I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.

Any suggestions as to what would work best?  In the past I would
simply have stood the wood in creosote and allowed it to soak in for a
few days.  Obviously I cannot buy creosote.  There is creosote
substitute, and I have some used engine oil.  Any ideas please?

Bruce wrote:
> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.

Its pressure treated according to the Wickes site.  Does it need any extra 
treatment?


-- 
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

"The Medway Handyman"  wrote:

>Bruce wrote:
>> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
>> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
>> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
>> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.
>
>Its pressure treated according to the Wickes site.  Does it need any extra 
>treatment?


I don't think I have that one.  

The current stock is from Border fencing and, as you say, it is
pressure treated - and it looks it.  Mine was old stock, unbranded,
and it doesn't appear to be pressure treated.

Hence my question.

On Jun 30, 8:04 pm, Bruce  wrote:

> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.
>
> Any suggestions as to what would work best?  In the past I would
> simply have stood the wood in creosote and allowed it to soak in for a
> few days.  Obviously I cannot buy creosote.  There is creosote
> substitute, and I have some used engine oil.  Any ideas please?

I could only offer a couple of experiences, others may know more.
Creosote, which you could buy if mildly determined, killed almost
everything within several feet when applied, so doesnt sound like an
ideal lawn edging preservative. 50/50 oil & paraffin I first used on a
low timber retaining wall in untreated softwood, in contact with damp
soil 24/7, and there was no  sign of any deterioration a number of
years later - I was quite surprised.


NT

meow2222@care2.com wrote:
>
>I could only offer a couple of experiences, others may know more.
>Creosote, which you could buy if mildly determined, killed almost
>everything within several feet when applied, so doesnt sound like an
>ideal lawn edging preservative. 


It would not be in contact with any vegetation, because I only intend
to treat the buried section.  I think creosote might have been ideal,
but now there is only "creosote substitute", which doesn't fill me
with any optimism.


>50/50 oil & paraffin I first used on a
>low timber retaining wall in untreated softwood, in contact with damp
>soil 24/7, and there was no  sign of any deterioration a number of
>years later - I was quite surprised.


Thanks - that sounds like a good idea.  I have plenty of old oil and a
can of paraffin.

Bruce wrote:
> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.
> 
> Any suggestions as to what would work best?  In the past I would
> simply have stood the wood in creosote and allowed it to soak in for a
> few days.  Obviously I cannot buy creosote.  There is creosote
> substitute, and I have some used engine oil.  Any ideas please?
> 
If it ain't pressure treated it will rot in 2-4 years, if it is it will 
rot in 10-20 years, underground. Nothing you can apply will change this.

The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:

>Bruce wrote:
>> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
>> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
>> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
>> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.
>> 
>> Any suggestions as to what would work best?  In the past I would
>> simply have stood the wood in creosote and allowed it to soak in for a
>> few days.  Obviously I cannot buy creosote.  There is creosote
>> substitute, and I have some used engine oil.  Any ideas please?
>> 
>If it ain't pressure treated it will rot in 2-4 years, if it is it will 
>rot in 10-20 years, underground. Nothing you can apply will change this.


Thanks.  (?)

On 30 Jun, 20:04, Bruce  wrote:
> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.
>
> Any suggestions as to what would work best?  In the past I would
> simply have stood the wood in creosote and allowed it to soak in for a
> few days.  Obviously I cannot buy creosote.  There is creosote
> substitute, and I have some used engine oil.  Any ideas please?

Dear Bruce
The only way to get it to last in ground contact by treatment is to
put in 8 kg per m 3 CCA and it will last more than 60 years (motorway
fence posts were done to 4 kgs and did not all last!)
I would have some doubts about Wickes pressure treatment until I knew
exactly what was specified - there is pressure and pressure !

