[WARNING!: x - posted to
rec.food.cooking,uk.food+drink.misc,alt.food.fast-food,rec.travel.europe...]


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article4560082.ece

From The TimesAugust 19, 2008

Supersize ... moi? How the French learnt to love McDonald's

McDonald's makes more money in France than it does in Britain, and Paris has
as many golden arches as London - but no self-respecting French diner will
admit to eating there


By Hugo Rifkind

"Magali, the photographer, is appalled. We are in McDonald's, just around
the corner from the Louvre in the 1st arrondissement of Paris, and we are
tucking into some breakfast. With a beer. Because we can.

"But what ees thees?" she demands.

Croque monsieur. Well, technically a Croque McDo. Jambon and a spot of
fromage. It's rather good.

"No," says Magali. "It is not. A croque is something ... beautiful. But
thees is ... my god."

Correction. Magali is not appalled. This is something deeper than appalled.
This is existential.

Magali doesn't eat in McDonald's. In fact, she says, she doesn't know
anybody who eats in McDonald's. Stop any Frenchman on the street - and we
stop plenty - and he will shrug and snarl and say that he doesn't eat in
McDonald's, either.

Yet an awful lot of people do eat in McDonald's. In this city of all things
haute cuisine and gastronomique, you will find almost 70 restaurants under
golden arches, with even more dotted around the outer suburbs. That's much
the same as London, but with only a third of the people.

McDonald's, or "macdoh" as it is ubiquitously known, is France's dirty
secret. In 2007, as you may have read on our business pages, the chain's
French revenues increased by 11 per cent to ?3 billion (£2.3 billion).
That's more than it generates in Britain. In terms of profit, France is
second only to the US itself - and this in the land that first realised that
food wasn't just about eating. How on earth did this come about?

Asking the customers can take you only so far. At the next table a family
are eating together. "We're only in here because we're in a rush," says the
father, much like a husband explaining a mistress to his incredulous wife.
"It's not normal. We would never eat in McDonald's usually." He says that he
is from Montreal, anyway, and that we may refer to him only as Mr X. The
rest of the family stay silent, and munch, and blush.

This year, for the first time, McDonald's looks likely to make the bulk of
its earnings from outside the US. This has much to do with the French, and
not just with their eating. McDonald's in Europe has changed. Three years
ago, Denis Hennequin - president of the chain in Europe and a Frenchman -
embarked on a makeover of the Continent's outlets. Just outside Paris there
is now the McDonald's European design studio, which has created a variety of
theoretically upmarket restaurant templates.

"We have eight concepts at the moment," says Stephen Douglas, implementation
director in the European design studio, "but none are France-specific." They
are Quality, Eternity, Generation, Lim, and Pure and Simple, with three
variations thrown in to make up the eight. Some are intended to give a
business vibe, some are targeted at families. Eternity is the most
impressive and design-heavy. "It provides a fast-food environment that is
significantly different," says Douglas, "inspired by an American
architectural heritage." In other words, your average McDonald's no longer
looks like a crèche in a lunatic asylum on a cross- Channel ferry.

But it's not exactly a chic French bistro, either. And the food remains much
the same, in France or anywhere. There are different regional flourishes, to
be sure. You can drink your beer in France, although nobody except me seems
to bother. You can have your (photographer-derided) croque. Also, as you may
remember from Samuel L Jackson in Pulp Fiction, what you call a cheeseburger
is known in these parts as a Royal Cheese, and your cheese is the Alpine
delicacy reblochon.

All of which might seem terribly exciting if you lived in, say, Stornoway.
But Paris? Part of the chain's success may be down to the way that France
has changed, and continues to change. In the British stereotype, the
Frenchman - banker or binman - takes a long lunch. He goes to the flawless
restaurant around the corner, sits down at his usual white-and-red-checked
table, undoes his top button and tucks in. He starts with a baguette, he
orders a bottle of red wine. Two, maybe three hours later he finishes his
cheese, emits a discreet belch and settles the bill, which comes to about
?3. Then he gets back to work.

This is no longer true. Or at least, it is no longer entirely true. As the
French have begun to adopt Anglo-American working practices, they have also
begun to adopt Anglo-American eating practices. One oft-quoted statistic is
that the length of the average French meal has fallen from 1 hour 22 minutes
in 1978 to a mere 38 minutes today.

To find out how they fill that 38 minutes we head to the 9th arrondissement,
an area full of offices and office workers, evidently requiring a
considerable number of lunches each day. The streets here are relatively
narrow and the buildings relatively high, but flat-fronted and
wood-shuttered in that very Parisian way. At street level, everything is
food: Pizza Venezia, Café la Roseraie, quite a few McDonald's, too. We pass
one with a super-fast takeaway hatch, like a walk-thru drive-thru. It is
next door to a gym.

Aside from the many McDonald's, we are told, the big change around here is
that an awful lot of these little cafés don't have much room to sit. You are
not expected to sit. You are expected to grab your food and go away. Like an
American. Or, worse, like a Brit.

Typical of these new places is the shorthand-unfriendly
CinQfrUitSetLeGumEScHaQueJoUr. That is to say, "five fruits and five
vegetables each day" but with the words all run together and capitals
applied with wild Gallic abandon. Fast food or not, the vibe here is all
about health.

"Our typical clientele is businessmen. A lot of creative types," says Robert
Renaud, 47, who is the co-owner and knows everybody who so much as wanders
past the window. "The women love it: they are much more up for trying
something new. The men just want ham and cheese baguettes."

Robert agrees that Parisian life has changed. People have a quick lunch so
that they can leave earlier and have a longer dinner. It's not that they are
no longer interested in savouring mealtimes, he says, just that they are
favouring one over the other. "Most people are between the ages of 30 and
35," he adds. "The old people don't like the idea of takeaway so much."

Philippe, 35, is one of his last customers and has grabbed something
involving salad and goat's cheese. He agrees that people no longer have the
time for a long lunch, but takes a more complex view on senior resistance.

"The French do not disapprove of fast food as a meal," he insists. "What is
wrong is to eat between meals. It is the mealtime that is sacred, not the
type of food. When your Lord Sandwich invented the sandwich, he did so to
eat without stopping. This is not French."

True enough, even when the French visit McDonald's, they do so differently.
They are more likely to visit as a family event, much like our "Canadian"
family above. A French McDonald's is busy on a weekday lunchtime but busier
still at the weekend. Here, in the birthplace of the Michelin guide,
McDonald's is considered a treat. It's enough to make you weep.

Healthy fast food is something new. Unsurprisingly, panting hard on the
heels of a convenience food culture comes the chubby spectre of obesity.
French obesity rates have rocketed in recent years. According to estimates,
11 per cent of the French are obese and 40 per cent are overweight. This is
better than the UK or the US, but it grows by about 5 per cent every year.
One thinks of those previously untouched indigenous tribes that manage to
wipe themselves out in a generation after being introduced to booze. The
French are failing to eat in moderation. For a culture that prides itself on
its waistline, this is a difficult failing to accept. Only a few years ago,
remember, there was a bestselling diet book called French Women Don't Get
Fat. But they do.

Not before time, the French seem to be wising up. In recent years, at least
in Paris, there has been a boom in fast-food eateries of the sort described
above. The pioneer in this respect is a newish chain called Cojean. It was
set up in 2001 by Alain Cojean, who had spent the previous 15 years working
in research and development for - yes - McDonald's. Cojean is a very
different beast.

