I ask here because I recall past conversations.................

Just changed the trusty Peugeot for a VW Touran.

On my commute from Worcestershire to Hampshire I used to switch off the RDS 
at the top of the Air Balloon hill above Gloucester and listen to BBC Radio 
Berkshire all the way to Winchester (useful travel news which doesn't get 
selected automatically on RDS - presumably because the national BBC stations 
are provided by SC or Wenvoe for most of the pre-M4 journey?)

I can't switch off the RDS in the VW, and switching the REG function on RDS 
to OFF rather then AUTO still does not prevent BBC Gloucester, BBC Oxford or 
BBC Swindon crashing over the top of Berks. I know the VW has internal 
window aerials which are rubbish compared with the Peugeot bee sting aerial, 
but when I can get it to hold BBC Berkshire for a few seconds reception 
seems reasonable.

Anyone else found a cure?

Cheers.

"Doctor D"  wrote in message 
news:x8qdndKmX5MLjsPVnZ2dnUVZ8uednZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>I ask here because I recall past conversations.................
>
> Just changed the trusty Peugeot for a VW Touran.
>
> On my commute from Worcestershire to Hampshire I used to switch off 
> the RDS at the top of the Air Balloon hill above Gloucester and listen 
> to BBC Radio Berkshire all the way to Winchester (useful travel news 
> which doesn't get selected automatically on RDS - presumably because 
> the national BBC stations are provided by SC or Wenvoe for most of the 
> pre-M4 journey?)
>
> I can't switch off the RDS in the VW, and switching the REG function 
> on RDS to OFF rather then AUTO still does not prevent BBC Gloucester, 
> BBC Oxford or BBC Swindon crashing over the top of Berks. I know the 
> VW has internal window aerials which are rubbish compared with the 
> Peugeot bee sting aerial, but when I can get it to hold BBC Berkshire 
> for a few seconds reception seems reasonable.
>
> Anyone else found a cure?
>
> Cheers.


I think you are maybe confused over the REG function - and believe it or 
not the REG function is there because of the atrocious way that RDS is 
used in Germany!

The RDS code for a station is four hexadeciaml characters long. If REG 
is on the radio will check all four characters and can then 
differentiate between the different frequencies used by any one local 
station but will ignore other stations with similar RDS identities. If 
REG is off then it only checks three of the four characters and for any 
regional group of stations it will not differentiate between them. For 
example, round here the regional group is Hull, York, Sheffield, and 
Leeds, so with REG off it will assume that any signal it picks up from 
any frequency used by any of these stations is the same programme. Put 
REG on and it will stick on, say, Leeds irrespective of what it receives 
from the others.

Because of the way RDS is used in Germany - which in theory would take 
about 40 minutes or so for the complete alternative frequency (AF) table 
to be broadcast and that local stations are opt-outs of national 
stations - German designed radios (Blaupunkt etc) learn and remember 
every station they have ever heard and use that as the AF table instead. 
This causes problems with the way it handles UK local stations - as you 
have discovered - but most of the time REG on will cure it, but not 
always. Again as an example 103.9 is used by both Leeds and Lancs, and 
even though they have different RDS codes, as the radio at some time has 
legitimately received another station on 103.9 whilst it is on Leeds it 
will still attempt to use it as Leeds if the signal is stronger. I 
think, but cannot confirm, that the radio does not read the RDS station 
name for comparison purposes.


-- 
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

"Doctor D"  wrote in message 
news:x8qdndKmX5MLjsPVnZ2dnUVZ8uednZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>I ask here because I recall past conversations.................
>
> Just changed the trusty Peugeot for a VW Touran.
>
> On my commute from Worcestershire to Hampshire I used to switch off the 
> RDS at the top of the Air Balloon hill above Gloucester and listen to BBC 
> Radio Berkshire all the way to Winchester (useful travel news which 
> doesn't get selected automatically on RDS - presumably because the 
> national BBC stations are provided by SC or Wenvoe for most of the pre-M4 
> journey?)
>
> I can't switch off the RDS in the VW, and switching the REG function on 
> RDS to OFF rather then AUTO still does not prevent BBC Gloucester, BBC 
> Oxford or BBC Swindon crashing over the top of Berks. I know the VW has 
> internal window aerials which are rubbish compared with the Peugeot bee 
> sting aerial, but when I can get it to hold BBC Berkshire for a few 
> seconds reception seems reasonable.
>
> Anyone else found a cure?
>
> Cheers.

Older radios, used to find an RDS station and keep it until it was too weak, 
but newer radios scan around all the time and receive more than one channel.

The real PITA is when they leave the traffic announcement flag on for ages.

