Holland
Scotland
Iceland
Macedonia
Norway

Cant understand some of the betting thoughts on sky....ROI to win it 400/1 
and scotland 1000/1 !!!!!!!!!

And nice to see england have croatia in their group! ;-)

JB

Jonbhoy wrote:
> Holland
> Scotland
> Iceland
> Macedonia
> Norway
> 
> Cant understand some of the betting thoughts on sky....ROI to win it 400/1 
> and scotland 1000/1 !!!!!!!!!
> 
> And nice to see england have croatia in their group! ;-)
> 

Doesn't the fact that we are in the only 5 team group mean that we have 
no chance of qualifying unless we top the group?  It's a conspiracy I 
tell you.

Stewart

Stewart wrote:
> Jonbhoy wrote:
>> Holland
>> Scotland
>> Iceland
>> Macedonia
>> Norway
>>
>> Cant understand some of the betting thoughts on sky....ROI to win it
>> 400/1 and scotland 1000/1 !!!!!!!!!
>>
>> And nice to see england have croatia in their group! ;-)
>>
>
> Doesn't the fact that we are in the only 5 team group mean that we
> have no chance of qualifying unless we top the group?  It's a
> conspiracy I tell you.
>
> Stewart

It wouldn't be Scotland if the odds weren't stacked against us in so many 
ways all the time!
Ach we can win that group no bother...


-- 
 www.bebo.com/bizenya79
 www.myspace.com/bizenya
Of all the words in the English language, the word ' set '  has the
most definitions!

"Jonbhoy"  wrote in message 
news:RsOdnaJphplHPdTanZ2dnUVZ8qminZ2d@giganews.com...
> Holland
> Scotland
> Iceland
> Macedonia
> Norway
>
> Cant understand some of the betting thoughts on sky....ROI to win it 400/1 
> and scotland 1000/1 !!!!!!!!!
>
> And nice to see england have croatia in their group! ;-)
>
> JB

What are the implications of us being in the 5 team group? Apart from having 
less games to play? I'm wondering what the criteria for best placed 2nd 
placed team will be and how the fact the 2nd team in our group has less 
chance of marking up points will work?

On the face of it though, it could have been worse although neither Norway 
nor Macedonia will be a walk in the park.

Just heard that we'd be fcuked. Only groups 1-8 can be involved in 
play-offs.


"louisxiv"  wrote in message 
news:13kj98rl9fjpie7@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Jonbhoy"  wrote in message 
> news:RsOdnaJphplHPdTanZ2dnUVZ8qminZ2d@giganews.com...
>> Holland
>> Scotland
>> Iceland
>> Macedonia
>> Norway
>>
>> Cant understand some of the betting thoughts on sky....ROI to win it 
>> 400/1 and scotland 1000/1 !!!!!!!!!
>>
>> And nice to see england have croatia in their group! ;-)
>>
>> JB
>
> What are the implications of us being in the 5 team group? Apart from 
> having less games to play? I'm wondering what the criteria for best placed 
> 2nd placed team will be and how the fact the 2nd team in our group has 
> less chance of marking up points will work?
>
> On the face of it though, it could have been worse although neither Norway 
> nor Macedonia will be a walk in the park.
>

Actually the boy was talking crap. The bottom teams in the other groups are 
discounted so if we finish second we'll be in the running for a play-off 
place.

"louisxiv"  wrote in message 
news:13kj9keon23rfe8@corp.supernews.com...
> Just heard that we'd be fcuked. Only groups 1-8 can be involved in 
> play-offs.
>
>
> "louisxiv"  wrote in message 
> news:13kj98rl9fjpie7@corp.supernews.com...
>>
>> "Jonbhoy"  wrote in message 
>> news:RsOdnaJphplHPdTanZ2dnUVZ8qminZ2d@giganews.com...
>>> Holland
>>> Scotland
>>> Iceland
>>> Macedonia
>>> Norway
>>>
>>> Cant understand some of the betting thoughts on sky....ROI to win it 
>>> 400/1 and scotland 1000/1 !!!!!!!!!
>>>
>>> And nice to see england have croatia in their group! ;-)
>>>
>>> JB
>>
>> What are the implications of us being in the 5 team group? Apart from 
>> having less games to play? I'm wondering what the criteria for best 
>> placed 2nd placed team will be and how the fact the 2nd team in our group 
>> has less chance of marking up points will work?
>>
>> On the face of it though, it could have been worse although neither 
>> Norway nor Macedonia will be a walk in the park.
>>
>
>

