Adrian wrote:

> On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 16:01:06 GMT, Jim Warren
>  wrote:
> 

>> But if I do think I have to go somewhere else, I will speak to Charlie 
>> Ware (he lives in Bath, and I often see him around), pass on your 
>> appreciation, and see what he has to say.  Thanks for the recommendation.
> 
> No problem.
> To jog his memory - it's the Almond Green '64 Traveller that he sent
> to the stained glass guy in south-west Ireland......
> ...that should narrow it down a bit <g>
> 
> Good luck
> Adrian

I met Charlie on Monday and passed on your message.

He didn't say anything apart from Oh yes I remember that one, but he 
looked really pleased.

Jim

HI Jim

Jim Warren wrote:
> Adrian wrote:
> 
>> On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 16:01:06 GMT, Jim Warren
>>  wrote:
>>
> 
>>> But if I do think I have to go somewhere else, I will speak to 
>>> Charlie Ware (he lives in Bath, and I often see him around), pass on 
>>> your appreciation, and see what he has to say.  Thanks for the 
>>> recommendation.
>>
>> No problem.
>> To jog his memory - it's the Almond Green '64 Traveller that he sent
>> to the stained glass guy in south-west Ireland......
>> ...that should narrow it down a bit <g>
>>
>> Good luck
>> Adrian
> 
> I met Charlie on Monday and passed on your message.
> 
> He didn't say anything apart from Oh yes I remember that one, but he 
> looked really pleased.
> 
> Jim

Ah - that's nice.....
Never met him in person - but we've spoken several times on the phone, 
and he seems like one of those people who knows their stuff on Moggies...

Thanks
Adrian

Adrian wrote:

> 
> Ah - that's nice.....
> Never met him in person - but we've spoken several times on the phone, 
> and he seems like one of those people who knows their stuff on Moggies...
> 
> Thanks
> Adrian

He is a very interesting man to talk to, though he always seems 
incredibly busy and never chats for long at any time.

He was once a millionaire who fought (and won) a running battle with the 
council who wanted to demolish a row of Georgian houses that they had 
deliberately allowed to go derelict to make them worthless.  Charlie 
stepped in and bought them from under the council's nose, restored them 
and then forced the council to rethink their development plans because 
what they intended to demolish was no longer unfit for habitation.  He 
sold them on and used the money to buy up another set of derelicts and 
restored them.  Unfortunately at that time there was a property price 
crash and he lost most of his money because this latest batch sold for 
less than it cost him to restore them.

Having found himself with insufficient cash to restore property he 
decided to start restoring something else and settled on Morris Minors. 
  And as the business grew and became more profitable, he bought another 
Georgian terrace, restored that and used it as his business 
headquarters.  He also started up a factory in Sri Lanka which now makes 
his parts for his restoration business.

Before the second World War, there were several garages named Ware's, 
most of which got bombed.  I don't know if they were his family or not - 
I have never asked him - but my guess is that they were, and he grew up 
in an environment where cars were repaired.  He certainly knows a lot 
about classic cars which would have been current cars when he was 
growing up.

Jim

Hi Jim

Jim Warren wrote:
> Adrian wrote:
> 
>>
>> Ah - that's nice.....
>> Never met him in person - but we've spoken several times on the phone, 
>> and he seems like one of those people who knows their stuff on Moggies...
>>
>> Thanks
>> Adrian
> 
> He is a very interesting man to talk to, though he always seems 
> incredibly busy and never chats for long at any time.
> 
> He was once a millionaire who fought (and won) a running battle with the 
> council who wanted to demolish a row of Georgian houses that they had 
> deliberately allowed to go derelict to make them worthless.  Charlie 
> stepped in and bought them from under the council's nose, restored them 
> and then forced the council to rethink their development plans because 
> what they intended to demolish was no longer unfit for habitation.  He 
> sold them on and used the money to buy up another set of derelicts and 
> restored them.  Unfortunately at that time there was a property price 
> crash and he lost most of his money because this latest batch sold for 
> less than it cost him to restore them.

