<http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200227110930&ru=htt
p%3A%2F%2Fsearch.ebay.co.uk%3A80%2Fsearch%2Fsearch.dll%3Ffrom%3DR40%26_tr
ksid%3Dm37%26satitle%3D200227110930%26fvi%3D1>

Hey. It's in Glossop. No shipping to pay. Yay!!

Nige.

-- 
Nev
snowman1@molars.yetitracks.org.uk
Remove the teeth from my email address to reply

> <http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200227110930&ru=htt
> p%3A%2F%2Fsearch.ebay.co.uk%3A80%2Fsearch%2Fsearch.dll%3Ffrom%3DR40%26_tr
> ksid%3Dm37%26satitle%3D200227110930%26fvi%3D1>
> 
> Hey. It's in Glossop. No shipping to pay. Yay!!

Easier to manage URL:

http://tinyurl.com/3kyd2h

As to the item in question ... No comment. Yet.

Al.

Good Grief !!!
And just look at the other items for sale list.

Who the hell buys something like this ??
What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.

I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
its just to much money to actually play.
this is not about music is it ?
(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")  mouse

In article <483dc63e$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>,
 "Trimble Bracegirdle"  wrote:

> Good Grief !!!
> And just look at the other items for sale list.

Indeed...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1960-GIBSON-LES-PAUL-STANDARD-EARLY-SERIAL-0-8875_W
0QQitemZ200227133389

I think I've just had an accident.

> 
> Who the hell buys something like this ??
> What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.

Yeah, and I guess the high price is a direct result of the sort of 
people who buy it... investors who have no intention of playing it. 
These things are workhorses, designed to do a job, not sit in a bank 
vault.

> 
> I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
> its just to much money to actually play.

Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music. 
£1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it has 
the potential to earn you money over years and decades.


adrian

-- 
http://www.spaghetti-factory.co.uk
http://www.myspace.com/adrianclarkmusic

On 28 May, 19:30, Nev  wrote:
> <http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200227110930&ru=htt
> p%3A%2F%2Fsearch.ebay.co.uk%3A80%2Fsearch%2Fsearch.dll%3Ffrom%3DR40%26_tr
> ksid%3Dm37%26satitle%3D200227110930%26fvi%3D1>
>
> Hey. It's in Glossop. No shipping to pay. Yay!!
>
> Nige.
>
> --
> Nev
> snowm...@molars.yetitracks.org.uk
> Remove the teeth from my email address to reply

The Olympic White Strat took my fancy . And yes i would pay the asking
price .But unfortunately im not a Euro mp .

Adrian Clark wrote:
> 
> Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music. 
> £1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it has 
> the potential to earn you money over years and decades.

On the other hand - http://tinyurl.com/3zaal6

Mark Bluemel wrote:
> Adrian Clark wrote:
>>
>> Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music. 
>> £1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it 
>> has the potential to earn you money over years and decades.
> 
> On the other hand - http://tinyurl.com/3zaal6

Quite right - on the other hand, it IS possible to get a playable 
instrument for £150, even today.

The difference, though (assuming that the £150 guitar wasn't a £1500 
guitar sold by a seller who didn't know what it was worth), is that a 
cheap guitar is less likely to last a lifetime, less likely to give 
overall "professional" results, less likely to be worth repairing or 
refurbishing (in economic terms) and less likely to appreciate in value.

"Adrian Clark"  wrote in message 
news:sfocata-4589AD.22522628052008@news.zen.co.uk...
> In article <483dc63e$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>,
> "Trimble Bracegirdle"  wrote:
>
>> Good Grief !!!
>> And just look at the other items for sale list.
>
> Indeed...
>
> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1960-GIBSON-LES-PAUL-STANDARD-EARLY-SERIAL-0-8875_W
> 0QQitemZ200227133389
>
> I think I've just had an accident.
>
>>
>> Who the hell buys something like this ??
>> What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>
> Yeah, and I guess the high price is a direct result of the sort of
> people who buy it... investors who have no intention of playing it.
> These things are workhorses, designed to do a job, not sit in a bank
> vault.
>
>>
>> I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
>> its just to much money to actually play.
>
> Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music.
> £1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it has
> the potential to earn you money over years and decades.

All agreed, Adrian.
However, I have a (probably irrational) aversion to Gibson's prices, and 
being a cheapskate, can't see what a Gibson LP offers over and above my 
Gordon-Smith Graduate, which retails new at half the price of a Gibbo. 
(Needless to say, I got mine second-hand, so it was even cheaper!)
It's hand-made, built like a tank, looks and sounds like an LP and is more 
versatile, having coil-tapping on both pickups.
Sits back and prepares to be flamed by Gibbo-owners.....

