I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one with an 
external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by the luton top.

Has anybody got any experience of a model that works well?

Rgds

Andy R

"Andy R"  wrote in message 
news:695a0dF306edhU1@mid.individual.net...
> I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one with 
> an external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by the luton 
> top.
>
> Has anybody got any experience of a model that works well?

i got the garmin nuvi 250W, no external antenna possible as no jack for it, 
but not needed one, i was sceptical when i bought it, but in the shop the 
nuvi's were the only models on display that had a 3 bar signal lock, all the 
tomtoms and other sat navs that had external antenna options were 'searching 
for sattelites'

Put my garmin on my dashboard front, so it's about a foot and a half back 
from the windscreen, and it got a lock after about 20 seconds, never lost 
the signal once when traveling around europe last year for 8 months, my 
motorhome has a luton that overhangs the bonnet about a foot and a half, so 
the sat nav has 3 foot the clear before it can see the sky, yet it still 
manages to get a signal, even get a signal in the back of the van as long as 
the blinds are down... put them up and it will loose the signal, pretty 
obviouse tho as they are the metal backed blinds, they even lower the mobile 
phone signal and almost totaly blank out the wifi signal.

Only problem is i dont like the garmins maps, very childish like drawings 
and they dont accurately represent the roads,
when i ran tomtom on a pda, the maps were like paper maps, i could drive in 
the thick fog at dunkerque docks and find my way round by the tomtoms maps, 
when it showed a bend in the road, it was accdurate even to the angle of the 
bend,

the garmin is also a lot less customizable than a tomtom is, but then again 
the tomtom software for a pda is the highest spec one you only get in the 
500 quid plus standalone satnav models, with all the options enabled like 
bluetooth phone controll that the cheaper models just dont have.

On Fri, 16 May 2008 12:37:49 +0100, "Andy R" 
wrote:

>I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one with an 
>external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by the luton top.

Yes on the Luton type camper you will need an external antenna for
effective use. Sats rely on line of sight so without an antenna you
would be losing at least 2/3 of usability. As the luton is also
plastic/alloy you need to glue it as well.

>Has anybody got any experience of a model that works well?

I use a Garmin 2610 which is fine although it doesn't do decent
postcode facility, I think it only lets you put in first 4 digits
which is a real pain. I wouldn't buy another 2610.

1: Try and get one that includes full Europe mapping
2: Get one that does full postcode searching
3: Check the prices of updates as some are silly.
4: Never trust GPS 100%. You will still need to check and cross
reference plus use your noddle.

Still one of the best tools out for many decades.

Andy R wrote:
> I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one
> with an external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by
> the luton top.
> Has anybody got any experience of a model that works well?
>
> Rgds
>
> Andy R

Don't limit yourself to ones only with external antenna conection as you can 
get a sort of repeater/amplifier which just rebroadcasts the signals inside, 
which is what I got for use in my camper, very handy because you can take 
the sat nav in the back and plot stuff on the table.  I got mine from 
GPSWarehouse.

You may also find that the newer sat navs work perfectly ok with nothing 
extra, some of them work inside buildings now !

I own two sat navs, a Garmin etrex which is more of a walkers GPS, but 
includes many features not found on car GPS and easily integrates into 
computer mapping programs/laptop and a cheapy medion from aldi which works 
very well.

"Darren"  wrote in message 
news:dk0r249ji1pb9q3rm2l53fvkvpuk0mtf4l@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 16 May 2008 12:37:49 +0100, "Andy R" 
> wrote:
>
>>I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one with 
>>an
>>external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by the luton top.
>
> Yes on the Luton type camper you will need an external antenna for
> effective use.

best tell my garmin sat nav that then, it can get a lock inside a building, 
in the back of my motorhome, on the dash of the motorhome where there is no 
line of sight to the sky at all from where the satnav lives.

the tomtom models cant do that, hence they have the external antenna jacks,

but like i said, the garmin lets it's self down by the maps that apeer to be 
drawn by a 2 year old in crayon.