Sounds like a man after my own heart !
I'm running a campaign at the moment the bring back the Swansea-Cork 
ferry - which is a vital link for tourism & industry out here in the 
South-West of Ireland

www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com

with an online petition if you or anybody you know is interested....


> 
> Having found himself with insufficient cash to restore property he 
> decided to start restoring something else and settled on Morris Minors. 
>  And as the business grew and became more profitable, he bought another 
> Georgian terrace, restored that and used it as his business 
> headquarters.  He also started up a factory in Sri Lanka which now makes 
> his parts for his restoration business.

Ah - that's interesting - have heard mention of a factory out that way 
that's making Moggie spares - didn't put 2&2 together though....

One day when I'm rich I'm going to get Charles's organisation to biuld 
me a new Moggie - but then - that'd take away all the fun of patching up 
the odd hole in my 'original' one <g>


> 
> Before the second World War, there were several garages named Ware's, 
> most of which got bombed.  I don't know if they were his family or not - 
> I have never asked him - but my guess is that they were, and he grew up 
> in an environment where cars were repaired.  He certainly knows a lot 
> about classic cars which would have been current cars when he was 
> growing up.
> 

 From the few chats I've had with him he's certainly a mine of 
information on the Minors...

Regards
Adrian - West Cork, Ireland

Adrian  wrote:

> I'm running a campaign at the moment the bring back the Swansea-Cork 
> ferry - which is a vital link for tourism & industry out here in the 
> South-West of Ireland

Ooh I used to use that "quite often" because a good friend of mine lived
at Ringaskiddy. His family were a bit famous around those parts since
they had an Island named after them.

> www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com
> 
> with an online petition if you or anybody you know is interested....

Just as long as it's not an aging Greek reject this time and hopefully
the loos won't asphyxiate people in their sleep or the windows in the
bar break during heavy weather.

Hi Steve

Steve Firth wrote:
> Adrian  wrote:
> 
>> I'm running a campaign at the moment the bring back the Swansea-Cork 
>> ferry - which is a vital link for tourism & industry out here in the 
>> South-West of Ireland
> 
> Ooh I used to use that "quite often" because a good friend of mine lived
> at Ringaskiddy. His family were a bit famous around those parts since
> they had an Island named after them.

Sounds interesting....

> 
>> www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com
>>
>> with an online petition if you or anybody you know is interested....
> 
> Just as long as it's not an aging Greek reject this time and hopefully
> the loos won't asphyxiate people in their sleep or the windows in the
> bar break during heavy weather.

Well yes.....

On the website we _do_ say

==Just to clarify one thing - we’d all like the Swansea-Cork link to be 
restored, preferably with a modern, comfortable (different!) boat, 
operated by a responsive, efficient company.
This may or may not be “Swansea Cork Ferries” - but, whoever is involved 
in operating it, the Swansea-Cork ferry service and the onward 
‘land-bridge’ must be restored as soon as possible!==

Even though the last boat was a bit of a tub, it was, at least, a 
link.... and without that link which gave easy access by car from the UK 
/ EU to South-West Ireland - many holidaymakers are simply not making 
the journey.... - and the tourist industry out here is suffering.

As I say - all e-signatures are very welcome !

http://www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com/html/e-petition.php

Adrian

Adrian  wrote:

> Hi Steve
> 
> Steve Firth wrote:
> > Adrian  wrote:
> > 
> >> I'm running a campaign at the moment the bring back the Swansea-Cork
> >> ferry - which is a vital link for tourism & industry out here in the
> >> South-West of Ireland
> > 
> > Ooh I used to use that "quite often" because a good friend of mine lived
> > at Ringaskiddy. His family were a bit famous around those parts since
> > they had an Island named after them.
> 
> Sounds interesting....

