Hello!
Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
Best regards,
Dima

"D"  wrote in message 
news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> Hello!
> Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> Best regards,
> Dima

Because there is not enough light falling on the CCD?... As the old 
saying goes, crap in = crap out!

D wrote:
> Hello!
> Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> Best regards,
> Dima

Maybe your son's JVC has a more sensitive CCD device than your Sony, so 
can run at a higher frame rate in low light.

John.

On May 21, 2:54 pm, John  wrote:
> D wrote:
> > Hello!
> > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> > Best regards,
> > Dima
>
> Maybe your son's JVC has a more sensitive CCD device than your Sony, so
> can run at a higher frame rate in low light.
>
> John.

Thanks for replying!
The JVC VHS-C is 11 year old. It is mine, not son's.

On May 21, 2:46 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Hello!
> > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> > Best regards,
> > Dima
>
> Because there is not enough light falling on the CCD?... As the old
> saying goes, crap in = crap out!
Thanks Jerry for replying!
Why is there enough light for the 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder, not
for the 100 times more expensive Sony HC5E camcorder in the same
conditions?

"D"  wrote in message 
news:1e021ef4-ed6a-41d9-a2af-982afd1288eb@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On May 21, 2:46 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Hello!
> > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, 
> > shot
> > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? 
> > My
> > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> > Best regards,
> > Dima
>
> Because there is not enough light falling on the CCD?... As the old
> saying goes, crap in = crap out!
Thanks Jerry for replying!
Why is there enough light for the 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder, not
for the 100 times more expensive Sony HC5E camcorder in the same
conditions?

Because of the way the camera is designed, DV camera have always 
needed more light, OTOH electronic tweaking (automatic gain etc.) of 
the available image has improved, so although the camera will produce 
an image in less than 1 Lux the image will be poor.

On May 21, 3:23 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:1e021ef4-ed6a-41d9-a2af-982afd1288eb@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> On May 21, 2:46 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:> "D"  wrote in message
>
> >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...> > > Hello!
> > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building,
> > > shot
> > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps?
> > > My
> > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> > > Best regards,
> > > Dima
>
> > Because there is not enough light falling on the CCD?... As the old
> > saying goes, crap in = crap out!
>
> Thanks Jerry for replying!
> Why is there enough light for the 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder, not
> for the 100 times more expensive Sony HC5E camcorder in the same
> conditions?
>
> Because of the way the camera is designed, DV camera have always
> needed more light, OTOH electronic tweaking (automatic gain etc.) of
> the available image has improved, so although the camera will produce
> an image in less than 1 Lux the image will be poor.
Thanks Jerry for your explanation!
Do all DV camcorders drop a frame rate to 10fps in an average
appartment illumination?

"D"  wrote in message 
news:a14344de-a7b8-49a2-9f06-4052bca06e16@l42g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
On May 21, 3:23 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:1e021ef4-ed6a-41d9-a2af-982afd1288eb@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> On May 21, 2:46 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:> "D" 
>  wrote in message
>
> >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > Hello!
> > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building,
> > > shot
> > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 
> > > fps?
> > > My
> > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> > > Best regards,
> > > Dima
>
> > Because there is not enough light falling on the CCD?... As the 
> > old
> > saying goes, crap in = crap out!
>
> Thanks Jerry for replying!
> Why is there enough light for the 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder, 
> not
> for the 100 times more expensive Sony HC5E camcorder in the same
> conditions?
>
> Because of the way the camera is designed, DV camera have always
> needed more light, OTOH electronic tweaking (automatic gain etc.) of
> the available image has improved, so although the camera will 
> produce
> an image in less than 1 Lux the image will be poor.
Thanks Jerry for your explanation!
Do all DV camcorders drop a frame rate to 10fps in an average
appartment illumination?

How a certain camera does given a certain level of light, depends on 
the spec - and I don't mean the spec that the marketing men use as 
sales fodder either - I don't have the spec of the Sony HC5E so can't 
even start working it out, nor have I the time to go hunting it down 
ATM. :~(

BTW, what is the 'average' apartment illumination, some people live in 
darkness and others live in a light level only normally found in a 
medical operation room, this is why camera specs use Lux levels - 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lux, note the first (main) table.

