I can forgive a little bit of scientific nonesense (like time travel) if its
fundamental to the story but all this use of totall gibberish and frankly
impossible nonesense is just flat out incompetent.

How in gods name does everyone telephoning the same number cause a powerful
signal to travel acrooss the universe? Its purile drivel. And suddenly the earth
now has teleport capability? Is there no script control at all?

This episode is full of it.  If the writer had submitted this rubbish to a
science fiction magazine as a short story the editor would have written back
suggesting he try again sometime after his 10th birthday.

You might just as well keep waiving a magic wand about... oh wait...

Even the DrWho universe needs a little credibility. This franchise universe is
cracking up far faster than the story one.

A little creativity wouldn't go amiss either.
What we had this week was nothing more than a stage farce and a Tardis on
fishing line.

Come back bertie basset all is forgiven...
The sad thing is technically they're doing a fine enough job (apart from that
sad wobbly tardis scene) and now the writing is letting them down.

They need some real science fiction writers and fast.

In article ,
po   wrote:
>
>I can forgive a little bit of scientific nonesense (like time travel) if its
>fundamental to the story but all this use of totall gibberish and frankly
>impossible nonesense is just flat out incompetent.
>
>How in gods name does everyone telephoning the same number cause a powerful
>signal to travel acrooss the universe? Its purile drivel. And suddenly the earth
>now has teleport capability? Is there no script control at all?
>
>This episode is full of it.  If the writer had submitted this rubbish to a
>science fiction magazine as a short story the editor would have written back
>suggesting he try again sometime after his 10th birthday.
>
>You might just as well keep waiving a magic wand about... oh wait...
>
>Even the DrWho universe needs a little credibility. This franchise universe is
>cracking up far faster than the story one.
>
>A little creativity wouldn't go amiss either.
>What we had this week was nothing more than a stage farce and a Tardis on
>fishing line.
>
>Come back bertie basset all is forgiven...
>The sad thing is technically they're doing a fine enough job (apart from that
>sad wobbly tardis scene) and now the writing is letting them down.
>
>They need some real science fiction writers and fast.
>

How does wired and wireless exist?
-- 
Member - Liberal International	
This is doctor@nl2k.ab.ca	Ici doctor@nl2k.ab.ca
God, Queen and country! Beware Anti-Christ rising!  
USA petition for dissolution of your nation!

"po"  wrote in message 
news:0pth64taco5ta6cfrsfqf3m5p0ilthuf26@4ax.com...
>
> They need some real science fiction writers and fast.

That's exactly what they don't need. And the last 4 years prove this quite 
adequately.

I like science fiction. But when I want real science fiction, I read a 
decent book. I like Dr Who. But Dr Who isn't science fiction. It's fantasy 
entertainment for the family.

In article <bIdak.103206$P83.72426@newsfe20.ams2>,
Stephen Wilson  wrote:
>
>"po"  wrote in message 
>news:0pth64taco5ta6cfrsfqf3m5p0ilthuf26@4ax.com...
>>
>> They need some real science fiction writers and fast.
>
>That's exactly what they don't need. And the last 4 years prove this quite 
>adequately.
>
>I like science fiction. But when I want real science fiction, I read a 
>decent book. I like Dr Who. But Dr Who isn't science fiction. It's fantasy 
>entertainment for the family.
>
>

Time Travel using black holes.  Hmm!
-- 
Member - Liberal International	
This is doctor@nl2k.ab.ca	Ici doctor@nl2k.ab.ca
God, Queen and country! Beware Anti-Christ rising!  
USA petition for dissolution of your nation!

"po"  wrote in message 
news:0pth64taco5ta6cfrsfqf3m5p0ilthuf26@4ax.com...
>
> I can forgive a little bit of scientific nonesense (like time travel) if 
> its
> fundamental to the story but all this use of totall gibberish and frankly
> impossible nonesense is just flat out incompetent.


C'mon....it's Doctor Who.....it's got Davros in it, Dalek Caan.....and the 
Über-Milfalicious Sarah Jane Smith...and Billie Piper with a big sexy 
gun....and the Tardis....and time travelling....and [perhaps the second 
greatest thing ever] Space Rhinos....and you complain? ;)

Look, it's a season finale, they're just going out with a bang. Plus, once 
you suspend your disbelief to accept a 900yr old alien bloke with two hearts 
flying around time and space, you tend not to start nitpicking on the 
science...or at least I don't, or the millions of other happy viewers. I 
suggest that if you don't like it, simply watch the other side - but I bet 
you don't. :)
-- 
Slitheen.
Manchester United - Back to Back Champions 2006/07, 2007/08 & Champions of 
Europe 2008.

