I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for over 2 
years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and a couple of 
brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud clonk noise around 
the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel and like I say the track 
rods are new.  I can also get it to make the clonk noise if I drive in a 
straight line and quickly swerve the steering from side to side.  It does it 
even if it's freewheeling along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.

Redwood wrote:
> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for over 2 
> years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and a couple of 
> brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud clonk noise around 
> the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel and like I say the track 
> rods are new.  I can also get it to make the clonk noise if I drive in a 
> straight line and quickly swerve the steering from side to side.  It does it 
> even if it's freewheeling along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome. 

Anti-roll bar bushes/droplinks, bottom balljoint, wishbone bushes, strut 
top mounts?

-- 
Douglas

Redwood wrote:
> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for
> over 2 years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and a
> couple of brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud
> clonk noise around the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel
> and like I say the track rods are new.  I can also get it to make the
> clonk noise if I drive in a straight line and quickly swerve the
> steering from side to side.  It does it even if it's freewheeling
> along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.

broken a/r link is the most likely/common

"Mrcheerful"  wrote in message 
news:6IHik.33284$E41.17590@text.news.virginmedia.com...
> Redwood wrote:
>> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for
>> over 2 years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and a
>> couple of brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud
>> clonk noise around the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel
>> and like I say the track rods are new.  I can also get it to make the
>> clonk noise if I drive in a straight line and quickly swerve the
>> steering from side to side.  It does it even if it's freewheeling
>> along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.
>
> broken a/r link is the most likely/common

Just fitted a new pair of drop links and no difference.  However I went for 
a longer test drive round the country lanes and noticed the steering wallows 
about quite a lot. Seems to want extra turning of the wheel to get round 
sharp bends and going over rough ground it feels like the nearside wheel 
wanting to pull into the kerb.  Does this sound more like a bottom ball 
joint - although I can't feel play when jacked up, but I'll have another 
look.

Redwood wrote:
> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
> news:6IHik.33284$E41.17590@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>> Redwood wrote:
>>> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for
>>> over 2 years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and
>>> a couple of brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud
>>> clonk noise around the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel
>>> and like I say the track rods are new.  I can also get it to make
>>> the clonk noise if I drive in a straight line and quickly swerve the
>>> steering from side to side.  It does it even if it's freewheeling
>>> along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.
>>
>> broken a/r link is the most likely/common
>
> Just fitted a new pair of drop links and no difference.  However I
> went for a longer test drive round the country lanes and noticed the
> steering wallows about quite a lot. Seems to want extra turning of
> the wheel to get round sharp bends and going over rough ground it
> feels like the nearside wheel wanting to pull into the kerb.  Does
> this sound more like a bottom ball joint - although I can't feel play
> when jacked up, but I'll have another look.

bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible, levering may 
be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom ball joint then it is 
often easier to feel the play directly at the pin, as the supension can 
often hold the balljoint in tension which masks the play.

vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the rack attaches to the 
body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an assistant to 
yank the steering around while you watch under the bonnet for odd movements

On Sat, 26 Jul 2008 18:34:27 +0100, Mrcheerful  wrote:

> Redwood wrote:
>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>> news:6IHik.33284$E41.17590@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for
>>>> over 2 years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and
>>>> a couple of brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud
>>>> clonk noise around the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel
>>>> and like I say the track rods are new.  I can also get it to make
>>>> the clonk noise if I drive in a straight line and quickly swerve the
>>>> steering from side to side.  It does it even if it's freewheeling
>>>> along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.
>>>
>>> broken a/r link is the most likely/common
>>
>> Just fitted a new pair of drop links and no difference.  However I
>> went for a longer test drive round the country lanes and noticed the
>> steering wallows about quite a lot. Seems to want extra turning of
>> the wheel to get round sharp bends and going over rough ground it
>> feels like the nearside wheel wanting to pull into the kerb.  Does
>> this sound more like a bottom ball joint - although I can't feel play
>> when jacked up, but I'll have another look.
>
> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible, levering  
> may
> be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom ball joint then it  
> is
> often easier to feel the play directly at the pin, as the supension can
> often hold the balljoint in tension which masks the play.
>
> vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the rack attaches to the
> body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an assistant to
> yank the steering around while you watch under the bonnet for odd  
> movements
>
>

It's cunningly hidden behind the sound damping so the 1st indication ois  
when the rack starts moving.

"Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
news:DeJik.33328$E41.7033@text.news.virginmedia.com...
> Redwood wrote:
>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>> news:6IHik.33284$E41.17590@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for
>>>> over 2 years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and
>>>> a couple of brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud
>>>> clonk noise around the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel
>>>> and like I say the track rods are new.  I can also get it to make
>>>> the clonk noise if I drive in a straight line and quickly swerve the
>>>> steering from side to side.  It does it even if it's freewheeling
>>>> along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.
>>>
>>> broken a/r link is the most likely/common
>>
>> Just fitted a new pair of drop links and no difference.  However I
>> went for a longer test drive round the country lanes and noticed the
>> steering wallows about quite a lot. Seems to want extra turning of
>> the wheel to get round sharp bends and going over rough ground it
>> feels like the nearside wheel wanting to pull into the kerb.  Does
>> this sound more like a bottom ball joint - although I can't feel play
>> when jacked up, but I'll have another look.
>
> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible, levering may
> be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom ball joint then it
> is often easier to feel the play directly at the pin, as the supension can
> often hold the balljoint in tension which masks the play.
>
> vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the rack attaches to the
> body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an assistant to
> yank the steering around while you watch under the bonnet for odd
> movements

Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried levering the
ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to ease pressure off the
joint but I can't find any movement in the ball joint.  And no matter what I
do when it's stationery I can't replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I
also noticed that if I put full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants
to push the wheel and carry straight on instead of turning!

Redwood wrote:
> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
> news:DeJik.33328$E41.7033@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>> Redwood wrote:
>>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>>> news:6IHik.33284$E41.17590@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>>> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for
>>>>> over 2 years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks
>>>>> and a couple of brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice
>>>>> a loud clonk noise around the front nearside.  There's no play in
>>>>> the wheel and like I say the track rods are new.  I can also get
>>>>> it to make the clonk noise if I drive in a straight line and
>>>>> quickly swerve the steering from side to side.  It does it even
>>>>> if it's freewheeling along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.
>>>>
>>>> broken a/r link is the most likely/common
>>>
>>> Just fitted a new pair of drop links and no difference.  However I
>>> went for a longer test drive round the country lanes and noticed the
>>> steering wallows about quite a lot. Seems to want extra turning of
>>> the wheel to get round sharp bends and going over rough ground it
>>> feels like the nearside wheel wanting to pull into the kerb.  Does
>>> this sound more like a bottom ball joint - although I can't feel
>>> play when jacked up, but I'll have another look.
>>
>> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible,
>> levering may be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom
>> ball joint then it is often easier to feel the play directly at the
>> pin, as the supension can often hold the balljoint in tension which
>> masks the play. vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the rack 
>> attaches to
>> the body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an
>> assistant to yank the steering around while you watch under the
>> bonnet for odd movements
>
> Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried levering
> the ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to ease
> pressure off the joint but I can't find any movement in the ball
> joint.  And no matter what I do when it's stationery I can't
> replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I also noticed that if I put
> full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants to push the wheel and
> carry straight on instead of turning!

Did you reset the tracking after changing the track rod ends?

"Redwood"  wrote in message 
news:6f1eo9F9ghp1U1@mid.individual.net...
> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
> news:DeJik.33328$E41.7033@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>> Redwood wrote:
>>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>>> news:6IHik.33284$E41.17590@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>>> I've been working on a 1997 Astra Van 1.7TD that's been stood for
>>>>> over 2 years.  (New track rod ends, rear cylinders, front disks and
>>>>> a couple of brake pipes).  Took it for a test run and notice a loud
>>>>> clonk noise around the front nearside.  There's no play in the wheel
>>>>> and like I say the track rods are new.  I can also get it to make
>>>>> the clonk noise if I drive in a straight line and quickly swerve the
>>>>> steering from side to side.  It does it even if it's freewheeling
>>>>> along out of gear.  Any thoughts welcome.
>>>>
>>>> broken a/r link is the most likely/common
>>>
>>> Just fitted a new pair of drop links and no difference.  However I
>>> went for a longer test drive round the country lanes and noticed the
>>> steering wallows about quite a lot. Seems to want extra turning of
>>> the wheel to get round sharp bends and going over rough ground it
>>> feels like the nearside wheel wanting to pull into the kerb.  Does
>>> this sound more like a bottom ball joint - although I can't feel play
>>> when jacked up, but I'll have another look.
>>
>> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible, levering 
>> may
>> be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom ball joint then it
>> is often easier to feel the play directly at the pin, as the supension 
>> can
>> often hold the balljoint in tension which masks the play.
>>
>> vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the rack attaches to the
>> body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an assistant to
>> yank the steering around while you watch under the bonnet for odd
>> movements
>
> Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried levering the
> ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to ease pressure off the
> joint but I can't find any movement in the ball joint.  And no matter what 
> I
> do when it's stationery I can't replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I
> also noticed that if I put full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants
> to push the wheel and carry straight on instead of turning!

