Has any past leader who's seriously offering themselves up a potential Prime 
Minister/First Minister fought a seat that's either deep in the target list 
or where the party's a third place?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4615942.stm

Salmond sets his sights on Gordon

SNP leader Alex Salmond is planning to fight the Gordon constituency in the 
2007 Scottish Parliament elections.

The Banff and Buchan MP would be taking on the current holder of the seat, 
Liberal Democrat MSP Nora Radcliffe.

At a meeting in Oldmeldrum on Sunday, Mr Salmond accepted an invitation from 
local activists to put his name forward for selection.

A final decision on the nomination will be made by local nationalist members 
in the next few weeks.

Gordon is currently held by Ms Radcliffe and is seen by the Scottish 
National Party as its 18th "most-winnable" seat.

Mr Salmond said he had considered fighting Aberdeen Central, a seat held by 
Scottish Executive minister Lewis MacDonald, but instead chose Gordon.

The constituency overlaps with his current Westminster seat, with some 
10,000 of his present constituents in the Scottish parliamentary seat.

A further 6,000 of the Gordon electorate are also in the SNP-held Moray seat 
at Westminster.

Speaking at the SNP meeting, he said: "I said that I would stand for the 
Scottish Parliament in this corner of Scotland and that is exactly what I 
intend to do.

"The issues of the rural economy and services are vital across the north 
east of Scotland and these will be at the centre of our campaign.

"The SNP need to gain 20 new seats to win that election and become 
Scotland's leading party.

'Most-winnable'

"The Gordon seat is the 18th most-winnable on that list of potential gains. 
Therefore, Gordon will be the crucible of the election. If we win Gordon 
then the SNP will be well on our way to a famous victory across Scotland. "

Mr Salmond said he expected a "tough fight".

"I take nothing for granted, but we intend to win," he said. "I am looking 
forward enormously to this challenge as is every single local SNP activist."

He added: "Many thousands of my current constituents are already in this 
seat.

"The north east is not just my political base but my home and this decision 
gives me the opportunity to continue to represent this wonderful corner of 
Scotland."

Mr Salmond denied that present problems within the Liberal Democrats 
influenced his decision. He said it was gaining seats in the upcoming 
election not just holding seats currently held by the SNP.

"They certainly haven't done themselves any favours by their shabby 
treatment of Charles Kennedy," he said.

"However my decision was made on the positive merits of what the SNP can do 
for the people of Aberdeenshire and Scotland not the failings of any other 
party."

Mr Salmond is also expected to head the north east SNP list, meaning he 
could return as an MSP without having to win the Gordon seat.

At the last Holyrood election the SNP came third behind the Conservatives in 
Gordon.

Dunfermline by-election

The SNP has also named its candidate for the Westminster by-election 
triggered by the death of Labour MP Rachel Squire.

Former councillor Douglas Chapman, who fought the seat of Dunfermline and 
West Fife in the May general election, was selected to contest the seat once 
again.

Mr Chapman, a former councillor for Rosyth West, has lived in Dunfermline 
for 15 years.

Ms Squire died on 5 January after a long battle against illness.

Despite being unwell, she fought the general election in May and was 
returned for her Dunfermline and West Fife seat with an 11,562 majority.

"Tim Roll-Pickering"  wrote in message 
news:431jlqF1krmveU1@individual.net...
> Has any past leader who's seriously offering themselves up a potential 
> Prime Minister/First Minister fought a seat that's either deep in the 
> target list or where the party's a third place?

I don't think it's entirely absurd if you take the view that Salmond's 
someone who's in politics to change things, and he'll only change things if 
he wins power, so why not stand for a seat that, if it's won, will likely 
give them power...if he loses, then the SNP are set for another four years 
of opposition and why be a part of that?

That said, he has a high profile and could, theoretically secure a larger 
swing in Gordon than his party achieves anywhere else, so he could end up in 
opposition again having won!

Adam

Adam Gray wrote:

>> Has any past leader who's seriously offering themselves up a potential 
>> Prime Minister/First Minister fought a seat that's either deep in the 
>> target list or where the party's a third place?

> I don't think it's entirely absurd if you take the view that Salmond's 
> someone who's in politics to change things, and he'll only change things 
> if he wins power, so why not stand for a seat that, if it's won, will 
> likely give them power...if he loses, then the SNP are set for another 
> four years of opposition and why be a part of that?

> That said, he has a high profile and could, theoretically secure a larger 
> swing in Gordon than his party achieves anywhere else, so he could end up 
> in opposition again having won!

Of course there's also the top up list - and Richard Lochhead's selection 
for Moray will make it easier for Salmond to get in by the backdoor. So he'd 
still be there in opposition.

But is Salmond really best deployed in fighting a seat where the SNP aren't 
even the main challengers to the Lib Dems, nor the highest polling non 
coalition partners, rather than leading the campaign across the country?

"Tim Roll-Pickering"  wrote in message 
news:432013F1lkohhU1@individual.net...
> Adam Gray wrote:
>
>>> Has any past leader who's seriously offering themselves up a potential 
>>> Prime Minister/First Minister fought a seat that's either deep in the 
>>> target list or where the party's a third place?
>
>> I don't think it's entirely absurd if you take the view that Salmond's 
>> someone who's in politics to change things, and he'll only change things 
>> if he wins power, so why not stand for a seat that, if it's won, will 
>> likely give them power...if he loses, then the SNP are set for another 
>> four years of opposition and why be a part of that?
>
>> That said, he has a high profile and could, theoretically secure a larger 
>> swing in Gordon than his party achieves anywhere else, so he could end up 
>> in opposition again having won!
>
> Of course there's also the top up list - and Richard Lochhead's selection 
> for Moray will make it easier for Salmond to get in by the backdoor. So 
> he'd still be there in opposition.
>
> But is Salmond really best deployed in fighting a seat where the SNP 
> aren't even the main challengers to the Lib Dems, nor the highest polling 
> non coalition partners, rather than leading the campaign across the 
> country?
If we look back before the 2003 elections, the SNP were second in Gordon in 
1999 after the Tory vote collapsed by another 6% compared to 1997. In that 
particular contest there was also an Independent candidate called Hamish 
Watt who was an SNP MP in the 70s.