> I think you are maybe confused over the REG function - and believe it or 
> not the REG function is there because of the atrocious way that RDS is 
> used in Germany!
>
> The RDS code for a station is four hexadeciaml characters long. If REG is 
> on the radio will check all four characters and can then differentiate 
> between the different frequencies used by any one local station but will 
> ignore other stations with similar RDS identities. If REG is off then it 
> only checks three of the four characters and for any regional group of 
> stations it will not differentiate between them. For example, round here 
> the regional group is Hull, York, Sheffield, and Leeds, so with REG off it 
> will assume that any signal it picks up from any frequency used by any of 
> these stations is the same programme. Put REG on and it will stick on, 
> say, Leeds irrespective of what it receives from the others.
>
> Because of the way RDS is used in Germany - which in theory would take 
> about 40 minutes or so for the complete alternative frequency (AF) table 
> to be broadcast and that local stations are opt-outs of national 
> stations - German designed radios (Blaupunkt etc) learn and remember every 
> station they have ever heard and use that as the AF table instead. This 
> causes problems with the way it handles UK local stations - as you have 
> discovered - but most of the time REG on will cure it, but not always. 
> Again as an example 103.9 is used by both Leeds and Lancs, and even though 
> they have different RDS codes, as the radio at some time has legitimately 
> received another station on 103.9 whilst it is on Leeds it will still 
> attempt to use it as Leeds if the signal is stronger. I think, but cannot 
> confirm, that the radio does not read the RDS station name for comparison 
> purposes.

Thanks Woody - very useful.

I know that BBC Berkshire and BBC Oxford used to be combined under the name 
BBC Thames Valley. I wonder if they still share an RDS code? Anyone know? 
They often broadcast travel news almost simultaneously which can be a pain 
when listening to Berkshire deliberately for the travel news, and it 
switches to Oxford just before Berkshire get their travel flag activated!

When driving around Aldershot last Thursday (where Hannington reception is 
poor) BBC Berks kept being replaced by BBC London which surprised me. By 
that time I may have switched  the REG off, I will check it's set back at 
AUTO and try to make the best of it.

I always used to listen to Alex Lester on Radio 2 until 6am, then Steve 
Madden on Berks to avoid Sarah Kennedy! I may have to find something else to 
listen to or pray that SK gets replaced soon. Even Aled Jones was a 
revelation compared with her!

Doctor D wrote:

> I know that BBC Berkshire and BBC Oxford used to be combined under the 
> name BBC Thames Valley. I wonder if they still share an RDS code? Anyone 
> know? They often broadcast travel news almost simultaneously which can 
> be a pain when listening to Berkshire deliberately for the travel news, 
> and it switches to Oxford just before Berkshire get their travel flag 
> activated!
> 
> When driving around Aldershot last Thursday (where Hannington reception 
> is poor) BBC Berks kept being replaced by BBC London which surprised me. 
> By that time I may have switched  the REG off, I will check it's set 
> back at AUTO and try to make the best of it.
> 
> I always used to listen to Alex Lester on Radio 2 until 6am, then Steve 
> Madden on Berks to avoid Sarah Kennedy! I may have to find something 
> else to listen to or pray that SK gets replaced soon. Even Aled Jones 
> was a revelation compared with her!

There are two things at play here:-

Berks and Oxford do have different RDS PI codes CD11 and CB11, however all 
neighbouring BBC local stations are EON linked for travel news. So if Berks 
has a traffic flash, you can be vectored away from Oxford, Swindon, London, 
Wiltshire, Solent, or SCR to hear it, and vice versa of course. However is 
your problem that the radio is REG switching away from Berks, rather than TA 
switching for traffic news ?

The Berks/London flip-flopping is because both share the **11 regional generic 
linking. London is CC11, so that will be a REG setting thing on your radio.

Glos and Swindon are not genericly linked to Berks, they are **12 stations, 
(CB12 and CA12)

http://www.dxradio.co.uk/ukrdsbbc.php

The biggest mystery of all Doctor, is how you keep your sanity for that long 
listening to Radio Berkshire !


-- 
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

> There are two things at play here:-
>
> Berks and Oxford do have different RDS PI codes CD11 and CB11, however all 
> neighbouring BBC local stations are EON linked for travel news. So if 
> Berks has a traffic flash, you can be vectored away from Oxford, Swindon, 
> London, Wiltshire, Solent, or SCR to hear it, and vice versa of course. 
> However is your problem that the radio is REG switching away from Berks, 
> rather than TA switching for traffic news ?
>
> The Berks/London flip-flopping is because both share the **11 regional 
> generic linking. London is CC11, so that will be a REG setting thing on 
> your radio.
>
> Glos and Swindon are not genericly linked to Berks, they are **12 
> stations, (CB12 and CA12)
>
> http://www.dxradio.co.uk/ukrdsbbc.php
>
> The biggest mystery of all Doctor, is how you keep your sanity for that 
> long listening to Radio Berkshire !