On May 21, 3:54 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:a14344de-a7b8-49a2-9f06-4052bca06e16@l42g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On May 21, 3:23 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "D"  wrote in message
>
> >news:1e021ef4-ed6a-41d9-a2af-982afd1288eb@i76g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...> > On May 21, 2:46 pm, ":Jerry:" <INVA...@INVALID.INVALID> wrote:> "D"
> >  wrote in message
>
> > >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com.> > > > Hello!
> > > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building,
> > > > shot
> > > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10
> > > > fps?
> > > > My
> > > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
> > > > Best regards,
> > > > Dima
>
> > > Because there is not enough light falling on the CCD?... As the
> > > old
> > > saying goes, crap in = crap out!
>
> > Thanks Jerry for replying!
> > Why is there enough light for the 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder,
> > not
> > for the 100 times more expensive Sony HC5E camcorder in the same
> > conditions?
>
> > Because of the way the camera is designed, DV camera have always
> > needed more light, OTOH electronic tweaking (automatic gain etc.) of
> > the available image has improved, so although the camera will
> > produce
> > an image in less than 1 Lux the image will be poor.
>
> Thanks Jerry for your explanation!
> Do all DV camcorders drop a frame rate to 10fps in an average
> appartment illumination?
>
> How a certain camera does given a certain level of light, depends on
> the spec - and I don't mean the spec that the marketing men use as
> sales fodder either - I don't have the spec of the Sony HC5E so can't
> even start working it out, nor have I the time to go hunting it down
> ATM. :~(
>
> BTW, what is the 'average' apartment illumination, some people live in
> darkness and others live in a light level only normally found in a
> medical operation room, this is why camera specs use Lux levels -http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lux, note the first (main) table.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Thanks Jerry for answering!
The spec of the Sony HC5E
Image Device: Size :1/3.0 ClearVid CMOS Sensor
14bit DXP :YES
Advanced HAD technology :NO
Number of Pixels Gross (K) :2100
Number of Pixels Act Camera mode (K) :16:9 Mode ; 1430 / 4:3 Mode ;
1080
Number of Pixels Act Memory mode (K) :16:9 Mode ; 1490 / 4:3 Mode ;
1990
Focus: Full Range Auto :YES
Focus: Manual :YES
Manual Focus Key :Panel
Spot Focus (Touch Panel) :YES
Spot Meter :YES
Minimum Illumination (lux) :2.0
Minimum Illumination with NightShot (lux) :0.0
SteadyShot (Image Stabilisation) :Super (electronic)
Night Shot :Super NightShot
Camera Noise Reduction :NO
Shutter Speed :1/2-1/425
White Balance :Auto / Outdoor / Indoor / Onepush
Scene Selection :Twilight / Twilight Portrait (Still only) / Candle /
Sunrise & Sunset / Fireworks / Landscape / Portrait / Spotlight /
Beach / Snow
Auto Slow Shutter :YES
Colour Slow Shutter :YES
Backlight Compensation :YES
Smooth Slow Rec :YES
Interval Rec. :NO
Fader :Black / White / Mosaic / Monotone
Telemacro :YES
http://www.sony.co.uk/view/ShowProduct.action?product=HDR-HC5E&productsku=HDRHC5E.CEH&site=odw_en_GB&pageType=TechnicalSpecs&imageType=Main&category=HDDᰵ#tab

The 'average' apartment illumination is 200W of incandescent light for
a 20 sq.m. room.

"D"  wrote in message 
news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> Hello!
> Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.

Hi Dima,

If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a PC,
forget what I said.

Cheers,
-- 
Rob

On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Hello!
> > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> Hi Dima,
>
> If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a PC,
> forget what I said.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Rob

Thanks Rob for replying!
I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.

"D"  wrote in message 
news:43f38aaf-e71e-463b-afd7-7eb9462cf22f@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Hello!
> > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> Hi Dima,
>
> If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a PC,
> forget what I said.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Rob

Thanks Rob for replying!
I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.


===


Why is the frame rate worse in low light? Does the CCD integrate the light 
over a longer period to compensate, rather than raising the gain. Is it 
something that is only the case with more recent cameras and the OP's 
11-year-old camera which I imagine will also be using a CCD rather than a 
tube. Is it a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame rate 
versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to winding up the 
gain?

On May 22, 3:59 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:43f38aaf-e71e-463b-afd7-7eb9462cf22f@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "D"  wrote in message
>
> >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...> > > Hello!
> > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> > Hi Dima,
>
> > If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> > that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> > If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a PC,
> > forget what I said.
>
> > Cheers,
> > --
> > Rob
>
> Thanks Rob for replying!
> I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.
>
> ===
>
> Why is the frame rate worse in low light? Does the CCD integrate the light> over a longer period to compensate, rather than raising the gain. Is it
> something that is only the case with more recent cameras and the OP's
> 11-year-old camera which I imagine will also be using a CCD rather than a
> tube. Is it a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame rate
> versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to winding up the
> gain?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yes, it looks like the the CCD integrates the light over a longer
period to compensate, rather than raising the gain.
It is not a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
rate versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to
winding up the gain in my case.

