I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
price as technology improves etc.

Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
waiting for?

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186144466.999946.94430@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
>
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Hi Ben.
Prices are normaly a function of supply/demand and then market saturation 
rather than cost to produce. At this stage the market is way short of 
saturation and peoples inertia to change from their VCRs makes the demand 
steady but consistant. This is complicated slightly by the VCR market which 
is now way past saturation and into the dumping/give-away phase.

There are ALWAYS upgrades just over the horizon, but you'd wait forever for 
the ultimate machine.If there's one that does what you want now, it makes no 
sense to wait. Having said that sods law seems to dictate that buying 
anything means it will be replaced the following week with a better 
specified cheaper model. (A 4 tuner Toppy with 1 terrabyte HD & built in DVD 
recorder for £200 ;-)

Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec 
and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a 
single owners recomendation for a Humax.

Cheers
    Djimbo
* Life.. don't talk to me about Life! Hate it or ignore it, you can't like 
it *
[Marvin] 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
good arguments for each of them.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On 03/08/2007, Ben Lidgey wrote in message
:
 
> I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
> 
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Well, there have not been any new PVR launches in those six months that
have been widely publicised.  I can't think of any at all: it's still just
TopField and Humax the two biggies, and a few attempts by other companies
lack some of the features of the big two.

You're not going to see substantial movement on prices until the the UK
analogue transmission areas go away.  Although that starts in October, it
won't really get going until next spring.

Simon.
-- 
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Ben

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2cjqs.rmrj67bghyedN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
>> spec
>> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
>> a
>> single owners recomendation for a Humax.
>
> I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
> choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
> good arguments for each of them.

Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully 
suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an 
individuals requirements.
I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more 
money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed 
more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

Djimbo. 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186384401.222428.20750@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
> spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
> a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?


Hiya Ben.
You pays your money, you makes your choice, but  my daughter has another 
adage - Buy cheap, pay twice.
The only way to be sure would be test drive both. If the Humax does what 
you're after I can't see a reason to pay more.
Any newsgroup advice is likely to come from owners of one or the other and 
be more than a little 'coloured' by the normal human inability to accept 
that they may have made an expensive mistake. Or indeed they may genuinely 
be 'in love' with their purchase to the exclusion of all others.
What you could do with, is a genuine assesment of both by someone who owns 
both, and even then his requirements may not be yours.
Let us know how you go on with the Humax.

Djimbo.





-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
 wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

On Aug 6, 8:29 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
> "Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message
>
> news:1186384401.222428.20750@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
> [snip]
>
> > Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the
> > spec
> > and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following
> > a
> > single owners recomendation for a Humax.
>
> The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> (£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
>
> Hiya Ben.
> You pays your money, you makes your choice, but  my daughter has another
> adage - Buy cheap, pay twice.
> The only way to be sure would be test drive both. If the Humax does what
> you're after I can't see a reason to pay more.
> Any newsgroup advice is likely to come from owners of one or the other and
> be more than a little 'coloured' by the normal human inability to accept
> that they may have made an expensive mistake. Or indeed they may genuinely
> be 'in love' with their purchase to the exclusion of all others.
> What you could do with, is a genuine assesment of both by someone who owns
> both, and even then his requirements may not be yours.
> Let us know how you go on with the Humax.
>
> Djimbo.
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com

Nice assumption re Humax :-)

It is a shame you cannot rent them for a bit to see which one is a
better fit. Or even go and play with them in a shop somewhere. I've
seen the Humax in somewhere like Comet, but not seen a Toppy in the
flesh.

Ben

djimbo  wrote:


> Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully
> suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an
> individuals requirements.
> I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more
> money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
> The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed
> more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

I reckon these two are specialist items. That is, if one has (or wants)
Sky televison, then Sky+ is an obvious choice, while it is pointless
without Sky TV (or amy I wrong in this). And while the Tivo seems
excellent, is it even on the British market at present?

Of course there are other machines, some of them much cheaper, but in
terms of reliability and functions, Topfield and Humax are leaders.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

Andrew  wrote:

> On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
>  wrote:
> 
> >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> 
> Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.

You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
not, that could be an issue.

And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
possible issue.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 21:44:02 +0100, danspam@f2s.com (Daniel Cohen)
wrote:

>You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
>installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
>what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
>not, that could be an issue.

I am a Windows user so haven't really looked into what other platforms
it supports. www.toppy.org.uk will have an answer to your questions.