Given that it is now  allegedly treated the best thing you can do is
a) dip treat for 12 hours in an OS borne fungicide and allow to dry
b) soak in a water repellant wax or the like
c) apply a healty does of pitch or bitumen to the end grain
d) if you feel like it wrap in a dpc

It might be cheaper just to replace it when it rots!
Chris

mail@atics.co.uk wrote:
> On 30 Jun, 20:04, Bruce  wrote:
>> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
>> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
>> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
>> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.
>>
>> Any suggestions as to what would work best?  In the past I would
>> simply have stood the wood in creosote and allowed it to soak in for a
>> few days.  Obviously I cannot buy creosote.  There is creosote
>> substitute, and I have some used engine oil.  Any ideas please?
> 
> Dear Bruce
> The only way to get it to last in ground contact by treatment is to
> put in 8 kg per m 3 CCA and it will last more than 60 years (motorway
> fence posts were done to 4 kgs and did not all last!)
> I would have some doubts about Wickes pressure treatment until I knew
> exactly what was specified - there is pressure and pressure !
> 
> Given that it is now  allegedly treated the best thing you can do is
> a) dip treat for 12 hours in an OS borne fungicide and allow to dry
> b) soak in a water repellant wax or the like
> c) apply a healty does of pitch or bitumen to the end grain
> d) if you feel like it wrap in a dpc
> 
> It might be cheaper just to replace it when it rots!
> Chris
The latter is my view.

Ive used a fair annount of wod round te garden..pressure treated and not 
- to hold up trees. It laways rots in the gruund eventually. The 
pressure treated last longer, but not forever.


Had a lovely rustic seat from Germany. Round pine poles all treated up. 
Thats done about ten years and collapsed in a pile of rot.

mail@atics.co.uk wrote:

>On 30 Jun, 20:04, Bruce  wrote:
>> I have bought some cheap log roll lawn edging from Wickes.  It is
>> 300mm (12 inches) high.  I want to stain the top half green to match
>> our fences and shed.  But I also want to apply a long-lasting
>> preservative to the bottom half that will be buried in soil.
>>
>> Any suggestions as to what would work best?  In the past I would
>> simply have stood the wood in creosote and allowed it to soak in for a
>> few days.  Obviously I cannot buy creosote.  There is creosote
>> substitute, and I have some used engine oil.  Any ideas please?
>
>Dear Bruce
>The only way to get it to last in ground contact by treatment is to
>put in 8 kg per m 3 CCA and it will last more than 60 years (motorway
>fence posts were done to 4 kgs and did not all last!)
>I would have some doubts about Wickes pressure treatment until I knew
>exactly what was specified - there is pressure and pressure !
>
>Given that it is now  allegedly treated the best thing you can do is
>a) dip treat for 12 hours in an OS borne fungicide and allow to dry
>b) soak in a water repellant wax or the like
>c) apply a healty does of pitch or bitumen to the end grain
>d) if you feel like it wrap in a dpc
>
>It might be cheaper just to replace it when it rots!


Well, that's probably true.  What I should have done is waited until
Wickes got the new stock in, which is all pressure treated.  It is
made by Border Fencing, too, so that should be an indicator of at
least a reasonable quality.

Instead, I got it on the cheap, thinking I could soak it in creosote,
and only then remembered - no creosote!

On Jun 30, 11:31 pm, Bruce  wrote:
> meow2...@care2.com wrote:

> >I could only offer a couple of experiences, others may know more.
> >Creosote, which you could buy if mildly determined, killed almost
> >everything within several feet when applied, so doesnt sound like an
> >ideal lawn edging preservative.
>
> It would not be in contact with any vegetation, because I only intend
> to treat the buried section.  I think creosote might have been ideal,
> but now there is only "creosote substitute", which doesn't fill me
> with any optimism.

No, creosote still exists and is still buyable. But getting it does
involve use of brain.