George

George Weston wrote:
> "Adrian Clark"  wrote in message 
> news:sfocata-4589AD.22522628052008@news.zen.co.uk...
>> In article <483dc63e$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>,
>> "Trimble Bracegirdle"  wrote:
>>
>>> Good Grief !!!
>>> And just look at the other items for sale list.
>> Indeed...
>>
>> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1960-GIBSON-LES-PAUL-STANDARD-EARLY-SERIAL-0-8875_W
>> 0QQitemZ200227133389
>>
>> I think I've just had an accident.
>>
>>> Who the hell buys something like this ??
>>> What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>> Yeah, and I guess the high price is a direct result of the sort of
>> people who buy it... investors who have no intention of playing it.
>> These things are workhorses, designed to do a job, not sit in a bank
>> vault.
>>
>>> I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
>>> its just to much money to actually play.
>> Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music.
>> £1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it has
>> the potential to earn you money over years and decades.
> 
> All agreed, Adrian.
> However, I have a (probably irrational) aversion to Gibson's prices, and 
> being a cheapskate, can't see what a Gibson LP offers over and above my 
> Gordon-Smith Graduate, which retails new at half the price of a Gibbo. > (Needless to say, I got mine second-hand, so it was even cheaper!)
> It's hand-made, built like a tank, looks and sounds like an LP and is more 
> versatile, having coil-tapping on both pickups.
> Sits back and prepares to be flamed by Gibbo-owners.....
> 
> George
> 
> 
I'm a Gibbo owner  AND  an ex G&S owner...
I prefered my Gibsons for the complexity of tone that a good one gives 
out. I don't think the G&S I had and others I have played quite do that 
as well. Superb guitars though G&S especially in my opinion the simplest models...
Having said that, my Gibsons don't leave their cases much since I 
indulged in 2 Sid Poole LP's which are just out of this world...
I think with Gibsons it's more the lack if consistency which is 
annoying, but a good one is still a stonking guitar. Resale is better 
than most other guitars, so that is an advantage IF you sell guitars 
(something I seem very bad at)

"david morley"  wrote in message 
news:6aauurF36ppq3U1@mid.individual.net...
George Weston wrote:
> "Adrian Clark"  wrote in message 
> news:sfocata-4589AD.22522628052008@news.zen.co.uk...
>> In article <483dc63e$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>,
>> "Trimble Bracegirdle"  wrote:
>>
>>> Good Grief !!!
>>> And just look at the other items for sale list.
>> Indeed...
>>
>> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1960-GIBSON-LES-PAUL-STANDARD-EARLY-SERIAL-0-8875_W
>> 0QQitemZ200227133389
>>
>> I think I've just had an accident.
>>
>>> Who the hell buys something like this ??
>>> What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>> Yeah, and I guess the high price is a direct result of the sort of
>> people who buy it... investors who have no intention of playing it.
>> These things are workhorses, designed to do a job, not sit in a bank
>> vault.
>>
>>> I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe 
>>> £1300
>>> its just to much money to actually play.
>> Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music.
>> £1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it has
>> the potential to earn you money over years and decades.
>
> All agreed, Adrian.
> However, I have a (probably irrational) aversion to Gibson's prices, and 
> being a cheapskate, can't see what a Gibson LP offers over and above my 
> Gordon-Smith Graduate, which retails new at half the price of a Gibbo. 
> (Needless to say, I got mine second-hand, so it was even cheaper!)
> It's hand-made, built like a tank, looks and sounds like an LP and is more 
> versatile, having coil-tapping on both pickups.
> Sits back and prepares to be flamed by Gibbo-owners.....
>
> George
>
>
I'm a Gibbo owner  AND  an ex G&S owner...
I prefered my Gibsons for the complexity of tone that a good one gives
out. I don't think the G&S I had and others I have played quite do that
as well. Superb guitars though G&S especially in my opinion the simplest
models...
Having said that, my Gibsons don't leave their cases much since I
indulged in 2 Sid Poole LP's which are just out of this world...
I think with Gibsons it's more the lack if consistency which is
annoying, but a good one is still a stonking guitar. Resale is better
than most other guitars, so that is an advantage IF you sell guitars
(something I seem very bad at)

Sell?
Sorry - do not understand that word....
;-)

