Sorry.  Because I don't live in the fucking South-West
(thank God!) no-one will be interested and the information has
therefore been withdrawn.
          I'm off - posting here is pointless and I have better things
to do with my time than try and muscle in on a group of smug, self-
centred arseholes.  That cunt Dawlish will have one less enemy but you
can deal with him yourselves.  Meantime, I hope your fucking houses
are washed away.  Don't reply.  I mean it.

TH

"Tudor Hughes"  wrote in message 
news:9c495749-f7e9-4d18-9175-ec2a5e14140d@s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
>          Sorry.  Because I don't live in the fucking South-West
> (thank God!) no-one will be interested and the information has
> therefore been withdrawn.
>          I'm off - posting here is pointless and I have better things
> to do with my time than try and muscle in on a group of smug, self-
> centred arseholes.  That cunt Dawlish will have one less enemy but you
> can deal with him yourselves.  Meantime, I hope your fucking houses
> are washed away.  Don't reply.  I mean it.

ISTM that only you and DaveR have any problem with the SW brigade.
That idiot 'NE Zephyr' doesn't count as he just follewd Dawlish here
from elsewhere.
Still, as this is easily the most foul-mouthed post I'm seen on this
group in 10 years you're probably better off leaving anyway.
-- 
Col

Bolton, Lancashire
160m asl

On Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:15:14 -0700 (PDT), Tudor Hughes 
wrote:

>...
>I'm off - posting here is pointless and I have better things
>to do with my time than try and muscle in on a group of smug, self-
>centred arseholes. 
>...

Don't be so daft and never, ever post before breakfast.

-- 
Alan White
Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
Twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, overlooking Lochs Long and Goil in Argyll, Scotland.
Webcam and weather:- http://windycroft.gt-britain.co.uk/weather

Tudor Hughes wrote:

>      [expletives deleted]

Well, Tudor had been heading for my kill-file for a while and now he's saved
me the trouble. Good riddance.

-- 
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks., UK.  E-mail: newsman not newsboy

Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated from TH 
himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur in this 
instance?Permit the accused to explain the circumstances if possible prior 
the hard and fast accusations.

On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 11:44:02 +0100, jovian hypercane wrote in
<news:Vl1ck.249510$1B6.69608@newsfe21.ams2> 

> Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated from TH 
> himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur in this 
> instance?Permit the accused to explain the circumstances if possible prior 
> the hard and fast accusations.

That was my initial reaction, but a look at the headers of the post
suggests it was indeed Tudor.

-- 
Mike Tullett - Coleraine 55.13°N 6.69°W  posted 06/07/2008 10:55:11  GMT

> Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated from TH
> himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur in this
> instance?

I find it inconceivable that it orginated from TH.  Totally out of
character.

Assuming someone did post under his name, how easy would that be?  If
it is indeed easy, then it gives us all cause for great concern.   All
sorts of false accusations could fly around.

Jack

Impersonation does occur in political newsgroups.Whether all disguise can be 
picked up in the message source field I don't know ,not being computerate.It 
concerns me immensely just how much obscene material manages to filter 
through to what is a very sensible and technical newsgroup such as this.



>
> I find it inconceivable that it orginated from TH.  Totally out of
> character.
>
> Assuming someone did post under his name, how easy would that be?  If
> it is indeed easy, then it gives us all cause for great concern.   All
> sorts of false accusations could fly around.
>
> Jack

On Jul 6, 11:44 am, "jovian hypercane" <jovian hypercane@global
warming .com> wrote:
> Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated from TH
> himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur in this
> instance?Permit the accused to explain the circumstances if possible prior
> the hard and fast accusations.

I honestly think that's a good idea. I know Tudor doesn't love what I
say and he has forthright views about people, but that is way, way,
out of character, for an obviously well educated man.

Paul

"Jack (jack.harrison@gmail.com)"  wrote in
news:5193eb88-db0a-4022-8bfb-53b00f2b8ba7@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com: 

>> Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated
>> from TH himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur
>> in this instance?
> 
> I find it inconceivable that it orginated from TH.  Totally out of
> character.

Or, given the time of the post, a rant after one too many ales?!

Richard

"Richard Dixon"  wrote in message 
news:Xns9AD3A30FEBCA7rdngemailyahoocouk@69.16.176.253...
> "Jack (jack.harrison@gmail.com)"  wrote in
> news:5193eb88-db0a-4022-8bfb-53b00f2b8ba7@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com:
>
>>> Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated
>>> from TH himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur
>>> in this instance?
>>
>> I find it inconceivable that it orginated from TH.  Totally out of
>> character.
>
> Or, given the time of the post, a rant after one too many ales?!