>And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
>that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
>possible issue.

John Lewis stock the Toppy.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186406172.300089.268850@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 6, 8:29 am, "djimbo"  wrote:

It is a shame you cannot rent them for a bit to see which one is a
better fit. Or even go and play with them in a shop somewhere. I've
seen the Humax in somewhere like Comet, but not seen a Toppy in the
flesh.

Yep, funny thing is Currys have the Toppy on their website, but as yet only 
appear to have the Humax in their stores (around here anyway).
Comet here only have the Humax but seem to want to charge more for it than 
everyone else is charging.
It's still a developing market.
I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic 
functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a 
removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
That's NostroJimuses prediction for the next Toppy ;-)

Djimbo. 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic
> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a
> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).

Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.

And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
separate hard drive.

Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
tuners.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 Ben Lidgey wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

I've mentioned this before, I think, but having borrowed a friend's 
Humax then subsequently bought my own Topfield I have to admit that the 
Humax user interface is much clearer and user friendly than the default 
Topfield interface.

On the other hand, if you take time to install the MyStuff UI 
replacement on the Topfield -- a relatively painless experience if you 
have access to a PC with USB and an internet connection -- then it blows 
everything else away. Even the TiVo UI isn't as pretty or functional as 
MyStuff (although obviously the TiVo does have some features that the 
Topfield/MyStuff combination can't emulate).

If you never, ever intend to play around with alternative UIs or other 
enhancements, go for the Humax. For general use it's fine right out of 
the box. If you want something with a few more bells and whistles, and 
you can afford the extra, go for the Topfield.

-- 
Kev
__________________________________________________________________________
   "One word sums up probably the responsibility of any Vice President, and
    that one word is 'to be prepared'."                          Dan Quayle

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same 
>> basic
>> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes 
>> to a
>> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
>
> Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
> drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.
Duh(!)


> And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> separate hard drive.
Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like 
lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying 
a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd 
film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)
This will happen as soon as the need is appreciated... just look at the 
proliferation of VHS/DVD recorders that have hit the market since granny 
expressed a wish to xfer her old VHS vids to DVD.



> Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> tuners.
I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
Djimbo.



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> "Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
> news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...

> 
> 
> > And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> > separate hard drive.
> Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like
> lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
> I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying
> a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
> Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd
> film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)

If it's just the "odd" film, rather than lots of programmes, the hard
drive PVRs would be fine. Say, around twenty or thirty stored films and
still space for time shifting another forty hours of TV. 
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> > tuners.
> I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
> Djimbo.

Well, if you prefer the wording, there are no PVRs with two tuners, a
hard drive, and the ability to record to DVD.

With one tuner there are several options, and it doens't really matter
whether you call them PVRs or DVD recorders.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On 06/08/2007, Daniel Cohen wrote in message
<1i2fp4e.1hlizlb1vrd8dhN%danspam@f2s.com>:
 
> Andrew  wrote:
> 
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> > >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> > >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> > >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> > 
> > Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> > you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> > like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
> 
> You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
> installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax

Or it might be true that the Toppy is better value than the Humax without
any add-ons.  I have used both, but bought the Toppy.  I don't use any
TAPs on it and it suits me just fine.

> (which is
> what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
> not, that could be an issue.

Mac yes.  I don't know if there are Linux equivalents but you can install
TAPs, update the firmware, and move video files onto and off of the box
with a Mac.  You can even get a Mac application which will convert
QuickTime files into and out of the Topfield format, so you can record
something off of the TV then view it in QuickTime on your computer.

> And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
> that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
> possible issue.

There are plenty of shops that stock the Topfield including Currys and
Euronics stockists (the majority of high-street TV shops).  For details see

<http://www.toppy.org.uk/shops.php>

and pick your area from the popup menu.

Simon.
-- 
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2j239.1se0ihy1ja8y23N%danspam@f2s.com...

> If it's just the "odd" film, rather than lots of programmes, the hard
> drive PVRs would be fine. Say, around twenty or thirty stored films and
> still space for time shifting another forty hours of TV.

Yeh you'r probably right, they already have a mass market appeal. hell what 
do I know.



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186144466.999946.94430@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
>
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Hi Ben.
Prices are normaly a function of supply/demand and then market saturation 
rather than cost to produce. At this stage the market is way short of 
saturation and peoples inertia to change from their VCRs makes the demand 
steady but consistant. This is complicated slightly by the VCR market which 
is now way past saturation and into the dumping/give-away phase.

