My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.

There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable 
to the landlord / owner.

She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know 
why.

Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
cheques but that's about it.

Any answers would be appreciated.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>  writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> >why.
>
> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> --
> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
good start.
You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.

Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
writing like any other legally binding contract.

Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)

Here's a radical suggestion. Tell the HB department you don't want
your landlord finding out about your claim. It won't be the first time
they have been told that and there is nothing wrong with that anyway.
It should also make them work with you to find evidence of the tenancy
through methods like checking bank statements for regular payment to
the landlord. If you appear to be a bit cagey about providing evidence
it will start their fraud whiskers twitching. Just Tell Them.

One thing is for sure though - no evidence of tenancy = rejected
claim.

All round it would be easier if you get a brief copy of the agreement
in writing from the landlord and tell HB you don't want him notified
of your claim.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>  writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> >why.
>
> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> --
> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
good start.
You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.

Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
writing like any other legally binding contract.

Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)

Here's a radical suggestion. Tell the HB department you don't want
your landlord finding out about your claim. It won't be the first time
they have been told that and there is nothing wrong with that anyway.
It should also make them work with you to find evidence of the tenancy
through methods like checking bank statements for regular payment to
the landlord. If you appear to be a bit cagey about providing evidence
it will start their fraud whiskers twitching. Just Tell Them.

One thing is for sure though - no evidence of tenancy = rejected
claim.

All round it would be easier if you get a brief copy of the agreement
in writing from the landlord and tell HB you don't want him notified
of your claim.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>>  writes
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been 
>> >through
>> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
>> >payable
>> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for 
>> >Council
>> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance 
>> >of
>> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
>> >know
>> >why.
>>
>> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on 
>> >to
>> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple 
>> >of
>> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
>> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> --
>> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> good start.
> You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>

Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing, 
I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>  writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> >why.
>
> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> --
> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
good start.
You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.

Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
writing like any other legally binding contract.

Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)

Here's a radical suggestion. Tell the HB department you don't want
your landlord finding out about your claim. It won't be the first time
they have been told that and there is nothing wrong with that anyway.
It should also make them work with you to find evidence of the tenancy
through methods like checking bank statements for regular payment to
the landlord. If you appear to be a bit cagey about providing evidence
it will start their fraud whiskers twitching. Just Tell Them.

One thing is for sure though - no evidence of tenancy = rejected
claim.

All round it would be easier if you get a brief copy of the agreement
in writing from the landlord and tell HB you don't want him notified
of your claim.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>>  writes
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been 
>> >through
>> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
>> >payable
>> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for 
>> >Council
>> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance 
>> >of
>> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
>> >know
>> >why.
>>
>> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on 
>> >to
>> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple 
>> >of
>> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
>> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> --
>> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> good start.
> You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>

Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing, 
I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>  writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> >why.
>
> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> --
> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
good start.
You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.

Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
writing like any other legally binding contract.

Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)

Here's a radical suggestion. Tell the HB department you don't want
your landlord finding out about your claim. It won't be the first time
they have been told that and there is nothing wrong with that anyway.
It should also make them work with you to find evidence of the tenancy
through methods like checking bank statements for regular payment to
the landlord. If you appear to be a bit cagey about providing evidence
it will start their fraud whiskers twitching. Just Tell Them.

One thing is for sure though - no evidence of tenancy = rejected
claim.

All round it would be easier if you get a brief copy of the agreement
in writing from the landlord and tell HB you don't want him notified
of your claim.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>>  writes
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been 
>> >through
>> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
>> >payable
>> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for 
>> >Council
>> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance 
>> >of
>> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
>> >know
>> >why.
>>
>> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on 
>> >to
>> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple 
>> >of
>> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
>> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> --
>> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> good start.
> You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>

Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing, 
I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>  writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> >why.
>
> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> --
> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
good start.
You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.

Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
writing like any other legally binding contract.

Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)

Here's a radical suggestion. Tell the HB department you don't want
your landlord finding out about your claim. It won't be the first time
they have been told that and there is nothing wrong with that anyway.
It should also make them work with you to find evidence of the tenancy
through methods like checking bank statements for regular payment to
the landlord. If you appear to be a bit cagey about providing evidence
it will start their fraud whiskers twitching. Just Tell Them.

One thing is for sure though - no evidence of tenancy = rejected
claim.

All round it would be easier if you get a brief copy of the agreement
in writing from the landlord and tell HB you don't want him notified
of your claim.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>>  writes
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been 
>> >through
>> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
>> >payable
>> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for 
>> >Council
>> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance 
>> >of
>> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
>> >know
>> >why.
>>
>> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on 
>> >to
>> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple 
>> >of
>> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
>> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> --
>> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> good start.
> You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>

Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing, 
I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.