We visit the branch across the road from the Louvre. Cool and airy, it is
tastefully converted from an elaborately corniced patisserie. It sells fresh
salads, proper coffee and sandwiches that are resolutely not triangular. We
pick a ham and melon salad with noodles and rocket. The melon tastes as if
it has just fallen from a tree, and the ham just scraped from a happy pig.
There is a surprise bit of jagged plastic lurking in the middle, true
enough, but we are not in McDonald's so we have no urge to sue. It just adds
to the sense of handmade authenticity.

At the next table we find Johan, Gilles and Caroline, all groomed, trendy
and in their twenties. Johan works in an office near by. The other two are
students. They eat, they debate. It is all very French.

"It's not too embarrassing to go to McDonald's. Although I wouldn't go
often."

"Not more than three or four times a month."

"No. And I don't think of the burger as being part of an invasion of
American culture, or anything like that. Burgers generally are much better
quality than they used to be. There is a tendency to eat better. More
healthily."

"This stuff is much better than McDonald's. It's really good. I'm not
ashamed to be here at all."

If only Cojean would cross the Channel. Everything looks wonderful, and at
only ?6 a pop. This place is to Pret A Manger what the Eiffel Tower is to
the Blackpool Tower.

Even with takeaway food, the French are deeply reluctant to eat at their
desks. They prefer to hang around in the office kitchen or sit in a communal
area. The food may have changed but the concept of lunch remains so
ingrained in French life that none of the many diners we meet bothers to
mention what, for a Brit, is the most striking French culinary fact of all:
they don't pay for their lunch. Their employer does. Mais oui. Bien sur.

The French economy may be Anglofying at a rapid rate but, for now, the
ticket restaurant survives more or less intact. This is a voucher, normally
for between ?6 and ?12, which every employer provides every day, by law, and
which may be spent only on lunch. So you have to go out for lunch. You are
being paid to go out for lunch. It is the rules. The French take the
ticketrestaurant for granted to such an extent that they barely notice it.
Most would probably be appalled to realise that the system actually
originated, like the sandwich, in Britain. Virtually forgotten about here,
they generate heavy tax breaks for employers in France and are often
credited with sustaining the French restaurant industry. And, in these
troubled times, they could provide a clue to the French fast-food boom.
Whereas ?10 will pay for only two thirds of your plat du jour, it will pay
for your whole takeaway.

Or a meal for two in McDonald's. Not, of course, that we have yet found
anybody French who is prepared to admit that the macdoh is their lunch-spot
of choice. Around the corner, on Rue La Fayette, we try once more.

Dareth, 33, works in property. "This burger is disgusting," he admits.
"Every couple of months I get a craving. It's a chemical thing, I think. I
don't even work near here. I just came for the McDonald's. I had to."

And does this embarrass him, as a Frenchman?

"I wouldn't know," shrugs Dareth. "I'm from Switzerland."
</>


ADDENDA:

Burger culture clash

(from Pulp Fiction)

Jules: You know what they call a Quarter Pounder with cheese in France?

Brett: No.

Jules: Tell 'em, Vincent.

Vincent: A Royale with cheese.

Jules: A Royale with cheese! You know why they call it that?

Brett: Because of the metric system?

Jules: Check out the big brain on Brett! You're a smart motherf***er. That's
right. The metric system.


Designer burgers

The best in the UK

A marked trend in recent years has been the rise of the "posh" burger.
Madonna offered guests at her 50th birthday bash kosher-prepared Wagyu beef
burgers, and chains such as the Gourmet Burger Kitchen are doing a roaring
trade in burgers made from Aberdeen Angus beef or even organic wild boar,
trading on the fact that, while we all want to be healthier, sometimes only
a slab of meat in a bun will do. Here are some of those whetting the UK's
appetite for wholesome fast food.

Gourmet Burger Kitchen

A chain with locations across the UK (www.gbkinfo.com)

Woodies Diner

366 Kingsway, Brighton BN3 4QT (01273 430300)

Eagle Bar Diner

3-5 Rathbone Place, London W1 (020-7637 1418)

Haché

24 Inverness Street, Camden NW1 7HJ (020-7485 9100)

Vingt-Quatre

325 Fulham Road, SW10 9QL (020-7376 7224)

Relish

217 High Street, Edinburgh EH1 1EP (0131 2258770)

River Bar & Grill

89 Victoria Street, Liverpool City Centre L1 6DG (0871 8114800)

Handmade Burger Company

Upper Mill Arcade, Touchwood, Birmingham (0121 7113004).."

</>

A better place is a place without morrow the moron.

