I understood that the SkyHD test card might be available on channel
268 after closedown but it seems not to be so, and that it might
appear on Anytime. No such luck it seems....does anyone know if it is
available?

Thanks for any info.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2007 11:42:29 +0000, bressound@btinternet.com wrote:

>I understood that the SkyHD test card might be available on channel
>268 after closedown but it seems not to be so, and that it might
>appear on Anytime. No such luck it seems....does anyone know if it is
>available?
>
>Thanks for any info.

If you've got an Xbox 360 or something which you can plug into your HD
TV to get a proper HD image then here's the 1080 SkyHD test card:

<http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2145538857/> <-- Go to "all
sizes" at the top then 'original'

Alternative test card:
<http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2146331038/> <-- This works
better for checking detail, in my humble opinion - a 1038 lines tall
Tube Map!
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bressound@btinternet.com wrote:
> I understood that the SkyHD test card might be available on channel
> 268 after closedown but it seems not to be so, and that it might
> appear on Anytime. No such luck it seems....does anyone know if it is
> available?
> 
> Thanks for any info.
Seem to remember that it is only broadcast on Saturdays

In , BGN
 wrote:

>If you've got an Xbox 360 or something which you can plug into your HD
>TV to get a proper HD image then here's the 1080 SkyHD test card:
>
><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2145538857/> <-- Go to "all
>sizes" at the top then 'original'

That's a great idea to capture the original, but I'm surprised that you
used lossy JPEG compression on it. It sortof defeats the point a bit when
you introduce JPEG artefacts onto a test image! For example the thinnest
(2 pixel wide) vertical lines have been mashed into two different shades
of dark grey spaced apart by two shades of white. :-(

>Alternative test card:
><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2146331038/> <-- This works
>better for checking detail, in my humble opinion - a 1038 lines tall
>Tube Map!

Again very nice, but not as nice as a PNG would have been for testing a
display. Do you still have access to the original (before JPEG was used)
images? If so you could save as PNGs (lossless compression) for the full
quality.

On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 11:37:56 +0000, Mike Henry
<{$mrtickle$}@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>>If you've got an Xbox 360 or something which you can plug into your HD
>>TV to get a proper HD image then here's the 1080 SkyHD test card:
>>
>><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2145538857/> <-- Go to "all
>>sizes" at the top then 'original'
>
>That's a great idea to capture the original, but I'm surprised that you
>used lossy JPEG compression on it. It sortof defeats the point a bit when
>you introduce JPEG artefacts onto a test image! For example the thinnest
>(2 pixel wide) vertical lines have been mashed into two different shades
>of dark grey spaced apart by two shades of white. :-(

I think you can safely blame that on the original MPEG compression it
was broadcast in!

>>Alternative test card:
>><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2146331038/> <-- This works
>>better for checking detail, in my humble opinion - a 1038 lines tall
>>Tube Map!
>
>Again very nice, but not as nice as a PNG would have been for testing a
>display. Do you still have access to the original (before JPEG was used)
>images? If so you could save as PNGs (lossless compression) for the full
>quality.

Do a standard search for a tube map on google images.
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In , BGN
 wrote:

>On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 11:37:56 +0000, Mike Henry
><{$mrtickle$}@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>>If you've got an Xbox 360 or something which you can plug into your HD
>>>TV to get a proper HD image then here's the 1080 SkyHD test card:
>>>
>>><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2145538857/> <-- Go to "all
>>>sizes" at the top then 'original'
>>
>>That's a great idea to capture the original, but I'm surprised that you
>>used lossy JPEG compression on it. It sortof defeats the point a bit when
>>you introduce JPEG artefacts onto a test image! For example the thinnest
>>(2 pixel wide) vertical lines have been mashed into two different shades
>>of dark grey spaced apart by two shades of white. :-(
>
>I think you can safely blame that on the original MPEG compression it
>was broadcast in!

Not necessarily. It could have (and should have, being a testcard!) been
broadcast as a still I-frame - ie the full resolution image with no lossy
compression. 