There are ALWAYS upgrades just over the horizon, but you'd wait forever for 
the ultimate machine.If there's one that does what you want now, it makes no 
sense to wait. Having said that sods law seems to dictate that buying 
anything means it will be replaced the following week with a better 
specified cheaper model. (A 4 tuner Toppy with 1 terrabyte HD & built in DVD 
recorder for £200 ;-)

Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec 
and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a 
single owners recomendation for a Humax.

Cheers
    Djimbo
* Life.. don't talk to me about Life! Hate it or ignore it, you can't like 
it *
[Marvin] 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
good arguments for each of them.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On 03/08/2007, Ben Lidgey wrote in message
:
 
> I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
> 
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Well, there have not been any new PVR launches in those six months that
have been widely publicised.  I can't think of any at all: it's still just
TopField and Humax the two biggies, and a few attempts by other companies
lack some of the features of the big two.

You're not going to see substantial movement on prices until the the UK
analogue transmission areas go away.  Although that starts in October, it
won't really get going until next spring.

Simon.
-- 
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Ben

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2cjqs.rmrj67bghyedN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
>> spec
>> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
>> a
>> single owners recomendation for a Humax.
>
> I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
> choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
> good arguments for each of them.

Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully 
suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an 
individuals requirements.
I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more 
money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed 
more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

Djimbo. 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186384401.222428.20750@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
> spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
> a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?


Hiya Ben.
You pays your money, you makes your choice, but  my daughter has another 
adage - Buy cheap, pay twice.
The only way to be sure would be test drive both. If the Humax does what 
you're after I can't see a reason to pay more.
Any newsgroup advice is likely to come from owners of one or the other and 
be more than a little 'coloured' by the normal human inability to accept 
that they may have made an expensive mistake. Or indeed they may genuinely 
be 'in love' with their purchase to the exclusion of all others.
What you could do with, is a genuine assesment of both by someone who owns 
both, and even then his requirements may not be yours.
Let us know how you go on with the Humax.

Djimbo.





-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
 wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

djimbo  wrote:


> Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully
> suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an
> individuals requirements.
> I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more
> money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
> The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed
> more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

I reckon these two are specialist items. That is, if one has (or wants)
Sky televison, then Sky+ is an obvious choice, while it is pointless
without Sky TV (or amy I wrong in this). And while the Tivo seems
excellent, is it even on the British market at present?

Of course there are other machines, some of them much cheaper, but in
terms of reliability and functions, Topfield and Humax are leaders.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

Andrew  wrote:

> On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
>  wrote:
> 
> >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> 
> Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.

You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
not, that could be an issue.

And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
possible issue.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 21:44:02 +0100, danspam@f2s.com (Daniel Cohen)
wrote:

>You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
>installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
>what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
>not, that could be an issue.

I am a Windows user so haven't really looked into what other platforms
it supports. www.toppy.org.uk will have an answer to your questions.

>And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
>that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
>possible issue.

John Lewis stock the Toppy.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
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"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186406172.300089.268850@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 6, 8:29 am, "djimbo"  wrote:

It is a shame you cannot rent them for a bit to see which one is a
better fit. Or even go and play with them in a shop somewhere. I've
seen the Humax in somewhere like Comet, but not seen a Toppy in the
flesh.

Yep, funny thing is Currys have the Toppy on their website, but as yet only 
appear to have the Humax in their stores (around here anyway).
Comet here only have the Humax but seem to want to charge more for it than 
everyone else is charging.
It's still a developing market.
I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic 
functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a 
removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
That's NostroJimuses prediction for the next Toppy ;-)

Djimbo. 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic
> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a
> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).

Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.

And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
separate hard drive.

Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
tuners.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 Ben Lidgey wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

I've mentioned this before, I think, but having borrowed a friend's 
Humax then subsequently bought my own Topfield I have to admit that the 
Humax user interface is much clearer and user friendly than the default 
Topfield interface.

On the other hand, if you take time to install the MyStuff UI 
replacement on the Topfield -- a relatively painless experience if you 
have access to a PC with USB and an internet connection -- then it blows 
everything else away. Even the TiVo UI isn't as pretty or functional as 
MyStuff (although obviously the TiVo does have some features that the 
Topfield/MyStuff combination can't emulate).

