Hi All

Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
something right.

I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).

Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
swing like that Tiger fellow?

Cheers

Dave

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

> "david s-a"  wrote in message
> Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> cheers
> david

Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

thanks
Martin

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
> 
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the 
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously 
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A:	- The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3 
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was 
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women. 
	- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score 
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%); 
and 120 and above (15.3%). 
	- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change 
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by 
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age, 
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players. 

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: 	- Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004 
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for 
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.) 
 

This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to 
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

Mark,
Thanks ..... I'm delighted to discover I'm better than I thought :-)

Although for me a golfer is someone who maintains a handicap and is 
different from someone who plays golf occasionally ..... bit like casual 
drinker versus alcoholic . Average amongst those who maintain a handicap @ 
15 is more what I expected.

thanks again

Hi ... I'm Martin, I'm a golfer ;-)
-- 
mjn at onetel dot com

"Mark Myers"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.20e1e381f623e0af989700@news.altopia.net...
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do 
> > that!
>
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A: - The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women.
- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%);
and 120 and above (15.3%).
- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age,
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players.

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.)


This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

> "david s-a"  wrote in message
> Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> cheers
> david

Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

thanks
Martin

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
> 
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the 
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously 
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A:	- The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3 
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was 
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women. 
	- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score 
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%); 
and 120 and above (15.3%). 
	- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change 
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by 
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age, 
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players. 

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: 	- Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004 
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for 
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.) 
 

This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to 
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

Mark,
Thanks ..... I'm delighted to discover I'm better than I thought :-)

Although for me a golfer is someone who maintains a handicap and is 
different from someone who plays golf occasionally ..... bit like casual 
drinker versus alcoholic . Average amongst those who maintain a handicap @ 
15 is more what I expected.

thanks again

Hi ... I'm Martin, I'm a golfer ;-)
-- 
mjn at onetel dot com

"Mark Myers"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.20e1e381f623e0af989700@news.altopia.net...
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do 
> > that!
>
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A: - The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women.
- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%);
and 120 and above (15.3%).
- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age,
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players.

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.)


This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>
> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>
> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>(snip)
> Also:
> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
> 2007.)

Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
handicap of about 18.

Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

--
"To iterate is human, to recurse, divine."

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
wrote:

>On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>>
>> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
>> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>>
>> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>>
>> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>>(snip)
>> Also:
>> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
>> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
>> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
>> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
>> 2007.)
>
>Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
>handicap of about 18.
>
>Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
>yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
>(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
is actually good for.

Crispin Roche

On Jun 19, 5:13 pm, Crispin Roche  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
> wrote:
> >
> >Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
> >yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
> >(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))
>
> Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
> is actually good for.

Competitive play, obviously. Or benchmarking ?  Much social golf has a
competitive side to it.  "Personal bests", although common in many
activities and sports, don't really mean too much in golf, especially
amongst casual players, for whom consistency may never be realistic.

I'm surprised there are so many "casual" players, though.  It might be
more enlightening to see statistics from this side of the pond.

Looking at it from another angle, I consider myself a fairly serious
hill-walker.  I can plan routes, navigate, and own (what seems like
far too much) proper gear.  But I might occasionally find myself on
the same path as someone who gets out of their car once a year and
plods up the tourist route to the top, badly equipped and probably
even more badly out of condition.  They are, without doubt, walking in
the hills.  Does the same label apply to us both ?  I wonder what,
exactly, constitutes a golfer...

--
"Shin - a device for finding furniture in the dark.."

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

> "david s-a"  wrote in message
> Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> cheers
> david

Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

thanks
Martin

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
> 
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the 
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously 
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A:	- The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3 
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was 
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women. 
	- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score 
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%); 
and 120 and above (15.3%). 
	- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change 
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by 
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age, 
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players. 

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: 	- Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004 
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for 
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.) 
 