"Gregory Morrow"  a écrit dans 
le message de news:tcqdnYfV9NOG4DbVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d@earthlink.com...
> [WARNING!: x - posted to
> rec.food.cooking,uk.food+drink.misc,alt.food.fast-food,rec.travel.europe...]
>
>
> http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article4560082.ece
>
> From The TimesAugust 19, 2008
>
> Supersize ... moi? How the French learnt to love McDonald's
>
> McDonald's makes more money in France than it does in Britain, and Paris 
> has
> as many golden arches as London - but no self-respecting French diner will
> admit to eating there
>
>
> By Hugo Rifkind
>
> "Magali, the photographer, is appalled. We are in McDonald's, just around
> the corner from the Louvre in the 1st arrondissement of Paris, and we are
> tucking into some breakfast. With a beer. Because we can.
>
> "But what ees thees?" she demands.
>
> Croque monsieur. Well, technically a Croque McDo. Jambon and a spot of
> fromage. It's rather good.
>
> "No," says Magali. "It is not. A croque is something ... beautiful. But
> thees is ... my god."
>
> Correction. Magali is not appalled. This is something deeper than 
> appalled.
> This is existential.
>
> Magali doesn't eat in McDonald's. In fact, she says, she doesn't know
> anybody who eats in McDonald's. Stop any Frenchman on the street - and we
> stop plenty - and he will shrug and snarl and say that he doesn't eat in
> McDonald's, either.
>
> Yet an awful lot of people do eat in McDonald's. In this city of all 
> things
> haute cuisine and gastronomique, you will find almost 70 restaurants under
> golden arches, with even more dotted around the outer suburbs. That's much
> the same as London, but with only a third of the people.
>
> McDonald's, or "macdoh" as it is ubiquitously known, is France's dirty
> secret. In 2007, as you may have read on our business pages, the chain's
> French revenues increased by 11 per cent to ?3 billion (£2.3 billion).
> That's more than it generates in Britain. In terms of profit, France is
> second only to the US itself - and this in the land that first realised 
> that
> food wasn't just about eating. How on earth did this come about?
>
> Asking the customers can take you only so far. At the next table a family
> are eating together. "We're only in here because we're in a rush," says 
> the
> father, much like a husband explaining a mistress to his incredulous wife.
> "It's not normal. We would never eat in McDonald's usually." He says that 
> he
> is from Montreal, anyway, and that we may refer to him only as Mr X. The
> rest of the family stay silent, and munch, and blush.
>
> This year, for the first time, McDonald's looks likely to make the bulk of
> its earnings from outside the US. This has much to do with the French, and
> not just with their eating. McDonald's in Europe has changed. Three years
> ago, Denis Hennequin - president of the chain in Europe and a Frenchman -
> embarked on a makeover of the Continent's outlets. Just outside Paris 
> there
> is now the McDonald's European design studio, which has created a variety 
> of
> theoretically upmarket restaurant templates.
>
> "We have eight concepts at the moment," says Stephen Douglas, 
> implementation
> director in the European design studio, "but none are France-specific." 
> They
> are Quality, Eternity, Generation, Lim, and Pure and Simple, with three
> variations thrown in to make up the eight. Some are intended to give a
> business vibe, some are targeted at families. Eternity is the most
> impressive and design-heavy. "It provides a fast-food environment that is
> significantly different," says Douglas, "inspired by an American
> architectural heritage." In other words, your average McDonald's no longer
> looks like a crèche in a lunatic asylum on a cross- Channel ferry.
>
> But it's not exactly a chic French bistro, either. And the food remains 
> much
> the same, in France or anywhere. There are different regional flourishes, 
> to
> be sure. You can drink your beer in France, although nobody except me 
> seems
> to bother. You can have your (photographer-derided) croque. Also, as you 
> may
> remember from Samuel L Jackson in Pulp Fiction, what you call a 
> cheeseburger
> is known in these parts as a Royal Cheese, and your cheese is the Alpine
> delicacy reblochon.
>
> All of which might seem terribly exciting if you lived in, say, Stornoway.
> But Paris? Part of the chain's success may be down to the way that France
> has changed, and continues to change. In the British stereotype, the
> Frenchman - banker or binman - takes a long lunch. He goes to the flawless
> restaurant around the corner, sits down at his usual white-and-red-checked
> table, undoes his top button and tucks in. He starts with a baguette, he
> orders a bottle of red wine. Two, maybe three hours later he finishes his
> cheese, emits a discreet belch and settles the bill, which comes to about
> ?3. Then he gets back to work.
>
> This is no longer true. Or at least, it is no longer entirely true. As the
> French have begun to adopt Anglo-American working practices, they have 
> also
> begun to adopt Anglo-American eating practices. One oft-quoted statistic 
> is
> that the length of the average French meal has fallen from 1 hour 22 
> minutes
> in 1978 to a mere 38 minutes today.
>
> To find out how they fill that 38 minutes we head to the 9th 
> arrondissement,
> an area full of offices and office workers, evidently requiring a
> considerable number of lunches each day. The streets here are relatively
> narrow and the buildings relatively high, but flat-fronted and
> wood-shuttered in that very Parisian way. At street level, everything is
> food: Pizza Venezia, Café la Roseraie, quite a few McDonald's, too. We 
> pass
> one with a super-fast takeaway hatch, like a walk-thru drive-thru. It is
> next door to a gym.
>
> Aside from the many McDonald's, we are told, the big change around here is
> that an awful lot of these little cafés don't have much room to sit. You 
> are
> not expected to sit. You are expected to grab your food and go away. Like 
> an
> American. Or, worse, like a Brit.
>
> Typical of these new places is the shorthand-unfriendly
> CinQfrUitSetLeGumEScHaQueJoUr. That is to say, "five fruits and five
> vegetables each day" but with the words all run together and capitals
> applied with wild Gallic abandon. Fast food or not, the vibe here is all
> about health.
>
> "Our typical clientele is businessmen. A lot of creative types," says 
> Robert
> Renaud, 47, who is the co-owner and knows everybody who so much as wanders
> past the window. "The women love it: they are much more up for trying
> something new. The men just want ham and cheese baguettes."
>
> Robert agrees that Parisian life has changed. People have a quick lunch so
> that they can leave earlier and have a longer dinner. It's not that they 
> are
> no longer interested in savouring mealtimes, he says, just that they are
> favouring one over the other. "Most people are between the ages of 30 and
> 35," he adds. "The old people don't like the idea of takeaway so much."
>
> Philippe, 35, is one of his last customers and has grabbed something
> involving salad and goat's cheese. He agrees that people no longer have 
> the
> time for a long lunch, but takes a more complex view on senior resistance.
>
> "The French do not disapprove of fast food as a meal," he insists. "What 
> is
> wrong is to eat between meals. It is the mealtime that is sacred, not the
> type of food. When your Lord Sandwich invented the sandwich, he did so to
> eat without stopping. This is not French."
>
> True enough, even when the French visit McDonald's, they do so 
> differently.
> They are more likely to visit as a family event, much like our "Canadian"
> family above. A French McDonald's is busy on a weekday lunchtime but 
> busier
> still at the weekend. Here, in the birthplace of the Michelin guide,
> McDonald's is considered a treat. It's enough to make you weep.
>
> Healthy fast food is something new. Unsurprisingly, panting hard on the
> heels of a convenience food culture comes the chubby spectre of obesity.
> French obesity rates have rocketed in recent years. According to 
> estimates,
> 11 per cent of the French are obese and 40 per cent are overweight. This 
> is
> better than the UK or the US, but it grows by about 5 per cent every year.
> One thinks of those previously untouched indigenous tribes that manage to
> wipe themselves out in a generation after being introduced to booze. The
> French are failing to eat in moderation. For a culture that prides itself 
> on
> its waistline, this is a difficult failing to accept. Only a few years 
> ago,
> remember, there was a bestselling diet book called French Women Don't Get
> Fat. But they do.
>
> Not before time, the French seem to be wising up. In recent years, at 
> least
> in Paris, there has been a boom in fast-food eateries of the sort 
> described
> above. The pioneer in this respect is a newish chain called Cojean. It was
> set up in 2001 by Alain Cojean, who had spent the previous 15 years 
> working
> in research and development for - yes - McDonald's. Cojean is a very
> different beast.
>
> We visit the branch across the road from the Louvre. Cool and airy, it is
> tastefully converted from an elaborately corniced patisserie. It sells 
> fresh
> salads, proper coffee and sandwiches that are resolutely not triangular. 
> We
> pick a ham and melon salad with noodles and rocket. The melon tastes as if
> it has just fallen from a tree, and the ham just scraped from a happy pig.
> There is a surprise bit of jagged plastic lurking in the middle, true
> enough, but we are not in McDonald's so we have no urge to sue. It just 
> adds
> to the sense of handmade authenticity.
>
> At the next table we find Johan, Gilles and Caroline, all groomed, trendy
> and in their twenties. Johan works in an office near by. The other two are
> students. They eat, they debate. It is all very French.
>
> "It's not too embarrassing to go to McDonald's. Although I wouldn't go
> often."
>
> "Not more than three or four times a month."
>
> "No. And I don't think of the burger as being part of an invasion of
> American culture, or anything like that. Burgers generally are much better
> quality than they used to be. There is a tendency to eat better. More
> healthily."
>
> "This stuff is much better than McDonald's. It's really good. I'm not
> ashamed to be here at all."
>
> If only Cojean would cross the Channel. Everything looks wonderful, and at
> only ?6 a pop. This place is to Pret A Manger what the Eiffel Tower is to
> the Blackpool Tower.
>
> Even with takeaway food, the French are deeply reluctant to eat at their
> desks. They prefer to hang around in the office kitchen or sit in a 
> communal
> area. The food may have changed but the concept of lunch remains so
> ingrained in French life that none of the many diners we meet bothers to
> mention what, for a Brit, is the most striking French culinary fact of 
> all:
> they don't pay for their lunch. Their employer does. Mais oui. Bien sur.
>
> The French economy may be Anglofying at a rapid rate but, for now, the
> ticket restaurant survives more or less intact. This is a voucher, 
> normally
> for between ?6 and ?12, which every employer provides every day, by law, 
> and
> which may be spent only on lunch. So you have to go out for lunch. You are
> being paid to go out for lunch. It is the rules. The French take the
> ticketrestaurant for granted to such an extent that they barely notice it.
> Most would probably be appalled to realise that the system actually
> originated, like the sandwich, in Britain. Virtually forgotten about here,
> they generate heavy tax breaks for employers in France and are often
> credited with sustaining the French restaurant industry. And, in these
> troubled times, they could provide a clue to the French fast-food boom.
> Whereas ?10 will pay for only two thirds of your plat du jour, it will pay
> for your whole takeaway.
>
> Or a meal for two in McDonald's. Not, of course, that we have yet found
> anybody French who is prepared to admit that the macdoh is their 
> lunch-spot
> of choice. Around the corner, on Rue La Fayette, we try once more.
>
> Dareth, 33, works in property. "This burger is disgusting," he admits.
> "Every couple of months I get a craving. It's a chemical thing, I think. I
> don't even work near here. I just came for the McDonald's. I had to."
>
> And does this embarrass him, as a Frenchman?
>
> "I wouldn't know," shrugs Dareth. "I'm from Switzerland."
> </>
>
>
> ADDENDA:
>
> Burger culture clash
>
> (from Pulp Fiction)
>
> Jules: You know what they call a Quarter Pounder with cheese in France?
>
> Brett: No.
>
> Jules: Tell 'em, Vincent.
>
> Vincent: A Royale with cheese.
>
> Jules: A Royale with cheese! You know why they call it that?
>
> Brett: Because of the metric system?
>
> Jules: Check out the big brain on Brett! You're a smart motherf***er. 
> That's
> right. The metric system.
>
>
> Designer burgers
>
> The best in the UK
>
> A marked trend in recent years has been the rise of the "posh" burger.
> Madonna offered guests at her 50th birthday bash kosher-prepared Wagyu 
> beef
> burgers, and chains such as the Gourmet Burger Kitchen are doing a roaring
> trade in burgers made from Aberdeen Angus beef or even organic wild boar,
> trading on the fact that, while we all want to be healthier, sometimes 
> only
> a slab of meat in a bun will do. Here are some of those whetting the UK's
> appetite for wholesome fast food.
>
> Gourmet Burger Kitchen
>
> A chain with locations across the UK (www.gbkinfo.com)
>
> Woodies Diner
>
> 366 Kingsway, Brighton BN3 4QT (01273 430300)
>
> Eagle Bar Diner
>
> 3-5 Rathbone Place, London W1 (020-7637 1418)
>
> Haché
>
> 24 Inverness Street, Camden NW1 7HJ (020-7485 9100)
>
> Vingt-Quatre
>
> 325 Fulham Road, SW10 9QL (020-7376 7224)
>
> Relish
>
> 217 High Street, Edinburgh EH1 1EP (0131 2258770)
>
> River Bar & Grill
>
> 89 Victoria Street, Liverpool City Centre L1 6DG (0871 8114800)
>
> Handmade Burger Company
>
> Upper Mill Arcade, Touchwood, Birmingham (0121 7113004).."
>
> </>
>
>