Cheers Mark. I think I got myself confused by fiddling with the REG settings 
whilst travelling!
It's not a TA issue. It's that Oxford keeps dragging Berkshire away whenever 
signal levels drop even slightly. On the A419 from Gloucester to Swindon, 
BBC Oxford is far stronger then Berkshire. The Peugeot Clarion radio just 
allowed me to switch off the RDS and solved the problem. The VW radio is too 
clever for it's own good!

I cope with Steve Madden on BBC Berks because he's much better than SK on 
Radio 2, however Andrew Peach after 7am is very irritating and "our" friend 
Andy "Up the M3" McColl has been absent for a little while which has also 
increased my enjoyment! The excellent travel news which has saved me hours 
of traffic jams on the M4 also helps!

"Doctor D"  wrote in message 
news:Rs6dncC9xcoPwMPVnZ2dnUVZ8t3inZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>> I think you are maybe confused over the REG function - and believe it 
>> or not the REG function is there because of the atrocious way that 
>> RDS is used in Germany!
>>
>> The RDS code for a station is four hexadeciaml characters long. If 
>> REG is on the radio will check all four characters and can then 
>> differentiate between the different frequencies used by any one local 
>> station but will ignore other stations with similar RDS identities. 
>> If REG is off then it only checks three of the four characters and 
>> for any regional group of stations it will not differentiate between 
>> them. For example, round here the regional group is Hull, York, 
>> Sheffield, and Leeds, so with REG off it will assume that any signal 
>> it picks up from any frequency used by any of these stations is the 
>> same programme. Put REG on and it will stick on, say, Leeds 
>> irrespective of what it receives from the others.
>>
>> Because of the way RDS is used in Germany - which in theory would 
>> take about 40 minutes or so for the complete alternative frequency 
>> (AF) table to be broadcast and that local stations are opt-outs of 
>> national stations - German designed radios (Blaupunkt etc) learn and 
>> remember every station they have ever heard and use that as the AF 
>> table instead. This causes problems with the way it handles UK local 
>> stations - as you have discovered - but most of the time REG on will 
>> cure it, but not always. Again as an example 103.9 is used by both 
>> Leeds and Lancs, and even though they have different RDS codes, as 
>> the radio at some time has legitimately received another station on 
>> 103.9 whilst it is on Leeds it will still attempt to use it as Leeds 
>> if the signal is stronger. I think, but cannot confirm, that the 
>> radio does not read the RDS station name for comparison purposes.
>
> Thanks Woody - very useful.
>
> I know that BBC Berkshire and BBC Oxford used to be combined under the 
> name BBC Thames Valley. I wonder if they still share an RDS code? 
> Anyone know? They often broadcast travel news almost simultaneously 
> which can be a pain when listening to Berkshire deliberately for the 
> travel news, and it switches to Oxford just before Berkshire get their 
> travel flag activated!
>
> When driving around Aldershot last Thursday (where Hannington 
> reception is poor) BBC Berks kept being replaced by BBC London which 
> surprised me. By that time I may have switched  the REG off, I will 
> check it's set back at AUTO and try to make the best of it.
>
> I always used to listen to Alex Lester on Radio 2 until 6am, then 
> Steve Madden on Berks to avoid Sarah Kennedy! I may have to find 
> something else to listen to or pray that SK gets replaced soon. Even 
> Aled Jones was a revelation compared with her!



On many RDS car radios - possibly not Blaupunkt - if you hold the RDS 
button pressed for long enough it will Usually) first switch RDS off but 
keep on pressing and it will change to show the station RDS ID and some 
other text part of which is an indication of signal strength.


-- 
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

"Doctor D"  wrote in message 
news:x8qdndKmX5MLjsPVnZ2dnUVZ8uednZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>I ask here because I recall past conversations.................
>
> Just changed the trusty Peugeot for a VW Touran.
>
Does it have a digital TV fitted?  A clue is in the name of the group.

Woody wrote:

> 
> On many RDS car radios - possibly not Blaupunkt - if you hold the RDS 
> button pressed for long enough it will Usually) first switch RDS off but 
> keep on pressing and it will change to show the station RDS ID and some 
> other text part of which is an indication of signal strength.

Yes, I had a Grundig (in a Vauxhall) like that.  You'd get PI code, and signal 
strength on a scale from 0 to 1.99 mV, plus AM content (aka multipath) as a 
read out from 0 to 99.