This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to 
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

Mark,
Thanks ..... I'm delighted to discover I'm better than I thought :-)

Although for me a golfer is someone who maintains a handicap and is 
different from someone who plays golf occasionally ..... bit like casual 
drinker versus alcoholic . Average amongst those who maintain a handicap @ 
15 is more what I expected.

thanks again

Hi ... I'm Martin, I'm a golfer ;-)
-- 
mjn at onetel dot com

"Mark Myers"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.20e1e381f623e0af989700@news.altopia.net...
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do 
> > that!
>
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A: - The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women.
- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%);
and 120 and above (15.3%).
- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age,
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players.

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.)


This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>
> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>
> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>(snip)
> Also:
> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
> 2007.)

Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
handicap of about 18.

Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

--
"To iterate is human, to recurse, divine."

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
wrote:

>On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>>
>> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
>> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>>
>> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>>
>> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>>(snip)
>> Also:
>> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
>> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
>> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
>> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
>> 2007.)
>
>Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
>handicap of about 18.
>
>Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
>yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
>(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
is actually good for.

Crispin Roche

On Jun 19, 5:13 pm, Crispin Roche  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
> wrote:
> >
> >Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
> >yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
> >(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))
>
> Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
> is actually good for.

Competitive play, obviously. Or benchmarking ?  Much social golf has a
competitive side to it.  "Personal bests", although common in many
activities and sports, don't really mean too much in golf, especially
amongst casual players, for whom consistency may never be realistic.

I'm surprised there are so many "casual" players, though.  It might be
more enlightening to see statistics from this side of the pond.

Looking at it from another angle, I consider myself a fairly serious
hill-walker.  I can plan routes, navigate, and own (what seems like
far too much) proper gear.  But I might occasionally find myself on
the same path as someone who gets out of their car once a year and
plods up the tourist route to the top, badly equipped and probably
even more badly out of condition.  They are, without doubt, walking in
the hills.  Does the same label apply to us both ?  I wonder what,
exactly, constitutes a golfer...

--
"Shin - a device for finding furniture in the dark.."

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

> "david s-a"  wrote in message
> Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> cheers
> david

Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

thanks
Martin

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
> 
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the 
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously 
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A:	- The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3 
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was 
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women. 
	- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score 
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%); 
and 120 and above (15.3%). 
	- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change 
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by 
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age, 
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players. 

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: 	- Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004 
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for 
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.) 
 

This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to 
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

Mark,
Thanks ..... I'm delighted to discover I'm better than I thought :-)

Although for me a golfer is someone who maintains a handicap and is 
different from someone who plays golf occasionally ..... bit like casual 
drinker versus alcoholic . Average amongst those who maintain a handicap @ 
15 is more what I expected.

thanks again

Hi ... I'm Martin, I'm a golfer ;-)
-- 
mjn at onetel dot com

"Mark Myers"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.20e1e381f623e0af989700@news.altopia.net...
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do 
> > that!
>
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A: - The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women.
- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%);
and 120 and above (15.3%).
- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age,
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players.

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.)


This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>
> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>
> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>(snip)
> Also:
> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
> 2007.)

Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
handicap of about 18.

Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

--
"To iterate is human, to recurse, divine."

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
wrote:

>On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>>
>> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
>> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>>
>> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>>
>> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>>(snip)
>> Also:
>> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
>> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
>> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
>> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
>> 2007.)
>
>Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
>handicap of about 18.
>
>Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
>yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
>(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
is actually good for.

Crispin Roche

On Jun 19, 5:13 pm, Crispin Roche  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
> wrote:
> >
> >Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
> >yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
> >(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))
>
> Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
> is actually good for.

Competitive play, obviously. Or benchmarking ?  Much social golf has a
competitive side to it.  "Personal bests", although common in many
activities and sports, don't really mean too much in golf, especially
amongst casual players, for whom consistency may never be realistic.

I'm surprised there are so many "casual" players, though.  It might be
more enlightening to see statistics from this side of the pond.