On 8 Jun, 17:10, "Niteawk"  wrote:
> "Zargon"  wrote in message
>
> news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> >> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
> >>  writes
>
> >> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been
> >> >through
> >> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made
> >> >payable
> >> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for
> >> >Council
> >> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance
> >> >of
> >> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't
> >> >know
> >> >why.
>
> >> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on
> >> >to
> >> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple
> >> >of
> >> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> >> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> >> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> >> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> >> --
> >> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
> > Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> > agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> > how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> > good start.
> > You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> > WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> > Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> > outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> > doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> > writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> > Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> > Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> > then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> > the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> > they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>
> Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing,
> I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Apologies to Niteawk. I misread his post.

On Jun 7, 11:55 pm, "Fred"  wrote:
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.

Quite simply the council want proof that there is a rental agreement
for the property between the tenant and the landlord and what it
covers.

Demonstrating she pays John Smith £80 pw with statements etc does not
prove that it's IRO the house or what she gets for her money.  The
council will need to confirm the amount of rent net of any extras e.g.
the amount she pays might cover some bills, service charges, furniture
or a garage.

It will be difficult to etsablish this without a tenacy agreement or
contact with the landlord.  If she wants to avoid the landlord finding
out she may have to try and put the tenancy on a more formal footing.
I beleive standard tenancy agreements can be downloaded/purchased from
stationers.  As long as the chap who signs it is the owner of the hse
and he's not subletting or acting on behalf of someone else that
should suffice.

Once she has a formal agreement she has more rights even if the
landlord did find out, which is quite likely if he knows people living
nearby.  If she proves herself to be a reliable tennant he may not
care!  Landlords tend to get sniffy about HB on new lets because of
delays starting payments up and also it may mean the tennant is from a
poorer background and might damage the property skip leaving O/S
bills.

Obviously not the case for most but definitely the case for some.

Mike

On 7 Jun, 23:55, "Fred"  wrote:
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.

I had a similar problem.  I had a tenency agreement that had expired,
and become a periodic tenancy, so the tenancy agreement had nominally
expired.

I my landlord for a letter confirming that I was his tenant and the
amount of rent I paid.  I didn't specify why I needed confirmation,
and you shouldn't need to.  As I said, he was a bit lazy, so I
eventually a letter from him with the information I needed, and sent
it to him with a stamped self addressed envelope, and just asked him
to sign it, and that seemed good enough for Wandsworth council.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181390597.517014.261370@n4g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 17:10, "Niteawk"  wrote:
>> "Zargon"  wrote in message
>>
>> news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> >> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>> >>  writes
>>
>> >> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an 
>> >> >offer
>> >> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been
>> >> >through
>> >> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made
>> >> >payable
>> >> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for
>> >> >Council
>> >> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy. 
>> >> >She'd
>> >> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual 
>> >> >acquaintance
>> >> >of
>> >> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I 
>> >> >don't
>> >> >know
>> >> >why.
>>
>> >> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted 
>> >> >on
>> >> >to
>> >> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a 
>> >> >couple
>> >> >of
>> >> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> >> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't 
>> >> demand
>> >> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> >> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> >> --
>> >> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> > Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
>> > agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
>> > how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
>> > good start.
>> > You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
>> > WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>>
>> > Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
>> > outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
>> > doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
>> > writing like any other legally binding contract.
>>
>> > Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
>> > Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
>> > then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
>> > the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
>> > they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>>
>> Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of 
>> doing,
>> I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.- 
>> Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Apologies to Niteawk. I misread his post.
>

I think there has been a general misunderstanding here.  The ex has no 
intention of committing any kind of fraud and is not going to forge any 
letters or documents.

The purpose of this post was to understand what the HB department would 
reasonably accept for the existence of a tenancy without the landlord aware 
being made aware of a claim for HB.  I was hoping that evidence of payment 
and the fact she is living there might be sufficient though I have already 
stressed to her there ought to be some additional written evidence.

I would also like to take the opportunity to than those who have taken the 
trouble to reply.  It is appreciated.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

Many thanks for the replies.

I wrote the above with a bit too much haste.  The landlord is selling the 
house to my ex, pending the proceeds from the sale of her and her husband's 
house.  In the mean time she is living in the new house and paying rent.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>  writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> >why.
>
> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> --
> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
good start.
You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.

Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
writing like any other legally binding contract.

Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)

Here's a radical suggestion. Tell the HB department you don't want
your landlord finding out about your claim. It won't be the first time
they have been told that and there is nothing wrong with that anyway.
It should also make them work with you to find evidence of the tenancy
through methods like checking bank statements for regular payment to
the landlord. If you appear to be a bit cagey about providing evidence
it will start their fraud whiskers twitching. Just Tell Them.

One thing is for sure though - no evidence of tenancy = rejected
claim.

All round it would be easier if you get a brief copy of the agreement
in writing from the landlord and tell HB you don't want him notified
of your claim.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>>  writes
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been 
>> >through
>> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
>> >payable
>> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for 
>> >Council
>> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance 
>> >of
>> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
>> >know
>> >why.
>>
>> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on 
>> >to
>> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple 
>> >of
>> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
>> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> --
>> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> good start.
> You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>

Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing, 
I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.

On 8 Jun, 17:10, "Niteawk"  wrote:
> "Zargon"  wrote in message
>
> news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> >> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
> >>  writes
>
> >> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been
> >> >through
> >> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made
> >> >payable
> >> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for
> >> >Council
> >> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance
> >> >of
> >> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't
> >> >know
> >> >why.
>
> >> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on
> >> >to
> >> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple
> >> >of
> >> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> >> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> >> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> >> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> >> --
> >> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
> > Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> > agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> > how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> > good start.
> > You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> > WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> > Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> > outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> > doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> > writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> > Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> > Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> > then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> > the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> > they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>
> Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing,
> I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Apologies to Niteawk. I misread his post.

On Jun 7, 11:55 pm, "Fred"  wrote:
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.

Quite simply the council want proof that there is a rental agreement
for the property between the tenant and the landlord and what it
covers.

Demonstrating she pays John Smith £80 pw with statements etc does not
prove that it's IRO the house or what she gets for her money.  The
council will need to confirm the amount of rent net of any extras e.g.
the amount she pays might cover some bills, service charges, furniture
or a garage.

It will be difficult to etsablish this without a tenacy agreement or
contact with the landlord.  If she wants to avoid the landlord finding
out she may have to try and put the tenancy on a more formal footing.
I beleive standard tenancy agreements can be downloaded/purchased from
stationers.  As long as the chap who signs it is the owner of the hse
and he's not subletting or acting on behalf of someone else that
should suffice.

Once she has a formal agreement she has more rights even if the
landlord did find out, which is quite likely if he knows people living
nearby.  If she proves herself to be a reliable tennant he may not
care!  Landlords tend to get sniffy about HB on new lets because of
delays starting payments up and also it may mean the tennant is from a
poorer background and might damage the property skip leaving O/S
bills.

Obviously not the case for most but definitely the case for some.

Mike

On 7 Jun, 23:55, "Fred"  wrote:
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.

I had a similar problem.  I had a tenency agreement that had expired,
and become a periodic tenancy, so the tenancy agreement had nominally
expired.

I my landlord for a letter confirming that I was his tenant and the
amount of rent I paid.  I didn't specify why I needed confirmation,
and you shouldn't need to.  As I said, he was a bit lazy, so I
eventually a letter from him with the information I needed, and sent
it to him with a stamped self addressed envelope, and just asked him
to sign it, and that seemed good enough for Wandsworth council.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181390597.517014.261370@n4g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 17:10, "Niteawk"  wrote:
>> "Zargon"  wrote in message
>>
>> news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> >> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>> >>  writes
>>
>> >> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an 
>> >> >offer
>> >> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been
>> >> >through
>> >> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made
>> >> >payable
>> >> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for
>> >> >Council
>> >> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy. 
>> >> >She'd
>> >> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual 
>> >> >acquaintance
>> >> >of
>> >> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I 
>> >> >don't
>> >> >know
>> >> >why.
>>
>> >> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted 
>> >> >on
>> >> >to
>> >> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a 
>> >> >couple
>> >> >of
>> >> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> >> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't 
>> >> demand
>> >> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> >> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> >> --
>> >> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> > Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
>> > agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
>> > how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
>> > good start.
>> > You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
>> > WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>>
>> > Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
>> > outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
>> > doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
>> > writing like any other legally binding contract.
>>
>> > Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
>> > Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
>> > then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
>> > the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
>> > they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>>
>> Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of 
>> doing,
>> I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.- 
>> Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Apologies to Niteawk. I misread his post.
>

I think there has been a general misunderstanding here.  The ex has no 
intention of committing any kind of fraud and is not going to forge any 
letters or documents.

The purpose of this post was to understand what the HB department would 
reasonably accept for the existence of a tenancy without the landlord aware 
being made aware of a claim for HB.  I was hoping that evidence of payment 
and the fact she is living there might be sufficient though I have already 
stressed to her there ought to be some additional written evidence.

