One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If 
you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting" 
you to renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to 
read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just 
been bereaved, and was taken in.

Anyone any experience of what happens next?

Phil, London

On Thu, 22 May 2008 21:13:27 +0100, Philip Herlihy
 wrote:

>One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If 
>you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting" 
>you to renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to 
>read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just 
>been bereaved, and was taken in.
>
>Anyone any experience of what happens next?

No.

I had a letter from them inviting me to renew a domain I hadn't even
bought. I can't quite believe this, but it appears they got the whois
details from a website I run - name and address and so on - and
registered a domain on Microsoft Live (for free) then two years later
tried to get me to pay for it to be renewed!!

-- 
http://www.kingqueen.org.uk
remove .lartsspammers to reply

Doug Paulley wrote:
> On Thu, 22 May 2008 21:13:27 +0100, Philip Herlihy
>  wrote:
> 
>> One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If 
>> you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting" 
>> you to renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to 
>> read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just 
>> been bereaved, and was taken in.
>>
>> Anyone any experience of what happens next?
> 
> No.
> 
> I had a letter from them inviting me to renew a domain I hadn't even
> bought. I can't quite believe this, but it appears they got the whois
> details from a website I run - name and address and so on - and
> registered a domain on Microsoft Live (for free) then two years later
> tried to get me to pay for it to be renewed!!
> 

I've clarified that they can't take over the domains without my 
supplying a code, so that's not about to happen.  I'll check with my 
legal service to see if there's a problem with trying to stop the cheques.

PH

On Thu, 22 May 2008 21:13:27 +0100, Philip Herlihy wrote:

> One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If
> you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting"
> you to renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to
> read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just
> been bereaved, and was taken in.
> 
> Anyone any experience of what happens next?
> 
> Phil, London

I probably get 2 clients a month phoning with exactly the same question.  
The receive these in the post and it frightens the into thinking they're 
going to lose their domain name.

The trouble is, they're not really doing anything wrong.  It's very 
misleading but legally is probably a hair's breadth from the line between 
the right and wrong side of the law.  They're also not too bad price wise 
at $50 for 2 years for a .com.

Worse than these are the ones that phone and tell you that they have a 
client that's interested in a domain name that is similar to yours, maybe 
with hyphens or something, and tell you that they're 'honour bound' to 
offer it to you first.  I had a client pay £250 EACH for 3.co.uk domains 
with a credit card from one such call.

-- 
Andy Jacobs

Philip Herlihy wrote:
> One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If 
> you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting" 
> you to renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to 
> read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just 
> been bereaved, and was taken in.
> 
> Anyone any experience of what happens next?
> 
> Phil, London

I've had them. They include an envelope which is not prepaid. I stick it 
the post box and hope they get it and have to pay for the postage.

Generally my technique with spam that includes a prepaid envelope is to 
send it back. On one occasion I filled the form in, and did not put a 
credit credit card number and did not sign it. They then sent it back 
saying I'd forgot the credit card and to sign it. I then sent it back 
with the sensible looking credit card number, but again did not sign it. 
They then sent it back again. Each time they sent it with a prepaid 
envelope, so it must have cost them money.

Sometimes I send the spam from one company onto another.

Those creeps you are on about dont send prepaid envelopes, but they 
might well chose to pay the postage.

Andy Jacobs wrote:

> Worse than these are the ones that phone and tell you that they have a 
> client that's interested in a domain name that is similar to yours, maybe 
> with hyphens or something, and tell you that they're 'honour bound' to 
> offer it to you first.  I had a client pay £250 EACH for 3.co.uk domains 
> with a credit card from one such call.
> 

Again, I'd chose to mess them around. There are a few programs around 
which can generate credit card numbers that pass all tests for validity, 
but of course are fake. They are apparently used for testing things like 
web services.

Another trick of mine for people phoning about some offer is I say I am 
interested, but are changing the baby right now, so will they wait on 
the phone. It's surprising how long some will wait!

On Sat, 24 May 2008 15:31:43 +0100, Dave wrote:

> Andy Jacobs wrote:
> 
>> Worse than these are the ones that phone and tell you that they have a
>> client that's interested in a domain name that is similar to yours,
>> maybe with hyphens or something, and tell you that they're 'honour
>> bound' to offer it to you first.  I had a client pay £250 EACH for
>> 3.co.uk domains with a credit card from one such call.
>> 
>> 
> Again, I'd chose to mess them around. There are a few programs around
> which can generate credit card numbers that pass all tests for validity,
> but of course are fake. They are apparently used for testing things like
> web services.