"Stewart"  wrote
> Doesn't the fact that we are in the only 5 team group mean that we have no
> chance of qualifying unless we top the group?  It's a conspiracy I tell
> you.

"The eight best second-place sides will be drawn against each other for four
playoff matches that will be played on a home-and-away basis. The four
winners will qualify for the Cup."

By saying the eight "best" second place sides, it implies that every group
is treated the same. What I imagine they will do, which they have done in
the past, is to discount the results of the 2nd place team against the
bottom team in the 6 team groups.

All it really means is that we don't have to play 2 games against Estonia,
which are normally a guaranteed 6 points anyway although with us you were
never totally sure.

Stevio wrote:
> "Stewart"  wrote
>> Doesn't the fact that we are in the only 5 team group mean that we have no
>> chance of qualifying unless we top the group?  It's a conspiracy I tell
>> you.
> 
> "The eight best second-place sides will be drawn against each other for four
> playoff matches that will be played on a home-and-away basis. The four
> winners will qualify for the Cup."
> 
> By saying the eight "best" second place sides, it implies that every group
> is treated the same. What I imagine they will do, which they have done in
> the past, is to discount the results of the 2nd place team against the
> bottom team in the 6 team groups.
> 
> All it really means is that we don't have to play 2 games against Estonia,
> which are normally a guaranteed 6 points anyway although with us you were
> never totally sure. 
> 
> 


I still don't quite get it.
There's 9 Groups.
8 groups have 6 teams, and 1 groups has 5.
8 Second place teams go into playoff games.

That still leaves 1 second place team spare!
Does the best second place team go through with all the group winners 
automatically? I don't see how else it could work.

"i"  wrote in message news:4749b065$0$31650
> I still don't quite get it.
> There's 9 Groups.
> 8 groups have 6 teams, and 1 groups has 5.
> 8 Second place teams go into playoff games.
>
> That still leaves 1 second place team spare!
> Does the best second place team go through with all the group winners 
> automatically? I don't see how else it could work.

The eight "best" second place sides go into a play off. The ninth second 
place team is out, simple as that (and it better not be us)!

Europe has 13 qualifying places available. The 9 group winners go through 
plus 4 second place teams (the play off winners).

Stevio wrote:
> "i"  wrote in message news:4749b065$0$31650
>> I still don't quite get it.
>> There's 9 Groups.
>> 8 groups have 6 teams, and 1 groups has 5.
>> 8 Second place teams go into playoff games.
>>
>> That still leaves 1 second place team spare!
>> Does the best second place team go through with all the group winners 
>> automatically? I don't see how else it could work.
> 
> The eight "best" second place sides go into a play off. The ninth second 
> place team is out, simple as that (and it better not be us)!
> 
> Europe has 13 qualifying places available. The 9 group winners go through 
> plus 4 second place teams (the play off winners). 
> 
> 
Ah right, I understand now. Brain still a bit fuzzy from last night.
I'm optimistic now.

Stewart wrote:
> Doesn't the fact that we are in the only 5 team group mean that we have 
> no chance of qualifying unless we top the group?  It's a conspiracy I 
> tell you.
> 

I blame the BBC, it was their site that I saw this pish on.  If I'd 
thought about it "8 best placed runners up" doesn't make sense if only 8 
groups are eligible.