Either way, you degraded it (further?) by saving as a jpeg :-(

"Mike Henry" <{$mrtickle$}@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
news:r2bgn3p8gf89u9nai6juajv0mn3bel42pi@4ax.com...
> In , BGN
>  wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 11:37:56 +0000, Mike Henry
>><{$mrtickle$}@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>>If you've got an Xbox 360 or something which you can plug into your HD
>>>>TV to get a proper HD image then here's the 1080 SkyHD test card:
>>>>
>>>><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2145538857/> <-- Go to "all
>>>>sizes" at the top then 'original'
>>>
>>>That's a great idea to capture the original, but I'm surprised that you
>>>used lossy JPEG compression on it. It sortof defeats the point a bit when
>>>you introduce JPEG artefacts onto a test image! For example the thinnest
>>>(2 pixel wide) vertical lines have been mashed into two different shades
>>>of dark grey spaced apart by two shades of white. :-(
>>
>>I think you can safely blame that on the original MPEG compression it
>>was broadcast in!
>
> Not necessarily. It could have (and should have, being a testcard!) been
> broadcast as a still I-frame - ie the full resolution image with no lossy
> compression.
>
> Either way, you degraded it (further?) by saving as a jpeg :-(

Could that be because AFAICS it is not a testcard at all,
as you or I would define it? Rather just a tutorial for the hoi polloi.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yatMoXGPm5o

-- 
Graham

%Profound_observation%

On Sun, 30 Dec 2007 23:43:09 +0000, Mike Henry
<{$mrtickle$}@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>>>>If you've got an Xbox 360 or something which you can plug into your HD
>>>>TV to get a proper HD image then here's the 1080 SkyHD test card:
>>>>
>>>><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2145538857/> <-- Go to "all
>>>>sizes" at the top then 'original'
>>>
>>>That's a great idea to capture the original, but I'm surprised that you
>>>used lossy JPEG compression on it. It sortof defeats the point a bit when
>>>you introduce JPEG artefacts onto a test image! For example the thinnest
>>>(2 pixel wide) vertical lines have been mashed into two different shades
>>>of dark grey spaced apart by two shades of white. :-(
>>
>>I think you can safely blame that on the original MPEG compression it
>>was broadcast in!
>
>Not necessarily. It could have (and should have, being a testcard!) been
>broadcast as a still I-frame - ie the full resolution image with no lossy
>compression. 

It was broadcast as part of a config programme, so not in the I-frame.

>Either way, you degraded it (further?) by saving as a jpeg :-(

Wow, I feel your pain.  Perhaps you can source a better quality 1080
test card from somewhere else.  Either way I couldn't give a fuck.
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On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 08:20:33 +0000, BGN 
wrote:

>>>>>If you've got an Xbox 360 or something which you can plug into your HD
>>>>>TV to get a proper HD image then here's the 1080 SkyHD test card:
>>>>>
>>>>><http://www.flickr.com/photos/hayn0r/2145538857/> <-- Go to "all
>>>>>sizes" at the top then 'original'
>>>>
>>>>That's a great idea to capture the original, but I'm surprised that you
>>>>used lossy JPEG compression on it. It sortof defeats the point a bit when
>>>>you introduce JPEG artefacts onto a test image! For example the thinnest
>>>>(2 pixel wide) vertical lines have been mashed into two different shades
>>>>of dark grey spaced apart by two shades of white. :-(
>>>
>>>I think you can safely blame that on the original MPEG compression it
>>>was broadcast in!
>>
>>Not necessarily. It could have (and should have, being a testcard!) been
>>broadcast as a still I-frame - ie the full resolution image with no lossy
>>compression. 
>
>It was broadcast as part of a config programme, so not in the I-frame.
>
>>Either way, you degraded it (further?) by saving as a jpeg :-(
>
>Wow, I feel your pain.  Perhaps you can source a better quality 1080
>test card from somewhere else.  Either way I couldn't give a fuck.

I've had a look at the original PNG and the JPG (Flickr converts
everything to JPG) and they're the same - thus SkyHD broadcast it that
way.

And, about your argument that I've mashed it into dark grey - the
penultimate vertical lines are 2 pixels of white and then 2 pixels of
black - there's not a grey there until the last lot of vertial liens
which would be one line of black and one line of white.

If you look at the rest of the image you can see the MPEG compression.
It's not JPEG compression which is the problem on this image.
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BGN wrote:

> Wow, I feel your pain.  Perhaps you can source a better quality 1080
> test card from somewhere else. 