Looking at it from another angle, I consider myself a fairly serious
hill-walker.  I can plan routes, navigate, and own (what seems like
far too much) proper gear.  But I might occasionally find myself on
the same path as someone who gets out of their car once a year and
plods up the tourist route to the top, badly equipped and probably
even more badly out of condition.  They are, without doubt, walking in
the hills.  Does the same label apply to us both ?  I wonder what,
exactly, constitutes a golfer...

--
"Shin - a device for finding furniture in the dark.."

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago,
   Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

If you are now older than 3 years old - which I suspect you are , you 
have not a hope on earth of playing like Tiger - better get used to it 
and find yourself another role model. I watched Neil Coles last week as 
he knocked  it round in par 72 at the age of 73 with an easy swing that 
hasn't changed in 50 odd  years. Tiger won't be able to play past 40 
without another complete remodelling of his swing - though I am sure he 
is talented enough to do that.

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

> "david s-a"  wrote in message
> Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> cheers
> david

Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

thanks
Martin

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
> 
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the 
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously 
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A:	- The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3 
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was 
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women. 
	- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score 
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%); 
and 120 and above (15.3%). 
	- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change 
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by 
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age, 
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players. 

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: 	- Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004 
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for 
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.) 
 

This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to 
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

Mark,
Thanks ..... I'm delighted to discover I'm better than I thought :-)

Although for me a golfer is someone who maintains a handicap and is 
different from someone who plays golf occasionally ..... bit like casual 
drinker versus alcoholic . Average amongst those who maintain a handicap @ 
15 is more what I expected.

thanks again

Hi ... I'm Martin, I'm a golfer ;-)
-- 
mjn at onetel dot com

"Mark Myers"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.20e1e381f623e0af989700@news.altopia.net...
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do 
> > that!
>
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A: - The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women.
- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%);
and 120 and above (15.3%).
- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age,
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players.

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.)


This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>
> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>
> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>(snip)
> Also:
> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
> 2007.)

Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
handicap of about 18.

Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

--
"To iterate is human, to recurse, divine."

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
wrote:

>On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>>
>> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
>> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>>
>> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>>
>> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>>(snip)
>> Also:
>> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
>> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
>> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
>> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
>> 2007.)
>
>Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
>handicap of about 18.
>
>Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
>yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
>(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
is actually good for.

Crispin Roche

On Jun 19, 5:13 pm, Crispin Roche  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
> wrote:
> >
> >Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
> >yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
> >(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))
>
> Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
> is actually good for.

Competitive play, obviously. Or benchmarking ?  Much social golf has a
competitive side to it.  "Personal bests", although common in many
activities and sports, don't really mean too much in golf, especially
amongst casual players, for whom consistency may never be realistic.

I'm surprised there are so many "casual" players, though.  It might be
more enlightening to see statistics from this side of the pond.

Looking at it from another angle, I consider myself a fairly serious
hill-walker.  I can plan routes, navigate, and own (what seems like
far too much) proper gear.  But I might occasionally find myself on
the same path as someone who gets out of their car once a year and
plods up the tourist route to the top, badly equipped and probably
even more badly out of condition.  They are, without doubt, walking in
the hills.  Does the same label apply to us both ?  I wonder what,
exactly, constitutes a golfer...

--
"Shin - a device for finding furniture in the dark.."

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago,
   Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

If you are now older than 3 years old - which I suspect you are , you 
have not a hope on earth of playing like Tiger - better get used to it 
and find yourself another role model. I watched Neil Coles last week as 
he knocked  it round in par 72 at the age of 73 with an easy swing that 
hasn't changed in 50 odd  years. Tiger won't be able to play past 40 
without another complete remodelling of his swing - though I am sure he 
is talented enough to do that.

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

> "david s-a"  wrote in message
> Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> cheers
> david

Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

thanks
Martin

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
> 
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the 
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously 
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A:	- The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3 
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was 
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women. 
	- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score 
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%); 
and 120 and above (15.3%). 
	- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change 
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by 
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age, 
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players. 

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: 	- Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004 
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for 
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.) 
 