George

George Weston wrote:
> "david morley"  wrote in message 
> news:6aauurF36ppq3U1@mid.individual.net...
> George Weston wrote:
>> "Adrian Clark"  wrote in message 
>> news:sfocata-4589AD.22522628052008@news.zen.co.uk...
>>> In article <483dc63e$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>,
>>> "Trimble Bracegirdle"  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Good Grief !!!
>>>> And just look at the other items for sale list.
>>> Indeed...
>>>
>>> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1960-GIBSON-LES-PAUL-STANDARD-EARLY-SERIAL-0-8875_W
>>> 0QQitemZ200227133389
>>>
>>> I think I've just had an accident.
>>>
>>>> Who the hell buys something like this ??
>>>> What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>>> Yeah, and I guess the high price is a direct result of the sort of
>>> people who buy it... investors who have no intention of playing it.
>>> These things are workhorses, designed to do a job, not sit in a bank
>>> vault.
>>>
>>>> I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe >>>> £1300
>>>> its just to much money to actually play.
>>> Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music.
>>> £1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it has
>>> the potential to earn you money over years and decades.
>> All agreed, Adrian.
>> However, I have a (probably irrational) aversion to Gibson's prices, and 
>> being a cheapskate, can't see what a Gibson LP offers over and above my 
>> Gordon-Smith Graduate, which retails new at half the price of a Gibbo. 
>> (Needless to say, I got mine second-hand, so it was even cheaper!)
>> It's hand-made, built like a tank, looks and sounds like an LP and is more 
>> versatile, having coil-tapping on both pickups.
>> Sits back and prepares to be flamed by Gibbo-owners.....
>>
>> George
>>
>>
> I'm a Gibbo owner  AND  an ex G&S owner...
> I prefered my Gibsons for the complexity of tone that a good one gives
> out. I don't think the G&S I had and others I have played quite do that> as well. Superb guitars though G&S especially in my opinion the simplest
> models...
> Having said that, my Gibsons don't leave their cases much since I
> indulged in 2 Sid Poole LP's which are just out of this world...
> I think with Gibsons it's more the lack if consistency which is
> annoying, but a good one is still a stonking guitar. Resale is better
> than most other guitars, so that is an advantage IF you sell guitars
> (something I seem very bad at)
> 
> Sell?
> Sorry - do not understand that word....
> ;-)
> 
> George
> 
> 
Yes, sorry about that.
Perhaps if you can imagine the opposite of "Buy" then the concept 
becomes clear, although it is (obviously) purely theoretical..

On Wed, 28 May 2008 22:52:27 +0100, Adrian Clark 
wrote:

>> Who the hell buys something like this ??
>> What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>
>Yeah, and I guess the high price is a direct result of the sort of 
>people who buy it... investors who have no intention of playing it. 
>These things are workhorses, designed to do a job, not sit in a bank 
>vault.
>
>> 
>> I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
>> its just to much money to actually play.
>
>Depends on what you consider a worthwhile investment in your music. 
>£1300 is a perfectly normal amount to pay for a pro instrument... it has 
>the potential to earn you money over years and decades.

I don't know that many super-rich people, although I have known one or
two - even taught a millionaire for a while.

It's a different world where people spend as much money on a car as
some people would on a house and I've come to the conclusion that most
people tend to spend according to their budget, and where money is
virtually no object then they'll spend accordingly.

Now, I wouldn't spend that much on any guitar, but that's hardly
likely to happen given my current financial situation. But if I was
rich enough, who knows?

What leaves a sour taste in the mouth in all this is the thought that
such a guitar is going to be used for investment purposes and not be
played by someone who is going to use it in a manner it was intended
for when it was first made.

But that's really not that far from the cliche of the Van Gogh in the
bank vault, is it?

My take on this - essentially - is that if people want to spend vast
amounts of dosh on anything then let them - as long as no-one gets
harmed in any way. I've come a long way from the time when I viewed
all property as theft and now view such vast sums of money spent on
things like guitars, cars and property as totally irrelevant as far as
my current lifestyle is concerned.

Steve.

"SteveShark" <steveATguitarsDOTpowernetDOTcoDOTuk> wrote in message 
news:gj8244tqtbjardvi761nt22hq8k43p7a54@4ax.com...
>
> What leaves a sour taste in the mouth in all this is the thought that
> such a guitar is going to be used for investment purposes and not be
> played by someone who is going to use it in a manner it was intended
> for when it was first made.

But there are plenty more equally good and much cheaper guitars left outside 
of bank vaults.

> My take on this - essentially - is that if people want to spend vast
> amounts of dosh on anything then let them - as long as no-one gets
> harmed in any way.

Indeed. Live and let live.

Steve.

On Sat, 31 May 2008 10:35:46 GMT, "Steve Robinson"
 wrote:

>"SteveShark" <steveATguitarsDOTpowernetDOTcoDOTuk> wrote in message 
>news:gj8244tqtbjardvi761nt22hq8k43p7a54@4ax.com...
>>
>> What leaves a sour taste in the mouth in all this is the thought that
>> such a guitar is going to be used for investment purposes and not be
>> played by someone who is going to use it in a manner it was intended
>> for when it was first made.
>
>But there are plenty more equally good and much cheaper guitars left outside 
>of bank vaults.