Runge12 wrote:
> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
> 
> "Gregory Morrow"  a écrit 
> dans le message de news:tcqdnYfV9NOG4DbVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d@earthlink.com...
>> [WARNING!: x - posted to
>> rec.food.cooking,uk.food+drink.misc,alt.food.fast-food,rec.travel.europe...] 
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article4560082.ece 

Well, I for one enjoyed the article enormously. You must have also since 
you reposted it in entirety.

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 01:58:51 -0400, Goomba wrote:

> Runge12 wrote:
>> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
>> 
>> "Gregory Morrow"  a écrit 
>> dans le message de news:tcqdnYfV9NOG4DbVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d@earthlink.com...
>>> [WARNING!: x - posted to
>>> rec.food.cooking,uk.food+drink.misc,alt.food.fast-food,rec.travel.europe...] 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article4560082.ece 
> 
> Well, I for one enjoyed the article enormously. You must have also since 
> you reposted it in entirety.

the french gave the u.s. the war in vietnam, we gave them mcdonald's.
seems fair.

your pal,
blake

Op Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:12:22 GMT frommelde blake murphy :

> the french gave the u.s. the war in vietnam

I know US education was below par, but apparently it now is nonexistent.

-- 
*** Waldo ***
I've been around so long I can remember Doris Day before she was 
a virgin.

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 21:19:52 -0500, "Gregory Morrow"
 wrote:

>http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article4560082.ece
>
>From The TimesAugust 19, 2008
>
>Supersize ... moi? How the French learnt to love McDonald's
>
>McDonald's makes more money in France than it does in Britain, and Paris has
>as many golden arches as London - but no self-respecting French diner will
>admit to eating there

It's strange that some people won't admit to eating there (people on
these groups too!) even though they secretly do.

Corey Richardson said...

> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 21:19:52 -0500, "Gregory Morrow"
>  wrote:
> 
>>http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article456
>>0082.ece 
>>
>>From The TimesAugust 19, 2008
>>
>>Supersize ... moi? How the French learnt to love McDonald's
>>
>>McDonald's makes more money in France than it does in Britain, and Paris
>>has as many golden arches as London - but no self-respecting French
>>diner will admit to eating there
> 
> It's strange that some people won't admit to eating there (people on
> these groups too!) even though they secretly do.


I remember in Amsterdam at McDs you could get a hamburger first thing in 
the morning. They didn't have "breakfast hours."

I'd go to Wendy's before McDonalds. Even though they're both chock full o' 
fat and sodium and other garbage, at least Wendy's puts tomato on their 
burgers. McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste 
like anything remotely resembling meat.

McD in SA, Australia burgers tasted different, maybe kangaroo, which is 
great stuff (grey kangaroo NOT red), BTW.

Now if there was a White Castle near me, we'd have a problem!!! ;)

Andy

"Runge12"  
news:48aba2e3$0$953$ba4acef3@news.orange.fr: in rec.food.cooking 

> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
> 

Yet you felt compelled to respond with the entire OP intact. The article 
was fine and it was about food. 

Michael 



-- 
"No More Getting Jerked Around by the Gas Nozzle"
		~ Senator Larry Craig R-Idaho on Cspan-2


 To email - michael at lonergan dot us dot com

blake murphy  
news:1pf7qdkzvsfho.1j3o6yxhvankk.dlg@40tude.net: in rec.food.cooking 

> 
> the french gave the u.s. the war in vietnam, we gave them mcdonald's.
> seems fair.
> 
> your pal,
> blake

<splurt> you owe me paper towels.

Michael
-- 
"No More Getting Jerked Around by the Gas Nozzle"
		~ Senator Larry Craig R-Idaho on Cspan-2


 To email - michael at lonergan dot us dot com

In article , Corey 
Richardson says...
 
> It's strange that some people won't admit to eating there (people on
> these groups too!) even though they secretly do.

During our recent trip to France we have eaten lots of time in McDonalds 
restaurants (too many times!), mainly because due to the travelling and 
sightseeing we found ourselves often eating at odd times (French 
restaurants close at 2:30pm) and sometimes only wanted to have a small 
thing or didn't have much time.
-- 

Alfred Molon
http://www.molon.de - Photos of Asia, Africa and Europe

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:40:42 GMT, "Michael \"Dog3\"" 
wrote:

>"Runge12"  
>news:48aba2e3$0$953$ba4acef3@news.orange.fr: in rec.food.cooking 
>
>> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
>> 
>
>Yet you felt compelled to respond with the entire OP intact. The article 
>was fine and it was about food. 
>
>Michael 

It's a wonder that some people didn't demand he multi-post it!

he will, just ask for it

"Corey Richardson"  a écrit dans le message de 
news:tjroa417gj460klaj8c5ck61o1anc8um1q@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:40:42 GMT, "Michael \"Dog3\"" 
> wrote:
>
>>"Runge12" 
>>news:48aba2e3$0$953$ba4acef3@news.orange.fr: in rec.food.cooking
>>
>>> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
>>>
>>
>>Yet you felt compelled to respond with the entire OP intact. The article
>>was fine and it was about food.
>>
>>Michael
>
> It's a wonder that some people didn't demand he multi-post it!
>

Goomba wrote:

> Runge12 wrote:
> > A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
> >
> > "Gregory Morrow"  a écrit
> > dans le message de
news:tcqdnYfV9NOG4DbVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d@earthlink.com...
> >> [WARNING!: x - posted to
> >>
rec.food.cooking,uk.food+drink.misc,alt.food.fast-food,rec.travel.europe...]
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article4560082.ece
>
> Well, I for one enjoyed the article enormously. You must have also since
> you reposted it in entirety.