Slitheen wrote:
> "po"  wrote in message
> news:0pth64taco5ta6cfrsfqf3m5p0ilthuf26@4ax.com...
>>
>> I can forgive a little bit of scientific nonesense (like time
>> travel) if its
>> fundamental to the story but all this use of totall gibberish and
>> frankly impossible nonesense is just flat out incompetent.
>
>
> C'mon....it's Doctor Who.....it's got Davros in it, Dalek
> Caan.....and the Über-Milfalicious Sarah Jane Smith...and Billie
> Piper with a big sexy gun....and the Tardis....and time
> travelling....and [perhaps the second greatest thing ever] Space
> Rhinos....and you complain? ;)

Also *wisecracking* Daleks.

Harriet: "Harriet Jones, former prime minister."

Daleks [in unison] "Yes, we know who you are!"

(kim)

On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 13:56:34 +0100, kim  wrote:
> Slitheen wrote:
>> "po"  wrote in message
>> news:0pth64taco5ta6cfrsfqf3m5p0ilthuf26@4ax.com...
>>>
>>> I can forgive a little bit of scientific nonesense (like time
>>> travel) if its
>>> fundamental to the story but all this use of totall gibberish and
>>> frankly impossible nonesense is just flat out incompetent.
>>
>>
>> C'mon....it's Doctor Who.....it's got Davros in it, Dalek
>> Caan.....and the Über-Milfalicious Sarah Jane Smith...and Billie
>> Piper with a big sexy gun....and the Tardis....and time
>> travelling....and [perhaps the second greatest thing ever] Space
>> Rhinos....and you complain? ;)
>
> Also *wisecracking* Daleks.

This is the problem.  It seems too much like bad fan-fic.  Same as
Daleks vs Cybermen was bad fan-fic.

-- 
Andy Leighton => andyl@azaal.plus.com
"The Lord is my shepherd, but we still lost the sheep dog trials" 
   - Robert Rankin, _They Came And Ate Us_

In article <g4c2ns$tmn$1@registered.motzarella.org>,
Slitheen  wrote:
>"po"  wrote in message 
>news:0pth64taco5ta6cfrsfqf3m5p0ilthuf26@4ax.com...
>>
>> I can forgive a little bit of scientific nonesense (like time travel) if 
>> its
>> fundamental to the story but all this use of totall gibberish and frankly
>> impossible nonesense is just flat out incompetent.
>
>
>C'mon....it's Doctor Who.....it's got Davros in it, Dalek Caan.....and the 
>Über-Milfalicious Sarah Jane Smith...and Billie Piper with a big sexy 
>gun....and the Tardis....and time travelling....and [perhaps the second 
>greatest thing ever] Space Rhinos....and you complain? ;)
>
>Look, it's a season finale, they're just going out with a bang. Plus, once 
>you suspend your disbelief to accept a 900yr old alien bloke with two hearts 
>flying around time and space, you tend not to start nitpicking on the 
>science...or at least I don't, or the millions of other happy viewers. I 
>suggest that if you don't like it, simply watch the other side - but I bet 
>you don't. :)

Defy the prophecy!

>-- 
>Slitheen.
>Manchester United - Back to Back Champions 2006/07, 2007/08 & Champions of 
>Europe 2008. 
>
>

Man U and Die!
-- 
Member - Liberal International	
This is doctor@nl2k.ab.ca	Ici doctor@nl2k.ab.ca
God, Queen and country! Beware Anti-Christ rising!  
USA petition for dissolution of your nation!

On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 02:54:09 +0100, "Slitheen"  wrote:

>
>C'mon....it's Doctor Who.....it's got Davros in it, Dalek Caan.....and the 
>Über-Milfalicious Sarah Jane Smith...and Billie Piper with a big sexy 
>gun....and the Tardis....and time travelling....and [perhaps the second 
>greatest thing ever] Space Rhinos....and you complain? ;)
>
>Look, it's a season finale, they're just going out with a bang. Plus, once 
>you suspend your disbelief to accept a 900yr old alien bloke with two hearts 
>flying around time and space, you tend not to start nitpicking on the 
>science...or at least I don't, or the millions of other happy viewers. I 
>suggest that if you don't like it, simply watch the other side - but I bet 
>you don't. :)

There is a big difference between nitpicking and pointing out that the entire
construction of the franchise is becoming gibberish and senseless.