Oh indeed, and TBH there are probably plenty of set ups you could rig
up following which you could blindfold someone and ask them whether it
was a 1960 Standard they were hearing or an Epi copy, for example.

I'd bet money that people wouldn't be right all the time - maybe half?

I'd also bet that if you did the same with a Stradivarius and a pretty
standard violin that more people would be able to hear the difference.

And that's the kicker...you might pay a lot of money for a nice old LP
Standard, but it really isn't worth exponentially more than a standard
Standard (!).

At the end of the day, it's a nice old guitar, not particularly
carefully made and not really that old.

Whereas a nice Stradivarius has all the qualities the '60 LP hasn't
got, plus it's also way more valuable *and* you get to hear them as
the top professional violinists want to use them because of their
quality sound.

What I find particularly gratifying is that private collectors of
Strads will loan them out quite often so that they and others can hear
them played properly.

When was the last time you heard of that being done with a guitar?

Steve.

On Wed, 28 May 2008 21:53:13 +0100, "Trimble Bracegirdle"
 wrote:

>Good Grief !!!
>And just look at the other items for sale list.
>
>Who the hell buys something like this ??
>What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>
>I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
>its just to much money to actually play.

Is it? Last year I was up for buying a Ricky bass because I've always
wanted one and I could afford it. It's very difficult to buy them for
less, even second-hand. I would have had one, too, if one had crossed my
path at the right time.

Fortunately for my wallet, the nice man in Sound Control handed me the
Fender I had never wanted but which proved too nice not to buy. And
saved me half my money in the process.

And yes, I think it is worth that amount.
-- 
Chris Bolus (change o to zero to reply by email)
A guitar is for life, not just for Christmas!

Chris Bolus  wrote:

> On Wed, 28 May 2008 21:53:13 +0100, "Trimble Bracegirdle"
>  wrote:
> 
> >Good Grief !!!
> >And just look at the other items for sale list.
> >
> >Who the hell buys something like this ??
> >What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
> >
> >I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
> >its just to much money to actually play.
> 
> Is it? Last year I was up for buying a Ricky bass because I've always
> wanted one and I could afford it. It's very difficult to buy them for
> less, even second-hand. I would have had one, too, if one had crossed my
> path at the right time.
> 
> Fortunately for my wallet, the nice man in Sound Control handed me the
> Fender I had never wanted but which proved too nice not to buy. And
> saved me half my money in the process.
> 
> And yes, I think it is worth that amount.

I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
is not like anything actually has a value other than that.

I don't have a guitar of that cost, but then I can't justify it because
I am not good enough. However, I have other things that cost me that, so
I don't see it as unreasonable.

In article <1ihtipl.ezxflhejzavcN%usenet@alienrat.co.uk>,
 usenet@alienrat.co.uk (Woody) wrote:

> Chris Bolus  wrote:
> 
> > On Wed, 28 May 2008 21:53:13 +0100, "Trimble Bracegirdle"
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > >Good Grief !!!
> > >And just look at the other items for sale list.
> > >
> > >Who the hell buys something like this ??
> > >What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
> > >
> > >I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
> > >its just to much money to actually play.
> > 
> > Is it? Last year I was up for buying a Ricky bass because I've always
> > wanted one and I could afford it. It's very difficult to buy them for
> > less, even second-hand. I would have had one, too, if one had crossed my
> > path at the right time.
> > 
> > Fortunately for my wallet, the nice man in Sound Control handed me the
> > Fender I had never wanted but which proved too nice not to buy. And
> > saved me half my money in the process.
> > 
> > And yes, I think it is worth that amount.
> 
> I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
> is not like anything actually has a value other than that.

Emotionally (I was going to say technically, but that's not right), that 
is not a universal tenet of value. There are some things I have that 
no-one would pay for, but to me are valuable. Old photos and things are 
obvious, but there is my Epiphone Les Paul. I love that silly, little 
guitar, and to me it is worth more than its second-hand value. 

Houses are something that is uppermost in the minds of anyone talking 
about value at the moment, but houses are not simple in terms of value. 
Emotion comes into that too: "Oh Charlie darling, we simply must have 
this house, the kitchen is to die for and little Max[1] will so love the 
garden!"

1. Dear upper middle class, please can you stop calling your kids bloody 
'Max'.

Nige - trying to bring some warmth and happiness to UKMG .. one posting 
at a time.