Indeed, that's something that occured to me.
Never mind all this dark talk about imposters and agent provocateurs,
the simplest explanation is usually the best. We know Tudor had
become increasingly irritated by the predominace of SW posts and
perhaps he just lost it with a belly full of beer and decided to vent
his spleen?
-- 
Col

Bolton, Lancashire
160m asl

On 6 Jul, 13:13, Dawlish  wrote:
> On Jul 6, 11:44 am, "jovian hypercane" <jovian hypercane@global
>
> warming .com> wrote:
> > Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated from TH
> > himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur in this
> > instance?Permit the accused to explain the circumstances if possible prior
> > the hard and fast accusations.
>
> I honestly think that's a good idea. I know Tudor doesn't love what I
> say and he has forthright views about people, but that is way, way,
> out of character, for an obviously well educated man.
>
> Paul

I hope Tudor decides to return, and I've been trying my best not to
respond to your patronising posts, but  I've just had a couple of
drinks, so I don't care. I hope you reflect on your remarks regarding
low income families, single mothers, in fact anyone who some elitist
snob.

E.g.
"Like I say, the understanding  of such terms as "weather advisory" is
OK for anyone reading this site, but most of the people here are in
the highest educational elite, many of us having degrees, some of us
several and some of us members of some pretty elite academic
organisations, which are truly arcane when viewed in the wider context
of life! "
or
"A "Hydrometeorological" unit is a very nice word, but I'm not sure
many single parents and low-income workers would be able to say it,"

I find remarks like that offensive. I think you'll find a good
proportion of lifeboatmen are on low incomes, but manage to understand
the shipping forecast. Having a degree doesn't make you a better
person, but can make it easier to become a patronising bastard.

Just a personal view, Weatherlawyer was so nice in retropspect.

Feel free to have the last word.

Graham
Penzance

On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 04:41:18 -0700 (PDT), "Jack
(jack.harrison@gmail.com)"  wrote:

>I find it inconceivable that it orginated from TH.  Totally out of
>character.

After my little spat with 'Dawlish' at the beginning of May when he was
attempting to whip up a vendetta against 'Weatherlawyer', I received an
e-mail from him. It was couched in terms so vicious that I deleted it
before Lesley could read it and put 'Dawlish' into my e-mail kill file.
It concluded by referring to the 'bitterness festering in my guts'.

If Tudor has been a recipient of the sort of e-mail that I received and
hasn't killed them at source after the first one then I can quite easily
believe that he posted what he has. While I don't agree with his
language I endorse his sentiments.

Given the above, the latest from 'Dawlish' in this thread is so mind
boggling in its hypocrisy that words fail me, which is probably just as
well.

It's all very sad.

Sorry about this, but I thought the background should be known..

I've e-mailed Tudor, called him an idiot and offered a shoulder. I think
he might need it.

-- 
Alan White
Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
Twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, overlooking Lochs Long and Goil in Argyll, Scotland.
Webcam and weather:- http://windycroft.gt-britain.co.uk/weather

On Jul 6, 5:55 pm, Alan White  wrote:
> On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 04:41:18 -0700 (PDT), "Jack
>
> (jack.harri...@gmail.com)"  wrote:
> >I find it inconceivable that it orginated from TH.  Totally out of
> >character.
>
> After my little spat with 'Dawlish' at the beginning of May when he was
> attempting to whip up a vendetta against 'Weatherlawyer', I received an
> e-mail from him. It was couched in terms so vicious that I deleted it
> before Lesley could read it and put 'Dawlish' into my e-mail kill file.
> It concluded by referring to the 'bitterness festering in my guts'.
>
> If Tudor has been a recipient of the sort of e-mail that I received and
> hasn't killed them at source after the first one then I can quite easily
> believe that he posted what he has. While I don't agree with his
> language I endorse his sentiments.
>
> Given the above, the latest from 'Dawlish' in this thread is so mind
> boggling in its hypocrisy that words fail me, which is probably just as
> well.
>
> It's all very sad.
>
> Sorry about this, but I thought the background should be known..
>
> I've e-mailed Tudor, called him an idiot and offered a shoulder. I think
> he might need it.
>
> --
> Alan White
> Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
> Twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, overlooking Lochs Long and Goil in Argyll, Scotland.
> Webcam and weather:-http://windycroft.gt-britain.co.uk/weather

That deserves a response in defence.

