On 1 Jan, 00:30, Sanforized  wrote:
> I have an instance where someone is using "English"
> (probably not AmerEnglish) words when writing and
> I wondered if these can give a reasonable clue as
> to what part of the world this individual comes
> from originally:
>
> [1] before for afore [ Afore ye decide, etc. ... .]
>
> [2] by for bye [ Never have read it anywhere ...]
>
> [3] don't worry for don't fret.

(Don't misunderstand jokes, ever!)

[1] Common enough in Scotland, but only in spoken English. A former
registrar, a Scot, Margaret Love, however, left me colloquial notes,
saying, 'Afore I left ... Don't fret, John, we have placed Manlio with
Mrs Gibbons [ a student placement.]. You could hear her talk via her
memos!'. Wonderful!
[2] Unknown.
[3] Very common in Ireland. ['frettan' is ME for 'consume', so don't
consume yourself in worry or grief, so 'Don't worry!'.]
--
foolsrushin.

> I'd have to do some difficult research to find
> more examples.

You could look at Henry Sweet's 'Anglo-Saxon Grammar.' It is thought
that he was the model for Henry Higgins - in Shaw's 'Pygmalion,'
transformed by Lerner and Lowe into 'My Fair Lady.' At one point, they
began to regret their attempt to do it, notwitsanding their love for
the plays of Shaw.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zA7sidgFGHU

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/883791/my_fair_lady/

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zA7sidgFGHU&feature=related

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=8kBNr3djnZM&feature=related

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=owWPgUyK7DY&NR=1
--
foolsrushin.

PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen ... .

On 1 Jan, 05:19, foolsrushin  wrote:
> On 1 Jan, 00:30, Sanforized  wrote:
>
> > I have an instance where someone is using "English"
> > (probably not AmerEnglish) words when writing and
> > I wondered if these can give a reasonable clue as
> > to what part of the world this individual comes
> > from originally:
>
> > [1] before for afore [ Afore ye decide, etc. ... .]
>
> > [2] by for bye [ Never have read it anywhere ...]
>
> > [3] don't worry for don't fret.
>
> (Don't misunderstand jokes, ever!)
>
> [1] Common enough in Scotland, but only in spoken English. A former
> registrar, a Scot, Margaret Love, however, left me colloquial notes,
> saying, 'Afore I left ... Don't fret, John, we have placed Manlio with
> Mrs Gibbons [ a student placement.]. You could hear her talk via her
> memos!'. Wonderful!
> [2] Unknown.
> [3] Very common in Ireland. ['frettan' is ME for 'consume', so don't
> consume yourself in worry or grief, so 'Don't worry!'.]
> --
> foolsrushin.
>
> > I'd have to do some difficult research to find
> > more examples.
>
> You could look at Henry Sweet's 'Anglo-Saxon Grammar.' It is thought
> that he was the model for Henry Higgins - in Shaw's 'Pygmalion,'
> transformed by Lerner and Lowe into 'My Fair Lady.' At one point, they
> began to regret their attempt to do it, notwitsanding their love for
> the plays of Shaw.
>
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zA7sidgFGHU
>
> http://www.metacafe.com/watch/883791/my_fair_lady/
>
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zA7sidgFGHU&feature=related
>
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=8kBNr3djnZM&feature=related
>
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=owWPgUyK7DY&NR=1
> --
> foolsrushin.
>
> PS: In Hertford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen ... .

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=txz-lURNxsc&feature=related

Amateur production: none of them is that bad, but just listen to this
Eliza: with a voice coach in a professional production, she would have
been as good as Andrews or Hepburn. 'She's got it!' Amazing
performance, actually! Higgins, better than OK, and the others very
good, but listening for their lines. They could get the hang of it!

Yes, I know Julie Andrewws did voice over. Wrong? No! Hepburn and
Andrews were oustanding. The role should have gone, though, to the one
who could do the whole of it!
--
foolsrushin.

Happy New Year! Wea are just clearin up!