-- 
Nev
snowman1@molars.yetitracks.org.uk
Remove the teeth from my email address to reply

Nev  wrote:

> In article <1ihtipl.ezxflhejzavcN%usenet@alienrat.co.uk>,
>  usenet@alienrat.co.uk (Woody) wrote:
> 
> > Chris Bolus  wrote:
> > 
> > > On Wed, 28 May 2008 21:53:13 +0100, "Trimble Bracegirdle"
> > >  wrote:
> > > 
> > > >Good Grief !!!
> > > >And just look at the other items for sale list.
> > > >
> > > >Who the hell buys something like this ??
> > > >What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
> > > >
> > > >I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
> > > >its just to much money to actually play.
> > > 
> > > Is it? Last year I was up for buying a Ricky bass because I've always
> > > wanted one and I could afford it. It's very difficult to buy them for
> > > less, even second-hand. I would have had one, too, if one had crossed my
> > > path at the right time.
> > > 
> > > Fortunately for my wallet, the nice man in Sound Control handed me the
> > > Fender I had never wanted but which proved too nice not to buy. And
> > > saved me half my money in the process.
> > > 
> > > And yes, I think it is worth that amount.
> > 
> > I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
> > is not like anything actually has a value other than that.
> 
> Emotionally (I was going to say technically, but that's not right), that
> is not a universal tenet of value. There are some things I have that 
> no-one would pay for, but to me are valuable. Old photos and things are
> obvious, but there is my Epiphone Les Paul. I love that silly, little
> guitar, and to me it is worth more than its second-hand value. 

The price that you would pay, not anyone else. Everything has a value,
even peoples life (when doing calculations on transport or military
operations).

> Houses are something that is uppermost in the minds of anyone talking
> about value at the moment, but houses are not simple in terms of value.
> Emotion comes into that too: "Oh Charlie darling, we simply must have
> this house, the kitchen is to die for and little Max[1] will so love the
> garden!"
> 
> 1. Dear upper middle class, please can you stop calling your kids bloody
> 'Max'.

Do they? I thought they called them something like 'Nigel'. They cant
all be stockbrokers surely?

"Woody"  wrote in message 
news:1ihtipl.ezxflhejzavcN%usenet@alienrat.co.uk...

> I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
> is not like anything actually has a value other than that.

I think my last car has scrap value based only on its weight and steel 
content.

icarusi
--

remove 00 to reply

icarusi  wrote:

> "Woody"  wrote in message 
> news:1ihtipl.ezxflhejzavcN%usenet@alienrat.co.uk...
> 
> > I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
> > is not like anything actually has a value other than that.
> 
> I think my last car has scrap value based only on its weight and steel
> content.

Well, I have had vehicles that were worth far less than that!

-- 
Woody

On Sat, 31 May 2008 18:45:53 +0100, usenet@alienrat.co.uk (Woody) wrote:

>Chris Bolus  wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 28 May 2008 21:53:13 +0100, "Trimble Bracegirdle"
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> >Good Grief !!!
>> >And just look at the other items for sale list.
>> >
>> >Who the hell buys something like this ??
>> >What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>> >
>> >I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
>> >its just to much money to actually play.
>> 
>> Is it? Last year I was up for buying a Ricky bass because I've always
>> wanted one and I could afford it. It's very difficult to buy them for
>> less, even second-hand. I would have had one, too, if one had crossed my
>> path at the right time.
>> 
>> Fortunately for my wallet, the nice man in Sound Control handed me the
>> Fender I had never wanted but which proved too nice not to buy. And
>> saved me half my money in the process.
>> 
>> And yes, I think it is worth that amount.
>
>I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
>is not like anything actually has a value other than that.
>
>I don't have a guitar of that cost, but then I can't justify it because
>I am not good enough. However, I have other things that cost me that, so
>I don't see it as unreasonable.
>
I can't justify it in terms of being good at it (though I do think it
makes it easier to be good when the guitar plays well). I justify it
because I've earned the dosh and it feels good to have it!

I'm after an Ampeg to go with it this summer...
-- 
Chris Bolus (change o to zero to reply by email)
A guitar is for life, not just for Christmas!

On Sat, 31 May 2008 20:42:24 +0100, Nev
 wrote:


>
>Emotionally (I was going to say technically, but that's not right), that 
>is not a universal tenet of value. There are some things I have that 
>no-one would pay for, but to me are valuable. Old photos and things are 
>obvious, but there is my Epiphone Les Paul. I love that silly, little 
>guitar, and to me it is worth more than its second-hand value. 
>
That Epi is a nice guitar. I feel the same way about my old CMI EB0
bass, which I still needs to restore the charred remains of...
-- 
Chris Bolus (change o to zero to reply by email)
A guitar is for life, not just for Christmas!