I can assure you that our correspondence (two-way, Alan, not one way,
with very similar sentiments on both sides and culminating, actually,
in no particularly bad feeling, which is good - I thought the
background should be known too) was nothing like the email I received
from Tudor, saying "goodbye" today and please don't try to stir up
feelings by innuendo and assumption about the supposed content of my
personal correspondence with anyone. I could forward the penultimate
email I recieved from Tudor, should you wish and the sentiments
contained within might surprise you, but I would never publish actual
email content from anyone, even in my own defence. The support I have
in my inbox for posting and also standing up about various issues,
since I started in the discussion group is very heartening, I can
assure you. It is far greater than the emails from Tudor, some
correspondence with yorself and also with W. However, I don't suppose
you would wish me to forward to you your friend's email to me today.
There is no way that I could ever condone support in any way, shape,
or form, from abusive people, in public, on weather sites, or
discussion boards. Never have, never will. Defending people against
bullies and abusers has got me into trouble many times and I don't
regret those actions in the slightest. I'd do the same again without
fear, or favour.

It was Tudor who wrote that post, amazingly enough. After a post like
that, good riddance, but I doubt someone with axes as blunt as his
will be able to stay away from grinding them for long.

It is, as you say Alan, all very sad. Putting one's case and arguing
it well, keeping personal insults and feelings away from the
discussion group, is by far the best way. BUT, I would always reserve
the right to defend myself and support others, should they need it
from abuse such as is perpetrated by a (thankfully) tiny number of
people in public, on the boards.

Paul



Graham, please read that post on the weather warnings again. In
Education, I work with all sorts of disadvantaged groups and all the
research shows that poverty is inextricably linked to poor literacy
standards. I argued at length about that on another thread. I was
talking about the percieved elitism of another poster, now gone. It's
a fact that many on here are very highly educated and members of some
(to the general public) very arcane organisations. It's also a fact
that the old and the poor aren't accessing weather warnings, well
enough. My point was that it isn't their fault. It's so easy for
people to assume that others have the same capabilities as themselves.
They don't and the EA and the MetO have to bear that in mind. The Pitt
report highlights that beautifully.

Patronising bastard eh? Nice touch! Argue your case sober. People who
use the word "patronising" usually do so because the argument they
face is a difficult one to counter and it's easier to snipe than
present a cogent argument in response. People who argue well very
seldom use that term. I always retain the right to defence, Graham,
should you insult me in public. I never have you, until that attack.
Feel free. of course, to have the last word.

On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 11:19:05 -0700 (PDT), Dawlish 
wrote:

>I can assure you that our correspondence (two-way, Alan, not one way,
>with very similar sentiments on both sides and culminating, actually,
>in no particularly bad feeling, which is good...

Here's my response to your original e-mail.

Please publish your original, with headers, so that mine is in context.
Don't miss out the bit about my festering guts.

<quote>
From: Alan White 
To: Dawlish 
Subject: Re: World weather map
Date: Sun, 04 May 2008 18:14:24 +0100
Organization: G84
Message-ID: 
References:







In-Reply-To:

X-Mailer: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652

Hi,

Thanks for the e-mail. As it's considered poor netiquette to respond to
Usenet posts by e-mail, could you please post it again but this time to
uk.sci.weather where I've had my last word so there'll be no come back
from me.

I'm sorry about my spelling of ad hominum. Put it down to a combination
of waning powers, lack of breakfast, the fact that I wasn't wearing my
specs and misuse of my spellchecker. I've never visited TWO. I picked up
the phrase from a chap called James Boyle at a meeting I attended in
1989.

-- 
Alan White
Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
Twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, overlooking Lochs Long and Goil in
Argyll, Scotland.
Webcam and weather:- http://windycroft.gt-britain.co.uk/weather
</quote>

-- 
Alan White
Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
Twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, overlooking Lochs Long and Goil in Argyll, Scotland.
Webcam and weather:- http://windycroft.gt-britain.co.uk/weather

