Posted at 2009-10-09 09:40 BST by RevK
Update #5: 2009-10-09 10:57 BST

  We are planning to make a change to the billing for usage based
  broadband from 1st Jan 2010.
  
  The change is not directly one of price, but a change in the way usage
  is accounted for. This in turn means some more usage and lower prices
  become available to customers on some types of line.
  
  Basically, instead of charging based on gigabytes peak and gigabytes
  off-peak it changes to units. These can then be used during peak and
  off-peak periods at different rates. In essence it means a trade-off
  between the peak and off-peak usage rather than them being separate
  things.
  
  In addition, customers on some types of line will get more usage per
  units during peak (9am-6pm Mon-Fri). For example, customers on 21CN
  lines will get 1½GB per units instead of 1GB. Customers on BE lines
  will get 8GB per unit at peak times. Off-peak usage is 100GB per unit.
  
  We will change over tariffs after the December bills are raised
  allowing people nearly a whole month to pick a different tariff based
  on units rather than GB if they wish in advance. As usual you can
  change tariff any time which takes effect from your next regular bill.
  
  We have a page explaining this
  http://aaisp.net.uk/broadband-prices-ubc.html but will be updating the
  main web site with details when we change over at the start of
  December.
  
  If you do nothing: You get at least as much usage as you have now at
  the same price (apart from VAT based increase). See note on night time
  usage.
  
  Customers on the 1GB basic tariff now will get an extra benefit.
| Currently they get 1GB peak and 50GB off-peak. However the new tariff
| will mean they get 2 units at the same price, which gives 1GB peak and
| 100GB off-peak (or 2GB peak and none off-peak, or 200GB off-peak and
| none peak, etc).
  
  The only downside is that night time usage (2am-6am) will start to
  count a little towards usage at a rate of 1000GB per unit rather than
  being un-metered. Upload will still not count at all.
  
  The change means more flexible usage levels for different times of day,
  and allows us to incorporate the lower bandwidth costs for 21CN which
  come in next year as well as the lower bandwidth costs for BE lines all
  in to a single usage system that covers them all. We believe that it
  will be simpler for most people as there will not longer be the
  peak/off-peak allowance split. This should make the usage statements
  clearer.
  
  We have a number of volunteers for testing the new billing for Nov and
  Dec bills. Thank you for your help.[IMAGE]

URL: http://aaisp.blogspot.com/2009/10/info-new-billing-system-from-jan-2010.html

-- 
AAISP Status Blog
URL:http://aaisp.blogspot.com/

In article <han1fe$oko$1@news.eternal-september.org>, "RevK" wrote:
> 

>   
>   We have a page explaining this
>   http://aaisp.net.uk/broadband-prices-ubc.html but will be updating the
>   main web site with details when we change over at the start of
>   December.
  
Just looked at this and parts are confusing. My non-technical wife 
couldn't explain it to me either :-)  I think it needs a little KISS 
editing...

"The monthly cost depends on the type of line you choose. What types of 
line are available depends on your location. There is a line cost for 
each line (depending on the type), and also a cost for your selected 
tariff level which is a number of units per month (minimum 2 per 
login)."

What's a login?  I have several customers that switch off their 
modem/routers so it does a PPP login each morning.  Does this mean each 
one is charged?  Even worse, Joe User only knows about logging in to his 
computer, so maybe he thinks this is what is being charged. 

How about:

"The monthly tariff has two elements. The first, fixed part is to cover 
what we are charged by BT or Be to provide ADSL on your line and the 
second, variable part to cover the traffic you put on the carrier's 
infrastructure back to us.  This latter amount depends on the carrier, 
the technology they use to carry the traffic and the volume of data you 
put on their network. We measure this traffic and the time of day, 
allocating it to the usage _Baskets_ you have paid for in the tariff you 
have chosen."

I prefer "Basket" or similar to "Unit" since it is unlike the Unit of 
electricity, which has a prior meaning for most users, being a fixed 
amount of energy. 

In the fixed cost list, you should remove the reference to Be lines in 
the BT 21CN line notes. It's irrelevant here.  The notes column needs 
lining up with the the first two columns.

-- 
John W
I you want to mail me, replace the obvious with co.uk twice

On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 23:28:41 +0100, Mark Knight wrote:

>It frankly stinks that as a customer who is stuck on 20CN I've been 
>forced to suffer from a pretty crap service* ever since A&A migrated 
>away from it nice stable Centrals and *now* I'm going to get less for my 
>money than customer who is "lucky" enough to be on 21CN.
>
>Okay, life isn't fair but I now officially feel like a second class 
>citizen.

But you are a second class citizen still being on 20CN. If it's any
consolation we are a dying breed :-)

>Welcome to the A&A postcode lottery!

It's BTs postcode lottery.

>*more packet loss, frequent disconnection and outages due to errors in 
>PPP termination.

The 21CN people are suffering with this too and some of those 'lucky'
people are/were getting slower connections than when they were on 20CN.

-- 
Regards - Rodney Pont
The from address exists but is mostly dumped,
please send any emails to the address below
e-mail	ngpsm4 (at) infohitsystems (dot) ltd (dot) uk

On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 23:28:41 +0100, Mark Knight  wrote:
> 
>  It frankly stinks that as a customer who is stuck on 20CN

I think that's a comment against BT rather than A&A.

>  Welcome to the A&A postcode lottery!

It was a lottery if you were in Kingston Communication's reach and 
could get free (or unmetered) local calls when everyone else was 
paying continuously for their dial-up.