On 1 Jan, 06:06, foolsrushin  wrote:
> On 1 Jan, 05:19, foolsrushin  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 1 Jan, 00:30, Sanforized  wrote:
>
> > > I have an instance where someone is using "English"
> > > (probably not AmerEnglish) words when writing and
> > > I wondered if these can give a reasonable clue as
> > > to what part of the world this individual comes
> > > from originally:
>
> > > [1] before for afore [ Afore ye decide, etc. ... .]
>
> > > [2] by for bye [ Never have read it anywhere ...]
>
> > > [3] don't worry for don't fret.
>
> > (Don't misunderstand jokes, ever!)
>
> > [1] Common enough in Scotland, but only in spoken English. A former
> > registrar, a Scot, Margaret Love, however, left me colloquial notes,
> > saying, 'Afore I left ... Don't fret, John, we have placed Manlio with
> > Mrs Gibbons [ a student placement.]. You could hear her talk via her
> > memos!'. Wonderful!
> > [2] Unknown.
> > [3] Very common in Ireland. ['frettan' is ME for 'consume', so don't
> > consume yourself in worry or grief, so 'Don't worry!'.]
> > --
> > foolsrushin.
>
> > > I'd have to do some difficult research to find
> > > more examples.
>
> > You could look at Henry Sweet's 'Anglo-Saxon Grammar.' It is thought
> > that he was the model for Henry Higgins - in Shaw's 'Pygmalion,'
> > transformed by Lerner and Lowe into 'My Fair Lady.' At one point, they
> > began to regret their attempt to do it, notwitsanding their love for
> > the plays of Shaw.
>
> >http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zA7sidgFGHU
>
> >http://www.metacafe.com/watch/883791/my_fair_lady/
>
> >http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zA7sidgFGHU&feature=related
>
> >http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=8kBNr3djnZM&feature=related
>
> >http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=owWPgUyK7DY&NR=1
> > --
> > foolsrushin.
>
> > PS: In Hertford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen ... .
>
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=txz-lURNxsc&feature=related
>
> Amateur production: none of them is that bad, but just listen to this
> Eliza: with a voice coach in a professional production, she would have
> been as good as Andrews or Hepburn. 'She's got it!' Amazing
> performance, actually! Higgins, better than OK, and the others very
> good, but listening for their lines. They could get the hang of it!
>
> Yes, I know Julie Andrewws did voice over. Wrong? No! Hepburn and
> Andrews were oustanding. The role should have gone, though, to the one
> who could do the whole of it!
> --
> foolsrushin.
>
> Happy New Year! We are just clearing up!

Miscasting: I'd get Higgering and Pickens (Joke!) to switch roles,
Though, of course, they may just have come from work, they not dressed
for their roles.
--
foolsrushin.

You could hear her talk via her
> memos!'. Wonderful!

Talkin' through your notes is a much better thing to do than to talk
through your nose!

> PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen ... .

Thought there was the mention of a third 'H'-beginning town, apart
from Hartford and Hampshire "where hurricanes hardly happen..."

Paul.

At one point, they  began to regret their attempt to do it,
notwitsanding their love for
> the plays of Shaw.

Why? Did they find it too hard a challenge to handle?

Paul.

On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 08:35:05 -0800 (PST), Paul
 wrote:

>
>  At one point, they  began to regret their attempt to do it,
>notwitsanding their love for
>> the plays of Shaw.
>
>Why? Did they find it too hard a challenge to handle?
>
>Paul.
>
I hardly think so.  ;-)

Gordon

Paul wrote:
> You could hear her talk via her
> > memos!'. Wonderful!
> 
> Talkin' through your notes is a much better thing to do
> than to talk through your nose!
> 
> > PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen
> > ... . 
> 
> Thought there was the mention of a third 'H'-beginning
> town, apart from Hartford and Hampshire "where hurricanes
> hardly happen..." 

"In Hertford, Hereford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly ever happen."
-- 
John Briggs

In article ,
Paul   wrote:
>  You could hear her talk via her
> > memos!'. Wonderful!
> 
> Talkin' through your notes is a much better thing to do than to talk
> through your nose!
> 
> > PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen ... .
> 
> Thought there was the mention of a third 'H'-beginning town, apart
> from Hartford and Hampshire "where hurricanes hardly happen..."