On Jul 6, 7:50 pm, Alan White  wrote:
> On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 11:19:05 -0700 (PDT), Dawlish 
> wrote:
>
> >I can assure you that our correspondence (two-way, Alan, not one way,
> >with very similar sentiments on both sides and culminating, actually,
> >in no particularly bad feeling, which is good...
>
> Here's my response to your original e-mail.
>
> Please publish your original, with headers, so that mine is in context.
> Don't miss out the bit about my festering guts.
>
> <quote>
> From: Alan White 
> To: Dawlish 
> Subject: Re: World weather map
> Date: Sun, 04 May 2008 18:14:24 퍝
> Organization: G84
> Message-ID: 
> References:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In-Reply-To:
> 
> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652
>
> Hi,
>
> Thanks for the e-mail. As it's considered poor netiquette to respond to
> Usenet posts by e-mail, could you please post it again but this time to
> uk.sci.weather where I've had my last word so there'll be no come back
> from me.
>
> I'm sorry about my spelling of ad hominum. Put it down to a combination
> of waning powers, lack of breakfast, the fact that I wasn't wearing my
> specs and misuse of my spellchecker. I've never visited TWO. I picked up
> the phrase from a chap called James Boyle at a meeting I attended in
> 1989.
>
> --
> Alan White
> Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
> Twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, overlooking Lochs Long and Goil in
> Argyll, Scotland.
> Webcam and weather:-http://windycroft.gt-britain.co.uk/weather
> </quote>
>
> --
> Alan White
> Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
> Twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, overlooking Lochs Long and Goil in Argyll, Scotland.
> Webcam and weather:-http://windycroft.gt-britain.co.uk/weather

Thought you might go down that line. I would never post personal
emails on public sites. They are what they are - personal.

Your position of support for an abusive individual is clear. Little
else to add. I look forward to your future posts on the weather.

Paul

Dawlish  wrote in
news:89ef3d61-3b35-42f4-a87c-1c698614a3ef@27g2000hsf.googlegroups.com: 

> That deserves a response in defence.

<Large post snipped>

As largely a lurker on here these days, I find it gobsmacking that people 
can actually get het up enough to write enormous emails defending 
themselves. Just let it lie, and I politely suggest get on with your life 
outside the newsgroup for heavens' sake!

Richard

On 2008-07-06 21:58:24 +0100, Richard Dixon  said:

> Dawlish  wrote in
> news:89ef3d61-3b35-42f4-a87c-1c698614a3ef@27g2000hsf.googlegroups.com:
> 
>> That deserves a response in defence.
> 
> <Large post snipped>
> 
> As largely a lurker on here these days, I find it gobsmacking that people
> can actually get het up enough to write enormous emails defending
> themselves. Just let it lie, and I politely suggest get on with your life
> outside the newsgroup for heavens' sake!
> 
> Richard

Richard - I completely agree. To spend so much time and energy 
articulating a justfication or an argument (with people you'll probably 
never meet face to face) when it should be spent enjoying a hobby is 
beyond me.

50% of posts nowadays resemble a Jeremy Kyle blog site; where did the 
newsgroup of 6 years ago disappear to?

Joe
--
Hampstead, London

On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 22:06:54 +0100, Joe Hunt wrote in
<news:6dcqfeF1vikpU1@mid.individual.net> 

>> As largely a lurker on here these days, I find it gobsmacking that people
>> can actually get het up enough to write enormous emails defending
>> themselves. Just let it lie, and I politely suggest get on with your life
>> outside the newsgroup for heavens' sake!
>> 
>> Richard
> 
> Richard - I completely agree. To spend so much time and energy 
> articulating a justfication or an argument (with people you'll probably 
> never meet face to face) when it should be spent enjoying a hobby is 
> beyond me.
> 
> 50% of posts nowadays resemble a Jeremy Kyle blog site; where did the 
> newsgroup of 6 years ago disappear to?

I'm thinking these overlong and verbose posts are doing rather like what a
JCB does best:-)

-- 
Mike Tullett - Coleraine 55.13°N 6.69°W  posted 06/07/2008 21:14:04  GMT

"Joe Hunt"  wrote in message 
news:6dcqfeF1vikpU1@mid.individual.net...
> On 2008-07-06 21:58:24 +0100, Richard Dixon  said:
>
>> Dawlish  wrote in
>> news:89ef3d61-3b35-42f4-a87c-1c698614a3ef@27g2000hsf.googlegroups.com:
>>
>>> That deserves a response in defence.
>>
>> <Large post snipped>
>>
>> As largely a lurker on here these days, I find it gobsmacking that people
>> can actually get het up enough to write enormous emails defending
>> themselves. Just let it lie, and I politely suggest get on with your life
>> outside the newsgroup for heavens' sake!
>>
>> Richard
>
> Richard - I completely agree. To spend so much time and energy 
> articulating a justfication or an argument (with people you'll probably 
> never meet face to face) when it should be spent enjoying a hobby is 
> beyond me.
>
> 50% of posts nowadays resemble a Jeremy Kyle blog site; where did the 
> newsgroup of 6 years ago disappear to?
>
> Joe
> --
> Hampstead, London
>
>

Hey Joe, great to hear from you, how you doing?