Space Rhino's are one thing (I love) but fundamental non-scientific rubbish is
unforgivable and disastrous in the long term. 

Thats a sure fire way to kill it off quicker than any BBC controler could dream
up.

Every universe needs rules and consistency - especially in a fantasy story
otherwise
there is no point at all - you can set up any situation and just say - "And now
the bad wolf appears and they all live happily ever after" Or perhaps - "and low
and behold twas all in an alternate universe"

That I suggest is plain unacceptable even for or especially for children.

The trouble with going out with a bang is explosions tend to leave nothing but
rubble behind.

shesaid wrote:

> There is a big difference between nitpicking and pointing out that the entire
> construction of the franchise is becoming gibberish and senseless.
> 
> Space Rhino's are one thing (I love) but fundamental non-scientific rubbish is
> unforgivable and disastrous in the long term. 
>

I agree with the latter. On the former, I'm not much impressed by the 
space rhino and the stupid beetle-thing  (just how much more exactly 
like a regular earth animals could they look?) but I'm prepared to put 
up with the limits of human imagination as to aliens that look truly 
alien as well as looking like physically and anatomical viable entities. 
Enough said.

But the rubbish of the plot-lines and the repetitive nature of the "vast 
war followed by a magic reset button" concept is wearing a bit thin, 
especially as it seems to be all too easily predictable for next week, 
and the accompanying non-scientific twaddle is not helping one jot. It 
may be "fantasy not science" but it has to *make sense* in its own context.

RTD couldn't even think up a sensible means by which Davros reappeared. 
How contrived is it for Dalek Caan's "emergency temporal shift", which 
previously merely transported it from 21st century London to 1930s New 
York, suddenly to take Caan by the most ludicrous of coincidences into 
the Time Way itself and to the very point at which Davros is about to 
meet his end, only to save him? It's just so naff. And how ludicrous was 
the picture of Davros's exposed ribcage and beating internal organs when 
he showed the Dr how he had scavenged cells for his new dalek race? Come 
on! It's as bad as the old belching wheelie bin two years ago. It's bad 
*fantasy* as well as bad *science*, I would say.

On the one hand RTD weaves the most ridiculous, overintricate plots 
which require banal, magic reset buttons and on the other hand there are 
so many of these ill-conceived little snippets of guff and twaddle that 
make the conception as a whole seem very infantile whether you want to 
ignore any science or not.

On the science/consistency point the Caan time-jump doesn't seem to fit 
at all. I was under the impression the Time War was locked. Pretty 
rubbish and pointless lock, one has to say, if a desperate dalek can 
just wander through it with a blindfold over its eyestalk, as it were. 
This is just the thin end of the wedge of the weakness of plot that 
pervade the new Doctor Who. That's why I've only bothered to watch four 
of this series' shows. Last year I watched all but four episodes and in 
the first new series I think I watched every one. Extrapolating to 
future series, it doesn't look good, does it?

Michael

"shesaid"  wrote in message 
news:q4rm645n5hnu6ns2626g41l2fe2rmuiqmv@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 02:54:09 +0100, "Slitheen"  
> wrote:
>
>>
>>C'mon....it's Doctor Who.....it's got Davros in it, Dalek Caan.....and the
>>Über-Milfalicious Sarah Jane Smith...and Billie Piper with a big sexy
>>gun....and the Tardis....and time travelling....and [perhaps the second
>>greatest thing ever] Space Rhinos....and you complain? ;)
>>
>>Look, it's a season finale, they're just going out with a bang. Plus, once
>>you suspend your disbelief to accept a 900yr old alien bloke with two 
>>hearts
>>flying around time and space, you tend not to start nitpicking on the
>>science...or at least I don't, or the millions of other happy viewers. I
>>suggest that if you don't like it, simply watch the other side - but I bet
>>you don't. :)
>
> There is a big difference between nitpicking and pointing out that the 
> entire
> construction of the franchise is becoming gibberish and senseless.
>
> Space Rhino's are one thing (I love) but fundamental non-scientific 
> rubbish is
> unforgivable and disastrous in the long term.
>
> Thats a sure fire way to kill it off quicker than any BBC controler could 
> dream
> up.
>
> Every universe needs rules and consistency - especially in a fantasy story
> otherwise
> there is no point at all - you can set up any situation and just say - 
> "And now
> the bad wolf appears and they all live happily ever after" Or perhaps - 
> "and low
> and behold twas all in an alternate universe"
>
> That I suggest is plain unacceptable even for or especially for children.
>

Funny how I've heard no children complaining. Nice of you to take it upon 
yourself to complain on their behalf though, eh?
-- 
Slitheen.
"I've searched the phrase 'I shall walk the Earth and my hunger shall know 
no bounds', but I keep getting redirected to Weight Watchers!"
 Ianto Jones, Torchwood.