I think nowadays the Island is under the Ringaskiddy terminal. It's
certainly not in the harbour. IIRC there's a plaque to the family in
question somwhere in the terminal. They used to have a really nice
cottage a few doors down from the pub.

> >> www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com
> >>
> >> with an online petition if you or anybody you know is interested....
> > 
> > Just as long as it's not an aging Greek reject this time and hopefully
> > the loos won't asphyxiate people in their sleep or the windows in the
> > bar break during heavy weather.
> 
> Well yes.....
> 
> On the website we _do_ say
> 
> ==Just to clarify one thing - we'd all like the Swansea-Cork link to be
> restored, preferably with a modern, comfortable (different!) boat, 
> operated by a responsive, efficient company.
> This may or may not be "Swansea Cork Ferries" - but, whoever is involved
> in operating it, the Swansea-Cork ferry service and the onward 
> 'land-bridge' must be restored as soon as possible!==
> 
> Even though the last boat was a bit of a tub, it was, at least, a 
> link.... and without that link which gave easy access by car from the UK
> / EU to South-West Ireland - many holidaymakers are simply not making
> the journey.... - and the tourist industry out here is suffering.

That's a shame. I've still got fond memories of weddings, wakes, nights
out at the pub and cheese making.

> As I say - all e-signatures are very welcome !
> 
> http://www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com/html/e-petition.php

I shall probably endorse your petition.

Adrian  wrote:

> That's why we started the campaign.....

Have you thought about approaching LD Lines? They recently re-opened the
Porsmouth/Le Havre ferry which takes a similar time to the Swansea/Cork
route and are providing a good quality service at a reasonable price.

HI Steve

Steve Firth wrote:
> Adrian  wrote:
> 
>> Hi Steve
>>
>> Steve Firth wrote:
>>> Adrian  wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm running a campaign at the moment the bring back the Swansea-Cork
>>>> ferry - which is a vital link for tourism & industry out here in the
>>>> South-West of Ireland
>>> Ooh I used to use that "quite often" because a good friend of mine lived
>>> at Ringaskiddy. His family were a bit famous around those parts since
>>> they had an Island named after them.
>> Sounds interesting....
> 
> I think nowadays the Island is under the Ringaskiddy terminal. It's
> certainly not in the harbour. IIRC there's a plaque to the family in
> question somwhere in the terminal. They used to have a really nice
> cottage a few doors down from the pub.
> 
>>>> www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com
>>>>
>>>> with an online petition if you or anybody you know is interested....
>>> Just as long as it's not an aging Greek reject this time and hopefully
>>> the loos won't asphyxiate people in their sleep or the windows in the
>>> bar break during heavy weather.
>> Well yes.....
>>
>> On the website we _do_ say
>>
>> ==Just to clarify one thing - we'd all like the Swansea-Cork link to be
>> restored, preferably with a modern, comfortable (different!) boat, 
>> operated by a responsive, efficient company.
>> This may or may not be "Swansea Cork Ferries" - but, whoever is involved
>> in operating it, the Swansea-Cork ferry service and the onward 
>> 'land-bridge' must be restored as soon as possible!==
>>
>> Even though the last boat was a bit of a tub, it was, at least, a 
>> link.... and without that link which gave easy access by car from the UK
>> / EU to South-West Ireland - many holidaymakers are simply not making
>> the journey.... - and the tourist industry out here is suffering.
> 
> That's a shame. I've still got fond memories of weddings, wakes, nights
> out at the pub and cheese making.
> 
>> As I say - all e-signatures are very welcome !
>>
>> http://www.bringbacktheswanseacorkferry.com/html/e-petition.php
> 
> I shall probably endorse your petition.

Many thanks - it's appreciated
Adrian

Steve Firth wrote:
> Adrian  wrote:
> 
>> That's why we started the campaign.....
> 
> Have you thought about approaching LD Lines? They recently re-opened the
> Porsmouth/Le Havre ferry which takes a similar time to the Swansea/Cork
> route and are providing a good quality service at a reasonable price.