This sounds like it could be a problem with the diff?!

Tim..

"Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
news:LTNik.33494$E41.21388@text.news.virginmedia.com...
> Redwood wrote:
>>> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible,
>>> levering may be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom
>>> ball joint then it is often easier to feel the play directly at the
>>> pin, as the supension can often hold the balljoint in tension which
>>> masks the play. vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the rack
>>> attaches to
>>> the body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an
>>> assistant to yank the steering around while you watch under the
>>> bonnet for odd movements
>>
>> Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried levering
>> the ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to ease
>> pressure off the joint but I can't find any movement in the ball
>> joint.  And no matter what I do when it's stationery I can't
>> replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I also noticed that if I put
>> full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants to push the wheel and
>> carry straight on instead of turning!
>
> Did you reset the tracking after changing the track rod ends?

Finaly cracked it.  I'm kicking myself for not spotting it earlier but it
was one of the wishbone rubber mounts that had worn.  Fitted a new one
(which included a new ball joint) but now the fekking van refuses to start.
There's definitely diesel in the tank but undoing the injector pipes and
there's no diesel coming through.  It's always started first turn of the
key, even after sitting unused for 2 years!!

Redwood wrote:
> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
> news:LTNik.33494$E41.21388@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>> Redwood wrote:
>>>> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible,
>>>> levering may be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom
>>>> ball joint then it is often easier to feel the play directly at the
>>>> pin, as the supension can often hold the balljoint in tension which
>>>> masks the play. vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the
>>>> rack attaches to
>>>> the body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an
>>>> assistant to yank the steering around while you watch under the
>>>> bonnet for odd movements
>>>
>>> Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried
>>> levering the ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to
>>> ease pressure off the joint but I can't find any movement in the
>>> ball joint.  And no matter what I do when it's stationery I can't
>>> replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I also noticed that if I
>>> put full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants to push the
>>> wheel and carry straight on instead of turning!
>>
>> Did you reset the tracking after changing the track rod ends?
>
> Finaly cracked it.  I'm kicking myself for not spotting it earlier
> but it was one of the wishbone rubber mounts that had worn.  Fitted a
> new one (which included a new ball joint) but now the fekking van
> refuses to start. There's definitely diesel in the tank but undoing
> the injector pipes and there's no diesel coming through.  It's always
> started first turn of the key, even after sitting unused for 2 years!!

is the shut off valve clicking as it should?  has the cam belt snapped?

"Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
news:aI1jk.33725$E41.5216@text.news.virginmedia.com...
> Redwood wrote:
>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>> news:LTNik.33494$E41.21388@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>>> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible,
>>>>> levering may be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the bottom
>>>>> ball joint then it is often easier to feel the play directly at the
>>>>> pin, as the supension can often hold the balljoint in tension which
>>>>> masks the play. vauxhalls can have serious rust problems where the
>>>>> rack attaches to
>>>>> the body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an
>>>>> assistant to yank the steering around while you watch under the
>>>>> bonnet for odd movements
>>>>
>>>> Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried
>>>> levering the ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to
>>>> ease pressure off the joint but I can't find any movement in the
>>>> ball joint.  And no matter what I do when it's stationery I can't
>>>> replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I also noticed that if I
>>>> put full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants to push the
>>>> wheel and carry straight on instead of turning!
>>>
>>> Did you reset the tracking after changing the track rod ends?
>>
>> Finaly cracked it.  I'm kicking myself for not spotting it earlier
>> but it was one of the wishbone rubber mounts that had worn.  Fitted a
>> new one (which included a new ball joint) but now the fekking van
>> refuses to start. There's definitely diesel in the tank but undoing
>> the injector pipes and there's no diesel coming through.  It's always
>> started first turn of the key, even after sitting unused for 2 years!!
>
> is the shut off valve clicking as it should?  has the cam belt snapped?

cambelts ok but the only click I can hear is from one of the relays located
near the battery when ign is turned on.  I got someone turning on & off ign
while I had a good listen all around but can't hear any other clicks or
noises from anywhere else.  I'm guessing the shut off valve is the one
mounted on top of the fuel filter with the 2 main fuel pipes bolted on.
There is a two wire connector plugged into it and they look fairly thick
gauge wires to carry heavy current but using a DVM there is no voltage
showing when the ign is on or while it was cranking.  Also checked fuses and 
are ok.