This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to 
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

Mark,
Thanks ..... I'm delighted to discover I'm better than I thought :-)

Although for me a golfer is someone who maintains a handicap and is 
different from someone who plays golf occasionally ..... bit like casual 
drinker versus alcoholic . Average amongst those who maintain a handicap @ 
15 is more what I expected.

thanks again

Hi ... I'm Martin, I'm a golfer ;-)
-- 
mjn at onetel dot com

"Mark Myers"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.20e1e381f623e0af989700@news.altopia.net...
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do 
> > that!
>
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A: - The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women.
- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%);
and 120 and above (15.3%).
- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age,
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players.

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.)


This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>
> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>
> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>(snip)
> Also:
> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
> 2007.)

Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
handicap of about 18.

Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

--
"To iterate is human, to recurse, divine."

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
wrote:

>On Jun 19, 1:59 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
>>
>> > > "david s-a"  wrote in message
>> > > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>>
>> > Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?
>>
>> Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.
>>(snip)
>> Also:
>> Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
>> A:      - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
>> data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
>> men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
>> 2007.)
>
>Ah, that's more like it.  I had a vague recollection of an "average"
>handicap of about 18.
>
>Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
>yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
>(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))

Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
is actually good for.

Crispin Roche

On Jun 19, 5:13 pm, Crispin Roche  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
> wrote:
> >
> >Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
> >yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
> >(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))
>
> Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
> is actually good for.

Competitive play, obviously. Or benchmarking ?  Much social golf has a
competitive side to it.  "Personal bests", although common in many
activities and sports, don't really mean too much in golf, especially
amongst casual players, for whom consistency may never be realistic.

I'm surprised there are so many "casual" players, though.  It might be
more enlightening to see statistics from this side of the pond.

Looking at it from another angle, I consider myself a fairly serious
hill-walker.  I can plan routes, navigate, and own (what seems like
far too much) proper gear.  But I might occasionally find myself on
the same path as someone who gets out of their car once a year and
plods up the tourist route to the top, badly equipped and probably
even more badly out of condition.  They are, without doubt, walking in
the hills.  Does the same label apply to us both ?  I wonder what,
exactly, constitutes a golfer...

--
"Shin - a device for finding furniture in the dark.."

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago,
   Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

If you are now older than 3 years old - which I suspect you are , you 
have not a hope on earth of playing like Tiger - better get used to it 
and find yourself another role model. I watched Neil Coles last week as 
he knocked  it round in par 72 at the age of 73 with an easy swing that 
hasn't changed in 50 odd  years. Tiger won't be able to play past 40 
without another complete remodelling of his swing - though I am sure he 
is talented enough to do that.

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 19:35:46 -0000, John Laird said...
> On Jun 19, 5:13 pm, Crispin Roche  wrote:
> > On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
> > >yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
> > >(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))
> >
> > Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
> > is actually good for.
> 
> Competitive play, obviously. Or benchmarking ?  Much social golf has a
> competitive side to it.  "Personal bests", although common in many
> activities and sports, don't really mean too much in golf, especially
> amongst casual players, for whom consistency may never be realistic.
> 
> I'm surprised there are so many "casual" players, though.  It might be
> more enlightening to see statistics from this side of the pond.
> 
> Looking at it from another angle, I consider myself a fairly serious
> hill-walker.  I can plan routes, navigate, and own (what seems like
> far too much) proper gear.  But I might occasionally find myself on
> the same path as someone who gets out of their car once a year and
> plods up the tourist route to the top, badly equipped and probably
> even more badly out of condition.  They are, without doubt, walking in
> the hills.  Does the same label apply to us both ?  I wonder what,
> exactly, constitutes a golfer...

Having had a think, I'd say keenness matters. Or maybe just how often 
you play (or walk). Handicap or no, I think someone who plays a couple 
of times a month all year round can be called a golfer.