"D"  wrote in message 
news:bcb79ff6-b674-4611-9546-4a806b82a6cd@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
On May 22, 3:59 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:43f38aaf-e71e-463b-afd7-7eb9462cf22f@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
> > "D"  wrote in message
>
> >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > Hello!
> > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> > Hi Dima,
>
> > If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> > that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> > If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a PC,
> > forget what I said.
>
> > Cheers,
> > --
> > Rob
>
> Thanks Rob for replying!
> I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.
>
> ===
>
> Why is the frame rate worse in low light? Does the CCD integrate the light
> over a longer period to compensate, rather than raising the gain. Is it
> something that is only the case with more recent cameras and the OP's
> 11-year-old camera which I imagine will also be using a CCD rather than a
> tube. Is it a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame 
> rate
> versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to winding up 
> the
> gain?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yes, it looks like the the CCD integrates the light over a longer
period to compensate, rather than raising the gain.
It is not a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
rate versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to
winding up the gain in my case.
====

That's a bit of a bugger. I think most people would prefer noisy pictures 
than a reduced frame rate. I seems odd that it happens even at normal 
interior lighting levels inside a house. I can imagine it happening when 
it's really low light (eg outside at dusk or by moonlight) but not in 
conditions which will be routinely encountered.

On May 22, 8:56 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:bcb79ff6-b674-4611-9546-4a806b82a6cd@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On May 22, 3:59 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "D"  wrote in message
>
> >news:43f38aaf-e71e-463b-afd7-7eb9462cf22f@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...> > On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
> > > "D"  wrote in message
>
> > >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com.> > > > Hello!
> > > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot> > > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My> > > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> > > Hi Dima,
>
> > > If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> > > that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> > > If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a PC> > > forget what I said.
>
> > > Cheers,
> > > --
> > > Rob
>
> > Thanks Rob for replying!
> > I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.
>
> > ===
>
> > Why is the frame rate worse in low light? Does the CCD integrate the light
> > over a longer period to compensate, rather than raising the gain. Is it
> > something that is only the case with more recent cameras and the OP's
> > 11-year-old camera which I imagine will also be using a CCD rather than a
> > tube. Is it a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> > rate
> > versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to winding up
> > the
> > gain?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Yes, it looks like the the CCD integrates the light over a longer
> period to compensate, rather than raising the gain.
> It is not a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> rate versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to
> winding up the gain in my case.
> ====
>
> That's a bit of a bugger. I think most people would prefer noisy pictures
> than a reduced frame rate. I seems odd that it happens even at normal
> interior lighting levels inside a house. I can imagine it happening when
> it's really low light (eg outside at dusk or by moonlight) but not in
> conditions which will be routinely encountered.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thanks Mortimer for replying!
Yes, it seems odd that it happens even at normal interior lighting
levels inside a house to me too.

On May 22, 8:56 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:bcb79ff6-b674-4611-9546-4a806b82a6cd@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On May 22, 3:59 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "D"  wrote in message
>
> >news:43f38aaf-e71e-463b-afd7-7eb9462cf22f@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...> > On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
> > > "D"  wrote in message
>
> > >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com.> > > > Hello!
> > > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot> > > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My> > > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> > > Hi Dima,
>
> > > If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> > > that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> > > If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a PC> > > forget what I said.
>
> > > Cheers,
> > > --
> > > Rob
>
> > Thanks Rob for replying!
> > I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.
>
> > ===
>
> > Why is the frame rate worse in low light? Does the CCD integrate the light
> > over a longer period to compensate, rather than raising the gain. Is it
> > something that is only the case with more recent cameras and the OP's
> > 11-year-old camera which I imagine will also be using a CCD rather than a
> > tube. Is it a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> > rate
> > versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to winding up
> > the
> > gain?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Yes, it looks like the the CCD integrates the light over a longer
> period to compensate, rather than raising the gain.
> It is not a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> rate versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to
> winding up the gain in my case.
> ====
>
> That's a bit of a bugger. I think most people would prefer noisy pictures
> than a reduced frame rate. I seems odd that it happens even at normal
> interior lighting levels inside a house. I can imagine it happening when
> it's really low light (eg outside at dusk or by moonlight) but not in
> conditions which will be routinely encountered.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Hello!
The Sony service says today that the camcorder is normal. The contact
personel did not test the camcorder. The Sony service does not allow
to contact technicians which tested the camcorder the days before.
Sincerely.