I think they're just Mod 10, or is that ISBN numbers?
-- 
Andy Jacobs

Andy Jacobs wrote:
> On Sat, 24 May 2008 15:31:43 +0100, Dave wrote:
> 
>> Andy Jacobs wrote:
>>
>>> Worse than these are the ones that phone and tell you that they have a
>>> client that's interested in a domain name that is similar to yours,
>>> maybe with hyphens or something, and tell you that they're 'honour
>>> bound' to offer it to you first.  I had a client pay £250 EACH for
>>> 3.co.uk domains with a credit card from one such call.
>>>
>>>
>> Again, I'd chose to mess them around. There are a few programs around
>> which can generate credit card numbers that pass all tests for validity,
>> but of course are fake. They are apparently used for testing things like
>> web services.
> 
> I think they're just Mod 10, or is that ISBN numbers?


http://www.darkcoding.net/credit-card/luhn-formula/

has an explanation. I've no idea if its correct. I've never bothered 
myself generating 'valid' numbers, but just numbers that look reasonable 
to a human.

I suspect if more people would spend a bit of time wasting the time and 
postage costs for spammers, it might reduce the amount in our letter boxes.

A friend of mine once had someone phone offering a cheap deal on 
electricity. After string them along, he told them he had his own 
windmill and would they give him a good deal if he sells them electric.

In uk.net.web.authoring message <oNidnTBBMsdnH6XVnZ2dnUVZ8sninZ2d@bt.com
>, Sat, 24 May 2008 16:04:58, Andy Jacobs 
posted:
>
>I think they're just Mod 10, or is that ISBN numbers?

ISBN are not just mod 10; see in <URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/js-
misc1.htm> and links.

-- 
 (c) John Stockton, nr London, UK. ?@merlyn.demon.co.uk  Turnpike v6.05  MIME.
 Web  <URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/> - FAQish topics, acronyms, & links.
 Proper <= 4-line sig. separator as above, a line exactly "-- " (SonOfRFC1036)
 Do not Mail News to me. Before a reply, quote with ">" or "> " (SonOfRFC1036)

On 25/5/08 5:18 pm, in article
d9wDuKKGFZOIFwb$@invalid.uk.co.demon.merlyn.invalid, "Dr J R Stockton"
 wrote:

> In uk.net.web.authoring message <oNidnTBBMsdnH6XVnZ2dnUVZ8sninZ2d@bt.com
>> , Sat, 24 May 2008 16:04:58, Andy Jacobs 
> posted:
>> 
>> I think they're just Mod 10, or is that ISBN numbers?
> 
> ISBN are not just mod 10; see in <URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/js-
> misc1.htm> and links.

I just remember doing a programming exercise at college about 20 years ago
where we had to write something to validate ISBN numbers and I thought Mod
10 came into it somewhere.

-- 
Andy Jacobs
http://www.redcatmedia.co.uk

On 24 May, 22:04, Andy Jacobs  wrote:

> I think they're just Mod 10, or is that ISBN numbers?

First 4 digits are "well-known" identifiers for banks and card
providers. Checksum is Luhn algorithm, which is a weighted sum.

Offering duff CC numbers to a service, even a service you don't want,
is simple fraud.

Andy Dingley wrote:

> Offering duff CC numbers to a service, even a service you don't want,
> is simple fraud.

On what basis do you deduce that?

Andy Jacobs wrote:
> On Thu, 22 May 2008 21:13:27 +0100, Philip Herlihy wrote:
> 
>> One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If
>> you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting"
>> you to renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to
>> read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just
>> been bereaved, and was taken in.
>>
>> Anyone any experience of what happens next?
>>
>> Phil, London
> 
> I probably get 2 clients a month phoning with exactly the same question.  
> The receive these in the post and it frightens the into thinking they're 
> going to lose their domain name.
> 
> The trouble is, they're not really doing anything wrong.  It's very 
> misleading but legally is probably a hair's breadth from the line between 
> the right and wrong side of the law.  They're also not too bad price wise 
> at $50 for 2 years for a .com.
> 
> Worse than these are the ones that phone and tell you that they have a 
> client that's interested in a domain name that is similar to yours, maybe 
> with hyphens or something, and tell you that they're 'honour bound' to 
> offer it to you first.  I had a client pay £250 EACH for 3.co.uk domains 
> with a credit card from one such call.
> 

In this case they're charging $34 - three times what I charged this 
customer.

I checked with the registration service I use, and the domains are safe 
unless we send back a confirmation.  I've emailed them and told them 
that my customer thought she was renewing the existing arrangement, that 
she does not want to change these arrangements, and that they should 
refund her payment.  You never know.