If you never, ever intend to play around with alternative UIs or other 
enhancements, go for the Humax. For general use it's fine right out of 
the box. If you want something with a few more bells and whistles, and 
you can afford the extra, go for the Topfield.

-- 
Kev
__________________________________________________________________________
   "One word sums up probably the responsibility of any Vice President, and
    that one word is 'to be prepared'."                          Dan Quayle

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same 
>> basic
>> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes 
>> to a
>> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
>
> Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
> drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.
Duh(!)


> And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> separate hard drive.
Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like 
lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying 
a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd 
film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)
This will happen as soon as the need is appreciated... just look at the 
proliferation of VHS/DVD recorders that have hit the market since granny 
expressed a wish to xfer her old VHS vids to DVD.



> Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> tuners.
I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
Djimbo.



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> "Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
> news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...

> 
> 
> > And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> > separate hard drive.
> Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like
> lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
> I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying
> a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
> Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd
> film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)

If it's just the "odd" film, rather than lots of programmes, the hard
drive PVRs would be fine. Say, around twenty or thirty stored films and
still space for time shifting another forty hours of TV. 
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> > tuners.
> I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
> Djimbo.

Well, if you prefer the wording, there are no PVRs with two tuners, a
hard drive, and the ability to record to DVD.

With one tuner there are several options, and it doens't really matter
whether you call them PVRs or DVD recorders.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On 06/08/2007, Daniel Cohen wrote in message
<1i2fp4e.1hlizlb1vrd8dhN%danspam@f2s.com>:
 
> Andrew  wrote:
> 
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> > >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> > >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> > >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> > 
> > Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> > you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> > like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
> 
> You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
> installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax

Or it might be true that the Toppy is better value than the Humax without
any add-ons.  I have used both, but bought the Toppy.  I don't use any
TAPs on it and it suits me just fine.

> (which is
> what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
> not, that could be an issue.

Mac yes.  I don't know if there are Linux equivalents but you can install
TAPs, update the firmware, and move video files onto and off of the box
with a Mac.  You can even get a Mac application which will convert
QuickTime files into and out of the Topfield format, so you can record
something off of the TV then view it in QuickTime on your computer.

> And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
> that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
> possible issue.

There are plenty of shops that stock the Topfield including Currys and
Euronics stockists (the majority of high-street TV shops).  For details see

<http://www.toppy.org.uk/shops.php>

and pick your area from the popup menu.

Simon.
-- 
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2j239.1se0ihy1ja8y23N%danspam@f2s.com...

> If it's just the "odd" film, rather than lots of programmes, the hard
> drive PVRs would be fine. Say, around twenty or thirty stored films and
> still space for time shifting another forty hours of TV.

Yeh you'r probably right, they already have a mass market appeal. hell what 
do I know.



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186144466.999946.94430@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
>
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Hi Ben.
Prices are normaly a function of supply/demand and then market saturation 
rather than cost to produce. At this stage the market is way short of 
saturation and peoples inertia to change from their VCRs makes the demand 
steady but consistant. This is complicated slightly by the VCR market which 
is now way past saturation and into the dumping/give-away phase.

There are ALWAYS upgrades just over the horizon, but you'd wait forever for 
the ultimate machine.If there's one that does what you want now, it makes no 
sense to wait. Having said that sods law seems to dictate that buying 
anything means it will be replaced the following week with a better 
specified cheaper model. (A 4 tuner Toppy with 1 terrabyte HD & built in DVD 
recorder for £200 ;-)

Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec 
and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a 
single owners recomendation for a Humax.

Cheers
    Djimbo
* Life.. don't talk to me about Life! Hate it or ignore it, you can't like 
it *
[Marvin] 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
good arguments for each of them.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On 03/08/2007, Ben Lidgey wrote in message
:
 
> I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
> 
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Well, there have not been any new PVR launches in those six months that
have been widely publicised.  I can't think of any at all: it's still just
TopField and Humax the two biggies, and a few attempts by other companies
lack some of the features of the big two.

You're not going to see substantial movement on prices until the the UK
analogue transmission areas go away.  Although that starts in October, it
won't really get going until next spring.

Simon.
-- 
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Ben

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2cjqs.rmrj67bghyedN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
>> spec
>> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
>> a
>> single owners recomendation for a Humax.
>
> I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
> choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
> good arguments for each of them.

Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully 
suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an 
individuals requirements.
I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more 
money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed 
more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

Djimbo. 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186384401.222428.20750@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
> spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
> a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?