I think the BBC's Test Card W is available as a .gif from somewhere in the BBC 
Commissioning Information section of their website, only I can't locate it ?


-- 
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

In article ,
	Mark Carver wrote:
> BGN wrote:

>> Wow, I feel your pain.  Perhaps you can source a better quality 1080
>> test card from somewhere else. 

> I think the BBC's Test Card W is available as a .gif from somewhere in the BBC 
> Commissioning Information section of their website, only I can't locate it ?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/tvbranding/picturesize.shtml

-- 
Paul Martin

On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 14:12:47 +0000, Paul Martin  wrote:

>In article ,
>	Mark Carver wrote:
>> BGN wrote:
>
>>> Wow, I feel your pain.  Perhaps you can source a better quality 1080
>>> test card from somewhere else. 
>
>> I think the BBC's Test Card W is available as a .gif from somewhere in the BBC 
>> Commissioning Information section of their website, only I can't locate it ?
>
>http://www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/tvbranding/picturesize.shtml

Hmm, that's not HD rez, but over the next couple of days when I've got
a few spare moments I'll work on creating a custom 1080(p) High Def
based on tests for LCD panels.

Of course, it's not going to be created to any particular
specification but will feature gradients, colour contrast and perhaps
even an inversion test or two (which will be handy for 1080i peeps.

I'll post the results when I've made something useful.
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On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 15:11:02 +0000, BGN 
wrote:

>>>> Wow, I feel your pain.  Perhaps you can source a better quality 1080
>>>> test card from somewhere else. 
>>
>>> I think the BBC's Test Card W is available as a .gif from somewhere in the BBC 
>>> Commissioning Information section of their website, only I can't locate it ?
>>
>>http://www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/tvbranding/picturesize.shtml
>
>Hmm, that's not HD rez, but over the next couple of days when I've got
>a few spare moments I'll work on creating a custom 1080(p) High Def
>based on tests for LCD panels.
>
>Of course, it's not going to be created to any particular
>specification but will feature gradients, colour contrast and perhaps
>even an inversion test or two (which will be handy for 1080i peeps.
>
>I'll post the results when I've made something useful.

Scrub that, I can actually rescure the SkyHD test card and make it
pixel perfect, with *no* blurring at all but it's going to be a very
manual process, but at least it'll remove all of the broadcast
artifacts and MPEG compression.

Recolouring by hand, what fun!
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On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 16:11:53 +0000, BGN 
wrote:

>>>>> Wow, I feel your pain.  Perhaps you can source a better quality 1080
>>>>> test card from somewhere else. 
>>>
>>>> I think the BBC's Test Card W is available as a .gif from somewhere in the BBC 
>>>> Commissioning Information section of their website, only I can't locate it ?
>>>
>>>http://www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/tvbranding/picturesize.shtml
>>
>>Hmm, that's not HD rez, but over the next couple of days when I've got
>>a few spare moments I'll work on creating a custom 1080(p) High Def
>>based on tests for LCD panels.
>>
>>Of course, it's not going to be created to any particular
>>specification but will feature gradients, colour contrast and perhaps
>>even an inversion test or two (which will be handy for 1080i peeps.
>>
>>I'll post the results when I've made something useful.
>
>Scrub that, I can actually rescure the SkyHD test card and make it
>pixel perfect, with *no* blurring at all but it's going to be a very
>manual process, but at least it'll remove all of the broadcast
>artifacts and MPEG compression.
>
>Recolouring by hand, what fun!

After spending a few hours re-drawing their card I'm this far in:

<http://www.bgn.me.uk/TestCardInProgress.png>

The inset image is a progress chart - the covered in blue have been
redrawn and recoloured meaning that the lines are now one pixel wide,
no anti aliasing or anything like that - sharp pixels.

I'll do a bit more tomorrow then tackle the pipe lines.
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In article ,
	BGN wrote:

> The inset image is a progress chart - the covered in blue have been
> redrawn and recoloured meaning that the lines are now one pixel wide,
> no anti aliasing or anything like that - sharp pixels.

Even the new BBC test cards are anti-aliased. I've heard rumours of an
HD version of Test Card W.

-- 
Paul Martin