I don't think A&A can do anything about the geographic properties of 
your location - they can't make it nearer to a 21CN exchange just 
because you'd like that any more than they can make it nearer the 
seaside if you want to build sandcastles.

Personally, I prefer schemes where a user pays the costs, rather than 
set A subsidising set B.  I'd rather pay my way than sponge of others 
(or indeed pay for others).  There are clearly exceptions, but I think 
they generally relate to rare and high cost events - so I fully 
support the NHS, and I pay my buildings insurance premiums, and would 
help a neighbour whose house burnt down.

FWIW, I'm still on 20CN, I don't think it sensible to begrudge those 
other A&A subscribers who cost A&A less getting more for their money.  
I suppose there's teh alternative that A&A charge everyone at 20CN 
rate and laugh all the way to the bank.  Is that preferred?

regards,   Ian SMith
-- 
  |\ /|      no .sig
  |o o|
  |/ \|

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 08:12:45 퍍 (UTC), Ian Smith wrote:

> I suppose there's teh alternative that A&A charge everyone at 20CN 
> rate and laugh all the way to the bank.  Is that preferred?

Or A&A look at the costs of 20CN and 21CN usage. Then work out how
much to increase the 21CN and reduce the 20CN so they both pay the
same but raise the enough revenue (plus mark up) as charging each
group at cost plus would.

This removes several lines from the tariff/charging structure making
it simpler:

Tarrif:
BT Line: £10.17  useage credits @ £2.55 each (minimum of 2)
Be Line: £29.??  useage credits @ £2.55 each (minimum of 2)

Usage charges:
BT Line: x/y/z £/GB (peak/off peak/night)
Be Line: x/y/z £/GB (peak/off peak/night)

Of course as BT roll out 21CN end user connections the ratio of those
on 21CN v 20CN will change but that could be taken into account and a
price reduction down to 21CN cost plus made at some point.

It's much simpler to just differentiate between BT/Be, which is also
where the major cost differences are. Bear in mind that there is some
confusion over 21CN and 20CN connections anyway. As I understand it
we are all now connected to A&A at the A&A <> BT end via "21CN" but
many of us are still on "20CN" (ADSL2/ADSL-Max) at our end.

-- 
Cheers
Dave.

Mark Knight wrote:
> In message , Bob Eager 
>  writes
>> But if it weren't so, the 21CN customers would be subsidising you...
> 
> I feel I've been subsidising the 21CN experiment and suffering the 
> consequences without any of the benefits.  There is absolutely nothing 
> in 21CN for me for at least another year and even then there's no 
> guarantee I'll see any improvement to my line speed.
> 
> Like I say, life's not fair but there are better ways to treat loyal 
> customers that destroying their service and then offering them lesser 
> commercial terms.

They are not offering you lesser commercial terms. They are offering you the 
same terms you are getting at the moment (plus the ability to mix and match 
peak and off-peak, which you didn't have before). They are offering the people 
on 21CN better terms because the costs for them to BT are less. I sympathise if 
you can't get onto 21CN yet, but why shouldn't I benefit from the fact I can?

Rodney Pont wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 23:28:41 +0100, Mark Knight wrote:
> 
>> It frankly stinks that as a customer who is stuck on 20CN I've been 
>> forced to suffer from a pretty crap service* ever since A&A migrated 
>> away from it nice stable Centrals and *now* I'm going to get less for my 
>> money than customer who is "lucky" enough to be on 21CN.
>>
>> Okay, life isn't fair but I now officially feel like a second class 
>> citizen.
> 
> But you are a second class citizen still being on 20CN. If it's any
> consolation we are a dying breed :-)
> 
>> Welcome to the A&A postcode lottery!
> 
> It's BTs postcode lottery.
> 
>> *more packet loss, frequent disconnection and outages due to errors in 
>> PPP termination.
> 
> The 21CN people are suffering with this too and some of those 'lucky'
> people are/were getting slower connections than when they were on 20CN.

I'd have to say that lately 21CN has been a lot worse than 20CN, and
people have been pleading to change back to 20CN.

Hopefully BT have gained some clue on this now and things are getting
better. It is looking encouraging.

Rev Adrian Kennard wrote:
> Rodney Pont wrote:
>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 23:28:41 +0100, Mark Knight wrote:
>>
>>> It frankly stinks that as a customer who is stuck on 20CN I've been 
>>> forced to suffer from a pretty crap service* ever since A&A migrated 
>>> away from it nice stable Centrals and *now* I'm going to get less for my 
>>> money than customer who is "lucky" enough to be on 21CN.
>>>
>>> Okay, life isn't fair but I now officially feel like a second class 
>>> citizen.
>> But you are a second class citizen still being on 20CN. If it's any
>> consolation we are a dying breed :-)
>>
>>> Welcome to the A&A postcode lottery!
>> It's BTs postcode lottery.
>>
>>> *more packet loss, frequent disconnection and outages due to errors in 
>>> PPP termination.
>> The 21CN people are suffering with this too and some of those 'lucky'
>> people are/were getting slower connections than when they were on 20CN.
> 
> I'd have to say that lately 21CN has been a lot worse than 20CN, and
> people have been pleading to change back to 20CN.
> 
> Hopefully BT have gained some clue on this now and things are getting
> better. It is looking encouraging.

There is little point in transfering back to 20CN when the BT exchange 
<> A&A bit is 21CN, I'm on 20CN but getting the pain of 21CN without the 
benefits sadly.

Jeff.