Alternatively, have you approached DFSD?  They are popular for routes 
across the North Sea, and according to my brother who used them once, a 
nice comfortable boat at a sensible price.  If the channel tunnel has 
made a dent in their passenger numbers, they might have some spare 
capacity to move to Cork.

Jim

Adrian  wrote:

> > 
> > I shall probably endorse your petition.
> 
> Many thanks - it's appreciated

OK, I haven't done it. I don't want to subscribe to a newsletter and the
"code" whatever the fuck that is isn't visible so the website won't
accept my comment.

Another triumph of fuckbugwittery over common sense when it comes to
website design.

HI Jim / Steve

Jim Warren wrote:
> Steve Firth wrote:
>> Adrian  wrote:
>>
>>> That's why we started the campaign.....
>>
>> Have you thought about approaching LD Lines? They recently re-opened the
>> Porsmouth/Le Havre ferry which takes a similar time to the Swansea/Cork
>> route and are providing a good quality service at a reasonable price.
> 
> Alternatively, have you approached DFSD?  They are popular for routes 
> across the North Sea, and according to my brother who used them once, a 
> nice comfortable boat at a sensible price.  If the channel tunnel has 
> made a dent in their passenger numbers, they might have some spare 
> capacity to move to Cork.
> 
> Jim

Now this will sound like a cop-out - but I'm hoping that the actual 
chatting with ferry compaines can be done by somebody more experienced 
than I.

Our situation at the moment seems to be that the people in the Dail in 
Dublin either are unaware of the problem or don't care about the problem 
- either way - we aim to highlight the situation...

The website's full of reports from people whose businesses are suffering 
from not having this link in place. I came from Cornwall - and it's like 
digging a great big trench across the A30 and the A38 - having the same 
impact on our tourist industry. Thing is - it looks like such an easy 
problem to solve - get a boat! - but for some reason whi we aren't being 
told, it's being made more complicated...

Anyway - off the soapbox and out to sell some stained / fused glass to 
the few tourists who have got through the 'blockade' <g>

Thanks for the signature, Steve

Adrian

Hi Steve

Steve Firth wrote:
> Adrian  wrote:
> 
>>> I shall probably endorse your petition.
>> Many thanks - it's appreciated
> 
> OK, I haven't done it. I don't want to subscribe to a newsletter and the
> "code" whatever the fuck that is isn't visible so the website won't
> accept my comment.
> 
> Another triumph of fuckbugwittery over common sense when it comes to
> website design.

I hope you're joking...... cos your comments came through fine....
and are on the website now.

The 'code' is the three-letter 'captcha' image that should appear
just below the comment box. It's designed to stop those darn 'spambots'
that otherwise clog up such online forms - and it was working OK the 
last time I looked...

Where does it mention a newletter..... ? - can't remember putting that 
in there...

Adrian

Adrian  wrote:

> Hi Steve
> 
> Steve Firth wrote:
> > Adrian  wrote:
> > 
> >>> I shall probably endorse your petition.
> >> Many thanks - it's appreciated
> > 
> > OK, I haven't done it. I don't want to subscribe to a newsletter and the
> > "code" whatever the fuck that is isn't visible so the website won't
> > accept my comment.
> > 
> > Another triumph of fuckbugwittery over common sense when it comes to
> > website design.
> 
> I hope you're joking...... cos your comments came through fine....
> and are on the website now.

No, I'm not joking.

> The 'code' is the three-letter 'captcha' image that should appear
> just below the comment box. It's designed to stop those darn 'spambots'
> that otherwise clog up such online forms - and it was working OK the 
> last time I looked...

No sign of it and I didn't enter one. <checks> No, it's still not there.
Would it by any chance be some sort of Javascript thing? I don't run
Javascript from websites, for fairly obvious reasons.
 
> Where does it mention a newletter..... ? - can't remember putting that
> in there...