Don't mind the old Parisian malcontent "gRunge", he is the proverbial
cockroach on the wedding cake...lol.

How someone who lives in one of the most lovely places on the planet can be
such a consistently wretched churl like 'Runge' is beyond me, but then I
guess all things on God's good earth are possible...


:-)


-- 
Best
Greg

Alfred Molon wrote:
> In article , Corey 
> Richardson says...
>  
>> It's strange that some people won't admit to eating there (people on
>> these groups too!) even though they secretly do.
> 
> During our recent trip to France we have eaten lots of time in McDonalds 
> restaurants (too many times!), mainly because due to the travelling and 
> sightseeing we found ourselves often eating at odd times (French 
> restaurants close at 2:30pm) and sometimes only wanted to have a small 
> thing or didn't have much time.

  Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:

>Corey Richardson said...
>
>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 21:19:52 -0500, "Gregory Morrow"
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>>http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article456
>>>0082.ece 
>>>
>>>From The TimesAugust 19, 2008
>>>
>>>Supersize ... moi? How the French learnt to love McDonald's
>>>
>>>McDonald's makes more money in France than it does in Britain, and Paris
>>>has as many golden arches as London - but no self-respecting French
>>>diner will admit to eating there
>> 
>> It's strange that some people won't admit to eating there (people on
>> these groups too!) even though they secretly do.
>
>
>I remember in Amsterdam at McDs you could get a hamburger first thing in 
>the morning. They didn't have "breakfast hours."
>
>I'd go to Wendy's before McDonalds. Even though they're both chock full o' 
>fat and sodium and other garbage, at least Wendy's puts tomato on their 
>burgers. McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste 
>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>
>McD in SA, Australia burgers tasted different, maybe kangaroo, which is 
>great stuff (grey kangaroo NOT red), BTW.
>
Doubtful; they claim it's all Aussie beef. That does taste
different to US and European beef of course.

>Now if there was a White Castle near me, we'd have a problem!!! ;)
>
>Andy

I use McD's occasionally when I travel for their clean
toilets; I accept that the price of admission is a burger
but I usually bin it unless I'm very, very hungry.


Cheers, Alan, Australia
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/
http://loraltravel.blogspot.com 
Latest: Food, Glorious Food In India

In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith 
says...

>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i

Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1) 
the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you 
can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but 
in some situations they are quite practical.
-- 

Alfred Molon
http://www.molon.de - Photos of Asia, Africa and Europe

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
 wrote:

>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith 
>says...
>
>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>
>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1) 
>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you 
>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but 
>in some situations they are quite practical.

And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:01:39 +0100, Corey Richardson
 wrote:

>On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
> wrote:
>
>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith 
>>says...
>>
>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>
>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1) 
>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you 
>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but 
>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>
>And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!

Really? I suppose everything is relative, there have been
moments, very rare ones, when I agreed with you. Scroll down
to "There is another side":
http://loraltravel.blogspot.com/2008/08/food-glorious-food-in-india.html

In almost any other circumstances I would eat almost
anything else...

Cheers, Alan, Australia

"Alan S"  wrote

> I use McD's occasionally when I travel for their clean
> toilets; I accept that the price of admission is a burger
> but I usually bin it unless I'm very, very hungry.


I occasionally drop a slug in a McDonald's as they're usually very clean.  I 
feel no obligation to purchase anything.

TFM®

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:53:05 -0400, TFM® 
wrote:

>
>
>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
>news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
>>  wrote:
>>
>>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith
>>>says...
>>>
>>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>>
>>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1)
>>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you
>>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but
>>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>>
>> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>>
>
>Oh yes, it's quite healthy!  The average person can transform themselves 
>from a normal human to a Sumo wrestler within a matter of months.
>
>Your certificate of retardation is in the mail.
>
>
>TFM® 

No one is suggesting you eat a McDonalds every day, or even every week.

When consumed in moderation, there's absolutely nothing wrong with
fast-food.

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:

>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste 
>like anything remotely resembling meat.

In the UK it's 100% ground beef and the only thing they add after
cooking is a little ground salt and pepper.

I must admit I'd like to try a White Castle or a Wendy's.

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 22:44:56 +0200, "Runge12" 
wrote:

>"Corey Richardson"  a écrit dans le message de 
>news:tjroa417gj460klaj8c5ck61o1anc8um1q@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:40:42 GMT, "Michael \"Dog3\"" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>"Runge12" 
>>>news:48aba2e3$0$953$ba4acef3@news.orange.fr: in rec.food.cooking
>>>
>>>> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Yet you felt compelled to respond with the entire OP intact. The article
>>>was fine and it was about food.
>>>
>>>Michael
>>
>> It's a wonder that some people didn't demand he multi-post it!
>> 
>he will, just ask for it

Why top-post? It's nearly as bad as multi-posting!

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:8g8pa45399j8po5lqtdpng846p5jas3833@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:53:05 -0400, TFM® 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith
>>>>says...
>>>>
>>>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>>>
>>>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1)
>>>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you
>>>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but
>>>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>>>
>>> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>>>
>>
>>Oh yes, it's quite healthy!  The average person can transform themselves
>>from a normal human to a Sumo wrestler within a matter of months.
>>
>>Your certificate of retardation is in the mail.
>>
>>
>>TFM®
>
> No one is suggesting you eat a McDonalds every day, or even every week.
>
> When consumed in moderation, there's absolutely nothing wrong with
> fast-food.

Excepting the fact that it's not even food, I suppose you're right.  Nothing 
wrong with eating a dog turd every now and then either, I suppose.

Expect your certificate in 4-6 weeks.  Suitable for framing.


TFM®

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>
>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>
> In the UK it's 100% ground beef


It's 100% ground beef here too.  Mostly lungs and stomachs.

TFM®

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:10:16 -0400, TFM® 
wrote:

>
>
>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
>news:8g8pa45399j8po5lqtdpng846p5jas3833@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:53:05 -0400, TFM® 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
>>>>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith
>>>>>says...
>>>>>
>>>>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>>>>
>>>>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1)
>>>>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you
>>>>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but
>>>>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>>>>
>>>> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>>>>
>>>
>>>Oh yes, it's quite healthy!  The average person can transform themselves
>>>from a normal human to a Sumo wrestler within a matter of months.
>>>
>>>Your certificate of retardation is in the mail.
>>>
>>>
>>>TFM®
>>
>> No one is suggesting you eat a McDonalds every day, or even every week.
>>
>> When consumed in moderation, there's absolutely nothing wrong with
>> fast-food.
>
>Excepting the fact that it's not even food, I suppose you're right.  Nothing 
>wrong with eating a dog turd every now and then either, I suppose.

Very silly :)

If McDonalds burgers tasted like "dog turd" they would've been out of
business a *very* long time ago. They're not.

How successful are McDonalds, BK etc.?