For example, I can do all the hill walking stuff you mention, and I have 
all the gear, but for various reasons I haven't been for years. I don't 
think I could really call myself a hill walker now. Lapsed, perhaps :-)

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

On Jun 21, 2:15 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 19:35:46 -0000, John Laird said...
>
> Having had a think, I'd say keenness matters. Or maybe just how often
> you play (or walk). Handicap or no, I think someone who plays a couple
> of times a month all year round can be called a golfer.

That's more than some active club members manage (and certainly more
than me) :-)

> For example, I can do all the hill walking stuff you mention, and I have
> all the gear, but for various reasons I haven't been for years. I don't
> think I could really call myself a hill walker now. Lapsed, perhaps :-)

Tut tut.  I'm within easy reach of the Peak District, Yorkshire Dales,
Snowdonia and the Lake District(*).  Lucky me.  You're very welcome to
join me any time, but I can't offer any club golf on the same visit
just yet :-(

(*)  Although I'm leaning towards spending more time in Scotland,
having bagged a small handful of Munros recently...
--
"I'm spending a year dead for tax purposes."

On Thu, 21 Jun 2007 13:56:56 -0000, John Laird 
wrote:

>On Jun 21, 2:15 pm, Mark Myers  wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 19:35:46 -0000, John Laird said...
>>
>> Having had a think, I'd say keenness matters. Or maybe just how often
>> you play (or walk). Handicap or no, I think someone who plays a couple
>> of times a month all year round can be called a golfer.
>
>That's more than some active club members manage (and certainly more
>than me) :-)
>
>> For example, I can do all the hill walking stuff you mention, and I have
>> all the gear, but for various reasons I haven't been for years. I don't
>> think I could really call myself a hill walker now. Lapsed, perhaps :-)
>
>Tut tut.  I'm within easy reach of the Peak District, Yorkshire Dales,
>Snowdonia and the Lake District(*).  Lucky me.  You're very welcome to
>join me any time, but I can't offer any club golf on the same visit
>just yet :-(
>
>(*)  Although I'm leaning towards spending more time in Scotland,
>having bagged a small handful of Munros recently...

train spotter:-)

Crispin Roche

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 19:35:46 -0000, John Laird 
wrote:

>On Jun 19, 5:13 pm, Crispin Roche  wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 15:00:35 -0000, John Laird 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >Is it too snobby or elitist to suggest that you can only really call
>> >yourself a golfer if you bother to obtain and maintain a handicap ?
>> >(Speaking as someone who has but latterly hasn't :-))
>>
>> Before making that sugestion you would have to decide what a handicap
>> is actually good for.
>
>Competitive play, obviously. Or benchmarking ?  Much social golf has a
>competitive side to it.  "Personal bests", although common in many
>activities and sports, don't really mean too much in golf, especially
>amongst casual players, for whom consistency may never be realistic.
>
>I'm surprised there are so many "casual" players, though.  It might be
>more enlightening to see statistics from this side of the pond.
>

I'm not so surprised, one set of numbers suggests there are nearly 4
million "golfers" in the UK but as far as I can tell  the 4 national
golf unions and the ladies golf union only claim about 1.3 million
affiliated golfers.

And regarding the consistency of players, both consistent and regular,
how does a handicap of 15 mean anything when a player carrying that
handicap will only play to it 1 in 4 or 5 times but can beat that
handicap by 6 or 7 shots on occasion?


>Does the same label apply to us both ?  I wonder what,
>exactly, constitutes a golfer...

A very good question, the player who is a member of a national union
affiliated club but never plays is officially a golfer.  So I guess
anybody who plays a round of golf with the intention of playing
another round must also be a golfer.

Crispin Roche

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 
> I have gone from having good shots to good holes now I want to go from
> having bad holes to just bad shots!  Anyway, my problem is my swing
> follow through, it's almost as if once the ball is hit the shot is
> over which of course it isn't so...my question(s).
> 
> Any advice to help my follow through?  Any gems to help this newbie
> swing like that Tiger fellow?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Dave

Hi Dave,

Shooting less than 100 is a great achievement in itself and you 
obviously have a talent and ability you can build upon but this might 
not be the answer you were wanting.