On the home page:

"To show your support for our campaign - please support our 'e-petition'
here and we'll add your name to our e-newsletter and keep you up-to-date
with any developments."

Sorry it's an e-newsletter obviously not the same thing as a newsletter.

In article <1ih2rhe.20glvwdmxv7wN%%steve%@malloc.co.uk>,
   Steve Firth <%steve%@malloc.co.uk> wrote:
> > I hope you're joking...... cos your comments came through fine....
> > and are on the website now.

> No, I'm not joking.

They're there when I checked just now. 'Sent 05/17/2008 06:46:33'. Nothing
better to do this time on a Saturday? ;-)

> > The 'code' is the three-letter 'captcha' image that should appear
> > just below the comment box. It's designed to stop those darn 'spambots'
> > that otherwise clog up such online forms - and it was working OK the 
> > last time I looked...

> No sign of it and I didn't enter one. <checks> No, it's still not there.
> Would it by any chance be some sort of Javascript thing? I don't run
> Javascript from websites, for fairly obvious reasons.

It appears as just a JPEG icon here using an old version of JavaScript.

>

-- 
*Santa's helpers are subordinate clauses*

    Dave Plowman        dave@davenoise.co.uk           London SW
                  To e-mail, change noise into sound.

HI Steve / Dave

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
> In article <1ih2rhe.20glvwdmxv7wN%%steve%@malloc.co.uk>,
>    Steve Firth <%steve%@malloc.co.uk> wrote:
>>> I hope you're joking...... cos your comments came through fine....
>>> and are on the website now.
> 
>> No, I'm not joking.
> 
> They're there when I checked just now. 'Sent 05/17/2008 06:46:33'. Nothing
> better to do this time on a Saturday? ;-)

Interesting....

In theory (!), if you couldn't see the 'captcha' letters, and
therefore couldn't enter them - then your comment shouldn't have made it 
to the e-petition..... so I wonder how that happened....

I think I'll have to look into stopping the spammers server-side -
there's a couple of easy checks that 'spot' spambot entries and 'kill' 
them before writing them to the e-petition file - maybe I'll look inot 
that and scrap the 'captcha'...

> 
>>> The 'code' is the three-letter 'captcha' image that should appear
>>> just below the comment box. It's designed to stop those darn 'spambots'
>>> that otherwise clog up such online forms - and it was working OK the 
>>> last time I looked...
> 
>> No sign of it and I didn't enter one. <checks> No, it's still not there.
>> Would it by any chance be some sort of Javascript thing? I don't run
>> Javascript from websites, for fairly obvious reasons.
> 
> It appears as just a JPEG icon here using an old version of JavaScript.

It's a 'bolt on' feature supplied as part of the web editing program -
much of the form handling is done in php, but I'm not sure just how the
'captcha' bit works...

Thanks for the feedback folks ....

Adrian

Dave Plowman (News)  wrote:

> In article <1ih2rhe.20glvwdmxv7wN%%steve%@malloc.co.uk>,
>    Steve Firth <%steve%@malloc.co.uk> wrote:
> > > I hope you're joking...... cos your comments came through fine....
> > > and are on the website now.
> 
> > No, I'm not joking.
> 
> They're there when I checked just now. 'Sent 05/17/2008 06:46:33'. Nothing
> better to do this time on a Saturday? ;-)

Early start. Believe me  I was looking forward to a lie-in, but the
farmer's wives coven has a meeting over near Basingstoke and I was
volunteered as driver.

Yes, I can see that the comment is there, but the site gave an error
message and I can't find the spamtrap picture at all and I'm bemused
about why the site accepted the comment if the "captcha" thing is an
essential part of the process.

Still can't see it.