Hiya Ben.
You pays your money, you makes your choice, but  my daughter has another 
adage - Buy cheap, pay twice.
The only way to be sure would be test drive both. If the Humax does what 
you're after I can't see a reason to pay more.
Any newsgroup advice is likely to come from owners of one or the other and 
be more than a little 'coloured' by the normal human inability to accept 
that they may have made an expensive mistake. Or indeed they may genuinely 
be 'in love' with their purchase to the exclusion of all others.
What you could do with, is a genuine assesment of both by someone who owns 
both, and even then his requirements may not be yours.
Let us know how you go on with the Humax.

Djimbo.





-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
 wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

On Aug 6, 8:29 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
> "Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message
>
> news:1186384401.222428.20750@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
> [snip]
>
> > Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the
> > spec
> > and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following
> > a
> > single owners recomendation for a Humax.
>
> The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> (£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
>
> Hiya Ben.
> You pays your money, you makes your choice, but  my daughter has another
> adage - Buy cheap, pay twice.
> The only way to be sure would be test drive both. If the Humax does what
> you're after I can't see a reason to pay more.
> Any newsgroup advice is likely to come from owners of one or the other and
> be more than a little 'coloured' by the normal human inability to accept
> that they may have made an expensive mistake. Or indeed they may genuinely
> be 'in love' with their purchase to the exclusion of all others.
> What you could do with, is a genuine assesment of both by someone who owns
> both, and even then his requirements may not be yours.
> Let us know how you go on with the Humax.
>
> Djimbo.
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com

Nice assumption re Humax :-)

It is a shame you cannot rent them for a bit to see which one is a
better fit. Or even go and play with them in a shop somewhere. I've
seen the Humax in somewhere like Comet, but not seen a Toppy in the
flesh.

Ben

djimbo  wrote:


> Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully
> suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an
> individuals requirements.
> I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more
> money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
> The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed
> more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

I reckon these two are specialist items. That is, if one has (or wants)
Sky televison, then Sky+ is an obvious choice, while it is pointless
without Sky TV (or amy I wrong in this). And while the Tivo seems
excellent, is it even on the British market at present?

Of course there are other machines, some of them much cheaper, but in
terms of reliability and functions, Topfield and Humax are leaders.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

Andrew  wrote:

> On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
>  wrote:
> 
> >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> 
> Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.

You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
not, that could be an issue.

And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
possible issue.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 21:44:02 +0100, danspam@f2s.com (Daniel Cohen)
wrote:

>You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
>installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
>what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
>not, that could be an issue.

I am a Windows user so haven't really looked into what other platforms
it supports. www.toppy.org.uk will have an answer to your questions.

>And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
>that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
>possible issue.

John Lewis stock the Toppy.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186406172.300089.268850@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 6, 8:29 am, "djimbo"  wrote:

It is a shame you cannot rent them for a bit to see which one is a
better fit. Or even go and play with them in a shop somewhere. I've
seen the Humax in somewhere like Comet, but not seen a Toppy in the
flesh.

Yep, funny thing is Currys have the Toppy on their website, but as yet only 
appear to have the Humax in their stores (around here anyway).
Comet here only have the Humax but seem to want to charge more for it than 
everyone else is charging.
It's still a developing market.
I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic 
functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a 
removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
That's NostroJimuses prediction for the next Toppy ;-)

Djimbo. 



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic
> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a
> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).

Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.

And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
separate hard drive.

Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
tuners.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 Ben Lidgey wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

I've mentioned this before, I think, but having borrowed a friend's 
Humax then subsequently bought my own Topfield I have to admit that the 
Humax user interface is much clearer and user friendly than the default 
Topfield interface.

On the other hand, if you take time to install the MyStuff UI 
replacement on the Topfield -- a relatively painless experience if you 
have access to a PC with USB and an internet connection -- then it blows 
everything else away. Even the TiVo UI isn't as pretty or functional as 
MyStuff (although obviously the TiVo does have some features that the 
Topfield/MyStuff combination can't emulate).

If you never, ever intend to play around with alternative UIs or other 
enhancements, go for the Humax. For general use it's fine right out of 
the box. If you want something with a few more bells and whistles, and 
you can afford the extra, go for the Topfield.