Redwood wrote:
> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
> news:aI1jk.33725$E41.5216@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>> Redwood wrote:
>>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>>> news:LTNik.33494$E41.21388@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>>>> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible,
>>>>>> levering may be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the
>>>>>> bottom ball joint then it is often easier to feel the play
>>>>>> directly at the pin, as the supension can often hold the
>>>>>> balljoint in tension which masks the play. vauxhalls can have
>>>>>> serious rust problems where the rack attaches to
>>>>>> the body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an
>>>>>> assistant to yank the steering around while you watch under the
>>>>>> bonnet for odd movements
>>>>>
>>>>> Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried
>>>>> levering the ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to
>>>>> ease pressure off the joint but I can't find any movement in the
>>>>> ball joint.  And no matter what I do when it's stationery I can't
>>>>> replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I also noticed that if I
>>>>> put full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants to push the
>>>>> wheel and carry straight on instead of turning!
>>>>
>>>> Did you reset the tracking after changing the track rod ends?
>>>
>>> Finaly cracked it.  I'm kicking myself for not spotting it earlier
>>> but it was one of the wishbone rubber mounts that had worn.  Fitted
>>> a new one (which included a new ball joint) but now the fekking van
>>> refuses to start. There's definitely diesel in the tank but undoing
>>> the injector pipes and there's no diesel coming through.  It's
>>> always started first turn of the key, even after sitting unused for
>>> 2 years!!
>>
>> is the shut off valve clicking as it should?  has the cam belt
>> snapped?
>
> cambelts ok but the only click I can hear is from one of the relays
> located near the battery when ign is turned on.  I got someone
> turning on & off ign while I had a good listen all around but can't
> hear any other clicks or noises from anywhere else.  I'm guessing the
> shut off valve is the one mounted on top of the fuel filter with the
> 2 main fuel pipes bolted on. There is a two wire connector plugged
> into it and they look fairly thick gauge wires to carry heavy current
> but using a DVM there is no voltage showing when the ign is on or
> while it was cranking.  Also checked fuses and are ok.

that sounds more like a fuel heater.
 the fuel cut off solenoid is generally (always afaik) on the injection pump 
itself, generally tubular about an inch and a bit long, three quarters 
across with a single wire going to the end

On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:52:22 +0100, Mrcheerful  wrote:

> Redwood wrote:
>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>> news:aI1jk.33725$E41.5216@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>> "Mrcheerful"  wrote in message
>>>> news:LTNik.33494$E41.21388@text.news.virginmedia.com...
>>>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>>>>> bottom ball joint is not common on those, but quite possible,
>>>>>>> levering may be needed to show play.  If you disconnect the
>>>>>>> bottom ball joint then it is often easier to feel the play
>>>>>>> directly at the pin, as the supension can often hold the
>>>>>>> balljoint in tension which masks the play. vauxhalls can have
>>>>>>> serious rust problems where the rack attaches to
>>>>>>> the body.  The body work then cracks and movement starts, get an
>>>>>>> assistant to yank the steering around while you watch under the
>>>>>>> bonnet for odd movements
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ok cheers I'll have a look at the rack tomorrow.  I've tried
>>>>>> levering the ball joint and had it jacked in various positions to
>>>>>> ease pressure off the joint but I can't find any movement in the
>>>>>> ball joint.  And no matter what I do when it's stationery I can't
>>>>>> replicate the clonk noise.  When driving I also noticed that if I
>>>>>> put full right hand lock on, it feels like it wants to push the
>>>>>> wheel and carry straight on instead of turning!
>>>>>
>>>>> Did you reset the tracking after changing the track rod ends?
>>>>
>>>> Finaly cracked it.  I'm kicking myself for not spotting it earlier
>>>> but it was one of the wishbone rubber mounts that had worn.  Fitted
>>>> a new one (which included a new ball joint) but now the fekking van
>>>> refuses to start. There's definitely diesel in the tank but undoing
>>>> the injector pipes and there's no diesel coming through.  It's
>>>> always started first turn of the key, even after sitting unused for
>>>> 2 years!!
>>>
>>> is the shut off valve clicking as it should?  has the cam belt
>>> snapped?
>>
>> cambelts ok but the only click I can hear is from one of the relays
>> located near the battery when ign is turned on.  I got someone
>> turning on & off ign while I had a good listen all around but can't
>> hear any other clicks or noises from anywhere else.  I'm guessing the
>> shut off valve is the one mounted on top of the fuel filter with the
>> 2 main fuel pipes bolted on. There is a two wire connector plugged
>> into it and they look fairly thick gauge wires to carry heavy current
>> but using a DVM there is no voltage showing when the ign is on or
>> while it was cranking.  Also checked fuses and are ok.
>
> that sounds more like a fuel heater.