In 'ertford, 'ereford and 'ampshire, 'urricanes 'ardly hever 'appen.

Is there a technical term for the prepending of an 'h' sound to a vowel
where it doesn't belong, usually by a dropper of normal aitches?
I seem to remember Parker in Thurderbirds caricatured this a lot.

Cheers
Tony
-- 
Tony Mountifield
Work: tony@softins.co.uk - http://www.softins.co.uk
Play: tony@mountifield.org - http://tony.mountifield.org

On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 16:50:20 +0000 (UTC), tony@softins.clara.co.uk (Tony
Mountifield) wrote:

>In article ,
>Paul   wrote:
>>  You could hear her talk via her
>> > memos!'. Wonderful!
>> 
>> Talkin' through your notes is a much better thing to do than to talk
>> through your nose!
>> 
>> > PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen ... .
>> 
>> Thought there was the mention of a third 'H'-beginning town, apart
>> from Hartford and Hampshire "where hurricanes hardly happen..."
>
>In 'ertford, 'ereford and 'ampshire, 'urricanes 'ardly hever 'appen.
>
>Is there a technical term for the prepending of an 'h' sound to a vowel
>where it doesn't belong, usually by a dropper of normal aitches?
>I seem to remember Parker in Thurderbirds caricatured this a lot.
>
'ypercorrection?

>Cheers
>Tony

-- 
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in uk.culture.language.english)

On 2 Jan, 16:50, "John Briggs"  wrote:
> Paul wrote:
> > You could hear her talk via her
> > > memos!'. Wonderful!
>
> > Talkin' through your notes is a much better thing to do
> > than to talk through your nose!
>
> > > PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen
> > > ... .
>
> > Thought there was the mention of a third 'H'-beginning
> > town, apart from Hartford and Hampshire "where hurricanes
> > hardly happen..."
>
> "In Hertford, Hereford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly ever happen." [I'd never have known without your help!]

> --
> John Briggs

http://english-pe.over-blog.com/article-13433281-6.html

The voice of Eliza in My Fair Lady was that of Julie Andrews, though
personally, law permitting, I'd have married 'em both: dishy and
talented and sexy birds!
--
foolsrushin.

On 15 Jan, 12:00, UncleEnglish  wrote:
> On 2 Jan, 16:50, "John Briggs"  wrote:
>
>
>
> > Paul wrote:
> > > You could hear her talk via her
> > > > memos!'. Wonderful!
>
> > > Talkin' through your notes is a much better thing to do
> > > than to talk through your nose!
>
> > > > PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen
> > > > ... .
>
> > > Thought there was the mention of a third 'H'-beginning
> > > town, apart from Hartford and Hampshire "where hurricanes
> > > hardly happen..."
>
> > "In Hertford, Hereford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly ever happen." [I'd never have known without your help!]
> > --
> > John Briggs
>
> http://english-pe.over-blog.com/article-13433281-6.html
>
> The voice of Eliza in My Fair Lady was that of Julie Andrews, though
> personally, law permitting, I'd have married 'em both: dishy and
> talented and sexy birds!
> --
> foolsrushin.

The feminist in me asks, wouldn't you have first wanted to know if
either of them would  like to get married to you? (Talk of male
chauvinism!)

> > foolsrushin.

 "The role should have gone, though, to the one  who could do the
whole of it!"

The medium of celluloid necessitates such pooling in of talent.
Perhaps that's how movies come to have their magic.
I have listened to a man play on five different musical instruments at
the same time, one evening on a California beach. His audience watched
it more as a feat of skill than musical talent. I wouldn't say he
should be rated using the same paradigm we would use for the New York
Philharmonics.

On 2 Jan, 16:46, Antares 531  wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 08:35:05 -0800 (PST), Paul
>
>  wrote:
>
> >  At one point, they  began to regret their attempt to do it,
> >notwitsanding their love for
> >> the plays of Shaw.
>
> >Why? Did they find it too hard a challenge to handle?
>
> >Paul.
>
> I hardly think so.  ;-)
>
> Gordon

Sure, you are right, Gordie: amazing creatures, never gave up, having
decided the play could be transposed.