On Fri, 16 May 2008 16:07:57 +0100, "Gazz"  wrote:

>
>"Darren"  wrote in message 
>news:dk0r249ji1pb9q3rm2l53fvkvpuk0mtf4l@4ax.com...
>> On Fri, 16 May 2008 12:37:49 +0100, "Andy R" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one with 
>>>an
>>>external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by the luton top.
>>
>> Yes on the Luton type camper you will need an external antenna for
>> effective use.
>
>best tell my garmin sat nav that then, it can get a lock inside a building, 

That may be the case to a certain extent but the lock is not very
accurate or reliable. Satellites do need line of sight really, even if
it's just through the windows in the side of the van.

When I put the unit in the car I get no lost signals. When I put it in
my camper (Luton style) it keeps losing the signal which is a real
pain.

No offence but you do know a Luton covers the whole roof and extends
past the screen don't you?

>in the back of my motorhome, on the dash of the motorhome where there is no 
>line of sight to the sky at all from where the satnav lives.
>
>the tomtom models cant do that, hence they have the external antenna jacks,
>
>but like i said, the garmin lets it's self down by the maps that apeer to be 
>drawn by a 2 year old in crayon. 

Mine also routes me way off course sometimes. Never yet figured out
why!

"Darren"  wrote in message 
news:p9br24pbfka88svas7d9aqvp7u00g66qr7@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 16 May 2008 16:07:57 +0100, "Gazz"  wrote:
> When I put the unit in the car I get no lost signals. When I put it in
> my camper (Luton style) it keeps losing the signal which is a real
> pain.
>
> No offence but you do know a Luton covers the whole roof and extends
> past the screen don't you?

i should hope so, as i specified the exact size, shape and projection past 
the windscreen top of the luton part when i had my motorhomes body built,

Thats what i was getting at, my garmin manages to get a sat lock in places 
you just wouldent expect it to, even inside some buildings, but like i say, 
the maps really let the garmin units down, i went from tomtom on a pda, 
which had great maps but needed the external antenna even in a car, to the 
garmin that could prolly get a lock down a cave, but has maps that are 
embarresing to look at.

On Fri, 16 May 2008 17:26:34 +0100, "Gazz"  wrote:

>
>"Darren"  wrote in message 
>news:p9br24pbfka88svas7d9aqvp7u00g66qr7@4ax.com...
>> On Fri, 16 May 2008 16:07:57 +0100, "Gazz"  wrote:
>> When I put the unit in the car I get no lost signals. When I put it in
>> my camper (Luton style) it keeps losing the signal which is a real
>> pain.
>>
>> No offence but you do know a Luton covers the whole roof and extends
>> past the screen don't you?
>
>i should hope so, as i specified the exact size, shape and projection past 
>the windscreen top of the luton part when i had my motorhomes body built,

;-))

>Thats what i was getting at, my garmin manages to get a sat lock in places 
>you just wouldent expect it to, even inside some buildings, but like i say, 
>the maps really let the garmin units down, i went from tomtom on a pda, 
>which had great maps but needed the external antenna even in a car, to the 
>garmin that could prolly get a lock down a cave, but has maps that are 
>embarresing to look at.

Yes it's a shame, especially when you consider Navteq were the
producers of the excellent Autoroute! Mind you I don't suppose one
actually looks at the map that often on the GPS unit, though it is
handy when connected to the laptop.

I'll take a look at the nuvi 250W then as the lack of a decent
postcode facility is a real pain.

Have you had any problems getting it to recognise addresses with no
number. Like Joes Farm, Pendle lane etc?

What about recognising postcodes?

Will it allow you to go to a partial postcode if you just want the
general area?

Mine will also often not recognise a standard address and postcode, so
I need to go through the palaver of going to a town, then
postcode......all a bit random if you ask me.