Chris Bolus  wrote:

> On Sat, 31 May 2008 18:45:53 +0100, usenet@alienrat.co.uk (Woody) wrote:
> 
> >Chris Bolus  wrote:
> >
> >> On Wed, 28 May 2008 21:53:13 +0100, "Trimble Bracegirdle"
> >>  wrote:
> >> 
> >> >Good Grief !!!
> >> >And just look at the other items for sale list.
> >> >
> >> >Who the hell buys something like this ??
> >> >What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
> >> >
> >> >I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
> >> >its just to much money to actually play.
> >> 
> >> Is it? Last year I was up for buying a Ricky bass because I've always
> >> wanted one and I could afford it. It's very difficult to buy them for
> >> less, even second-hand. I would have had one, too, if one had crossed my
> >> path at the right time.
> >> 
> >> Fortunately for my wallet, the nice man in Sound Control handed me the
> >> Fender I had never wanted but which proved too nice not to buy. And
> >> saved me half my money in the process.
> >> 
> >> And yes, I think it is worth that amount.
> >
> >I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
> >is not like anything actually has a value other than that.
> >
> >I don't have a guitar of that cost, but then I can't justify it because
> >I am not good enough. However, I have other things that cost me that, so
> >I don't see it as unreasonable.
> >
> I can't justify it in terms of being good at it (though I do think it
> makes it easier to be good when the guitar plays well). 

well, yes, the justification is a bit odd. I have the PRS SE custom, the
fender baja telecaster and my new ibanez SAS36 (which I got for my
birthday). Amoungst other cheaper stuff. 
The value of those three is around £1000, but I couldn't justify that on
one instrument! I have no idea why.
Having said that, they do look nice hanging in the living room.

> I justify it
> because I've earned the dosh and it feels good to have it!

Good reason as any.

-- 
Woody

On Sun, 1 Jun 2008 00:10:41 +0100, "icarusi" 
wrote:

>"Woody"  wrote in message 
>news:1ihtipl.ezxflhejzavcN%usenet@alienrat.co.uk...
>
>> I think anything is worth the price that someone is prepared to pay. It
>> is not like anything actually has a value other than that.
>
>I think my last car has scrap value based only on its weight and steel 
>content.
>
>icarusi
---

One of the facts of car-ownership over here in Germany is you
constantly get flyers stuck under the wipers from exporters.  A decent
family car, 2nd or 3rd hand, which would often be considered a
junkheap in Germany is considered to be worth buying, repairing and
exporting to Poland or Turkey.  You'll often see car-carriers full of
written-off BMWs and Mercs on their way to the Eastern Bloc.

Which probably means that there's all sorts of deathtraps and
cut-and-shuts zooming round there, but, just as we're prepared to put
up with a Korean copy of an American guitar, they're prepared to put
up with it to own name-brand car.
-- 
http://www.cdbaby.com/sinistrals      http://sinistrals.stevedix.de/  
http://www.stevedix.de/blog           http://www.snorty.net/

"icarusi"  wrote in message 
news:DcmdnYRaPJ5vR9zVnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@posted.plusnet...
>
> I think my last car has scrap value based only on its weight and steel 
> content.

It was just too much hassle to sell mine so gave it away yesterday. Or, at 
least, swapped it for 2 cases of Old Speckled Hen.

I gave the one before that away too.

Steve.

> Or, at least, swapped it for 2 cases of Old Speckled Hen.

The last car I disposed of I swapped for 2 bottles of Bells Whisky. They 
were 1 litre bottles too! The car before that I only got £20 scrap value 
for, so I think I did well on the deal :-)

Al.

On 31-May-08 16:50:16, Chris Bolus said
>On Wed, 28 May 2008 21:53:13 +0100, "Trimble Bracegirdle"
> wrote:

>>Good Grief !!!
>>And just look at the other items for sale list.
>>
>>Who the hell buys something like this ??
>>What can you do with it ?...certainly not play it ...to damaging.
>>
>>I've always been put of a standard Gibson Les Paul because at maybe £1300
>>its just to much money to actually play.

>Is it? Last year I was up for buying a Ricky bass because I've always
>wanted one and I could afford it. It's very difficult to buy them for
>less, even second-hand. I would have had one, too, if one had crossed my
>path at the right time.

>Fortunately for my wallet, the nice man in Sound Control handed me the
>Fender I had never wanted but which proved too nice not to buy. And
>saved me half my money in the process.

What's the word on Sound Controls prospects. I went into the Bristol shop
yeterday, and it seemed healthy enough, but I think some of the more
expensive kit seemed to have thinned out a bit.

I hope they continue, because my experiences with them have been very
positive.

                  All the best,
                        Angus Manwaring.       (for e-mail remove ANTISPEM)

I need your memories for the Amiga Games Database: A collection of Amiga
Game reviews by Amiga players http://www.angusm.demon.co.uk/AGDB/AGDB.html

"Angus Manwaring"  wrote in message 
news:1387.109T2502T8875865angus@angusm_ANTISPEM_.demon.co.uk...
>
> What's the word on Sound Controls prospects. I went into the Bristol shop
> yeterday, and it seemed healthy enough, but I think some of the more
> expensive kit seemed to have thinned out a bit.
>
> I hope they continue, because my experiences with them have been very
> positive.