NT

meow2222@care2.com wrote:
> On Jun 30, 11:31 pm, Bruce  wrote:
>> meow2...@care2.com wrote:
> 
>>> I could only offer a couple of experiences, others may know more.
>>> Creosote, which you could buy if mildly determined, killed almost
>>> everything within several feet when applied, so doesnt sound like an
>>> ideal lawn edging preservative.
>> It would not be in contact with any vegetation, because I only intend
>> to treat the buried section.  I think creosote might have been ideal,
>> but now there is only "creosote substitute", which doesn't fill me
>> with any optimism.
> 
> No, creosote still exists and is still buyable. But getting it does
> involve use of brain.
> 
> 
> NT
The main problem is that the underground section of any wood rapidly 
becomes sodden. Surface treatment kills spores that land on the surface, 
and may halt undergound mycelia for a while, but sooner or later 
something is going to break through and start feasting on the inside.


Ive driven in some treated fence poles and gateposts: I expect about 15 
years max out of them.

meow2222@care2.com wrote:

>On Jun 30, 11:31 pm, Bruce  wrote:
>> meow2...@care2.com wrote:
>
>> >I could only offer a couple of experiences, others may know more.
>> >Creosote, which you could buy if mildly determined, killed almost
>> >everything within several feet when applied, so doesnt sound like an
>> >ideal lawn edging preservative.
>>
>> It would not be in contact with any vegetation, because I only intend
>> to treat the buried section.  I think creosote might have been ideal,
>> but now there is only "creosote substitute", which doesn't fill me
>> with any optimism.
>
>No, creosote still exists and is still buyable. But getting it does
>involve use of brain.


Rather than making condescending comments, is there any possibility
that you could make a practical suggestion as to where it can still be
bought?

On 2008-07-01, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:

> Ive used a fair annount of wod round te garden..pressure treated and not 
> - to hold up trees. It laways rots in the gruund eventually. The 
> pressure treated last longer, but not forever.

We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of rot, but
because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the bases were
fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his machine and
ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.

-- 
          "Be thankful that you have a life, and forsake your vain
                 and presumptuous desire for a second one."
               [email me at huge {at} huge (dot) org <dot> uk]

In message , Bruce 
 writes
>>>.
>>
>>No, creosote still exists and is still buyable. But getting it does
>>involve use of brain.
>
>
>Rather than making condescending comments, is there any possibility
>that you could make a practical suggestion as to where it can still be
>bought?

I bought creosote from a builders merchant post restriction. Nobody even 
asked if I was a *professional user* but this was a 25litre drum and 
purchased as an account holder. Phone round the BMs and ask.

regards
>
>

-- 
Tim Lamb

Tim Lamb  wrote:

>In message , Bruce 
> writes
>>>>.
>>>
>>>No, creosote still exists and is still buyable. But getting it does
>>>involve use of brain.
>>
>>
>>Rather than making condescending comments, is there any possibility
>>that you could make a practical suggestion as to where it can still be
>>bought?
>
>I bought creosote from a builders merchant post restriction. Nobody even 
>asked if I was a *professional user* but this was a 25litre drum and 
>purchased as an account holder. Phone round the BMs and ask.


Thanks Tim.

Huge wrote:
> On 2008-07-01, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
> 
>> Ive used a fair annount of wod round te garden..pressure treated and not 
>> - to hold up trees. It laways rots in the gruund eventually. The 
>> pressure treated last longer, but not forever.
> 
> We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of rot, but
> because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the bases were
> fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his machine and
> ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.
> 
Those things were simply soaked in tar weren't they?

On 2008-07-03, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
> Huge wrote:
>> On 2008-07-01, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
>> 
>>> Ive used a fair annount of wod round te garden..pressure treated and not 
>>> - to hold up trees. It laways rots in the gruund eventually. The 
>>> pressure treated last longer, but not forever.
>> 
>> We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of rot, but
>> because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the bases were
>> fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his machine and
>> ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.
>> 
> Those things were simply soaked in tar weren't they?

Pressure treated with creosote, I think, judging by the smell and the colour of
them where they've been sawn through.