"Andy R"  wrote in message 
news:695a0dF306edhU1@mid.individual.net...
> I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one with 
> an external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by the luton 
> top.
>
> Has anybody got any experience of a model that works well?
>
> Rgds
>
> Andy R

It should be fine on its own internal aerial. My campervan has a fibreglass 
hightop roof and it can get 7 satellites easily in any part of the van. I 
presume your Luton roof is fibreglass too and it won't have any trouble 
getting a signal through that. Fibreglass is very transparent to all 
frequencies under about 3GHz and that includes satnav at 1.5GHz, so you 
should have no problems. Line of sight to the satellite doesn't actually 
mean it needs to be optically line of sight, just line of sight for the 
radio signal, which of course can travel through quite a lot of materials 
with little attenuation.

Graham

"Darren"  wrote in message

> I'll take a look at the nuvi 250W then as the lack of a decent
> postcode facility is a real pain.

the 250 does full postcodes, uk and abroad,
>
> Have you had any problems getting it to recognise addresses with no
> number. Like Joes Farm, Pendle lane etc?

cant say i've tried to be honnest, think it might just do numbers tho.

>
> What about recognising postcodes?

yup full7 digit postcodes,

>
> Will it allow you to go to a partial postcode if you just want the
> general area?

yup, it'll take you to the centre of that post code area of course, i.e. ng1 
will take you to the main postoffice in the middle of nottingham. and 
putting any extra will take you to that area,
i.e. put in a full 7 digit postcode but no house number, and it'll take you 
to the street that postcode applies to.

>
> Mine will also often not recognise a standard address and postcode, so
> I need to go through the palaver of going to a town, then
> postcode......all a bit random if you ask me.

I've used my nuvi all over western europe, only had trouble on about 3 
occasions, but i was trying to find very obscure places (stellplatz's/aires) 
and i gather the addy given was wrong, but where i had co-ordinates i gave 
it them and it took me to the right place.

Only problem with the nuvi is it'll take you down any road it can to get you 
where you want to go, but apparantly all satnavs do that.

"Gazz"  wrote in message 
news:69ebv1F32al4rU1@mid.individual.net...
>
> "Darren"  wrote in message
>
>> I'll take a look at the nuvi 250W then as the lack of a decent
>> postcode facility is a real pain.
>
> the 250 does full postcodes, uk and abroad,
>>
>> Have you had any problems getting it to recognise addresses with no
>> number. Like Joes Farm, Pendle lane etc?
>
> cant say i've tried to be honnest, think it might just do numbers tho.
>
>>
>> What about recognising postcodes?
>
> yup full7 digit postcodes,
>
>>
>> Will it allow you to go to a partial postcode if you just want the
>> general area?
>
> yup, it'll take you to the centre of that post code area of course, i.e. 
> ng1 will take you to the main postoffice in the middle of nottingham. and 
> putting any extra will take you to that area,
> i.e. put in a full 7 digit postcode but no house number, and it'll take 
> you to the street that postcode applies to.
>
>>
>> Mine will also often not recognise a standard address and postcode, so
>> I need to go through the palaver of going to a town, then
>> postcode......all a bit random if you ask me.
>
> I've used my nuvi all over western europe, only had trouble on about 3 
> occasions, but i was trying to find very obscure places 
> (stellplatz's/aires) and i gather the addy given was wrong, but where i 
> had co-ordinates i gave it them and it took me to the right place.
>
> Only problem with the nuvi is it'll take you down any road it can to get 
> you where you want to go, but apparantly all satnavs do that.

