Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
building out of concrete.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/

Fantasy or not?

For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.


D

Vortex2 wrote:
> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
> building out of concrete.
> 
> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
> 
> Fantasy or not?
> 
> For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.
> 
> 
> D

Do you have to do the design in Illustrator if you choose the adobe option?

I wonder what they use - surely not just 'ordinary' concrete?

-- 
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious 
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
<www.thyromind.info> <www.thyroiduk.org> <www.altsupportthyroid.org>

On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:26:52 +0100, "Vortex2"
 wrote:

>Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
>building out of concrete.
>
>http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>
>Fantasy or not?
>
>For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.
>
>
>D 

It does sound a reasonable prospect. The problem will be the cost of
the machine, setting it up and running costs.

On Sep 2, 3:28 pm, EricP  wrote:
> On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:26:52 퍝, "Vortex2"
>  wrote:

> >Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a
> >building out of concrete.
>
> >http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>
> >Fantasy or not?
>
> >For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.
>
> >D
>
> It does sound a reasonable prospect. The problem will be the cost of
> the machine, setting it up and running costs.


If it reduces construction costs to 1/5th, lets be positively mean and
say it saves 40k per build. It builds a house a day, and lets say it
does this once every 3 days in practice, allowing time for moving,
running repairs, maintenance etc. If it works 50 weeks a yr it will
build
50x7/3 houses pa = 117 houses a year
saving 117 x 40k = £4,680,000 per year.
If we require a fairly good ROI of 20% pa then each machine has a
purchase budget of 4,680,000/20% = £23,400,000.
Now... even without doing some basic sums I reckon one could be built
for less than that!


NT

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 14:28:25 GMT, EricP wrote:

> It does sound a reasonable prospect. The problem will be the cost of
> the machine, setting it up and running costs.

But if it can build a house in 24hrs the savings in time and thus labour 
over employing brickies will pay for a lot of machine. It'll weight a bit 
so the tracks or temporay road it moves long would have to be substantial 
but one down you "print" a row of houses extremly quickly. Getting it to 
do the plumbing wiring and plaster finishing does seem to be a bit far 
fetched though.

-- 
Cheers
Dave.

In message , Rod 
 writes
>Vortex2 wrote:
>> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print 
>>yourself a  building out of concrete.
>>  http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>>  Fantasy or not?
>>  For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast 
>>Show.
>>   D
>
>Do you have to do the design in Illustrator if you choose the adobe option?
>
>I wonder what they use - surely not just 'ordinary' concrete?
>
Don't know but I bet you're not going to get a cheap cartridge at your 
local Tesco.
-- 
Clint Sharp

On 2 Sep, 11:26, "Vortex2" 
wrote:
> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a
> building out of concrete.
>
> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>
> Fantasy or not?

This was happening in the '60s, although the machine was human-driven
rather than programmed. There are photos in Papanek's "Design for the
Real World" (a superb book that everyone ought to read). As it's a
purely concrete structure without reinforcement, it limits you to
compression-based structures, i.e.  domes and arches.

"Rod"  wrote in message 
news:6i4k79Fo5rcbU1@mid.individual.net...
> Vortex2 wrote:
>> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
>> building out of concrete.
>>
>> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>>
>> Fantasy or not?

I've had plastic product prototypes made using the technology it is based on 
and they were very impressive.

>> For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.
>>
>>
>> D
>
> Do you have to do the design in Illustrator if you choose the adobe 
> option?
>
> I wonder what they use - surely not just 'ordinary' concrete?

I don't see any problem with that, provided it is only required to take 
compressive loads. Some sort of reinforcement would be needed if it is to 
take tensile loads and overhangs might need shuttering, or to be built up 
quite slowly, allowing the lower levels to start to go off before adding 
more.

Colin Bignell

On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 09:09:28 -0700 (PDT)  wrote :
> If it reduces construction costs to 1/5th, lets be positively mean
> and say it saves 40k per build.

But AIUI all you're really saving is the bricklaying. There's never 
£40K worth of bricklaying labour in a house, £4000 is probably nearer 
the mark.