-- 
          "Be thankful that you have a life, and forsake your vain
                 and presumptuous desire for a second one."
               [email me at huge {at} huge (dot) org <dot> uk]

Huge wrote:
> On 2008-07-03, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
>> Huge wrote:
>>> On 2008-07-01, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ive used a fair annount of wod round te garden..pressure treated and not 
>>>> - to hold up trees. It laways rots in the gruund eventually. The 
>>>> pressure treated last longer, but not forever.
>>> We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of rot, but
>>> because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the bases were
>>> fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his machine and
>>> ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.
>>>
>> Those things were simply soaked in tar weren't they?
> 
> Pressure treated with creosote, I think, judging by the smell and the colour of
> them where they've been sawn through.
> 
Not sure they had pressure treating that long ago..

It IS possible, if you wait long enough, to completely soak wood in 
preservative.

It takes about as long as air drying does..a year or two.

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
<>
> Not sure they had pressure treating that long ago..
> 
> It IS possible, if you wait long enough, to completely soak wood in 
> preservative.
> 
> It takes about as long as air drying does..a year or two.
> 
I thought that, whatever was done prior to installation, they topped it 
up by pouring creosote into a mini-trench round the base of the pole. 
This would then be sucked up the pole by capillary action.

(I suppose that should be 'bottomed it up' rather than 'topped it up' - 
but it doesn't sound right. :-)  )

-- 
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious 
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
<www.thyromind.info> <www.thyroiduk.org> <www.altsupportthyroid.org>

On 2008-07-03, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
> Huge wrote:
>> On 2008-07-03, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
>>> Huge wrote:
>>>> On 2008-07-01, The Natural Philosopher <a@b.c> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Ive used a fair annount of wod round te garden..pressure treated and not 
>>>>> - to hold up trees. It laways rots in the gruund eventually. The 
>>>>> pressure treated last longer, but not forever.
>>>> We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of rot, but
>>>> because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the bases were
>>>> fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his machine and
>>>> ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.
>>>>
>>> Those things were simply soaked in tar weren't they?
>> 
>> Pressure treated with creosote, I think, judging by the smell and the colour of
>> them where they've been sawn through.
>> 
> Not sure they had pressure treating that long ago..

"That long ago"? 1968?




-- 
          "Be thankful that you have a life, and forsake your vain
                 and presumptuous desire for a second one."
               [email me at huge {at} huge (dot) org <dot> uk]

>>>>> We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of 
>>>>> rot, but
>>>>> because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the 
>>>>> bases were
>>>>> fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his 
>>>>> machine and
>>>>> ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.
>>>>>
>>>> Those things were simply soaked in tar weren't they?
>>>
>>> Pressure treated with creosote, I think, judging by the smell and the 
>>> colour of
>>> them where they've been sawn through.
>>>
>> Not sure they had pressure treating that long ago..
>
> "That long ago"? 1968?
>
>
http://www.geocities.com/wellesley/atrium/8230/levenvalley/levenvalley.htm

scroll down to 'creosote works'

"Creosote Works
When the creosote works first opened in 1887 it was sited on the Methil side 
of the river, near Methil docks. As the docks became busier and grew the 
creosote works moved across the river to their present site. Today they 
specialise, as they have always done, in the treatment of telephone poles."


-- 
Keith

 

** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On 2008-07-03, Keith  wrote:
>
>
>>>>>> We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of 
>>>>>> rot, but
>>>>>> because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the 
>>>>>> bases were
>>>>>> fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his 
>>>>>> machine and
>>>>>> ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Those things were simply soaked in tar weren't they?
>>>>
>>>> Pressure treated with creosote, I think, judging by the smell and the 
>>>> colour of
>>>> them where they've been sawn through.
>>>>
>>> Not sure they had pressure treating that long ago..
>>
>> "That long ago"? 1968?
>>
>>
> http://www.geocities.com/wellesley/atrium/8230/levenvalley/levenvalley.htm
>
> scroll down to 'creosote works'
>
> "Creosote Works
> When the creosote works first opened in 1887 it was sited on the Methil side 
> of the river, near Methil docks. As the docks became busier and grew the 
> creosote works moved across the river to their present site. Today they 
> specialise, as they have always done, in the treatment of telephone poles."