Thanks for all the posts, I bought a nuvi250 based on the feedback and I 
must say I'm delighted with it.  At £115 it was amongst the cheapest in the 
shop and it works everywhere in the camper, not just on the windscreen, it 
even works on the top bunk surrounded by an ally body.  I can't quite work 
out how it does it, my Garmin 196 I use for flying is much more finnicky and 
will only work with an aerial stuck on the top of the windscreen of the 
aircraft where it's effectively pointing straight up, maybe it's because it 
needs more satellites for the altitude reporting.

rgds

Andy R

On Tue, 20 May 2008 08:05:27 +0100, "Andy R" 
wrote:

>
>"Gazz"  wrote in message 
>news:69ebv1F32al4rU1@mid.individual.net...
>>
>> "Darren"  wrote in message
>>
>>> I'll take a look at the nuvi 250W then as the lack of a decent
>>> postcode facility is a real pain.
>>
>> the 250 does full postcodes, uk and abroad,
>>>
>>> Have you had any problems getting it to recognise addresses with no
>>> number. Like Joes Farm, Pendle lane etc?
>>
>> cant say i've tried to be honnest, think it might just do numbers tho.
>>
>>>
>>> What about recognising postcodes?
>>
>> yup full7 digit postcodes,
>>
>>>
>>> Will it allow you to go to a partial postcode if you just want the
>>> general area?
>>
>> yup, it'll take you to the centre of that post code area of course, i.e. 
>> ng1 will take you to the main postoffice in the middle of nottingham. and 
>> putting any extra will take you to that area,
>> i.e. put in a full 7 digit postcode but no house number, and it'll take 
>> you to the street that postcode applies to.
>>
>>>
>>> Mine will also often not recognise a standard address and postcode, so
>>> I need to go through the palaver of going to a town, then
>>> postcode......all a bit random if you ask me.
>>
>> I've used my nuvi all over western europe, only had trouble on about 3 
>> occasions, but i was trying to find very obscure places 
>> (stellplatz's/aires) and i gather the addy given was wrong, but where i 
>> had co-ordinates i gave it them and it took me to the right place.
>>
>> Only problem with the nuvi is it'll take you down any road it can to get 
>> you where you want to go, but apparantly all satnavs do that.
>
>Thanks for all the posts, I bought a nuvi250 based on the feedback and I 
>must say I'm delighted with it.  At £115 it was amongst the cheapest in the 
>shop and it works everywhere in the camper, not just on the windscreen, it 
>even works on the top bunk surrounded by an ally body.  I can't quite work 
>out how it does it, my Garmin 196 I use for flying is much more finnicky and 
>will only work with an aerial stuck on the top of the windscreen of the 
>aircraft where it's effectively pointing straight up, maybe it's because it 
>needs more satellites for the altitude reporting.

Me2 I must say many thanks to Gazz I think it was. The 250w is a
little gem and it worked faultlessly despite a 100mile round trip
where I tried to get it confused.

I'm afraid that consigns my 2610 to the unused basket.

Just a couple of niggles. It doesn't have any trip information apart
from ETA. A compass pointer/bearing would be nice and a speed would be
nice on the route screen. They may be available on other screens but
not much use if you're driving.

No idea how it gets the signals it just does like you say.

It's good to talk.

On Tue, 20 May 2008 13:11:25 +0100, Darren 
wrote:

>On Tue, 20 May 2008 08:05:27 +0100, "Andy R" 
>wrote:
>
>>
>>"Gazz"  wrote in message 
>>news:69ebv1F32al4rU1@mid.individual.net...
>>>
>>> "Darren"  wrote in message
>>>
>>>> I'll take a look at the nuvi 250W then as the lack of a decent
>>>> postcode facility is a real pain.
>>>
>>> the 250 does full postcodes, uk and abroad,
>>>>
>>>> Have you had any problems getting it to recognise addresses with no
>>>> number. Like Joes Farm, Pendle lane etc?
>>>
>>> cant say i've tried to be honnest, think it might just do numbers tho.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> What about recognising postcodes?
>>>
>>> yup full7 digit postcodes,
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Will it allow you to go to a partial postcode if you just want the
>>>> general area?
>>>
>>> yup, it'll take you to the centre of that post code area of course, i.e. 
>>> ng1 will take you to the main postoffice in the middle of nottingham. and 
>>> putting any extra will take you to that area,
>>> i.e. put in a full 7 digit postcode but no house number, and it'll take 
>>> you to the street that postcode applies to.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mine will also often not recognise a standard address and postcode, so
>>>> I need to go through the palaver of going to a town, then
>>>> postcode......all a bit random if you ask me.
>>>
>>> I've used my nuvi all over western europe, only had trouble on about 3 
>>> occasions, but i was trying to find very obscure places 
>>> (stellplatz's/aires) and i gather the addy given was wrong, but where i 
>>> had co-ordinates i gave it them and it took me to the right place.
>>>
>>> Only problem with the nuvi is it'll take you down any road it can to get 
>>> you where you want to go, but apparantly all satnavs do that.
>>
>>Thanks for all the posts, I bought a nuvi250 based on the feedback and I 
>>must say I'm delighted with it.  At £115 it was amongst the cheapest in the 
>>shop and it works everywhere in the camper, not just on the windscreen, it 
>>even works on the top bunk surrounded by an ally body.  I can't quite work 
>>out how it does it, my Garmin 196 I use for flying is much more finnicky and 
>>will only work with an aerial stuck on the top of the windscreen of the 
>>aircraft where it's effectively pointing straight up, maybe it's because it 
>>needs more satellites for the altitude reporting.
>
>Me2 I must say many thanks to Gazz I think it was. The 250w is a
>little gem and it worked faultlessly despite a 100mile round trip
>where I tried to get it confused.
>
>I'm afraid that consigns my 2610 to the unused basket.
>
>Just a couple of niggles. It doesn't have any trip information apart
>from ETA. A compass pointer/bearing would be nice and a speed would be
>nice on the route screen. They may be available on other screens but
>not much use if you're driving.
>
>No idea how it gets the signals it just does like you say.

Driven a few hundred miles now and it really is a very good, but very
basic GPS.

The reason it appears to find itself in any conditions is mainly
bluff. On most GPS units when it loses a signal it will quickly say
so. On this it doesn't say anything and just carries on on a wing and
a prayer working out roughly what's happening. What this means in
effect is that often coming up to junctions and turns it can sometimes
be quite a few yards out depending on your speed. I've had it 50 to
100 feet out at 60mph. I guess the Luton does hamper it after all, but
still it's lovely and easy to use.

"Darren"  wrote in message 
news:rvsc34tlhl95d2n2pg2ag8fa2gllhpp0le@4ax.com...

> Driven a few hundred miles now and it really is a very good, but very
> basic GPS.

well it's basic but does all most people want, i've just takne up 
geocaching, and am using the nuvi 250W, does all i need for that and at the 
moment i'm using the standard road maps, so absolutely no date off the 
roads,

> The reason it appears to find itself in any conditions is mainly
> bluff. On most GPS units when it loses a signal it will quickly say
> so. On this it doesn't say anything and just carries on on a wing and
> a prayer working out roughly what's happening. What this means in
> effect is that often coming up to junctions and turns it can sometimes
> be quite a few yards out depending on your speed. I've had it 50 to
> 100 feet out at 60mph. I guess the Luton does hamper it after all, but
> still it's lovely and easy to use.

i noticed the 'turn left' thing when your still 100 yards from a junction 
thing only appered when i updated to the latest firmware from garmins 
webnsite, before that it was pretty much spot on,

I get this when i'm in the car, or on the motorbike, when it's on the 
motorbikes mount, it has a full view of the sky except the little bit where 
i'm blocking the signal by sitting on the bike riding it, it'll still tell 
me to turn well before the junction.

it will loose the sat signal, and tell you, but only when it's gone down to 
less than 3 sats for about 5 seconds,

assuming you have the wide screen version, press and hold the sat bar meter 
in the top left hand corner for about 5 seconds, this will bring up the sat 
info screen.. this is apparantly not mentioned in the manual, you have to 
get the bar icon spot on tho, fat fingers end up pressing the area for the 
'where to' icon :)