-- 
Tony Bryer SDA UK  'Software to build on'  http://www.sda.co.uk

nightjar <cpb@ wrote:
> "Rod"  wrote in message 
> news:6i4k79Fo5rcbU1@mid.individual.net...
>> Vortex2 wrote:
>>> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
>>> building out of concrete.
>>>
>>> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>>>
>>> Fantasy or not?
> 
> I've had plastic product prototypes made using the technology it is based on 
> and they were very impressive.
> 
>>> For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.
>>>
>>>
>>> D
>> Do you have to do the design in Illustrator if you choose the adobe 
>> option?
>>
>> I wonder what they use - surely not just 'ordinary' concrete?
> 
> I don't see any problem with that, provided it is only required to take 
> compressive loads. Some sort of reinforcement would be needed if it is to 
> take tensile loads and overhangs might need shuttering, or to be built up 
> quite slowly, allowing the lower levels to start to go off before adding 
> more.
> 
> Colin Bignell 
> 
> 
I wasn't thinking at all of it being an issue with eventual strength - 
more that it might be too coarse, too sloppy, too thick, or whatever to 
actually squeeze out and remain in place. In the animation I watched, it 
looked like toothpaste!

-- 
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious 
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
<www.thyromind.info> <www.thyroiduk.org> <www.altsupportthyroid.org>

On 2 Sep, 17:09, meow2...@care2.com wrote:
> If it reduces construction costs to 1/5th,

It barely reduces the cost _of_ 1/5th of a house's cost. Bricks and
mortar is the cheap stuff.

Clint Sharp  wrote:

>In message , Rod 
> writes
>>Vortex2 wrote:
>>> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print 
>>>yourself a  building out of concrete.
>>>  http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>>>  Fantasy or not?
>>>  For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast 
>>>Show.
>>>   D
>>
>>Do you have to do the design in Illustrator if you choose the adobe option?
>>
>>I wonder what they use - surely not just 'ordinary' concrete?
>>
>Don't know but I bet you're not going to get a cheap cartridge at your 
>local Tesco.


I'm not sure I would buy a set of Tesco "own brand" cartridges ...

wrote in message 
news:a147e691-8507-43b7-9a0a-f95c4b74520e@k37g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> On Sep 2, 3:28 pm, EricP  wrote:
>> On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:26:52 +0100, "Vortex2"
>>  wrote:
>
>> >Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a
>> >building out of concrete.
>>
>> >http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>>
>> >Fantasy or not?
>>
>> >For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.
>>
>> >D
>>
>> It does sound a reasonable prospect. The problem will be the cost of
>> the machine, setting it up and running costs.
>
>
> If it reduces construction costs to 1/5th, lets be positively mean and
> say it saves 40k per build. It builds a house a day, and lets say it
> does this once every 3 days in practice, allowing time for moving,
> running repairs, maintenance etc. If it works 50 weeks a yr it will
> build
> 50x7/3 houses pa = 117 houses a year
> saving 117 x 40k = £4,680,000 per year.
> If we require a fairly good ROI of 20% pa then each machine has a
> purchase budget of 4,680,000/20% = £23,400,000.
> Now... even without doing some basic sums I reckon one could be built
> for less than that!

If you wanted to build a concrete house in a day you could just make some 
steel shuttering and cast a house, then move it and cast another. I bet it 
would cost a few thousands.
The foundations to my house were done using a steel former that just bolted 
together to the exact shape and size.

The real question is will glass reinforced concrete do away with the need 
for any steelwork?
>
>
> NT

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 19:07:36 +0100, Bruce wrote:

> Clint Sharp  wrote:
> 
>>In message , Rod
>> writes
>>>Vortex2 wrote:
>>>> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print
>>>>yourself a  building out of concrete.
>>>>  http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>>>>  Fantasy or not?
>>>>  For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast
>>>>Show.
>>>>   D
>>>
>>>Do you have to do the design in Illustrator if you choose the adobe
>>>option?
>>>
>>>I wonder what they use - surely not just 'ordinary' concrete?
>>>
>>Don't know but I bet you're not going to get a cheap cartridge at your
>>local Tesco.
> 
> 
> I'm not sure I would buy a set of Tesco "own brand" cartridges ...


The threat of "Tesco Value" printed houses scares me...
:-)

-- 
Mick                      (Working in a M$-free zone!)
Web: http://www.nascom.info  http://mixpix.batcave.net
Filtering everything posted from googlegroups to kill spam.

mick <not.here@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 19:07:36 +0100, Bruce wrote:
>> 
>> I'm not sure I would buy a set of Tesco "own brand" cartridges ...
>
>
>The threat of "Tesco Value" printed houses scares me...
>:-)


I think IKEA sell houses, though perhaps not in the UK.

If IKEA made a success of it in the UK, you can be sure that Tesco
would follow.