They probably make a good living out of this.

Phil

"Dave"  wrote in message news:48382538@212.67.96.135...
> Philip Herlihy wrote:
>> One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If you 
>> haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting" you to 
>> renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to read the 
>> letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just been 
>> bereaved, and was taken in.
>>
>> Anyone any experience of what happens next?
>>
>> Phil, London
>
> I've had them. They include an envelope which is not prepaid. I stick it 
> the post box and hope they get it and have to pay for the postage.
>
> Generally my technique with spam that includes a prepaid envelope is to 
> send it back. On one occasion I filled the form in, and did not put a 
> credit credit card number and did not sign it. They then sent it back 
> saying I'd forgot the credit card and to sign it. I then sent it back with 
> the sensible looking credit card number, but again did not sign it. They 
> then sent it back again. Each time they sent it with a prepaid envelope, 
> so it must have cost them money.
>
> Sometimes I send the spam from one company onto another.
>
> Those creeps you are on about dont send prepaid envelopes, but they might 
> well chose to pay the postage.


I hate these scum too. I always post their crap back to them, minus a stamp, 
in the envelope they provide.

I wouldn't dick with them though. If you look at their long legalese, if you 
incur their admin time, the buggers may try and charge you, and for all you 
know the next door business in their rented apartment in "Gloucester Road" 
might be some sabre toothed debt collection agency.

In uk.net.web.authoring message <C45F5F73.11017%nospam@redcatgroup.co.uk
>, Sun, 25 May 2008 18:24:51, Andy Jacobs 
posted:
>On 25/5/08 5:18 pm, in article
>d9wDuKKGFZOIFwb$@invalid.uk.co.demon.merlyn.invalid, "Dr J R Stockton"
> wrote:
>> ISBN are not just mod 10; see in <URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/js-
>> misc1.htm> and links.
>
>I just remember doing a programming exercise at college about 20 years ago
>where we had to write something to validate ISBN numbers and I thought Mod
>10 came into it somewhere.

No; mod 11.  That URL should be to js-misc0.htm.

-- 
 (c) John Stockton, nr London, UK. ?@merlyn.demon.co.uk  Turnpike v6.05  MIME.
 Web  <URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/> - FAQish topics, acronyms, & links.
 Proper <= 4-line sig. separator as above, a line exactly "-- " (SonOfRFC1036)
 Do not Mail News to me. Before a reply, quote with ">" or "> " (SonOfRFC1036)

Dave wrote:
> Philip Herlihy wrote:
>> One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps.  If 
>> you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters "inviting" 
>> you to renew your domain at three times the going rate.  You have to 
>> read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a bill.  She'd just 
>> been bereaved, and was taken in.
>>
>> Anyone any experience of what happens next?
>>
>> Phil, London
> 
> I've had them. They include an envelope which is not prepaid. I stick it 
> the post box and hope they get it and have to pay for the postage.

I also send their envelopes back unstamped, but as an added bonus I 
enclose a - ahem - chit: Run a teaspoon under the tap to wet it and then 
put the back of that spoon into some instant coffee granules, then rub 
this over a sheet or two of toilet tissue. Looks nasty. Perhaps I'll put 
a stamp on the next one just to make sure they open it, but I assume 
their greed ensures they pay for the unstamped ones too.

In article <4845b5a1$0$10635$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk>, treadmill-- with 
the great taste of fish <nope@?.?.invalid> writes
>Dave wrote:
>> Philip Herlihy wrote:
>>> One of my clients has "renewed" two domains through these creeps. If 
>>>you haven't encountered them, they send speculative letters 
>>>"inviting"  you to renew your domain at three times the going rate. 
>>>You have to  read the letter carefully to realise that it isn't a 
>>>bill.  She'd just been bereaved, and was taken in.
>>>
>>> Anyone any experience of what happens next?
>>>
>>> Phil, London
>>  I've had them. They include an envelope which is not prepaid. I 
>>stick it the post box and hope they get it and have to pay for the 
>>postage.
>
>I also send their envelopes back unstamped, but as an added bonus I 
>enclose a - ahem - chit: Run a teaspoon under the tap to wet it and 
>then put the back of that spoon into some instant coffee granules, then 
>rub this over a sheet or two of toilet tissue. Looks nasty. Perhaps 
>I'll put a stamp on the next one just to make sure they open it, but I 
>assume their greed ensures they pay for the unstamped ones too.

My letter from them arrived this morning. What alerted me to check 
online first was the fact that the domain they want me to move isn't 
actually mine - it's a badly misspelled version of one I own.
-- 
congokid
Eating out in London? Read my tips...
http://congokid.com