To answer your question, people left - you, Richard D., Paul Bartlett, Dave 
Reynolds, Phil Gurr to name but a few. When folk leave the character and 
culture will inevitably change.

Cheers,

Will
--

Joe Hunt wrote:

> On 2008-07-06 21:58:24 +0100, Richard Dixon 
> said:
> 
> >Dawlish  wrote in
> > news:89ef3d61-3b35-42f4-a87c-1c698614a3ef@27g2000hsf.googlegroups.co
> > m:
> > 
> > > That deserves a response in defence.
> > 
> > <Large post snipped>
> > 
> > As largely a lurker on here these days, I find it gobsmacking that
> > people can actually get het up enough to write enormous emails
> > defending themselves. Just let it lie, and I politely suggest get
> > on with your life outside the newsgroup for heavens' sake!
> > 
> > Richard
> 
> Richard - I completely agree. To spend so much time and energy
> articulating a justfication or an argument (with people you'll
> probably never meet face to face) when it should be spent enjoying a
> hobby is beyond me.
> 
> 50% of posts nowadays resemble a Jeremy Kyle blog site; where did the
> newsgroup of 6 years ago disappear to?
> 
> Joe

The kill-file gets rid of all the irritating posters and keeps the
group much the same as it used to be. If I go into a book shop I don't
buy a book by an author I don't like. The kill-file enables me to make
the same choice on usenet.

Norman
-- 
Norman Lynagh
Chalfont St Giles, Buckinghamshire
85m a.s.l.
(remove "thisbit" twice to e-mail)

On Jul 6, 10:32 pm, "Norman" <normanthis...@thisbitweather-
consultancy.com> wrote:
> Joe Hunt wrote:
> > On 2008-07-06 21:58:24 퍝, Richard Dixon 
> > said:
>
> > >Dawlish  wrote in
> > >news:89ef3d61-3b35-42f4-a87c-1c698614a3ef@27g2000hsf.googlegroups.co
> > > m:
>
> > > > That deserves a response in defence.
>
> > > <Large post snipped>
>
> > > As largely a lurker on here these days, I find it gobsmacking that
> > > people can actually get het up enough to write enormous emails
> > > defending themselves. Just let it lie, and I politely suggest get
> > > on with your life outside the newsgroup for heavens' sake!
>
> > > Richard
>
> > Richard - I completely agree. To spend so much time and energy
> > articulating a justfication or an argument (with people you'll
> > probably never meet face to face) when it should be spent enjoying a
> > hobby is beyond me.
>
> > 50% of posts nowadays resemble a Jeremy Kyle blog site; where did the
> > newsgroup of 6 years ago disappear to?
>
> > Joe
>
> The kill-file gets rid of all the irritating posters and keeps the
> group much the same as it used to be. If I go into a book shop I don't
> buy a book by an author I don't like. The kill-file enables me to make
> the same choice on usenet.
>
> Norman
> --
> Norman Lynagh
> Chalfont St Giles, Buckinghamshire
> 85m a.s.l.
> (remove "thisbit" twice to e-mail)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Exactly what people should do, Norman, if that is what they want to
do. Things change over time. No-one is the same as anyone else. I've
found a rich diversity on weather sites. Some extremely informative
and knowledgeable people; some idiots; some who are simply agenda
items; some professional meteorologists who it is a pleasure to
converse with; some who make me laugh with almost every post; some who
post to entertain; some argumentative gits(!), some abusive people;
some who provide stats and data of the highest order, which I can use;
some who post beause they just have to; many who form the band of
amateur (and professional) weather recorders, for whom the Internet
has been such a boon and for whose data I'm very grateful; enemies; a
stalker and many friends with whom I swap many emails and make it a
pleasure to log on each morning......and lots more...and lots of
combinations of these.

I recognise many of the people I've encountered here, though this is
just the start!

http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/warriorshtm/innocenceabused.htm

Gave me a laugh anyway.

Even though people have moved on, we're here. For me, I wouldn't
killfile any of the above. It's the combination of them all that keeps
me coming back.

Paul *>))



Back to the weather.

On Jul 6, 11:44 am, "jovian hypercane" <jovian hypercane@global
warming .com> wrote:
> Does anyone seriously believe the out-of-character post originated from TH
> himself rather an interloper acting as an agent provocoteur in this
> instance?Permit the accused to explain the circumstances if possible prior
> the hard and fast accusations.

    Oh, it was me all right, and sober.  You're too kind.  I'll be
back when things improve and the content-free verbal diarrhoea
ceases.  You never know, it could.

Tudor Hughes.