Stewart

"beer" <beer@.donteventhinkaboutit.com> wrote in message 
news:ICi2j.23753$JA1.17927@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> Stevio wrote:
>> "i"  wrote in message news:4749b065$0$31650
>>> I still don't quite get it.
>>> There's 9 Groups.
>>> 8 groups have 6 teams, and 1 groups has 5.
>>> 8 Second place teams go into playoff games.
>>>
>>> That still leaves 1 second place team spare!
>>> Does the best second place team go through with all the group winners 
>>> automatically? I don't see how else it could work.
>>
>> The eight "best" second place sides go into a play off. The ninth second 
>> place team is out, simple as that (and it better not be us)!
>>
>> Europe has 13 qualifying places available. The 9 group winners go through 
>> plus 4 second place teams (the play off winners).
> Ah right, I understand now. Brain still a bit fuzzy from last night.
> I'm optimistic now.

Holland seems to be a reasonable draw, but I cant say I am optimistic about 
topping the group. That means we are in a fight for 2nd spot which means 
that we could play off against a good team such as Croatia, Czech republic 
etc.

"ZB"  wrote in message 
news:5qu30rF11po33U1@mid.individual.net...
>
> "beer" <beer@.donteventhinkaboutit.com> wrote in message 
> news:ICi2j.23753$JA1.17927@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>> Stevio wrote:
>>> "i"  wrote in message news:4749b065$0$31650
>>>> I still don't quite get it.
>>>> There's 9 Groups.
>>>> 8 groups have 6 teams, and 1 groups has 5.
>>>> 8 Second place teams go into playoff games.
>>>>
>>>> That still leaves 1 second place team spare!
>>>> Does the best second place team go through with all the group winners 
>>>> automatically? I don't see how else it could work.
>>>
>>> The eight "best" second place sides go into a play off. The ninth second 
>>> place team is out, simple as that (and it better not be us)!
>>>
>>> Europe has 13 qualifying places available. The 9 group winners go 
>>> through plus 4 second place teams (the play off winners).
>> Ah right, I understand now. Brain still a bit fuzzy from last night.
>> I'm optimistic now.
>
> Holland seems to be a reasonable draw, but I cant say I am optimistic 
> about topping the group. That means we are in a fight for 2nd spot which 
> means that we could play off against a good team such as Croatia, Czech 
> republic etc.

Or England?

"Grande Mal"  wrote in message 
news:ijn2j.9672$Ji6.1087@edtnps89...
>
> "ZB"  wrote in message 
> news:5qu30rF11po33U1@mid.individual.net...
>>
>> "beer" <beer@.donteventhinkaboutit.com> wrote in message 
>> news:ICi2j.23753$JA1.17927@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>>> Stevio wrote:
>>>> "i"  wrote in message news:4749b065$0$31650
>>>>> I still don't quite get it.
>>>>> There's 9 Groups.
>>>>> 8 groups have 6 teams, and 1 groups has 5.
>>>>> 8 Second place teams go into playoff games.
>>>>>
>>>>> That still leaves 1 second place team spare!
>>>>> Does the best second place team go through with all the group winners 
>>>>> automatically? I don't see how else it could work.
>>>>
>>>> The eight "best" second place sides go into a play off. The ninth 
>>>> second place team is out, simple as that (and it better not be us)!
>>>>
>>>> Europe has 13 qualifying places available. The 9 group winners go 
>>>> through plus 4 second place teams (the play off winners).
>>> Ah right, I understand now. Brain still a bit fuzzy from last night.
>>> I'm optimistic now.
>>
>> Holland seems to be a reasonable draw, but I cant say I am optimistic 
>> about topping the group. That means we are in a fight for 2nd spot which 
>> means that we could play off against a good team such as Croatia, Czech 
>> republic etc.
>
> Or England?
>
He said good team ;op

"ZB"  wrote
> That means we are in a fight for 2nd spot which means that we could play
> off against a good team such as Croatia, Czech republic

Second placed teams last time in the 2006 World Cup qualifiers (just to give
an idea of the quality of opposition we might get) were:

Sweden
Poland
Norway
Switzerland
Spain
Czech Republic
Turkey
Slovakia

If it was similar teams this time, I would give us a reasonable chance
against everyone bar Spain and possibly the Czech Republic. No doubt there
will be 1 or 2 big fish that end up in 2nd place in their groups this time
around too, it is just your luck of the draw.