Sound Control is (or soon will be) no more. SC was a victim of the credit 
crunch. I'm told that HSBC, who was the majority shareholder(!) pulled the 
rug from under them.

As Bob Sherunkle said, the Glasgow Otago Street store has been bought 
(back?) by Steve Caban and Jimmy Egypt.

It appears that Leeds, Salford and some other stores have been bought, 
probably by PMT http://www.pmtonline.co.uk/ Makes sense as their current 
stores are all in, or South of, the Midlands.

Steve.

On Sun, 01 Jun 2008 14:55:43 GMT, "Steve Robinson"
 wrote:

>"Angus Manwaring"  wrote in message 
>news:1387.109T2502T8875865angus@angusm_ANTISPEM_.demon.co.uk...
>>
>> What's the word on Sound Controls prospects. I went into the Bristol shop
>> yeterday, and it seemed healthy enough, but I think some of the more
>> expensive kit seemed to have thinned out a bit.
>>
>> I hope they continue, because my experiences with them have been very
>> positive.
>
>Sound Control is (or soon will be) no more. SC was a victim of the credit 
>crunch. I'm told that HSBC, who was the majority shareholder(!) pulled the 
>rug from under them.
>
>As Bob Sherunkle said, the Glasgow Otago Street store has been bought 
>(back?) by Steve Caban and Jimmy Egypt.
>
>It appears that Leeds, Salford and some other stores have been bought, 
>probably by PMT http://www.pmtonline.co.uk/ Makes sense as their current 
>stores are all in, or South of, the Midlands.

From what I can gather, some SC stores will remain trading - 16 -
whilst the others are sold off.

I heard at least two years ago that this was coming - at that time, SC
were in hock to the RBS to the tune of some £60 million. Well, that's
what I was told anyway by someone in the business.   

It must be very hard to beat some of the internet prices you see -
especially with those items you can try in a shop and then buy
elsewhere on line at a much cheaper price.

Steve.

"SteveShark" <steveATguitarsDOTpowernetDOTcoDOTuk> wrote in message 
news:e5m544p1t2l2lsptcm4qap3b4p3jc1fe09@4ax.com...

> It must be very hard to beat some of the internet prices you see -
> especially with those items you can try in a shop and then buy
> elsewhere on line at a much cheaper price.

I was chatting to a friend with a guitar/music shop the other day.

Nobody's buying anything at the moment.

He owns his own premises and the stock outright,  but he's only making his 
overheads back at the moment,  no profits to speak of at all...

He blames a number of factors:

The net,  and Thomman in particular,  now dominate the sales to school kids 
and they can get their guitar teacher to set up their instrument...

Kids who don't do music in school don't want to learn to play a musical 
instrument,  it's just too complicated and too much like hard work when you 
can do it all on a computer with some pirated software without actually 
learning to do anything complicated...

The few 'grown-ups' who have the money to spend on new instruments spend it 
on the net and get a mate to do the necessary set-up...

The other big market,  grandparents,  only come out at Christmas...

-- 
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

William Black  wrote:

> "SteveShark" <steveATguitarsDOTpowernetDOTcoDOTuk> wrote in message 
> news:e5m544p1t2l2lsptcm4qap3b4p3jc1fe09@4ax.com...
> 
> > It must be very hard to beat some of the internet prices you see -
> > especially with those items you can try in a shop and then buy
> > elsewhere on line at a much cheaper price.
> 
> I was chatting to a friend with a guitar/music shop the other day.
> 
> Nobody's buying anything at the moment.
> 
> He owns his own premises and the stock outright,  but he's only making his
> overheads back at the moment,  no profits to speak of at all...
> 
> He blames a number of factors:
> 
> The net,  and Thomman in particular,  now dominate the sales to school kids
> and they can get their guitar teacher to set up their instrument...

I guess it depends where you are. Where I am I couldn't get the guitar I
wanted, and there certainly isn't anywhere I could have got it set up.

I saw the guitar I wanted (ironically) in sound control, who couldn't
tell me how much it was, and when I went back and asked again, they
guessed it was around £350. On guy was actually helpful, but by then I
had already left and checked on the net as they couldn't tell me, and
found everywhere else (apart from thomman where it was more expensive)
it was around £299 (including real shops).

If they could have answered my question there and then, or shown much
interest in general, I would have probably bought it there.

If there was a real actual shop where I could have bought it set up
within commuting distance of my house, for less than £350 I would
probably have done so.

However, none of these things were available.