>Expect your certificate in 4-6 weeks.  Suitable for framing.

Now you're just trying to exchange nastiness for opinion...

Why?

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:11:57 -0400, TFM® 
wrote:

>
>
>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
>news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>>
>>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>>
>> In the UK it's 100% ground beef
>
>
>It's 100% ground beef here too.  Mostly lungs and stomachs.

You know that's not true, so why post it?

TFM® writes:

> I occasionally drop a slug in a McDonald's as they're usually very clean.  I 
> feel no obligation to purchase anything.

An increasing number of restaurants (at least in Paris) are putting digital
locks on the toilets.

Dave Smith writes:

> Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i

Most of the people eating at McDonald's in Paris are locals.

Corey Richardson said...

> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
> 
>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste 
>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
> 
> In the UK it's 100% ground beef and the only thing they add after
> cooking is a little ground salt and pepper.
> 
> I must admit I'd like to try a White Castle or a Wendy's.


Corey,

I think they sprinkle the flavoring before cooking!

For a couple months I used to man the Burger King burger machine. I used to 
twice run my burgers through it to get rid of the grease!

Cross the ocean and White Castle would be a fun tourist trip for you and me 
both!!! :)

Being in Philly, I'd recommend the Philly cheesesteak before blindly 
wandering into a Burger King!!! ;)

Best,

Andy

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 01:21:38 +0200, Mxsmanic  wrote:

>TFM® writes:
>
>> I occasionally drop a slug in a McDonald's as they're usually very clean.  I 
>> feel no obligation to purchase anything.
>
>An increasing number of restaurants (at least in Paris) are putting digital
>locks on the toilets.

A number of McDonalds in the UK are clamping vehicles for parking on
their car park when people aren't using their restaurant.

Some people seem surprised by this?

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:3m9pa4doqvdqaidcfhbmb53q7kmuqflqem@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:11:57 -0400, TFM® 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>>>
>>>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>>>
>>> In the UK it's 100% ground beef
>>
>>
>>It's 100% ground beef here too.  Mostly lungs and stomachs.
>
> You know that's not true, so why post it?
>

I've eaten McDonalds and I've eaten Alpo.  No difference.


TFM®

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:ld9pa4ddvshkt1rbd1lq79j36g9roaa96p@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:10:16 -0400, TFM® 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>news:8g8pa45399j8po5lqtdpng846p5jas3833@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:53:05 -0400, TFM® 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>>news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave 
>>>>>>Smith
>>>>>>says...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 
>>>>>>1)
>>>>>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you
>>>>>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" 
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>>>>>
>>>>> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Oh yes, it's quite healthy!  The average person can transform themselves
>>>>from a normal human to a Sumo wrestler within a matter of months.
>>>>
>>>>Your certificate of retardation is in the mail.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>TFM®
>>>
>>> No one is suggesting you eat a McDonalds every day, or even every week.
>>>
>>> When consumed in moderation, there's absolutely nothing wrong with
>>> fast-food.
>>
>>Excepting the fact that it's not even food, I suppose you're right. 
>>Nothing
>>wrong with eating a dog turd every now and then either, I suppose.
>
> Very silly :)
>
> If McDonalds burgers tasted like "dog turd" they would've been out of
> business a *very* long time ago. They're not.
>
> How successful are McDonalds, BK etc.?
>
>>Expect your certificate in 4-6 weeks.  Suitable for framing.
>
> Now you're just trying to exchange nastiness for opinion...
>
> Why?


Good Lord man!  A lot of fools still buy Fords and Chevys.  Does that make 
them good?

McDonald's success is merely an indication of the ignorance of the 
population.

Nasty as it may be, that's my opinion.

I've driven American made vehicles and will never do so again.  I've eaten 
at McDonald's and will never do so again.

Would you like your certificate super-sized?


TFM®

"Mxsmanic"  wrote in message 
news:en9pa4tqjv539v1lavvf1k709ct9u0ajip@4ax.com...
> TFM® writes:
>
>> I occasionally drop a slug in a McDonald's as they're usually very clean. 
>> I
>> feel no obligation to purchase anything.
>
> An increasing number of restaurants (at least in Paris) are putting 
> digital
> locks on the toilets.

So then what?  You have to swipe your encoded cheeseburger through a slot on 
the stall door?


TFM® - Not above crawling under the door on pay toilets...

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:40:31 -0400, TFM® 
wrote:

>
>
>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
>news:3m9pa4doqvdqaidcfhbmb53q7kmuqflqem@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:11:57 -0400, TFM® 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>>>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>>>>
>>>> In the UK it's 100% ground beef
>>>
>>>
>>>It's 100% ground beef here too.  Mostly lungs and stomachs.
>>
>> You know that's not true, so why post it?
>>
>
>I've eaten McDonalds and I've eaten Alpo.  No difference.
>
>
>TFM® 

There must be deficiencies in your taste-buds then.

That, or Alpo is very, very tasty!

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:7scpa41ja5edgtho8np5h8suclamrfpk0l@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:40:31 -0400, TFM® 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>news:3m9pa4doqvdqaidcfhbmb53q7kmuqflqem@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:11:57 -0400, TFM® 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>>news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>>>>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the UK it's 100% ground beef
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>It's 100% ground beef here too.  Mostly lungs and stomachs.
>>>
>>> You know that's not true, so why post it?
>>>
>>
>>I've eaten McDonalds and I've eaten Alpo.  No difference.
>>
>>
>>TFM®
>
> There must be deficiencies in your taste-buds then.
>
> That, or Alpo is very, very tasty!
>

I prefer it to the Cheeseburger Royal.  But then, I like Haggis!

TFM®

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:ld9pa4ddvshkt1rbd1lq79j36g9roaa96p@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:10:16 -0400, TFM® 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>news:8g8pa45399j8po5lqtdpng846p5jas3833@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:53:05 -0400, TFM® 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>>news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave 
>>>>>>Smith
>>>>>>says...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 
>>>>>>1)
>>>>>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you
>>>>>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" 
>>>>>>but
>>>>>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>>>>>
>>>>> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Oh yes, it's quite healthy!  The average person can transform themselves
>>>>from a normal human to a Sumo wrestler within a matter of months.
>>>>
>>>>Your certificate of retardation is in the mail.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>TFM®
>>>
>>> No one is suggesting you eat a McDonalds every day, or even every week.
>>>
>>> When consumed in moderation, there's absolutely nothing wrong with
>>> fast-food.
>>
>>Excepting the fact that it's not even food, I suppose you're right. 
>>Nothing
>>wrong with eating a dog turd every now and then either, I suppose.
>
> Very silly :)
>
> If McDonalds burgers tasted like "dog turd" they would've been out of
> business a *very* long time ago. They're not.
>
> How successful are McDonalds, BK etc.?
>
>>Expect your certificate in 4-6 weeks.  Suitable for framing.
>
> Now you're just trying to exchange nastiness for opinion...
>
> Why?

I need TP for my bunghole!  I am the great Cornholio!

TFM® writes:

> So then what?  You have to swipe your encoded cheeseburger through a slot on 
> the stall door?

The code for the lock is printed on your receipt.