-- 
Kev
__________________________________________________________________________
   "One word sums up probably the responsibility of any Vice President, and
    that one word is 'to be prepared'."                          Dan Quayle

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same 
>> basic
>> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes 
>> to a
>> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
>
> Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
> drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.
Duh(!)


> And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> separate hard drive.
Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like 
lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying 
a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd 
film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)
This will happen as soon as the need is appreciated... just look at the 
proliferation of VHS/DVD recorders that have hit the market since granny 
expressed a wish to xfer her old VHS vids to DVD.



> Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> tuners.
I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
Djimbo.



-- 
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

djimbo  wrote:

> "Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
> news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...

> 
> 
> > And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> > separate hard drive.
> Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like
> lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
> I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying
> a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
> Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd
> film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)

If it's just the "odd" film, rather than lots of programmes, the hard
drive PVRs would be fine. Say, around twenty or thirty stored films and
still space for time shifting another forty hours of TV. 
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> > tuners.
> I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
> Djimbo.

Well, if you prefer the wording, there are no PVRs with two tuners, a
hard drive, and the ability to record to DVD.

With one tuner there are several options, and it doens't really matter
whether you call them PVRs or DVD recorders.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
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On 06/08/2007, Daniel Cohen wrote in message
<1i2fp4e.1hlizlb1vrd8dhN%danspam@f2s.com>:
 
> Andrew  wrote:
> 
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> > >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> > >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> > >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> > 
> > Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> > you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> > like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
> 
> You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
> installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax

Or it might be true that the Toppy is better value than the Humax without
any add-ons.  I have used both, but bought the Toppy.  I don't use any
TAPs on it and it suits me just fine.

> (which is
> what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
> not, that could be an issue.

Mac yes.  I don't know if there are Linux equivalents but you can install
TAPs, update the firmware, and move video files onto and off of the box
with a Mac.  You can even get a Mac application which will convert
QuickTime files into and out of the Topfield format, so you can record
something off of the TV then view it in QuickTime on your computer.

> And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
> that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
> possible issue.

There are plenty of shops that stock the Topfield including Currys and
Euronics stockists (the majority of high-street TV shops).  For details see

<http://www.toppy.org.uk/shops.php>

and pick your area from the popup menu.

Simon.
-- 
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2j239.1se0ihy1ja8y23N%danspam@f2s.com...

> If it's just the "odd" film, rather than lots of programmes, the hard
> drive PVRs would be fine. Say, around twenty or thirty stored films and
> still space for time shifting another forty hours of TV.

Yeh you'r probably right, they already have a mass market appeal. hell what 
do I know.



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"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186144466.999946.94430@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
>
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Hi Ben.
Prices are normaly a function of supply/demand and then market saturation 
rather than cost to produce. At this stage the market is way short of 
saturation and peoples inertia to change from their VCRs makes the demand 
steady but consistant. This is complicated slightly by the VCR market which 
is now way past saturation and into the dumping/give-away phase.

There are ALWAYS upgrades just over the horizon, but you'd wait forever for 
the ultimate machine.If there's one that does what you want now, it makes no 
sense to wait. Having said that sods law seems to dictate that buying 
anything means it will be replaced the following week with a better 
specified cheaper model. (A 4 tuner Toppy with 1 terrabyte HD & built in DVD 
recorder for £200 ;-)

Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec 
and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a 
single owners recomendation for a Humax.

Cheers
    Djimbo
* Life.. don't talk to me about Life! Hate it or ignore it, you can't like 
it *
[Marvin] 



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djimbo  wrote:

> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
good arguments for each of them.
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On 03/08/2007, Ben Lidgey wrote in message
:
 
> I looked around at PVRs, and was recommended the Humax 9200T by a
> friend, about 6 months ago. I never got one but am looking again and
> am surprised that prices are the same. I was expecting a drop in the
> price as technology improves etc.
> 
> Can anyone think of a reason why PVRs are not coming down in price? I
> guess that there are no real upgrades coming along that makes it worth
> waiting for?

Well, there have not been any new PVR launches in those six months that
have been widely publicised.  I can't think of any at all: it's still just
TopField and Humax the two biggies, and a few attempts by other companies
lack some of the features of the big two.

You're not going to see substantial movement on prices until the the UK
analogue transmission areas go away.  Although that starts in October, it
won't really get going until next spring.

Simon.
-- 
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Ben

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2cjqs.rmrj67bghyedN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
>> spec
>> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
>> a
>> single owners recomendation for a Humax.
>
> I doubt if one needs to bother about "other PVRs". I reckon it's a
> choice between Humax and Topfield (I have a Humax myself), and there are
> good arguments for each of them.

Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully 
suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an 
individuals requirements.
I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more 
money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed 
more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

Djimbo. 



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"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186384401.222428.20750@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
[snip]
> Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the 
> spec
> and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following 
> a
> single owners recomendation for a Humax.

The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?


Hiya Ben.
You pays your money, you makes your choice, but  my daughter has another 
adage - Buy cheap, pay twice.
The only way to be sure would be test drive both. If the Humax does what 
you're after I can't see a reason to pay more.
Any newsgroup advice is likely to come from owners of one or the other and 
be more than a little 'coloured' by the normal human inability to accept 
that they may have made an expensive mistake. Or indeed they may genuinely 
be 'in love' with their purchase to the exclusion of all others.
What you could do with, is a genuine assesment of both by someone who owns 
both, and even then his requirements may not be yours.
Let us know how you go on with the Humax.

Djimbo.





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On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
 wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

On Aug 6, 8:29 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
> "Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message
>
> news:1186384401.222428.20750@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 4, 8:30 am, "djimbo"  wrote:
> [snip]
>
> > Oh and I know I'm not your friend, but I would suggest checking out the
> > spec
> > and net reviews on the Toppy and other PVRs rather than blindly following
> > a
> > single owners recomendation for a Humax.
>
> The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> (£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
>
> Hiya Ben.
> You pays your money, you makes your choice, but  my daughter has another
> adage - Buy cheap, pay twice.
> The only way to be sure would be test drive both. If the Humax does what
> you're after I can't see a reason to pay more.
> Any newsgroup advice is likely to come from owners of one or the other and
> be more than a little 'coloured' by the normal human inability to accept
> that they may have made an expensive mistake. Or indeed they may genuinely
> be 'in love' with their purchase to the exclusion of all others.
> What you could do with, is a genuine assesment of both by someone who owns
> both, and even then his requirements may not be yours.
> Let us know how you go on with the Humax.
>
> Djimbo.
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com

Nice assumption re Humax :-)

It is a shame you cannot rent them for a bit to see which one is a
better fit. Or even go and play with them in a shop somewhere. I've
seen the Humax in somewhere like Comet, but not seen a Toppy in the
flesh.

Ben

djimbo  wrote:


> Although I don't have your insight into the market, I would respectfully
> suggest that other PVRs are available, one of which may be suitable to an
> individuals requirements.
> I seem to recall SKY+ being a fairly popular choice amongst those with more
> money than sense, and Tivos still being held in high regard by their owners.
> The last call I had to a home with a Tivo & a Humax, the owner expressed
> more than a mild dislike for the Humax compared to his Tivo.

I reckon these two are specialist items. That is, if one has (or wants)
Sky televison, then Sky+ is an obvious choice, while it is pointless
without Sky TV (or amy I wrong in this). And while the Tivo seems
excellent, is it even on the British market at present?

Of course there are other machines, some of them much cheaper, but in
terms of reliability and functions, Topfield and Humax are leaders.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

Andrew  wrote:

> On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:13:21 -0000, Ben Lidgey
>  wrote:
> 
> >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> 
> Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.

You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
not, that could be an issue.

And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
possible issue.
-- 
http://www.decohen.com
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 21:44:02 +0100, danspam@f2s.com (Daniel Cohen)
wrote:

>You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
>installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax (which is
>what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
>not, that could be an issue.

I am a Windows user so haven't really looked into what other platforms
it supports. www.toppy.org.uk will have an answer to your questions.

>And, depending on where one lives, the Humax is available in shops. Is
>that true of the Toppy, or does it have to be ordered online? Again, a
>possible issue.

John Lewis stock the Toppy.
-- 
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

"Ben Lidgey"  wrote in message 
news:1186406172.300089.268850@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 6, 8:29 am, "djimbo"  wrote:

It is a shame you cannot rent them for a bit to see which one is a
better fit. Or even go and play with them in a shop somewhere. I've
seen the Humax in somewhere like Comet, but not seen a Toppy in the
flesh.

Yep, funny thing is Currys have the Toppy on their website, but as yet only 
appear to have the Humax in their stores (around here anyway).
Comet here only have the Humax but seem to want to charge more for it than 
everyone else is charging.
It's still a developing market.
I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic 
functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a 
removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
That's NostroJimuses prediction for the next Toppy ;-)

Djimbo. 