> Kids who don't do music in school don't want to learn to play a musical
> instrument,  it's just too complicated and too much like hard work when you
> can do it all on a computer with some pirated software without actually
> learning to do anything complicated...

That is something that I will never believe from meeting kids, they have
as much interest in guitars as they ever had. Also, the attitude that
making music on a computer is uncomplicated is very 80s.

> The few 'grown-ups' who have the money to spend on new instruments spend it
> on the net and get a mate to do the necessary set-up...

I spend my money on the net and then scrabble round looking for a guitar
tech as my last one has retired.


-- 
Woody

"Woody"  wrote in message 
news:1ihvn6f.1ws0lia31txtcN%usenet@alienrat.co.uk...
> William Black  wrote:

>> Kids who don't do music in school don't want to learn to play a musical
>> instrument,  it's just too complicated and too much like hard work when 
>> you
>> can do it all on a computer with some pirated software without actually
>> learning to do anything complicated...
>
> That is something that I will never believe from meeting kids, they have
> as much interest in guitars as they ever had.

But they're not buying them from shops.

They're possibly buying them from someone like Ebuyer for £40 and giving up 
when they can't make any progress because the instrument is set up badly.

>> The few 'grown-ups' who have the money to spend on new instruments spend 
>> it
>> on the net and get a mate to do the necessary set-up...
>
> I spend my money on the net and then scrabble round looking for a guitar
> tech as my last one has retired.

Music teachers are usually very good at this sort of thing as they're often 
overrun with kids with new guitars bought off the net,  and always seem to 
be in need of  some spare cash.

Ask a teacher...

-- 
William Black


I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time,  like icecream on the beach
Time for tea.

William Black  wrote:

> "Woody"  wrote in message 
> news:1ihvn6f.1ws0lia31txtcN%usenet@alienrat.co.uk...
> > William Black  wrote:
> 
> >> Kids who don't do music in school don't want to learn to play a musical
> >> instrument,  it's just too complicated and too much like hard work when
> >> you
> >> can do it all on a computer with some pirated software without actually
> >> learning to do anything complicated...
> >
> > That is something that I will never believe from meeting kids, they have
> > as much interest in guitars as they ever had.
> 
> But they're not buying them from shops.
> 
> They're possibly buying them from someone like Ebuyer for £40 and giving up
> when they can't make any progress because the instrument is set up badly.

If people gave up when they were kids with a badly setup instrument, I
doubt there would be any guitarists anywhere!

-- 
Woody

"Steve Robinson"  wrote in message 
news:PLy0k.1352$E41.1146@text.news.virginmedia.com...

> It appears that Leeds, Salford and some other stores have been bought, 
> probably by PMT http://www.pmtonline.co.uk/ Makes sense as their current 
> stores are all in, or South of, the Midlands.

Pre-minstrel tension?

icarusi
--

remove 00 to reply

"William Black"  wrote in message 
news:g1v1vu$93h$1@registered.motzarella.org...

> The few 'grown-ups' who have the money to spend on new instruments spend 
> it on the net and get a mate to do the necessary set-up...

My LMS does setups on guitars not bought there. He also has a Fender and 
Line6 dealership and is quite a small place. He does a lot of sheet music 
and seems to be doing OK, although I think it's a seasonal business anyway.

icarusi
--

remove 00 to reply

On Sun, 1 Jun 2008 22:23:19 +0100, usenet@alienrat.co.uk (Woody) wrote:

>William Black  wrote:
>

>
>> Kids who don't do music in school don't want to learn to play a musical
>> instrument,  it's just too complicated and too much like hard work when you
>> can do it all on a computer with some pirated software without actually
>> learning to do anything complicated...
>
>That is something that I will never believe from meeting kids, they have
>as much interest in guitars as they ever had. Also, the attitude that
>making music on a computer is uncomplicated is very 80s.
>
Got to agree with you there Woody. I have pictures of all our guitars on
my classroom wall; it often opens up a new line of conversation with
kids I've not met before. I know that there are around 90 kids taking
lessons in our school, which means about 8% of the school! The guitar is
by far the favourite instrument, even with the keyboard being the
vehicle for most music lessons.
-- 
Chris Bolus (change o to zero to reply by email)
A guitar is for life, not just for Christmas!

On Sun, 1 Jun 2008 22:45:30 +0100, "William Black"
 wrote:


>
>But they're not buying them from shops.
>
>They're possibly buying them from someone like Ebuyer for £40 and giving up 
>when they can't make any progress because the instrument is set up badly.
>
The local music shop got fed up with this and started "own-branding"
cheap chinese guitars. They're no better than what they buy on the net
but at least they're helping to keep the shop open.
-- 
Chris Bolus (change o to zero to reply by email)
A guitar is for life, not just for Christmas!