Everybody's swing is individual and the best, and for the vast majority 
only, way to achieve positive results is to get some lessons from a pro 
who you can get on with. Not all are the same though most teach a 
similar method each has a different way of communicating it. 
Teaching/Learning is a two way process.

Group lessons can work out cheaper but I would suggest say half a dozen 
individual lessons over three months with practice on the range in 
between say twice a week will get you playing to better than the average 
golfer in less than 6 months i.e. playing regularly in the late 80s and 
low 90s with an occasional rubbish round and possibly a golden one.

The only way to get something out of this game is to put something in, 
just blindly bashing away at a basket of balls or slogging round on the 
course does nothing in comparison to some structured and paid for advice 
in combination with a practice routine to get you on the right path.

The money you spend on your lessons will very quickly be more than 
returned in saved balls, bets and prizes won and sheer satisfaction. It 
would be certainly better than wasting money on some super duper driver 
or expensive clubs at this stage of your golfing experiences.

Good luck and enjoy,
-- 
Durram

d@btinternet.com wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Pretty new to this golf thing, never touched a club until 18 months
> ago, goofed around at the range for 12 months and have been playing on
> courses for 6 months now, just broke the hundred so hope I'm doing
> something right.
> 


Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!

cheers
david

> "david s-a"  wrote in message
> Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
>
> cheers
> david

Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

thanks
Martin

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do that!
> 
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the 
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously 
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A:	- The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3 
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was 
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women. 
	- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score 
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%); 
and 120 and above (15.3%). 
	- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change 
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by 
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age, 
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players. 

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: 	- Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004 
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for 
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.) 
 

This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to 
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=I&as_sitesearch=&as_rights=&safe=off

-- 
Mark Myers
usenet2 at mcm2002 dot f9 dot co dot uk
I have all the specs and diagrams at home.

Mark,
Thanks ..... I'm delighted to discover I'm better than I thought :-)

Although for me a golfer is someone who maintains a handicap and is 
different from someone who plays golf occasionally ..... bit like casual 
drinker versus alcoholic . Average amongst those who maintain a handicap @ 
15 is more what I expected.

thanks again

Hi ... I'm Martin, I'm a golfer ;-)
-- 
mjn at onetel dot com

"Mark Myers"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.20e1e381f623e0af989700@news.altopia.net...
On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 10:29:26 +0100, Martin said...
> > "david s-a"  wrote in message
> > Breaking one hundred is good. Only about one in three golfers can do 
> > that!
>
> Really ... 1 in 3. Can this statistic be backed up ?

Bear in mind that there are an awful lot of casual golfers around.

The R&A web site is down, so this is from an American Organisation, the
National Golf Federation (http://www.ngf.org), from their FAQ. Obviously
it is not a UK statistic, but the UK results will be similar.

Q: What is the average golfer's score?
A: - The average score on an 18-hole regulation golf course was 98.3
in 2005. (2006 figures will be released mid-2007.) Average score was
96.4 for men and 108.1 for women.
- The percentage of adult golfers by score category are: Score
under 80 (5% of golfers); 80-89 (19.7%); 90-99 (27.2%); 100-119 (32.8%);
and 120 and above (15.3%).
- Average score is a statistic that is very unlikely to change
over time, because the pool of golfers is constantly being refreshed by
newer, less skilled ones. Also, average score increases as golfers age,
which tends to balance out better scores by younger players.

Also:
Q: What percentage of today's golfers maintain a handicap?
A: - Twenty-one percent of all golfers maintain a handicap (2004
data). The average handicap (among those who maintain one) is 15 for
men, 23 for women, and 16 overall. (2006 figures will be released mid-
2007.)


This search on Google also throws up similar stats. It's up to you to
decide how accurate they are. This tinyurl:
http://tinyurl.com/yrq63b

will link to this:
http://www.google.co.uk/search?as_q=percentage+golfers+break+100
&hl=en&num=10
&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=I&as_filetype=&as_qd
r=all&as_occt=an