When i'm using it for gercaching, once i've set it to off road use, it takes 
me to the co-ordinates pretty well, i get within about 20 feet of the cache 
location, then i switch to the sat info screen, remembering the co-ordinates 
of the cache,

Even tho it's working at about 25 yard accuracy, it's always taken me to 
exactly the right spot on the co-ordinates,

On Wed, 28 May 2008 16:21:50 +0100, "Gazz"  wrote:

>
>"Darren"  wrote in message 
>news:rvsc34tlhl95d2n2pg2ag8fa2gllhpp0le@4ax.com...
>
>> Driven a few hundred miles now and it really is a very good, but very
>> basic GPS.
>
>well it's basic but does all most people want, i've just takne up 
>geocaching, and am using the nuvi 250W, does all i need for that and at the 
>moment i'm using the standard road maps, so absolutely no date off the 
>roads,
>
>> The reason it appears to find itself in any conditions is mainly
>> bluff. On most GPS units when it loses a signal it will quickly say
>> so. On this it doesn't say anything and just carries on on a wing and
>> a prayer working out roughly what's happening. What this means in
>> effect is that often coming up to junctions and turns it can sometimes
>> be quite a few yards out depending on your speed. I've had it 50 to
>> 100 feet out at 60mph. I guess the Luton does hamper it after all, but
>> still it's lovely and easy to use.
>
>i noticed the 'turn left' thing when your still 100 yards from a junction 
>thing only appered when i updated to the latest firmware from garmins 
>webnsite, before that it was pretty much spot on,
>
>I get this when i'm in the car, or on the motorbike, when it's on the 
>motorbikes mount, it has a full view of the sky except the little bit where 
>i'm blocking the signal by sitting on the bike riding it, it'll still tell 
>me to turn well before the junction.
>
>it will loose the sat signal, and tell you, but only when it's gone down to 
>less than 3 sats for about 5 seconds,
>
>assuming you have the wide screen version, press and hold the sat bar meter 
>in the top left hand corner for about 5 seconds, this will bring up the sat 
>info screen.. this is apparantly not mentioned in the manual, you have to 
>get the bar icon spot on tho, fat fingers end up pressing the area for the 
>'where to' icon :)
>
>When i'm using it for gercaching, once i've set it to off road use, it takes 
>me to the co-ordinates pretty well, i get within about 20 feet of the cache 
>location, then i switch to the sat info screen, remembering the co-ordinates 
>of the cache,
>
>Even tho it's working at about 25 yard accuracy, it's always taken me to 
>exactly the right spot on the co-ordinates,

Yeah cant grumble especially at the price.

"Graham"  wrote in message 
news:frKdnSd2h9w_bKzVnZ2dnUVZ8rGdnZ2d@posted.metronet...
>
> "Andy R"  wrote in message 
> news:695a0dF306edhU1@mid.individual.net...
>> I'm planning on getting a satnav device.  I'm expecting to need one with 
>> an external aerial as its view of the sky will be obscured by the luton 
>> top.
>>
>> Has anybody got any experience of a model that works well?
>>
>> Rgds
>>
>> Andy R
>
> It should be fine on its own internal aerial. My campervan has a 
> fibreglass hightop roof and it can get 7 satellites easily in any part of 
> the van. I presume your Luton roof is fibreglass too and it won't have any 
> trouble getting a signal through that. Fibreglass is very transparent to 
> all frequencies under about 3GHz and that includes satnav at 1.5GHz, so 
> you should have no problems. Line of sight to the satellite doesn't 
> actually mean it needs to be optically line of sight, just line of sight 
> for the radio signal, which of course can travel through quite a lot of 
> materials with little attenuation.
>
> Graham


I agree with that Graham,  I've had no problems with signal strength
using my Tom Tom in an Autosleeper Symbol even in city centres
with lots of high rise buildings.  Struggles a bit going through the tunnels
in the Alps, but fortunately not taken a wrong turning in one of those.
(yet)  <G>.

Zozzer