-- 
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djimbo  wrote:

> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same basic
> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes to a
> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).

Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.

And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
separate hard drive.

Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
tuners.
-- 
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Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read

On Mon, 6 Aug 2007 Ben Lidgey wrote:

>The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
>(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
>for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
>can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?

I've mentioned this before, I think, but having borrowed a friend's 
Humax then subsequently bought my own Topfield I have to admit that the 
Humax user interface is much clearer and user friendly than the default 
Topfield interface.

On the other hand, if you take time to install the MyStuff UI 
replacement on the Topfield -- a relatively painless experience if you 
have access to a PC with USB and an internet connection -- then it blows 
everything else away. Even the TiVo UI isn't as pretty or functional as 
MyStuff (although obviously the TiVo does have some features that the 
Topfield/MyStuff combination can't emulate).

If you never, ever intend to play around with alternative UIs or other 
enhancements, go for the Humax. For general use it's fine right out of 
the box. If you want something with a few more bells and whistles, and 
you can afford the extra, go for the Topfield.

-- 
Kev
__________________________________________________________________________
   "One word sums up probably the responsibility of any Vice President, and
    that one word is 'to be prepared'."                          Dan Quayle

"Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...
> djimbo  wrote:
>
>> I'm still not entirely sure they'll take off until they have the same 
>> basic
>> functionality as a VCR, that is the ability to store/archive programmes 
>> to a
>> removable media (A built in DVD recorder).
>
> Well, of course, both the Humax and Topfiled (and others) have hard
> drives, which can hold eighty hours or so of programmes.
Duh(!)


> And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> separate hard drive.
Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like 
lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying 
a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd 
film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)
This will happen as soon as the need is appreciated... just look at the 
proliferation of VHS/DVD recorders that have hit the market since granny 
expressed a wish to xfer her old VHS vids to DVD.



> Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> tuners.
I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
Djimbo.



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djimbo  wrote:

> "Daniel Cohen"  wrote in message 
> news:1i2hiyn.w3u1uam97qvcN%danspam@f2s.com...

> 
> 
> > And then, though it can be a hassle, the files can be moved to a
> > separate hard drive.
> Yes there's the word 'hassle' including all kinds of unforseen pitfalls like
> lipsync. Joe average or Granny want to press one button.
> I was talking of mass market appeal, not techno-nurd country where applying
> a TAP via a USB port is considered child's play.
> Granny and the vast majority out there want the ability to store the odd
> film for future viewing (even though it's technically illegal.)

If it's just the "odd" film, rather than lots of programmes, the hard
drive PVRs would be fine. Say, around twenty or thirty stored films and
still space for time shifting another forty hours of TV. 
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately, there are no DVD recorders with hard drive and *two*
> > tuners.
> I thought we were on PVRs ;-)
> Djimbo.

Well, if you prefer the wording, there are no PVRs with two tuners, a
hard drive, and the ability to record to DVD.

With one tuner there are several options, and it doens't really matter
whether you call them PVRs or DVD recorders.
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Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
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On 06/08/2007, Daniel Cohen wrote in message
<1i2fp4e.1hlizlb1vrd8dhN%danspam@f2s.com>:
 
> Andrew  wrote:
> 
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > >The thing with the Toppy is that it is more expensive than the Humax
> > >(£225-250 for a Toppy vs £180 for a Humax). And while the Toppy allows
> > >for additions, I doubt I have the time to play about with them, so I
> > >can't see any other features worth the extra. Have I missed anything?
> > 
> > Half an hour to install and configure Jags EPG on the Toppy will save
> > you hours in the long run as it will program itself for the series you
> > like. The extra spent on a Toppy is easily worth it.
> 
> You may well be right that the possibility of even just a few auickly
> installed add-ons makes the Toppy better value than the Humax

Or it might be true that the Toppy is better value than the Humax without
any add-ons.  I have used both, but bought the Toppy.  I don't use any
TAPs on it and it suits me just fine.

> (which is
> what I have). Can the add-ons be installed from a Mac or a Linux box? If
> not, that could be an issue.

Mac yes.  I don't know if there are Linux equivalents but you can install
TAPs, update the firmware, and move video files onto and off of the box
with a Mac.  You can even get a Mac application which will convert
QuickTime files into and out of the Topfield format, so you can record
something off of the TV then view it in QuickTime on your computer.

> And, depending on wh