-- 
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

In message <g3m7e1$tth$1@news.albasani.net>, john m <john@nospam.2net> 
writes
>
>"Doctor D"  wrote in message
>news:x8qdndKmX5MLjsPVnZ2dnUVZ8uednZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>>I ask here because I recall past conversations.................
>>
>> Just changed the trusty Peugeot for a VW Touran.
>>
>Does it have a digital TV fitted?  A clue is in the name of the group.
>
As this NG is presently not exactly being overloaded with postings, and 
the subject is declared as being TOT (where presumably the 'O' stands 
for 'off'), and it's interesting, I, for one, am not too offended.
-- 
Ian

"john m" <john@nospam.2net> wrote in message 
news:g3m7e1$tth$1@news.albasani.net...
>
> "Doctor D"  wrote in message 
> news:x8qdndKmX5MLjsPVnZ2dnUVZ8uednZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>>I ask here because I recall past conversations.................
>>
>> Just changed the trusty Peugeot for a VW Touran.
>>
> Does it have a digital TV fitted?  A clue is in the name of the group.

No it doesn't.
The clue is in the title TOT, this means Totally Off Topic. Not to be 
confused with you, who appear to be a TIT. Are you a TIT?

If TOT posts upset you - don't read them.

BTW - Welcome to the group - stick around, learn how the group works, change 
the tone of your posts and you may make some friends. I have, I value their 
opinions, hence I asked the question and received helpful 
advice.......................until you came along.

> On many RDS car radios - possibly not Blaupunkt - if you hold the RDS 
> button pressed for long enough it will Usually) first switch RDS off but 
> keep on pressing and it will change to show the station RDS ID and some 
> other text part of which is an indication of signal strength.

Sadly, this is the main problem, it has no RDS button.
A settings button, and then the option to switch REG to off or auto is about 
as far as it goes.

Do we know if current VW radios are made by Blaupunkt? I know in the past 
Sony have been involved.

On Sun, 22 Jun 2008 15:39:16 +0100, Mark Carver
<mark.carver@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>Doctor D wrote:
>
>> I know that BBC Berkshire and BBC Oxford used to be combined under the 
>> name BBC Thames Valley. I wonder if they still share an RDS code? Anyone 
>> know? They often broadcast travel news almost simultaneously which can 
>> be a pain when listening to Berkshire deliberately for the travel news, 
>> and it switches to Oxford just before Berkshire get their travel flag 
>> activated!
>> 
>> When driving around Aldershot last Thursday (where Hannington reception 
>> is poor) BBC Berks kept being replaced by BBC London which surprised me. 
>> By that time I may have switched  the REG off, I will check it's set 
>> back at AUTO and try to make the best of it.
>> 
>> I always used to listen to Alex Lester on Radio 2 until 6am, then Steve 
>> Madden on Berks to avoid Sarah Kennedy! I may have to find something 
>> else to listen to or pray that SK gets replaced soon. Even Aled Jones 
>> was a revelation compared with her!
>
>There are two things at play here:-
>
>Berks and Oxford do have different RDS PI codes CD11 and CB11, however all 
>neighbouring BBC local stations are EON linked for travel news. So if Berks 
>has a traffic flash, you can be vectored away from Oxford, Swindon, London, 
>Wiltshire, Solent, or SCR to hear it, and vice versa of course. However is 
>your problem that the radio is REG switching away from Berks, rather than TA 
>switching for traffic news ?
>
>The Berks/London flip-flopping is because both share the **11 regional generic 
>linking. London is CC11, so that will be a REG setting thing on your radio.
>
>Glos and Swindon are not genericly linked to Berks, they are **12 stations, 
>(CB12 and CA12)
>
>http://www.dxradio.co.uk/ukrdsbbc.php
>
>The biggest mystery of all Doctor, is how you keep your sanity for that long 
>listening to Radio Berkshire !

Interesting list, but why is Cambridge not an 11 station like Norfolk
& 3CR?  My RDS radio switches straight from 3CR to Norfolk or Suffolk
when travelling through Cambridge.

Marky P.

Marky P wrote:
> On Sun, 22 Jun 2008 15:39:16 +0100, Mark Carver

>> http://www.dxradio.co.uk/ukrdsbbc.php
>>

> Interesting list, but why is Cambridge not an 11 station like Norfolk
> & 3CR?  My RDS radio switches straight from 3CR to Norfolk or Suffolk
> when travelling through Cambridge.

Good question. All the digits from C511 to CF11 are already used, but I wonder 
what is wrong with using for Cambs say, C411 ?

-- 
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.