Gordon is the neighbouring seat and, as the BBC article says, contains 16000 
voters from the new, enlarged Banff & Buchan seat. While Aberdeen Central 
might have been the better target, Salmond will be familiar with a rural 
Aberdeenshire constituency and could pull off what another candidate 
couldn't.

Tim Roll-Pickering wrote:
> Has any past leader who's seriously offering themselves up a potential Prime
> Minister/First Minister fought a seat that's either deep in the target list
> or where the party's a third place?
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4615942.stm
>
> Salmond sets his sights on Gordon
>
> SNP leader Alex Salmond is planning to fight the Gordon constituency in the
> 2007 Scottish Parliament elections.


I may be wrong, but I believe that Ken Livingstone deliberately moved
to a marginal constituency for the 1981 GLC elections because he didn't
have any appetite for being elected as a member but staying in
opposition.  Thus a victory for him personally would only happen in the
event of a Labour victory overall.

"JohnLoony"  wrote in message

> I may be wrong, but I believe that Ken Livingstone deliberately moved
> to a marginal constituency for the 1981 GLC elections because he didn't
> have any appetite for being elected as a member but staying in
> opposition.  Thus a victory for him personally would only happen in the
> event of a Labour victory overall.

Labour Opposition Leader in Westminster Councillor Paul Dimoldenburg moved 
to the key swing ward of Cavendish in 1990...didn't work out for him too 
well, that one...

Labour Hammersmith & Fulham Council Leader Stephen Burke is standing in 
marginal Fulham Reach ward in May for similar reasons; he currently 
represents the safest Labour ward in the borough: Wormholt & White City.

Adam

In article ,
 "JohnLoony"  wrote:
>
> I may be wrong, but I believe that Ken Livingstone deliberately moved
> to a marginal constituency for the 1981 GLC elections because he didn't
> have any appetite for being elected as a member but staying in
> opposition.  Thus a victory for him personally would only happen in the
> event of a Labour victory overall.

He did, although he had moved from marginal Norwood in 1977 to safe
Hackney North and Stoke Newington. In 1981 he moved to marginal 
Paddington and had one of the biggest swings in London, which was one
of the earliest seats to declare then. This misled the television
election reporting teams who assumed a much bigger Labour victory than
was actually the case.

-- 
http://www.election.demon.co.uk
"We can also agree that Saddam Hussein most certainly has chemical and biolog-
ical weapons and is working towards a nuclear capability. The dossier contains
confirmation of information that we either knew or most certainly should have
been willing to assume." - Menzies Campbell, 24th September 2002.

In article <dqgvkt$73o$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk>,
 "Adam Gray"  wrote:
> "JohnLoony"  wrote in message
> 
> > I may be wrong, but I believe that Ken Livingstone deliberately moved
> > to a marginal constituency for the 1981 GLC elections because he didn't
> > have any appetite for being elected as a member but staying in
> > opposition.  Thus a victory for him personally would only happen in the
> > event of a Labour victory overall.
> 
> Labour Opposition Leader in Westminster Councillor Paul Dimoldenburg moved 
> to the key swing ward of Cavendish in 1990...didn't work out for him too 
> well, that one...

The once and future King, as Paul returned for Queen's Park ward in 1997.

-- 
http://www.election.demon.co.uk
"We can also agree that Saddam Hussein most certainly has chemical and biolog-
ical weapons and is working towards a nuclear capability. The dossier contains
confirmation of information that we either knew or most certainly should have
been willing to assume." - Menzies Campbell, 24th September 2002.

"David Boothroyd"  wrote in message 
news:david-82B6E6.21120316012006@news.news.demon.net...
> In article <dqgvkt$73o$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk>,
> "Adam Gray"  wrote:
>> "JohnLoony"  wrote in message
>>
>> > I may be wrong, but I believe that Ken Livingstone deliberately moved
>> > to a marginal constituency for the 1981 GLC elections because he didn't
>> > have any appetite for being elected as a member but staying in
>> > opposition.  Thus a victory for him personally would only happen in the
>> > event of a Labour victory overall.
>>
>> Labour Opposition Leader in Westminster Councillor Paul Dimoldenburg 
>> moved
>> to the key swing ward of Cavendish in 1990...didn't work out for him too
>> well, that one...
>
> The once and future King, as Paul returned for Queen's Park ward in 1997.

Was that his old ward pre 1990?

Adam

In article <dqh9jk$6oo$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>,
 "Adam Gray"  wrote:
> "David Boothroyd"  wrote in message 
> news:david-82B6E6.21120316012006@news.news.demon.net...
> > In article <dqgvkt$73o$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk>,
> > "Adam Gray"  wrote:
> >> Labour Opposition Leader in Westminster Councillor Paul Dimoldenberg 
> >> moved to the key swing ward of Cavendish in 1990...didn't work out
> >> for him too well, that one...
> >
> > The once and future King, as Paul returned for Queen's Park ward in 1997.
> 
> Was that his old ward pre 1990?

No - he was in Harrow Road 1982-1990.

-- 
http://www.election.demon.co.uk
"We can also agree that Saddam Hussein most certainly has chemical and biolog-
ical weapons and is working towards a nuclear capability. The dossier contains
confirmation of information that we either knew or most certainly should have
been willing to assume." - Menzies Campbell, 24th September 2002.