Just read some pilots set a plane down on the Hudson, having injected
a flight of geese. A sort of lateral thinking: best runway they could
find!
--
foolsrushin.

On 16 Jan, 14:21, Paul  wrote:
> On 15 Jan, 12:00, UncleEnglish  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2 Jan, 16:50, "John Briggs"  wrote:
>
> > > Paul wrote:
> > > > You could hear her talk via her
> > > > > memos!'. Wonderful!
>
> > > > Talkin' through your notes is a much better thing to do
> > > > than to talk through your nose!
>
> > > > > PS: In Hartford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly happen
> > > > > ... .
>
> > > > Thought there was the mention of a third 'H'-beginning
> > > > town, apart from Hartford and Hampshire "where hurricanes
> > > > hardly happen..."
>
> > > "In Hertford, Hereford and Hampshire, hurricanes hardly ever happen." [I'd never have known without your help!]
> > > --
> > > John Briggs
>
> >http://english-pe.over-blog.com/article-13433281-6.html
>
> > The voice of Eliza in My Fair Lady was that of Julie Andrews, though
> > personally, law permitting, I'd have married 'em both: dishy and
> > talented and sexy birds!
> > --
> > foolsrushin.
>
> The feminist in me asks, wouldn't you have first wanted to know if
> either of them would  like to get married to you? (Talk of male
> chauvinism!)

Excellent point! Though any man with any sense in his head at all
would have pursued either relentlessly, we all know that flowers are
not easily plucked! Sorry, still sounds a bit arrogant! They can be
very, very choosy, anyway, often whimsically!
--
foolsrushin.

On 16 Jan, 14:36, Paul  wrote:
> > > foolsrushin.
>
>  "The role should have gone, though, to the one  who could do the
> whole of it!"
>
> The medium of celluloid necessitates such pooling in of talent.
> Perhaps that's how movies come to have their magic.
> I have listened to a man play on five different musical instruments at
> the same time, one evening on a California beach. His audience watched
> it more as a feat of skill than musical talent. I wouldn't say he
> should be rated using the same paradigm we would use for the New York
> Philharmonics.

Brilliant! A one-man band cannot be definitionally, and so is not the
Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra! [ What, then,*is* an orchestra ...? why
don't you ask? ]

Now, I agree with you all, Oldham and Meredith especially, and so,
congrously, I leave you softly as I go!
--
foolsrushin.

On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 16:50:20 +0000 (UTC), tony@softins.clara.co.uk
(Tony Mountifield) wrote:

<snip>
|In 'ertford, 'ereford and 'ampshire, 'urricanes 'ardly hever 'appen.
|
|Is there a technical term for the prepending of an 'h' sound to a vowel
|where it doesn't belong, usually by a dropper of normal aitches?
|I seem to remember Parker in Thurderbirds caricatured this a lot.
|
|Cheers
|Tony

Hi.
I think i remember my English Professor calling it
'over-extension'. But I may be mis-remembering it.

Anyone else?

HowieC wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Jan 2009 16:50:20 +0000 (UTC), tony@softins.clara.co.uk
> (Tony Mountifield) wrote:
> 
> <snip>
> |In 'ertford, 'ereford and 'ampshire, 'urricanes 'ardly hever 'appen.
> |
> |Is there a technical term for the prepending of an 'h' sound to a vowel
> |where it doesn't belong, usually by a dropper of normal aitches?
> |I seem to remember Parker in Thurderbirds caricatured this a lot.
> |
> |Cheers
> |Tony
> 
> Hi.
> I think i remember my English Professor calling it
> 'over-extension'. But I may be mis-remembering it.
> 
> Anyone else?
> 
It's sometime called "over-correction" or "hypercorrection", but this 
doesn't really apply to this accent/dialect, which omits the "h" where 
it's pronounced in standard English (and most other accents or dialects) 
and inserts it before a vowel where it usually isn't pronounced.

Regards, Einde O'Callaghan