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 20:16:59 -0400, TFM® 
wrote:

>
>
>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
>news:7scpa41ja5edgtho8np5h8suclamrfpk0l@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:40:31 -0400, TFM® 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>news:3m9pa4doqvdqaidcfhbmb53q7kmuqflqem@4ax.com...
>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:11:57 -0400, TFM® 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>>>news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
>>>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>>>>>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the UK it's 100% ground beef
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>It's 100% ground beef here too.  Mostly lungs and stomachs.
>>>>
>>>> You know that's not true, so why post it?
>>>>
>>>
>>>I've eaten McDonalds and I've eaten Alpo.  No difference.
>>>
>>>
>>>TFM®
>>
>> There must be deficiencies in your taste-buds then.
>>
>> That, or Alpo is very, very tasty!
>>
>
>I prefer it to the Cheeseburger Royal.  But then, I like Haggis!
>
>TFM® 

We don't get Cheeseburger Royal's in the UK, and Haggis is made from
lungs, heart and liver - the things you claimed McDonalds made their
burgers from.

Corey Richardson writes:

> I must admit I'd like to try a White Castle or a Wendy's.

Mmm ... White Castle.  I still remember those!

TFM® writes:

> Excepting the fact that it's not even food ...

The nutritional analyses prove otherwise.  But hardly anyone reads those,
least of all people who prefer knee-jerk reactions to sound judgement.

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 02:34:53 +0200, Mxsmanic  wrote:

>TFM® writes:
>
>> Excepting the fact that it's not even food ...
>
>The nutritional analyses prove otherwise.  But hardly anyone reads those,
>least of all people who prefer knee-jerk reactions to sound judgement.

And some people prefer the "trendy" stance of dismissing everything from
McDonalds - because, it's well - trendy...

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:oodpa4pke98v7328i6c61mut7f74bqg3sk@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 20:16:59 -0400, TFM® 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>news:7scpa41ja5edgtho8np5h8suclamrfpk0l@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:40:31 -0400, TFM® 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>>news:3m9pa4doqvdqaidcfhbmb53q7kmuqflqem@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:11:57 -0400, TFM® 
>>>>> 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message
>>>>>>news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
>>>>>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>>>>>>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In the UK it's 100% ground beef
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>It's 100% ground beef here too.  Mostly lungs and stomachs.
>>>>>
>>>>> You know that's not true, so why post it?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I've eaten McDonalds and I've eaten Alpo.  No difference.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>TFM®
>>>
>>> There must be deficiencies in your taste-buds then.
>>>
>>> That, or Alpo is very, very tasty!
>>>
>>
>>I prefer it to the Cheeseburger Royal.  But then, I like Haggis!
>>
>>TFM®
>
> We don't get Cheeseburger Royal's in the UK, and Haggis is made from
> lungs, heart and liver - the things you claimed McDonalds made their
> burgers from.
>

McDonald's has no heart.

TFM® - You lose, take off all your clothes.

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 01:22:11 +0200, Mxsmanic  wrote:

>Dave Smith writes:
>
>> Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>
>Most of the people eating at McDonald's in Paris are locals.

The same in Italy too recently.

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 01:16:27 +0100, Corey Richardson
 wrote:

>>I've eaten McDonalds and I've eaten Alpo.  No difference.
>>
>>
>>TFM® 
>
>There must be deficiencies in your taste-buds then.
>
>That, or Alpo is very, very tasty!

How long have you been working for the Golden Arches? 

Cheers, Alan, Australia
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/
http://loraltravel.blogspot.com 
Latest: Food, Glorious Food In India

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 00:03:02 +0100, Corey Richardson
 wrote:

>On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:53:05 -0400, TFM® 
>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
>>news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith
>>>>says...
>>>>
>>>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>>>
>>>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1)
>>>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you
>>>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but
>>>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>>>
>>> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>>>
>>
>>Oh yes, it's quite healthy!  The average person can transform themselves 
>>from a normal human to a Sumo wrestler within a matter of months.
>>
>>Your certificate of retardation is in the mail.
>>
>>
>>TFM® 
>
>No one is suggesting you eat a McDonalds every day, or even every week.
>
>When consumed in moderation, there's absolutely nothing wrong with
>fast-food.

Where we differ is in the definiton of "moderation". Half a
cheeseburger is about my limit.


Cheers, Alan, Australia
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/alan_s/
http://loraltravel.blogspot.com 
Latest: Food, Glorious Food In India

TFM®  wrote:

> TFM® - Not above crawling under the door on pay toilets...

I haven't seen a pay toilet for decades.  And I even design public
bathrooms for a living nowadays!

(And yes, all the stalls have 11-13 inches of crawl space
underneath)

-sw

Mxsmanic  wrote:

> TFM® writes:
> 
>> So then what?  You have to swipe your encoded cheeseburger through a slot on 
>> the stall door?
> 
> The code for the lock is printed on your receipt.

Very interesting.  No doubt it changes every hour, and the codes are
only good for 2 hours max.

-sw

Mxsmanic  wrote:

> TFM® writes:
> 
>> So then what?  You have to swipe your encoded cheeseburger through a slot on 
>> the stall door?
> 
> The code for the lock is printed on your receipt.

Come to think of it, we don't get receipts at McDonalds unless we
specifically ask for them - in which case it confuses them.

-sw

Sqwertz writes:

> Very interesting.  No doubt it changes every hour, and the codes are
> only good for 2 hours max.

Actually, I suspect that in most cases the codes are never changed, unless the
system is fully automated.

Sqwertz writes:

> (And yes, all the stalls have 11-13 inches of crawl space
> underneath)

Not in France.  Toilets are essentially separate rooms, not the saloon-style
stalls that Americans seem to insist upon.

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 00:09:42 +0100, Corey Richardson  wrote:
>On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 22:44:56 +0200, "Runge12" 
>wrote:

>>"Corey Richardson"  a écrit dans le message de 
>>news:tjroa417gj460klaj8c5ck61o1anc8um1q@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:40:42 GMT, "Michael \"Dog3\"" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>"Runge12" 
>>>>news:48aba2e3$0$953$ba4acef3@news.orange.fr: in rec.food.cooking
>>>>
>>>>> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Yet you felt compelled to respond with the entire OP intact. The article
>>>>was fine and it was about food.
>>>>
>>>>Michael
>>>
>>> It's a wonder that some people didn't demand he multi-post it!
>>> 
>>he will, just ask for it

>Why top-post? It's nearly as bad as multi-posting!

Are you surprised, he uses "Microsoft Windows Mail" as a news reader?

"Gregory Morrow"  wrote in 
message news:R-udnSA2GabYEDHVnZ2dnUVZ_qzinZ2d@earthlink.com...
>
> Goomba wrote:
>
>> Runge12 wrote:
>> > A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
>> >
>> > "Gregory Morrow"  a écrit
>> > dans le message de
> news:tcqdnYfV9NOG4DbVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d@earthlink.com...
>> >> [WARNING!: x - posted to
>> >>
> rec.food.cooking,uk.food+drink.misc,alt.food.fast-food,rec.travel.europe...]
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
> http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/article4560082.ece
>>
>> Well, I for one enjoyed the article enormously. You must have also since
>> you reposted it in entirety.
>
>
> Don't mind the old Parisian malcontent "gRunge", he is the proverbial
> cockroach on the wedding cake...lol.
>
> How someone who lives in one of the most lovely places on the planet can 
> be
> such a consistently wretched churl like 'Runge' is beyond me, but then I
> guess all things on God's good earth are possible...
>
>

Well, Paris has quite a record of attracting malcontents, if r.t.e. is 
anything to go by.

Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore

"Dave Smith"  wrote in message 
news:48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
> Alfred Molon wrote:
>> In article , Corey Richardson 
>> says...
>>
>>> It's strange that some people won't admit to eating there (people on
>>> these groups too!) even though they secretly do.
>>
>> During our recent trip to France we have eaten lots of time in McDonalds 
>> restaurants (too many times!), mainly because due to the travelling and 
>> sightseeing we found ourselves often eating at odd times (French 
>> restaurants close at 2:30pm) and sometimes only wanted to have a small 
>> thing or didn't have much time.
>
>  Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i

The point, I believe, is that plenty of French non-tourists eat at McD's.