Precisely so - s'what I meant, innit?


-- 
          "Be thankful that you have a life, and forsake your vain
                 and presumptuous desire for a second one."
               [email me at huge {at} huge (dot) org <dot> uk]

"Huge" <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote in message 
news:g4itsf$983$2@anubis.demon.co.uk...
> On 2008-07-03, Keith  wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> "Creosote Works
>> When the creosote works first opened in 1887 it was sited on the Methil 
>> side
>> of the river, near Methil docks. As the docks became busier and grew the
>> creosote works moved across the river to their present site. Today they
>> specialise, as they have always done, in the treatment of telephone 
>> poles."
>
> Precisely so - s'what I meant, innit?
>
Absolutely, specifically didn't include you in the quote by name coz I was 
answering the question "were they soaked in Tar" as well as "that long ago?"
Sorry if the injection of a few facts threw you off guard ! (insert 
appropriate smiley).

It's possible to navigate most of Fife by smell, Kirkcaldy has Forbo-Nairn 
(lino), Windygates has Diageo (whisky), Leven has the Creosote works and 
Inverkeithing has the sewage plant.


-- 
Keith 

** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

Huge wrote:
> On 2008-07-03, Keith  wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> We had the power poles to our house replaced last year, not because of 
>>>>>>> rot, but
>>>>>>> because of woodpecker damage. They were over 40 years old, and the 
>>>>>>> bases were
>>>>>>> fine - the man from the 'leccy board couldn't pull them out with his 
>>>>>>> machine and
>>>>>>> ended up chainsawing them off at ground level.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Those things were simply soaked in tar weren't they?
>>>>> Pressure treated with creosote, I think, judging by the smell and the 
>>>>> colour of
>>>>> them where they've been sawn through.
>>>>>
>>>> Not sure they had pressure treating that long ago..
>>> "That long ago"? 1968?
>>>
>>>
>> http://www.geocities.com/wellesley/atrium/8230/levenvalley/levenvalley.htm
>>
>> scroll down to 'creosote works'
>>
>> "Creosote Works
>> When the creosote works first opened in 1887 it was sited on the Methil side 
>> of the river, near Methil docks. As the docks became busier and grew the 
>> creosote works moved across the river to their present site. Today they 
>> specialise, as they have always done, in the treatment of telephone poles."
> 
> Precisely so - s'what I meant, innit?
> 
> 
But nowhere does it say that they pressure treated telephone poles.

My point was not that cresosote wasnt't around then, (obviously it goes 
back to victorian times or so) but that pressure treating wasn't around 
40 years ago.

Keith wrote:
> 
> 
> "Huge" <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote in message 
> news:g4itsf$983$2@anubis.demon.co.uk...
>> On 2008-07-03, Keith  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Creosote Works
>>> When the creosote works first opened in 1887 it was sited on the 
>>> Methil side
>>> of the river, near Methil docks. As the docks became busier and grew the
>>> creosote works moved across the river to their present site. Today they
>>> specialise, as they have always done, in the treatment of telephone 
>>> poles."
>>
>> Precisely so - s'what I meant, innit?
>>
> Absolutely, specifically didn't include you in the quote by name coz I 
> was answering the question "were they soaked in Tar" as well as "that 
> long ago?"
> Sorry if the injection of a few facts threw you off guard ! (insert 
> appropriate smiley).

Now show me where it says that telephone poles have ever been pressure 
treated.

> 
> It's possible to navigate most of Fife by smell, Kirkcaldy has 
> Forbo-Nairn (lino), Windygates has Diageo (whisky), Leven has the 
> Creosote works and Inverkeithing has the sewage plant.
> 
>