonsense is
>> > > now engrained into the public psyche,.
>>
>> > > Summers like this one and the last are
>> > > ignored because that don't fit into the tropcal model we are told is
>> > > becoming the norm.
>>
>> > > Our rainfall will continue to fluctuate as much as it's
>> > > ever done and I shall continue to rant in the corner whilst the 
>> > > 'experts'
>> > > predict even more dire conditions for my grandchildren.
>>
>> > > Apparently I am not a 'denialist' but a 'sceptic', perhaps I wll let 
>> > > them put
>> > > that on my tombstone.....
>>
>> > Apart from his suposition he is correct.
>>
>> > It may be down to your innate biggotry that the supposition is
>> > rendered incorrectly. But since you had the foresight not to include a
>> > link, we will not find out until someone m,ore rational buys the paper/
>> > reads the article online.
>>
>> > He is evidentally talking about a region he is familiar with and is
>> > out in almost every day and not just to read the meter too neither.
>>
>> > He is concerned with several species of vegetable and they are under
>> > assault. If he is a fool he should be removed from office.
>>
>> > The supposition he bases his regrets on is climate change. But the
>> > death of British trees is or was World War One not 'climate change'.
>>
>> > Something is damaging his trees and it has damaged his environment.
>> > Something is causing stress in large vegetables. Judging by the levels
>> > of stress indicated by the violence of the 20th century, vegetables
>> > are not the only victims.
>>
>> Presumably this is the article Ron is referring to: "Oak and ash in
>> retreat as UK hots 
>> up"http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article4449530.ece
>
> I doubt it. The article there is fair, balanced and well written.
>
> "Scientists are cautious about making exact predictions about how the
> climate will alter, partly because there is uncertainty over how the
> global temperature rise of 2C-3C generally forecast by 2050 will
> affect Britain.
>
> Some experts believe that Britain should protect its woodlands by
> planting varieties better able to cope."
>
> What is wrong with that sort of remark?
>
>> The article mentions the the Beech Avenue at Kingston Lacy. 
>> See:http://www.whitemill.org/z0003.htm
>> Its fate is discussed 
>> here:http://www.tree-care.info/uktc/archive/2008/msg02754
>>
>> Its seems to depend more on protecting gas-guzzling motorists from
>> falling branches caused by the ravages of old age rather than the
>> stresses caused by climate change.
>
> "The National Trust is launching a celebration of the avenue in
> anticipation
> of its gradual removal at http://tiny.cc/4xmAz . At current rates it
> will be
> virtually gone in 20 years and will have lost its majestic avenue
> effect much
> much sooner."
>
> Most people these days don't realise that with WW I the pressure to
> get the last bean out of each field that was put on farmers turned
> into the beurocracy thet put farming intyhe parlus state of play it is
> in now.
>
> With a blockade in place and a desperate need for timber in France,
> uprooting trees became a major force for the military. fterwards
> horses began to be replaced and humanity went with them. There was a
> premium on uprooting hedges until recently and the use of pesticides
> coupled with bad forest management all combined to ruin the rural
> ecology.
>
> Trees are not equipped to take a lot of pressure because they are no
> longer a crop. We keep them past their sell by date because of a
> misguided attitude towards them.
>
> That and the short-sightedness that failed to plant their replacements
> a long time ago. They were still uprooting hedges for cash when those
> trees needed replacing. Or at least some preparation for the
> inevitable.
>
> You can't expect a mature broadleaf to cope so well with fairly dry
> seasons when the run off is geared to drain the land immediately. No
> proof of glowballs was offered. The fact is that drained land and
> large trees don't mix.
>
> And finally;
> We know so little about fungi that comments -even by garden experts,
> tree surgeons and the like, can not be taken as  the last word on the
> subject. Far from it.
>
> The fact that some fungi are getting out of control speaks more of
> poor husbandry than it does of burning oil.