I recently managed to do three weeks in three European countries - Turkey, 
UK and Spain -(and a day trip to Belgium) without resorting to fast food, 
odd hours or not. Still, I regard the occasional dose of salt-and-grease 
fast food as a treat, not part of the food pyramid.

Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:59:50 +0200, Alfred Molon
>  wrote:
>
>>In article <48ac8834$0$19210$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Dave Smith
>>says...
>>
>>>   Paris. thrives on tourists, ans tourists like eat at McDonalds.i
>>
>>Well, if you travel with small children McDonalds has two advantages: 1)
>>the food is ready soon and 2) there is a children playground where you
>>can park the kids while eating the burgers. I'm not a fan of "McDoh" but
>>in some situations they are quite practical.
>
> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>

Not so bad if you eat there rarely. I can see Alfred's point with kids. As 
an adult (more or less) I find they (or their competitors) are useful on 
road trips for a combined-bathroom-food-coffee stop. If there's a nearby 
non-chain alternative that looks decent, I'll choose that first.

Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore

"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>
>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>
> In the UK it's 100% ground beef and the only thing they add after
> cooking is a little ground salt and pepper.
>
> I must admit I'd like to try a White Castle or a Wendy's.
>

White Castle were certainly OK - for what they are - in Brooklyn, NY in the 
'80s. Once you got over the squareness, the sheer cubicness, of the serving.

Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore

Top is better than bottom

"Corey Richardson"  a écrit dans le message de 
news:8v8pa4p069l0mgdu2g9uvlmj2gbnq5ivn9@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 22:44:56 +0200, "Runge12" 
> wrote:
>
>>"Corey Richardson"  a écrit dans le message de
>>news:tjroa417gj460klaj8c5ck61o1anc8um1q@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:40:42 GMT, "Michael \"Dog3\"" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>"Runge12" 
>>>>news:48aba2e3$0$953$ba4acef3@news.orange.fr: in rec.food.cooking
>>>>
>>>>> A better place is a place without morrow the moron.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Yet you felt compelled to respond with the entire OP intact. The article
>>>>was fine and it was about food.
>>>>
>>>>Michael
>>>
>>> It's a wonder that some people didn't demand he multi-post it!
>>>
>>he will, just ask for it
>
> Why top-post? It's nearly as bad as multi-posting!
>

"Mxsmanic"  wrote in message 
news:ifopa4lu3pfgg1cb65e81m1d4dbfkg4t69@4ax.com...
> Sqwertz writes:
>
>> (And yes, all the stalls have 11-13 inches of crawl space
>> underneath)
>
> Not in France.  Toilets are essentially separate rooms, not the 
> saloon-style
> stalls that Americans seem to insist upon.

In France, the freaking FROGS just piss in the street.  Separate rooms my 
ass

grusl said...

> 
> "Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
> news:qm8pa4lc7kskii2m2g8609cjoviiqcnj0b@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
>>
>>>McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste
>>>like anything remotely resembling meat.
>>
>> In the UK it's 100% ground beef and the only thing they add after
>> cooking is a little ground salt and pepper.
>>
>> I must admit I'd like to try a White Castle or a Wendy's.
>>
> 
> White Castle were certainly OK - for what they are - in Brooklyn, NY in
> the '80s. Once you got over the squareness, the sheer cubicness, of the
> serving. 
> 
> Cheers,
> George W Russell
> Bangalore


George,

I've never had fresh, only frozen. :(

Did you like their mustard? A side condiment. Almost famous, from what I've 
been told.

The supermarket frozen ones are missing the pickle and mustard! :( The 
BUMS!!! ;)

Best,

Andy

grusl writes:

> Still, I regard the occasional dose of salt-and-grease 
> fast food as a treat, not part of the food pyramid.

Check the nutritional analysis of a plain McDonald's hamburger.

"Mxsmanic"  wrote in message 
news:emfqa4loiaqfthkgf23ssv3770010l5mh1@4ax.com...
> grusl writes:
>
>> Still, I regard the occasional dose of salt-and-grease
>> fast food as a treat, not part of the food pyramid.
>
> Check the nutritional analysis of a plain McDonald's hamburger.

They could be the ultimate in nutrition, but the important points for me are 
that taste salty and feel greasy. Anyway, I hardly ever eat the hamburgers; 
I go for the breakfast menus.

Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore

"Mxsmanic"  wrote in message 
news:emfqa4loiaqfthkgf23ssv3770010l5mh1@4ax.com...
> grusl writes:
>
>> Still, I regard the occasional dose of salt-and-grease
>> fast food as a treat, not part of the food pyramid.
>
> Check the nutritional analysis of a plain McDonald's hamburger.


Couldn't you do it?

      Energy 250 kcal
      Protein 12 g
      Total lipid (fat) 9 g
      Carbohydrate, by difference 31 g
      Fibre, total dietary 2 g
      Sugars, total 6 g
      Calcium, Ca 100 mg
      Iron, Fe 2.7 mg
      Sodium, Na 520 mg
      Vitamin C, total ascorbic acid 1.2 mg
      Vitamin A, IU ~ IU
      Fatty acids, total saturated 3.5 g
      Fatty acids, total trans 0.5 g
      Cholesterol 25 mg


-- 
JohnT

Corey Richardson wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:57:22 -0500, Andy <q> wrote:
> 
>> McD has to sprinkle flavor seasoning on their burgers to taste 
>> like anything remotely resembling meat.
> 
> In the UK it's 100% ground beef and the only thing they add after
> cooking is a little ground salt and pepper.
> 
> I must admit I'd like to try a White Castle or a Wendy's.
> 
> 

You don't have Wendy's overthere???

In article , JohnT says...
> "Mxsmanic" wrote in message 
> news:emfqa4loiaqfthkgf23ssv3770010l5mh1@4ax.com...
> > grusl writes:
> >
> >> Still, I regard the occasional dose of salt-and-grease
> >> fast food as a treat, not part of the food pyramid.
> >
> > Check the nutritional analysis of a plain McDonald's hamburger.
> 
> 
> Couldn't you do it?
> 
>       Energy 250 kcal
>       Protein 12 g
>       Total lipid (fat) 9 g
>       Carbohydrate, by difference 31 g
>       Fibre, total dietary 2 g
>       Sugars, total 6 g
>       Calcium, Ca 100 mg
>       Iron, Fe 2.7 mg
>       Sodium, Na 520 mg
>       Vitamin C, total ascorbic acid 1.2 mg
>       Vitamin A, IU ~ IU
>       Fatty acids, total saturated 3.5 g
>       Fatty acids, total trans 0.5 g
>       Cholesterol 25 mg

That is what - a simple hamburger without cheese? How about a Big Mac or 
a McChicken?
-- 

Alfred Molon
http://www.molon.de - Photos of Asia, Africa and Europe

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 00:03:02 +0100, Corey Richardson wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:53:05 -0400, TFM® 
> wrote:
> 
>>
>>
>>"Corey Richardson"  wrote in message 
>>news:t05pa4901m987of1quo7a7tpcsvgi6sh2b@4ax.com...
>>>
>>> And not nearly as bad for you as some people like to make out!
>>>
>>
>>Oh yes, it's quite healthy!  The average person can transform themselves 
>>from a normal huma