Hi Steve

Steve Firth wrote:
> Dave Plowman (News)  wrote:
> 
>> In article <1ih2rhe.20glvwdmxv7wN%%steve%@malloc.co.uk>,
>>    Steve Firth <%steve%@malloc.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> I hope you're joking...... cos your comments came through fine....
>>>> and are on the website now.
>>> No, I'm not joking.
>> They're there when I checked just now. 'Sent 05/17/2008 06:46:33'. Nothing
>> better to do this time on a Saturday? ;-)
> 
> Early start. Believe me  I was looking forward to a lie-in, but the
> farmer's wives coven has a meeting over near Basingstoke and I was
> volunteered as driver.

You & me both - up 0630 hours to pack the car for the local Farmers' 
market...

> 
> Yes, I can see that the comment is there, but the site gave an error
> message and I can't find the spamtrap picture at all and I'm bemused
> about why the site accepted the comment if the "captcha" thing is an
> essential part of the process.

So am I - I'll have to have a paddle round the code.... <g>

> 
> Still can't see it.

Aha - well - you won't now, 'cos I've taken it off <g>
- preparing for the avalance of spambot bother....

It's more of an irritation than a big deal, 'cos everything had to be 
validated by me before it gets published (had a couple of daft entries
early on) - but it's annoying ploughing through 20 spambot messages and 
deleting each one...

However - I'm all for making it more 'user-friendly' -
we don;t want to make it hard  for folks to sign up to the e-petition...

You don;t recall what the error message was, do you ??

Ah well - it's raining out here in West Cork this afternoon -
ideal weather for hacking server-side scripts !

Thanks
Adrian

Adrian  wrote:

> You don;t recall what the error message was, do you ??

Sorry, no I wasn't pying attention that much. It seemed to be offended
because Javascript is disabled in my browser and I got a error page that
looked like it was generated by NoScript rather than by your site.

HI Steve

Steve Firth wrote:
> Adrian  wrote:
> 
>> You don;t recall what the error message was, do you ??
> 
> Sorry, no I wasn't pying attention that much. It seemed to be offended
> because Javascript is disabled in my browser and I got a error page that
> looked like it was generated by NoScript rather than by your site.

Ah - OK.....

Odd that it let you post anyway.....

Have modded the page for the time being to remove the 'captcha' thing -
and modded the (hidden) admin page so's I can bulk-delete spambot posts.

We'll see how it goes...

Thanks
Adrian

Steve Firth wrote:

> 
> Yes, I can see that the comment is there, but the site gave an error
> message and I can't find the spamtrap picture at all and I'm bemused
> about why the site accepted the comment if the "captcha" thing is an
> essential part of the process.
> 
> Still can't see it.

I had a quick look at the page source.  I am not particularly good with 
javascript, because I never learned it, but there are enough 
similarities with Coral66 which I did learn 20 years ago to have some 
idea of what is going on.

As far as I can see, if the scripts don't run, then the validation to 
decide not to send the form if there is a completion error doesn't run 
either, so anything gets through.

Who hasn't tested the No Script conditions then?  ;-)

Jim

HI Jim

Jim Warren wrote:
> Steve Firth wrote:
> 
>>
>> Yes, I can see that the comment is there, but the site gave an error
>> message and I can't find the spamtrap picture at all and I'm bemused
>> about why the site accepted the comment if the "captcha" thing is an
>> essential part of the process.
>>
>> Still can't see it.
> 
> I had a quick look at the page source.  I am not particularly good with 
> javascript, because I never learned it, but there are enough 
> similarities with Coral66 which I did learn 20 years ago to have some 
> idea of what is going on.
> 
> As far as I can see, if the scripts don't run, then the validation to 
> decide not to send the form if there is a completion error doesn't run 
> either, so anything gets through.
> 
> Who hasn't tested the No Script conditions then?  ;-)
> 

Thanks for taking the time to look - appreciated..

As to 'who hasn't...?' then that'd be the folks at Netobjects.... <g>
- the form handling was their product, part of NetobjectsFusion10.

They're not very keen to sort out bugs in the scripts - I've asked 
them... seem to be much more focussed on the new version of NOF that's
due out sometime soon (probably using the same scripts !)

Ah well... that's life <g>

Thanks
Adrian