It is.

>  the fuel cut off solenoid is generally (always afaik) on the injection  
> pump
> itself, generally tubular about an inch and a bit long, three quarters
> across with a single wire going to the end
>
>
If that's got voltage
OPen one of the injector unions, spray a bit of easystart in the air  
filter & spin it over, the easistart should spin it fast enough to prime  
the pump.

"Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
news:op.uezykdnihaghkf@lucy...
> On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:52:22 +0100, Mrcheerful  wrote:
>
>> Redwood wrote:
>>> cambelts ok but the only click I can hear is from one of the relays
>>> located near the battery when ign is turned on.  I got someone
>>> turning on & off ign while I had a good listen all around but can't
>>> hear any other clicks or noises from anywhere else.  I'm guessing the
>>> shut off valve is the one mounted on top of the fuel filter with the
>>> 2 main fuel pipes bolted on. There is a two wire connector plugged
>>> into it and they look fairly thick gauge wires to carry heavy current
>>> but using a DVM there is no voltage showing when the ign is on or
>>> while it was cranking.  Also checked fuses and are ok.
>>
>> that sounds more like a fuel heater.
>
> It is.
>
>>  the fuel cut off solenoid is generally (always afaik) on the injection
>> pump
>> itself, generally tubular about an inch and a bit long, three quarters
>> across with a single wire going to the end
>>
>>
> If that's got voltage
> OPen one of the injector unions, spray a bit of easystart in the air
> filter & spin it over, the easistart should spin it fast enough to prime
> the pump.
>
Thanks guys, Took the airbox off for better access.  I can see a multiplug
with 3 wires that connect to a small black plastic box on the side of the
pump. The middle wire has voltage with ign on.  The only other wire I can
see going to the pump is a fairly thick single wire but I think this is an
earth cable as it fastens around a nut.

I removed an injection pipe and with the airbox removed I squirted easystart
into the inlet and it started.  Had it running for about half a minute on
the easystart but still no fuel came out the pipe.  Really got me stumped as
it was running perfect prior to fitting the new wishbone.  It's not as
though I could have disturbed something as there's nothing to disturb in
that area.

On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:01:31 +0100, Redwood  wrote:

> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
> news:op.uezykdnihaghkf@lucy...
>> On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:52:22 +0100, Mrcheerful   
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>> cambelts ok but the only click I can hear is from one of the relays
>>>> located near the battery when ign is turned on.  I got someone
>>>> turning on & off ign while I had a good listen all around but can't
>>>> hear any other clicks or noises from anywhere else.  I'm guessing the
>>>> shut off valve is the one mounted on top of the fuel filter with the
>>>> 2 main fuel pipes bolted on. There is a two wire connector plugged
>>>> into it and they look fairly thick gauge wires to carry heavy current
>>>> but using a DVM there is no voltage showing when the ign is on or
>>>> while it was cranking.  Also checked fuses and are ok.
>>>
>>> that sounds more like a fuel heater.
>>
>> It is.
>>
>>>  the fuel cut off solenoid is generally (always afaik) on the injection
>>> pump
>>> itself, generally tubular about an inch and a bit long, three quarters
>>> across with a single wire going to the end
>>>
>>>
>> If that's got voltage
>> OPen one of the injector unions, spray a bit of easystart in the air
>> filter & spin it over, the easistart should spin it fast enough to prime
>> the pump.
>>
> Thanks guys, Took the airbox off for better access.  I can see a  
> multiplug
> with 3 wires that connect to a small black plastic box on the side of the
> pump. The middle wire has voltage with ign on.  The only other wire I can
> see going to the pump is a fairly thick single wire but I think this is  
> an
> earth cable as it fastens around a nut.
>
> I removed an injection pipe and with the airbox removed I squirted  
> easystart
> into the inlet and it started.  Had it running for about half a minute on
> the easystart but still no fuel came out the pipe.  Really got me  
> stumped as
> it was running perfect prior to fitting the new wishbone.  It's not as
> though I could have disturbed something as there's nothing to disturb in
> that area.
>
>
>


Check the lift pump is delivering fuel to the pump when the ignitions on,  
otherwise it sounds like the fuel cut off solenoid has stuck & needs  
removing/replacing.

