On Tue, 01 Jan 2008 21:24:24 +0000 (GMT), Robert Seago
 wrote:

>In article ,
>    wrote:
>
>> >No, read it.
>> >
>
>> I have now and there no reference to killing deer.
>
>I have hardly time for this, but it says :
>
>"deer will be controlled to a level which maintains and enhances the
>biodiversity of the site"  

Which when you analyse it, means nothing. They can decide what
biodiversity the wand and kill and many deer as they want.


>
>It goes on to mention regular monitoring etc.  I cannot paste it as it is
>PDF.
>
>
>> Fox hunting was not illegal but the majority in the country were against
>> it.
>
>Fox hunting is illegal.  Don't expect pest control to become illegal, it
>won't.  Pest control is accepted by most people.  Hunting with dogs was
>not.

But the public don't regard deer as pests.

>
>> >> They are soliciting members and not revealing the true measures of
>> >> what they do to wildlife. 
>
>> >It is there for all to see.  Having pointed this out to you, if you
>> >continue to repeat your line you will be plain lying.
>
>> Where does it say they kill deer to protect their trees?
>
>Control of numbers is clearly stated.  

That could mean fencing them out of sensitive areas.

>Now try to tell me that the public
>might think they are using birth pills or something else.  People well
>understand what control means.
>

Some do, many don't.  Some people I have spoken to even think it is
herding them away from the woodlands.


>> >>  Do you not think the public are entitled to know exactly what goes
>> >> on before parting with their money?
>
>> >They can read it, and by the way the vast majority of people have no
>> >problem about control of pest species, and the majority also eat meat. 
>
>> You can control deer and protect trees without killing them.
>
>We had all this debate before, if you think you can change what people
>think, go into politics.
>

They can't think what they don't know.


>> >You don't, and it is tough for you that you can't dictate to the
>> >majority what they can do.
>
>> I accept that people eat meat.  
>
>> But they don't join the Woodland Trust
>> for them to kill deer. 

>People join the Woodland Trust because restoring forest is very popular. 

Sure, but they don't know the price deer pay for it.

>My view is that it would be more helpful to restore other habitats, but
>planting trees always interests the public.  The public are also believe
>me very happy to control animals such as rabbits that damage their trees.

I agree that they don't see rabbits the same as deer.

>> >We had that point before where it was explained to you, that measures
>> >can be demanded by neighbours. In our case they were and even if we
>> >thought they were unreasonable, which they weren't, they could have
>> >called in an agency on to our land to control them.. Gassing is the
>> >normal method.
>> >
>> >Have you got it this time?
>
>
>> Sure I've got it.  You put no objection to the rabbits being killed
>> because you wouldn't invest in fencing as an alternative - and probably
>> too lazy to get off your bum and do the fencing yourself which would
>> have cost very little.   


>Fencing would be of prohibitive cost as you well know on such a site, and
>ineffective. 

 A fraction of the cost of industrial fencing required to keep pests
out. 

So you'd rather kill wildlife that pay for fencing.      


> I have absolutely no objection in any case to the shooting
>of rabbits.  I don't follow your logic that somehow a rabbit has a right
>to life, and find it strange that you think that farming of livestock is
>OK, but an animal that is wild has a right to life.  Why?

Wildlife populations are not "ours". they are independent mammalian
populations in parallel to our own.  Farmed stock is bred for killing
and I am sensible enough to realise that the human population will not
stop eating meat altogether, although climate change could alter that,
and fast.  


   
Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk

All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident. 
-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 07:31:22 +0000, Malcolm
 wrote:

>
>In article , 
>amacmil304@aol.com writes
>>
>>But the public don't regard deer as pests.
>>
>That's not true, Angus. Try talking to people in southern England whose 
>market gardens and orchards, let alone private gardens, are being 
>subject to serious damage by Roe Deer and Muntjacs.
>
>See, e.g.:
>http://environment.independent.co.uk/article51962.ece
>written over three years ago.

Fabricated story to suit the agenda of fake CONservationists, which is
probably why it attracts people of ill repute like yourself.









--

My greatest speech to the peasants
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=em7LWuP0T7Q

pam the SPAMMERS send an email to enquires@urfreesim.co.uk



England / Angelic Upstarts 

The red in the flag is the blood that was spilt
In the way that your forefathers tell
And never a country has been so great
The stories Britannia could tell 

I never want to live my life
Away from the golden shores
There's never a country in the world
With the scent of an English rose 

England oh England a country so great
A land that's so fair and so true
There'll never be any colours like
The red the white and the blue 

Whenever you go to a far off land
There's something goes with you
The pride and the joy and the love that comes
For your mother of red white and blue 

You could never be born under a flag that's like
The one of the Union Jack
St.Georges spirit has never died
It all keeps coming back

On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 07:31:22 +0000, Malcolm
 wrote:

>
>In article , 
>amacmil304@aol.com writes
>>
>>But the public don't regard deer as pests.
>>
>That's not true, Angus. Try talking to people in southern England whose 
>market gardens and orchards, let alone private gardens, are being 
>subject to serious damage by Roe Deer and Muntjacs.
>
>See, e.g.:
>http://environment.independent.co.uk/article51962.ece
>written over three years ago.