In recent play offs we have had England and the Netherlands, we won 1 leg 
and lost by more in the other leg.

"Stevio"  wrote in message 
news:YPn2j.31873$ib1.31858@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
> "ZB"  wrote
>> That means we are in a fight for 2nd spot which means that we could play
>> off against a good team such as Croatia, Czech republic
>
> Second placed teams last time in the 2006 World Cup qualifiers (just to 
> give
> an idea of the quality of opposition we might get) were:
>
> Sweden
> Poland
> Norway
> Switzerland
> Spain
> Czech Republic
> Turkey
> Slovakia
>
> If it was similar teams this time, I would give us a reasonable chance
> against everyone bar Spain and possibly the Czech Republic. No doubt there
> will be 1 or 2 big fish that end up in 2nd place in their groups this time
> around too, it is just your luck of the draw.
>
> In recent play offs we have had England and the Netherlands, we won 1 leg 
> and lost by more in the other leg.
>

Thing i notice in our group is there really isnt a so called minnow team so 
think it could make for a tight group which isnt such a bad thing!

JB

"Jonbhoy"  wrote in message
> Thing i notice in our group is there really isnt a so called minnow team 
> so think it could make for a tight group which isnt such a bad thing!

At the end of the day, if we had a bottom seed like Estonia, everyone should 
beat them home and away anyway, so what difference does it make? Anyone that 
drops points to them probably wouldn't be in the mix for qualifying at the 
end of the campaign either, so basically it just saves a couple games.

Maybe we can arrange that England "friendly" now. The home internationals / 
Celtic Cup is no-goer though, the only games that would capture the public's 
interest are Scotland v England, and if the 2 Irelands played each other.

"Stevio"  wrote in message 
news:3MB2j.43947$6v.32930@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...
> "Jonbhoy"  wrote in message
>> Thing i notice in our group is there really isnt a so called minnow team 
>> so think it could make for a tight group which isnt such a bad thing!
>
> At the end of the day, if we had a bottom seed like Estonia, everyone 
> should beat them home and away anyway, so what difference does it make? 
> Anyone that drops points to them probably wouldn't be in the mix for 
> qualifying at the end of the campaign either, so basically it just saves a 
> couple games.

I disagree,to me if we say had a 6 team group and two were minnows you would 
end up with a split league points wise and the remaining four scrapping it 
out.If you have a minnow free league then if you slip up theres a good 
chance one of the other teams will do you a favour.Saves the kind of last 
games where you play a top team having to win while praying faroe islands 
can beat france 8-0! ;-)

> Maybe we can arrange that England "friendly" now. The home internationals 
> / Celtic Cup is no-goer though, the only games that would capture the 
> public's interest are Scotland v England, and if the 2 Irelands played 
> each other.

Id like to see an auld enemy game again but an english friend of mine whoes 
pretty level headed about it all says he wouldnt.Basically he says theres to 
much chance of the idiot element in the fans rearing their head again.....i 
didnt push it further to ask if he just meant the english element! ;-)

JB

"Jonbhoy"  wrote in message
> I disagree,to me if we say had a 6 team group and two were minnows you 
> would end up with a split league points wise and the remaining four 
> scrapping it out.If you have a minnow free league then if you slip up 
> theres a good chance one of the other teams will do you a favour.Saves the 
> kind of last games where you play a top team having to win while praying 
> faroe islands can beat france 8-0! ;-)

I'm not entirely sure I follow what you mean, but basically, in our Euro 
2008 group for example, the Faroe Islands got 0 points, so if they hadn't 
been there it would have made no difference at all, everyone would just have 
6 points less. Nowadays goal difference often doesn't matter too much either 
so there isn't much incentive to try and run up a big score.