Vortex2 wrote:
> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
> building out of concrete.
> 
> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
> 
> Fantasy or not?
> 
> For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.

"it will be possible for an automated setup to erect a 
2,000-square-foot, two storey house in 24 hours"

So the concrete at the bottom will have gone off enough to support the 
top of a 20ft wall in <24 hours?

Andy

Andy Champ  wrote:

>Vortex2 wrote:
>> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
>> building out of concrete.
>> 
>> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>> 
>> Fantasy or not?
>> 
>> For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.
>
>"it will be possible for an automated setup to erect a 
>2,000-square-foot, two storey house in 24 hours"
>
>So the concrete at the bottom will have gone off enough to support the 
>top of a 20ft wall in <24 hours?


Yes, easily.  

There is an established technique called "slipforming" that is used to
construct tall concrete structures.  The formwork is jacked upwards by
25mm to 30mm every four or five minutes.  The concrete is strong
enough to support what is above. 

20 feet in 24 hours is slightly on the slow side.  A rate of 300mm to
450mm per hour is typical, approximately 24 to 36 feet per 24 hours.

On 2 Sep, 19:24, "dennis@home"  wrote:
>  wrote in message
>
> news:a147e691-8507-43b7-9a0a-f95c4b74520e@k37g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > On Sep 2, 3:28 pm, EricP  wrote:
> >> On Tue, 2 Sep 2008 11:26:52 퍝, "Vortex2"
> >>  wrote:
>
> >> >Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a
> >> >building out of concrete.
>
> >> >http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>
> >> >Fantasy or not?
>
> >> >For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show> >> >D
>
> >> It does sound a reasonable prospect. The problem will be the cost of
> >> the machine, setting it up and running costs.
>
> > If it reduces construction costs to 1/5th, lets be positively mean and
> > say it saves 40k per build. It builds a house a day, and lets say it
> > does this once every 3 days in practice, allowing time for moving,
> > running repairs, maintenance etc. If it works 50 weeks a yr it will
> > build
> > 50x7/3 houses pa = 117 houses a year
> > saving 117 x 40k = £4,680,000 per year.
> > If we require a fairly good ROI of 20% pa then each machine has a
> > purchase budget of 4,680,000/20% = £23,400,000.
> > Now... even without doing some basic sums I reckon one could be built
> > for less than that!
>
> If you wanted to build a concrete house in a day you could just make some
> steel shuttering and cast a house, then move it and cast another. I bet it
> would cost a few thousands.
> The foundations to my house were done using a steel former that just bolted
> together to the exact shape and size.
>
Sounds interesting. Why did they need a steel former, and not just a
trench dug in the ground ?
Simon.

"sm_jamieson"  wrote in message 
news:4b625d0b-9e6e-4e78-9f04-e0fedfdb80c5@e53g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...

> Sounds interesting. Why did they need a steel former, and not just a
> trench dug in the ground ?

I don't know, my neighbour (structural engineer and head of building control 
for the next door council) reckons they bought a job lot of foundations off 
the contractor so they built the same raft for them all. The different 
design next door has strip foundations, while the ones like mine have these 
huge rafts with more steel work in them than some bridges I have seen.
If I ever need to move house I could, literally, jack it up and move the 
whole thing.

In message , Bruce 
 writes
>I think IKEA sell houses, though perhaps not in the UK.
They do sell houses outside the UK, self build ones at that and they 
look rather nice.
>
>If IKEA made a success of it in the UK, you can be sure that Tesco
>would follow.
>
The difference being that I've actually had quite good experiences with 
Ikea furniture, I've never managed to buy anything from them that I've 
been less than satisfied with.
-- 
Clint Sharp

On Wed, 3 Sep 2008 08:08:46 +0100, Clint Sharp
 wrote:

>In message , Bruce 
> writes
>>I think IKEA sell houses, though perhaps not in the UK.
>They do sell houses outside the UK, self build ones at that and they 
>look rather nice.
>>


http://www.e-architect.co.uk/newcastle/ikea_housing.htm


-- 
Frank Erskine

Clint Sharp wrote:
> In message , Bruce 
>  writes
>> I think IKEA sell houses, though perhaps not in the UK.
> They do sell houses outside the UK, self build ones at that and they 
> look rather nice.
>>
>> If IKEA made a success of it in the UK, you can be sure that Tesco
>> would follow.
>>
> The difference being that I've actually had quite good experiences with 
> Ikea furniture, I've never managed to buy anything from them that I've 
> been less than satisfied with.