That doesn't make it true>

"To many people, the latest urban wildlife phenomenon is a delight: an
authentic Bambi in the back garden."

"However, some less sentimental souls consider the latest addition to
the urban population a pest,..................


Note the "many" and "some" that you are willing to point out when it
suits you.

Generally, the public love to see deer foxes and squirrels.

How many times will someone say, Oh, look, there's a deer or a fox,
with glee?


Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk

All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident. 
-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 10:20:25 +0000, amacmil304@aol.com wrote:

>On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 07:31:22 +0000, Malcolm
> wrote:
>
>>
>>In article , 
>>amacmil304@aol.com writes
>>>
>>>But the public don't regard deer as pests.
>>>
>>That's not true, Angus. Try talking to people in southern England whose 
>>market gardens and orchards, let alone private gardens, are being 
>>subject to serious damage by Roe Deer and Muntjacs.
>>
>>See, e.g.:
>>http://environment.independent.co.uk/article51962.ece
>>written over three years ago.
>
>
>That doesn't make it true>
>
>"To many people, the latest urban wildlife phenomenon is a delight: an
>authentic Bambi in the back garden."
>
>"However, some less sentimental souls consider the latest addition to
>the urban population a pest,..................
>
>
>Note the "many" and "some" that you are willing to point out when it
>suits you.
>
>Generally, the public love to see deer foxes and squirrels.
>
>How many times will someone say, Oh, look, there's a deer or a fox,
>with glee?

Many more would donate to charities to protect these animals, and be
appalled once they find out the slaughter that goes on. It goes to
show how out of touch with reality the likes of the slob seago are. I
mean on a legal precedent it would be hard to justify slaughtering
foxes which feed on rabbits, then complaining you have too many
rabbits!

It just shows the mentality of the dirty old men infesting
conservation to their own ends.









--

My greatest speech to the peasants
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=em7LWuP0T7Q

pam the SPAMMERS send an email to enquires@urfreesim.co.uk



England / Angelic Upstarts 

The red in the flag is the blood that was spilt
In the way that your forefathers tell
And never a country has been so great
The stories Britannia could tell 

I never want to live my life
Away from the golden shores
There's never a country in the world
With the scent of an English rose 

England oh England a country so great
A land that's so fair and so true
There'll never be any colours like
The red the white and the blue 

Whenever you go to a far off land
There's something goes with you
The pride and the joy and the love that comes
For your mother of red white and blue 

You could never be born under a flag that's like
The one of the Union Jack
St.Georges spirit has never died
It all keeps coming back

On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 11:06:53 +0000, Malcolm
 wrote:

>
>In article , 
>amacmil304@aol.com writes
>>On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 07:31:22 +0000, Malcolm
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>In article ,
>>>amacmil304@aol.com writes
>>>>
>>>>But the public don't regard deer as pests.
>>>>
>>>That's not true, Angus. Try talking to people in southern England whose
>>>market gardens and orchards, let alone private gardens, are being
>>>subject to serious damage by Roe Deer and Muntjacs.
>>>
>>>See, e.g.:
>>>http://environment.independent.co.uk/article51962.ece
>>>written over three years ago.
>>
>>
>>That doesn't make it true>
>>
>I will remember that next time you quote from a newspaper :-)
>
>I know a number of people in southern England whose gardens are being 
>damaged by Muntjacs. And it is getting steadily worse.

That's life. Our gardens are being damaged by all sorts of wildlife
and the vast majority of us accept that. The world is not a sanitized,
clinical glass bowl where we can pick and choose what nature does. At
least that's our world. The world inside your head is somewhat warped!









--

My greatest speech to the peasants
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=em7LWuP0T7Q

pam the SPAMMERS send an email to enquires@urfreesim.co.uk



England / Angelic Upstarts 

The red in the flag is the blood that was spilt
In the way that your forefathers tell
And never a country has been so great
The stories Britannia could tell 

I never want to live my life
Away from the golden shores
There's never a country in the world
With the scent of an English rose 

England oh England a country so great
A land that's so fair and so true
There'll never be any colours like
The red the white and the blue 

Whenever you go to a far off land
There's something goes with you
The pride and the joy and the love that comes
For your mother of red white and blue 

You could never be born under a flag that's like
The one of the Union Jack
St.Georges spirit has never died
It all keeps coming back

On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 11:06:53 +0000, Malcolm
 wrote:

>
>In article , 
>amacmil304@aol.com writes
>>On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 07:31:22 +0000, Malcolm
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>In article ,
>>>amacmil304@aol.com writes
>>>>
>>>>But the public don't regard deer as pests.
>>>>
>>>That's not true, Angus. Try talking to people in southern England whose
>>>market gardens and orchards, let alone private gardens, are being
>>>subject to serious damage by Roe Deer and Muntjacs.
>>>
>>>See, e.g.:
>>>http://environment.independent.co.uk/article51962.ece
>>>written over three years ago.
>>
>>
>>That doesn't make it true>
>>
>I will remember that next time you quote from a newspaper :-)
>
>I know a number of people in southern England whose gardens are being 
>damaged by Muntjacs. And it is getting steadily worse.


Gardeners will complain about anything that damages their gardens.

Deer are very welcome in my garden or any part of our ground.


Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk

All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident. 
-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)