Looking at our group from Euro 2008, if you take away 6 points from Georgia 
(who got 10), that leaves them with 4 points, 3 of which came against us! So 
basically they picked up only 1 other point, makes you realise just how poor 
our performance and result was when we lost to them, that they only got 1 
draw and 8 defeats from their other 9 games.

If we'd beaten Georgia we'd be through.

"Stevio"  wrote in message 
news:HiJ2j.49859$T8.4556@newsfe5-win.ntli.net...
>>
> If we'd beaten Georgia we'd be through.

That's the tough-to-swallow fact coming out ot the tournament. It was 
Georgia (no disrespect intended) and it was nearly their under-21 team. 
That's when the tournament was lost- not when the ref awarded a free kick to 
Italy.

"Stevio"  wrote in message 
news:3MB2j.43947$6v.32930@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...
> "Jonbhoy"  wrote in message
>> Thing i notice in our group is there really isnt a so called minnow team 
>> so think it could make for a tight group which isnt such a bad thing!
>
> At the end of the day, if we had a bottom seed like Estonia, everyone 
> should beat them home and away anyway, so what difference does it make? 
> Anyone that drops points to them probably wouldn't be in the mix for 
> qualifying at the end of the campaign either, so basically it just saves a 
> couple games.
>
> Maybe we can arrange that England "friendly" now. The home internationals 
> / Celtic Cup is no-goer though, the only games that would capture the 
> public's interest are Scotland v England, and if the 2 Irelands played 
> each other.
>

I've always wondered what the Catholic/republican-minded NI players thought 
if faced with playing against the ROI? Any of them ever commented on it? 
Just curious...

> If we'd beaten Georgia we'd be through.
>
>

Do you really think France and Ukraine would have drawn if France hadn't 
already been through?

"Moody Marco" wrote
> "Stevio" wrote
>> "Jonbhoy"  wrote in message
>>> Thing i notice in our group is there really isnt a so called minnow team 
>>> so think it could make for a tight group which isnt such a bad thing!
>>
>> At the end of the day, if we had a bottom seed like Estonia, everyone 
>> should beat them home and away anyway, so what difference does it make? 
>> Anyone that drops points to them probably wouldn't be in the mix for 
>> qualifying at the end of the campaign either, so basically it just saves 
>> a couple games.
>>
>> Maybe we can arrange that England "friendly" now. The home internationals 
>> / Celtic Cup is no-goer though, the only games that would capture the 
>> public's interest are Scotland v England, and if the 2 Irelands played 
>> each other.
>
> I've always wondered what the Catholic/republican-minded NI players 
> thought if faced with playing against the ROI? Any of them ever commented 
> on it? Just curious...

Maybe like the schizophrenia Andy Goram would have felt if he played for 
Scotland against England...

liam wrote:
> "Moody Marco" wrote
>> "Stevio" wrote
>>> "Jonbhoy"  wrote in message
>>>> Thing i notice in our group is there really isnt a so called
>>>> minnow team so think it could make for a tight group which isnt
>>>> such a bad thing!
>>>
>>> At the end of the day, if we had a bottom seed like Estonia,
>>> everyone should beat them home and away anyway, so what difference
>>> does it make? Anyone that drops points to them probably wouldn't be
>>> in the mix for qualifying at the end of the campaign either, so
>>> basically it just saves a couple games.
>>>
>>> Maybe we can arrange that England "friendly" now. The home
>>> internationals / Celtic Cup is no-goer though, the only games that
>>> would capture the public's interest are Scotland v England, and if
>>> the 2 Irelands played each other.
>>
>> I've always wondered what the Catholic/republican-minded NI players
>> thought if faced with playing against the ROI? Any of them ever
>> commented on it? Just curious...
>
> Maybe like the schizophrenia Andy Goram would have felt if he played
> for Scotland against England...