You must be very easy to please.

I've never seen anything from Ikea that I had any desire to own.

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 21:18:51 +0100, Bruce  wrote:

>mick <not.here@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 19:07:36 +0100, Bruce wrote:
>>> 
>>> I'm not sure I would buy a set of Tesco "own brand" cartridges ...
>>
>>
>>The threat of "Tesco Value" printed houses scares me...
>>:-)
>
>
>I think IKEA sell houses, though perhaps not in the UK.
>
>If IKEA made a success of it in the UK, you can be sure that Tesco
>would follow.

http://www.alwayswow.com/Ikea%20Job%20Interview.jpg
-- 
http://www.freedeliveryuk.co.uk
http://www.holidayunder100.co.uk

sm_jamieson  wrote:
>
>Sounds interesting. Why did they need a steel former, and not just a
>trench dug in the ground ?


You don't necessarily *need* a steel former, but it does save an awful
lot of concrete compared to filling a trench which will be a lot wider
than needed.

You incur the costs of hiring, fixing, striking and cleaning the
formwork, plus you need to backfill the edges of the trench.  That
must be weighed against the saving in the cost of concrete.

"Vortex2"  wrote in message 
news:6i4incFo3dloU1@mid.individual.net...
> Imagine...one day you will be able to rent a machine to print yourself a 
> building out of concrete.
>
> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09/01/concrete_building_printers/
>
> Fantasy or not?
>
> For me it conjours up visions of Prof. Denzil Dexter in The Fast Show.

http://www.contourcrafting.org/

Look at the animations. It shows how it makes the homes.  I want one of 
these machines.

The message 
from Bruce  contains these words:

> There is an established technique called "slipforming" that is used to
> construct tall concrete structures.  The formwork is jacked upwards by
> 25mm to 30mm every four or five minutes.  The concrete is strong
> enough to support what is above. 

> 20 feet in 24 hours is slightly on the slow side.  A rate of 300mm to
> 450mm per hour is typical, approximately 24 to 36 feet per 24 hours.

It's a well-established method of building oil rigs, too.

In message , The Natural 
Philosopher <a@b.c> writes
>Clint Sharp wrote:
>> In message , Bruce 
>> writes
>>> I think IKEA sell houses, though perhaps not in the UK.
>> They do sell houses outside the UK, self build ones at that and they 
>>look rather nice.
>>>
>>> If IKEA made a success of it in the UK, you can be sure that Tesco
>>> would follow.
>>>
>> The difference being that I've actually had quite good experiences 
>>with Ikea furniture, I've never managed to buy anything from them that 
>>I've been less than satisfied with.
>
>You must be very easy to please.
>
>I've never seen anything from Ikea that I had any desire to own.


not even share certificates ?

-- 
geoff

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember geoff  saying
something like:

>>I've never seen anything from Ikea that I had any desire to own.
>
>
>not even share certificates ?

I don't know about Ikea, but things are shit for Habitatty here.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2008/0510/1210372189742.html
I reckon Ikea Belfast are will be feeling the pinch and the projected
Dublin store might be put on the back burner - even though it was
supposed to be opening about now, and currently delayed until next year
because of traffic access problems.
-- 
Dave
GS850x2 XS650 SE6a

"It's a moron working with power tools.
 How much more suspenseful can you get?"
 - House

Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
> We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
> drugs began to take hold. I remember geoff  saying
> something like:
> 
>>> I've never seen anything from Ikea that I had any desire to own.
>>
>> not even share certificates ?
> 
> I don't know about Ikea, but things are shit for Habitatty here.
> http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2008/0510/1210372189742.html
> I reckon Ikea Belfast are will be feeling the pinch and the projected
> Dublin store might be put on the back burner - even though it was
> supposed to be opening about now, and currently delayed until next year
> because of traffic access problems.

I have gotten completely out of retail crap as an investment along with 
property in any shape size or form.

The areas of growth are commodities and energy, and manufacturing and 
infrastructure. Thats where growth will be. WE dont need any more fitted 
kitchens made out of cardboard, or silly interior design feetchas, what 
we actually need are roads railways and sewers that work, houses that 
are cheap to heat and so on.

I dont foresee the end of Capitalism, but with luck, we may see off the 
worst excesses of Consumerism in the next decade. And that means bye 
Curry's Dixons, PCworld, Ikea, MFI, Starbucks, Honest Johns Mobyle Phone 
Shoppe, and indeed most of the out of town and high street operations.