I would also like to take the opportunity to than those who have taken the 
trouble to reply.  It is appreciated.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

Many thanks for the replies.

I wrote the above with a bit too much haste.  The landlord is selling the 
house to my ex, pending the proceeds from the sale of her and her husband's 
house.  In the mean time she is living in the new house and paying rent.

"Fred"  wrote in message 
news:46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
> My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer 
> accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through 
> pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
> payable to the landlord / owner.
>
> She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council 
> Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd 
> rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of 
> hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
> know why.
>
> Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to 
> prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of 
> cheques but that's about it.
>
> Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

What you are suggesting here could amount to fraud, it should make no 
difference to the LL how he gets paid so long as he gets paid.

She should ask him for some form of agreement to show she is the tenant. 
Anything in writing on a sheet of A4 will do as long as it shows the LL's 
details, amount of rent payable and signed by both parties.

The alternative is to make up a TA, forge the LL's signature, or even use a 
ficticious name for the LL.
Wouldnt take the council long to spot that one.

In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
 writes
>My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
>There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
>pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
>to the landlord / owner.
>
>She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
>Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
>hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
>why.
>
>Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
>prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
>cheques but that's about it.
>
>Any answers would be appreciated.
>
>

They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand 
it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent 
book and some insistence usually does the trick.

-- 
Mike_B

On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>  writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>
> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been through
> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made payable
> >to the landlord / owner.
>
> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for Council
> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance of
> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't know
> >why.
>
> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on to
> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple of
> >cheques but that's about it.
>
> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>
> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>
> --
> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
good start.
You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.

Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
writing like any other legally binding contract.

Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)

Here's a radical suggestion. Tell the HB department you don't want
your landlord finding out about your claim. It won't be the first time
they have been told that and there is nothing wrong with that anyway.
It should also make them work with you to find evidence of the tenancy
through methods like checking bank statements for regular payment to
the landlord. If you appear to be a bit cagey about providing evidence
it will start their fraud whiskers twitching. Just Tell Them.

One thing is for sure though - no evidence of tenancy = rejected
claim.

All round it would be easier if you get a brief copy of the agreement
in writing from the landlord and tell HB you don't want him notified
of your claim.

"Zargon"  wrote in message 
news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
>> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>>  writes
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
>> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and paying rent.
>>
>> >There is no rent book or any formal tenancy agreement.  It's been 
>> >through
>> >pure word of mouth and the only evidence she has are of cheques made 
>> >payable
>> >to the landlord / owner.
>>
>> >She's written a letter making a claim for Housing Benefit and for 
>> >Council
>> >Tax Benefit but they're now asking for evidence of her tenancy.  She'd
>> >rather the landlord wasn't aware of the claim and a mutual acquaintance 
>> >of
>> >hers and the landlord has recommended the landlord isn't told.  I don't 
>> >know
>> >why.
>>
>> >Can anyone help in what would evidence would be normally be insisted on 
>> >to
>> >prove a tenancy?  She'll soon have evidence from bills etc and a couple 
>> >of
>> >cheques but that's about it.
>>
>> >Any answers would be appreciated.
>>
>> They often request a tenancy agreement but the regulations don't demand
>> it. They simply need to know that a commercial tenancy exists. A rent
>> book and some insistence usually does the trick.
>>
>> --
>> Mike_B- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Agree with Mike_B that the regulations don't demand a written tenacy
> agreement. Even a verbal agreement is supposedly good enough (although
> how you would "prove" it is a bit uncertain). Evidence of payment is a
> good start.
> You could buy a rent book from a stationers e.g. WH Smith - but there
> WOULD be problems if they find out you have forged it.
>
> Is there any reason why the landlord wouldn't give you a letter
> outlining the agreement between you. This is only fair really and it
> doesn't need to be connected with a HB claim. Just say you want it in
> writing like any other legally binding contract.
>
> Definately do NOT agree with Niteawk on giving a false name for the
> Landlord. If a HB claim has not recently been made at that address
> then the HB dept will take steps to find out who the legal owner of
> the property is. (they won't contact the Landlord to do this - but
> they have a very quick and accurate method of doing it)
>

Eh, another one that cant read. Thats what the OP's ex is thinking of doing, 
I pointed out that it would not take the council long to spot that one.

On 8 Jun, 17:10, "Niteawk"  wrote:
> "Zargon"  wrote in message
>
> news:1181292773.128338.279590@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 8 Jun, 00:31, Mike_B  wrote:
> >> In message <46688f6f$0$30325$fa0fc...@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
> >>  writes
>
> >> >My ex-wife is separating from her present husband!  She's had an offer
> >> >accepted on a house and is currently living there and p