"D"  wrote in message 
news:f4d84128-9008-4dbf-a933-fdfa5e45b77f@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
On May 22, 8:56 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> > "D"  wrote in message
>
> >news:43f38aaf-e71e-463b-afd7-7eb9462cf22f@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> > On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
> > > "D"  wrote in message
>
> > >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > Hello!
> > > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> > > Hi Dima,
>
> > > If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> > > that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> > > If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a 
> > > PC,
> > > forget what I said.
>
> > > Cheers,
> > > --
> > > Rob
>
> > Thanks Rob for replying!
> > I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.
>
> > ===
>
> > Why is the frame rate worse in low light? Does the CCD integrate the 
> > light
> > over a longer period to compensate, rather than raising the gain. Is it
> > something that is only the case with more recent cameras and the OP's
> > 11-year-old camera which I imagine will also be using a CCD rather than 
> > a
> > tube. Is it a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> > rate
> > versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to winding up
> > the
> > gain?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Yes, it looks like the the CCD integrates the light over a longer
> period to compensate, rather than raising the gain.
> It is not a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> rate versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to
> winding up the gain in my case.
> ====
>
> That's a bit of a bugger. I think most people would prefer noisy pictures
> than a reduced frame rate. I seems odd that it happens even at normal
> interior lighting levels inside a house. I can imagine it happening when
> it's really low light (eg outside at dusk or by moonlight) but not in
> conditions which will be routinely encountered.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Hello!
The Sony service says today that the camcorder is normal. The contact
personel did not test the camcorder. The Sony service does not allow
to contact technicians which tested the camcorder the days before.
Sincerely.


====

A camera which works at a lower frame rate than 25 or 30 fps (according to 
video standard) in normal household room lighting sounds perilously close to 
being unfit for purpose, bearing in mind this is one of the environments in 
which it will commonly be used.

Don't you just love the level of "customer support" that companies try to 
get away with these days. Sounds absurd that you can't talk to the 
technician when the front-line person doesn't have all the answers himself.

On May 24, 8:15 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
> "D"  wrote in message
>
> news:f4d84128-9008-4dbf-a933-fdfa5e45b77f@y38g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
> On May 22, 8:56 pm, "Mortimer"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "D"  wrote in message
>
> > > "D"  wrote in message
>
> > >news:43f38aaf-e71e-463b-afd7-7eb9462cf22f@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com.> > > On May 21, 6:07 pm, "Rob"  wrote:
> > > > "D"  wrote in message
>
> > > >news:fb6cc9ca-6fd5-4822-a76a-2519340fa925@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > > > Hello!
> > > > > Why does a panoramic video (in an evening or inside a building, shot
> > > > > by Sony HC5E camcorder) look like the frame rate is about 10 fps? My
> > > > > 11-year old JVC VHS-C camcorder never had this problem.
>
> > > > Hi Dima,
>
> > > > If you are looking at it on a PC, are you sure that the problem isn't
> > > > that the PC is on the slow side? HDV is quite demanding.
> > > > If you don't see this effect in normal daylight, or are not using a
> > > > PC,
> > > > forget what I said.
>
> > > > Cheers,
> > > > --
> > > > Rob
>
> > > Thanks Rob for replying!
> > > I don't see this effect in normal daylight and am not using a PC.
>
> > > ===
>
> > > Why is the frame rate worse in low light? Does the CCD integrate the
> > > light
> > > over a longer period to compensate, rather than raising the gain. Is it
> > > something that is only the case with more recent cameras and the OP's
> > > 11-year-old camera which I imagine will also be using a CCD rather than
> > > a
> > > tube. Is it a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> > > rate
> > > versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to winding up
> > > the
> > > gain?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Yes, it looks like the the CCD integrates the light over a longer
> > period to compensate, rather than raising the gain.
> > It is not a switchable setting: low noise at the expense of low frame
> > rate versus normal frame rate at the expense of more noise due to
> > winding up the gain in my case.
> > ====
>
> > That's a bit of a bugger. I think most people would prefer noisy pictures
> > than a reduced frame rate. I seems odd that it happens even at normal
> > interior lighting levels inside a house. I can imagine it happening when> > it's really low light (eg outside at dusk or by moonlight) but not in
> > conditions which will be routinely encountered.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Hello!
> The Sony service says today that the camcorder is normal. The contact
> personel did not test the camcorder. The Sony service does not allow
> to contact technicians which tested the camcorder the days before.
> Sincerely.
>
> ====
>
> A camera which works at a lower frame rate than 25 or 30 fps (according to> video standard) in normal household room lighting sounds perilously close to
> being unfit for purpose, bearing in mind this is one of the environments in
> which it will commonly be used.
>
> Don't you just love the level of "customer support" that companies try to
> get away with these days. Sounds absurd that you can't talk to the
> technician when the front-line person doesn't have all the answers himself.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thanks Mortimer for your reply!
Yes, it sounds absurd that I can't talk to the technician. The front-
line personnel does not pass to technicians all the information about
the problem which I said to them.
The Sony repair shop is located away from the front-line offices.
The problem is worsened by automatic switching shutter speed below and
above 25 fps during shooting! The switching is noticeable and
disturbing!