"Duncan Wood"  wrote in message 
news:op.uez9ju0yhaghkf@lucy...
> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:01:31 +0100, Redwood  wrote:
>
>> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
>> news:op.uezykdnihaghkf@lucy...
>>> On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:52:22 +0100, Mrcheerful  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Redwood wrote:
>>>>> cambelts ok but the only click I can hear is from one of the relays
>>>>> located near the battery when ign is turned on.  I got someone
>>>>> turning on & off ign while I had a good listen all around but can't
>>>>> hear any other clicks or noises from anywhere else.  I'm guessing the
>>>>> shut off valve is the one mounted on top of the fuel filter with the
>>>>> 2 main fuel pipes bolted on. There is a two wire connector plugged
>>>>> into it and they look fairly thick gauge wires to carry heavy current
>>>>> but using a DVM there is no voltage showing when the ign is on or
>>>>> while it was cranking.  Also checked fuses and are ok.
>>>>
>>>> that sounds more like a fuel heater.
>>>
>>> It is.
>>>
>>>>  the fuel cut off solenoid is generally (always afaik) on the injection
>>>> pump
>>>> itself, generally tubular about an inch and a bit long, three quarters
>>>> across with a single wire going to the end
>>>>
>>>>
>>> If that's got voltage
>>> OPen one of the injector unions, spray a bit of easystart in the air
>>> filter & spin it over, the easistart should spin it fast enough to prime
>>> the pump.
>>>
>> Thanks guys, Took the airbox off for better access.  I can see a 
>> multiplug
>> with 3 wires that connect to a small black plastic box on the side of the
>> pump. The middle wire has voltage with ign on.  The only other wire I can
>> see going to the pump is a fairly thick single wire but I think this is 
>> an
>> earth cable as it fastens around a nut.
>>
>> I removed an injection pipe and with the airbox removed I squirted 
>> easystart
>> into the inlet and it started.  Had it running for about half a minute on
>> the easystart but still no fuel came out the pipe.  Really got me 
>> stumped as
>> it was running perfect prior to fitting the new wishbone.  It's not as
>> though I could have disturbed something as there's nothing to disturb in
>> that area.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Check the lift pump is delivering fuel to the pump when the ignitions on, 
> otherwise it sounds like the fuel cut off solenoid has stuck & needs 
> removing/replacing.

Lift pump is built into the injection pump.
The fuel cut-off solenoid is located underneath the security sheild on the 
back of the pump.
If you look at where the 4 injector pipes go onto it, the solenoid valve 
sits vertically just in front of them (in injection pump terms, the front of 
the pump is the sprocket/pulley end). The security sheild covers it, and is 
usally held on with shear bolts.

"moray"  wrote in message
news:g6km9h$6cj$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
>
> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
> news:op.uez9ju0yhaghkf@lucy...

>> Check the lift pump is delivering fuel to the pump when the ignitions on,
>> otherwise it sounds like the fuel cut off solenoid has stuck & needs
>> removing/replacing.
>
> Lift pump is built into the injection pump.
> The fuel cut-off solenoid is located underneath the security sheild on the
> back of the pump.
> If you look at where the 4 injector pipes go onto it, the solenoid valve
> sits vertically just in front of them (in injection pump terms, the front
> of the pump is the sprocket/pulley end). The security sheild covers it,
> and is usally held on with shear bolts.

Ok thanks, Looks a bit awkward to get at things in situ so I think the best
thing will be to remove the pump complete and see if there's someone local
who can test it.  Is it straight forward removing the pump and does it come
away from the pulley without needing to remove the cam sprocket or disturb
the timing belt? cheers.

On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:17:18 +0100, Redwood  wrote:

> "moray"  wrote in message
> news:g6km9h$6cj$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
>>
>> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
>> news:op.uez9ju0yhaghkf@lucy...
>
>>> Check the lift pump is delivering fuel to the pump when the ignitions  
>>> on,
>>> otherwise it sounds like the fuel cut off solenoid has stuck & needs
>>> removing/replacing.
>>
>> Lift pump is built into the injection pump.
>> The fuel cut-off solenoid is located underneath the security sheild on  
>> the
>> back of the pump.
>> If you look at where the 4 injector pipes go onto it, the solenoid valve
>> sits vertically just in front of them (in injection pump terms, the  
>> front
>> of the pump is the sprocket/pulley end). The security sheild covers it,
>> and is usally held on with shear bolts.
>
> Ok thanks, Looks a bit awkward to get at things in situ so I think the  
> best
> thing will be to remove the pump complete and see if there's someone  
> local
> who can test it.  Is it straight forward removing the pump and does it  
> come
> away from the pulley without needing to remove the cam sprocket or  
> disturb
> the timing belt? cheers.
>
>
>
>


Can you see if the solenoid is puliing any current 1st?

"Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
news:op.ue1uutn6haghkf@lucy...
> On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:17:18 +0100, Redwood  wrote:
>
>> "moray"  wrote in message
>> news:g6km9h$6cj$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
>>>
>>> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
>>> news:op.uez9ju0yhaghkf@lucy...
>>
>>>> Check the lift pump is delivering fuel to the pump when the ignitions
>>>> on,
>>>> otherwise it sounds like the fuel cut off solenoid has stuck & needs
>>>> removing/replacing.
>>>
>>> Lift pump is built into the injection pump.
>>> The fuel cut-off solenoid is located underneath the security sheild on
>>> the
>>> back of the pump.
>>> If you look at where the 4 injector pipes go onto it, the solenoid valve
>>> sits vertically just in front of them (in injection pump terms, the
>>> front
>>> of the pump is the sprocket/pulley end). The security sheild covers it,
>>> and is usally held on with shear bolts.
>>
>> Ok thanks, Looks a bit awkward to get at things in situ so I think the
>> best
>> thing will be to remove the pump complete and see if there's someone
>> local
>> who can test it.  Is it straight forward removing the pump and does it
>> come
>> away from the pulley without needing to remove the cam sprocket or
>> disturb
>> the timing belt? cheers.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Can you see if the solenoid is puliing any current 1st?

Will check the current tomorrow when I get hold of a decent DMM as I blew
that function on mine after connecting it across battery terminals and
forgetting to switch it from the amp setting!  The 3 wires going into the
pump; one is earth, the middle shows battery voltage and the other shows
fluctuating voltage.  (When the immobiliser LED is flashing there is no
voltage going to the pump).

To check if it was getting fuel from the tank I filled a bottle with diesel
and placed the pump feed pipe into it and spinning the engine over it sucked
fuel from the bottle but none got to the injector pipes.  I guess is was
pumping it back to the tank through the return pipe.  So at least we know
it's actually sucking fuel into the pump but not squirting it to the
injectors!  Do you think this is sounding like the a problem with the
shut-off solenoid?

"Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
news:op.ue1uutn6haghkf@lucy...
> On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:17:18 +0100, Redwood  wrote:
>
>> "moray"  wrote in message
>> news:g6km9h$6cj$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
>>>
>>> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
>>> news:op.uez9ju0yhaghkf@lucy...
>>
>>>> Check the lift pump is delivering fuel to the pump when the ignitions
>>>> on,
>>>> otherwise it sounds like the fuel cut off solenoid has stuck & needs
>>>> removing/replacing.
>>>
>>> Lift pump is built into the injection pump.
>>> The fuel cut-off solenoid is located underneath the security sheild on
>>> the
>>> back of the pump.
>>> If you look at where the 4 injector pipes go onto it, the solenoid valve
>>> sits vertically just in front of them (in injection pump terms, the
>>> front
>>> of the pump is the sprocket/pulley end). The security sheild covers it,
>>> and is usally held on with shear bolts.
>>
>> Ok thanks, Looks a bit awkward to get at things in situ so I think the
>> best
>> thing will be to remove the pump complete and see if there's someone
>> local
>> who can test it.  Is it straight forward removing the pump and does it
>> come
>> away from the pulley without needing to remove the cam sprocket or
>> disturb
>> the timing belt? cheers.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Can you see if the solenoid is puliing any current 1st?

From what I can make out, the middle wire is for the pump immobiliser. That
shows batt voltage when the immobiliser led is off but can't detect any
current being drawn from that.  The other wire comes live only when the
middle (immobiliser) wire is live.  With the ign switched on that wire shows
around 10v (not full batt voltage) and the current seems to be bouncing
around at very low mA's.  I thought I'd see what happens if I connect a wire
direct from the +batt onto this wire abd when I switch on ign it gives an
initial current draw of about 20mA before droping back down bouncing around
the very low mA's.  Fuel sucking into the pump but still nothing coming out.
Will try get hold of a longer easy out tool for the 2 sheer bolts and see if
I can get at the solenoid.  Can this be got at without undoing any pipes or 
removing the pump?

On Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:42:37 +0100, Redwood  wrote:

> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
> news:op.ue1uutn6haghkf@lucy..
>> On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:17:18 +0100, Redwood  wrote:
>>
>>> "moray"  wrote in message
>>> news:g6km9h$6cj$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
>>>>
>>>> "Duncan Wood"  wrote in message
>>>> news:op.uez9ju0yhaghkf@lucy...
>>>
>>>>> Check the lift pump is delivering fuel to the pump when the ignitions
>>>>> on,
>>>>> otherwise it sounds like the fuel cut off solenoid has stuck & needs
>>>>> removing/replacing.
>>>>
>>>> Lift pump is built into the injection pump.
>>>> The fuel cut-off solenoid is located underneath the security sheild on
>>>> the
>>>> back of the pump.
>>>> If you look at where the 4 injector pipes go onto it, the solenoid  
>>>> valve
>>>> sits vertically just in front of them (in injection pump terms, the
>>>> front
>>>> of the pump is the sprocket/pulley end). The security sheild covers  
>>>> it,
>>>> and is usally held on with shear bolts.
>>>
>>> Ok thanks, Looks a bit awkward to get at things in situ so I think the
>>> best
>>> thing will be to remove the pump complete and see if there's someone
>>> local
>>> who can test it.  Is it straight forward removing the pump and does it
>>> come
>>> away from the pulley without needing to remove the cam sprocket or
>>> disturb
>>> the timing belt? cheers.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Can you see if the solenoid is puliing any current 1st?
>
> From what I can make out, the middle wire is for the pump immobiliser.  
> That
> shows batt voltage when the immobiliser led is off but can't detect any
> current being drawn from that.  The other wire comes live only when the
> middle (immobiliser) wire is live.  With the ign switched on that wire  
> shows
> around 10v (not full batt voltage) and the current seems to be bouncing
> around at very low mA's.  I thought I'd see what happens if I connect a  
> wire
> direct from the +batt onto this wire abd when I switch on ign it gives an
> initial current draw of about 20mA before droping back down bouncing  
> around
> the very low mA's.  Fuel sucking into the pump but still nothing coming  
> out.
> Will try get hold of a longer easy out tool for the 2 sheer bolts and  
> see if
> I can get at the solenoid.  Can this be got at without undoing any pipes  
> or
> removing the pump?
>
>

If the solenoids working then with a screwdriver on it you'll hear the  
click when the voltage is applied.

"Duncan Wood"  wrote in message 
news:op.ue5j5x14haghkf@lucy...
> On Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:42:37 +0100, Redwood  wrote:
>

>>> Can you see if the solenoid is puliing any current 1st?
>>
>> From what I can make out, the middle wire is for the pump immobiliser. 
>> That
>> shows batt voltage when the immobiliser led is off but can't detect any
>> current being drawn from that.  The other wire comes live only when the
>> middle (immobiliser) wire is live.  With the ign switched on that wire 
>> shows
>> around 10v (not full batt voltage) and the current seems to be bouncing
>> around at very low mA's.  I thought I'd see what happens if I connect a 
>> wire
>> direct from the +batt onto this wire abd when I switch on ign it gives an
>> initial current draw of about 20mA before droping back down bouncing 
>> around
>> the very low mA's.  Fuel sucking into the pump but still nothing coming 
>> out.
>> Will try get hold of a longer easy out tool for the 2 sheer bolts and 
>> see if
>> I can get at the solenoid.  Can this be got at without undoing any pipes 
>> or
>> removing the pump?
>>
>>
>
> If the solenoids working then with a screwdriver on it you'll hear the 
> click when the voltage is applied.

Well all I can say is Halle[fucking]lujah!!!
Managed to get the cunting sheer bolts out and removed the immobiliser unit 
and discovered that although there is power going into the immobiliser unit, 
there is no power from the immobiliser to the solenoid terminal.  Connecting 
a wire straight from the +batt to the solenoid and it clicked into life and 
the van started.   I can only assume there must be a prob with the 
immobiliser unit itself.

The middle wire going into the immobiliser unit is live with the ign on and 
the immobiliser LED not blinking, so what I've done is used this wire to 
connect direct to the solenoid which now clicks on & off with the ignition. 
What a fucking palaver but at least it's going.

>>
>> If the solenoids working then with a screwdriver on it you'll hear the
>> click when the voltage is applied.
>
> Well all I can say is Halle[fucking]lujah!!!
> Managed to get the cunting sheer bolts out and removed the immobiliser  
> unit
> and discovered that although there is power going into the immobiliser  
> unit,
> there is no power from the immobiliser to the solenoid terminal.   
> Connecting
> a wire straight from the +batt to the solenoid and it clicked into life  
> and
> the van started.   I can only assume there must be a prob with the
> immobiliser unit itself.
>
> The middle wire going into the immobiliser unit is live with the ign on  
> and
> the immobiliser LED not blinking, so what I've done is used this wire to
> connect direct to the solenoid which now clicks on & off with the  
> ignition.
> What a fucking palaver but at least it's going.
>
>


Well I was beginning to wonder what on earth else might have failed. (you  
can get an internal failure in the pump but it's in the theoretically  
possible sort of odds)