On 2008-06-30, The Doctor  wrote:
>>
>>How in gods name does everyone telephoning the same number cause a powerful
>>signal to travel acrooss the universe? Its purile drivel. And suddenly the earth
>>now has teleport capability? Is there no script control at all?
>
> How does wired and wireless exist?

You'd never get them coherent. I'd expect if you tried the experiment
you'd at most bring down the exchanges at least get a lot of busy tones.

There's a lot of very silly science in there. I just find the bits daft
and confusing.

Plot-wise - how does moving the Medusa Cascade a second ahead make it
invisible, and didn't he visit it earlier or am I thinking somewhere
else?

 - Richard

-- 
   _/_/_/  _/_/_/  _/_/_/     Richard dot Corfield at gmail dot com
  _/  _/    _/    _/          
 _/_/      _/    _/                Time is a one way street,               
_/  _/  _/_/    _/_/_/                     except in the Twilight Zone

Richard Corfield wrote:

> Plot-wise - how does moving the Medusa Cascade a second ahead make it
> invisible?

I'm guessing the same way it enables the entire story to be set in an 
alternate universe and so a simple press of the reset button will return 
everything to normal?

(kim)

In article , po 
 writes
  ------cut------
>How in gods name does everyone telephoning the same number cause a 
>powerful signal to travel acrooss the universe? Its purile drivel.

It doesn't, then again how is a mobile phone connectable anywhere in the 
universe. Of course it is a mobile phone, if every base is tricked in to 
thinking that the phone is 'local' to it, it will transmit to it, 
however that would only be conventional Hertzian waves so you would need 
some way of linking hyperspace/underspace/etc. In order to reach a 
distant mobile phone. And wouldn't a phone call made at anytime make the 
far end ring at all times. It's pure hokum, but it makes a good script 
device, used sparingly.

>And suddenly the earth now has teleport capability? Is there no script 
>control at all?

The Earth hasn't, someone has the ability to teleport plants.
-- 
Ian             G8ILZ
There are always two people in every picture: the photographer and the viewer.
~Ansel Adams

In article <+jNPVqB01zbIFwXz@spam.newbrain.demon.co.uk>, Prometheus 
 writes
>
>The Earth hasn't, someone has the ability to teleport plants.

Along with the planet they are on, and the entire biosphere etc.

Typing too quickly, and glare on the screen from sunlight (at least that 
is my excuse).
-- 
Ian             G8ILZ
There are always two people in every picture: the photographer and the viewer.
~Ansel Adams

Richard Corfield <Richard.Corfield@reverse.uk.me.littondale> wrote:
> 
> There's a lot of very silly science in there. I just find the bits daft
> and confusing.

The idea of a shield around the Earth to hold the atmosphere in place is
also bad science, a planet's atmosphere is held in place by gravity.
It might make some sort of sense to "keep the heat in". But a more
obvious purpose would be to cut off communications, both with any
surviving comsats and whichever of the other planets were inhabited.
> 
> Plot-wise - how does moving the Medusa Cascade a second ahead make it
> invisible, and didn't he visit it earlier or am I thinking somewhere
> else?

It's one second out of sync with the rest of the universe.

On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 14:08:01 GMT, Mark Evans  wrote:

>It's one second out of sync with the rest of the universe. 

I suspect they tried to lift a very old SF idea of things being "out of phase"
without understanding the basic concept of  "phase" (see subject line)

On Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:26:03 +0100, shesaid  wrote:

>
>On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 14:08:01 GMT, Mark Evans  wrote:
>
>>It's one second out of sync with the rest of the universe. 
>
>I suspect they tried to lift a very old SF idea of things being "out of phase"
>without understanding the basic concept of  "phase" (see subject line)
>

I  understand the UK government figures now say  that less than 1  in  4  UK
schools employ a Physics teacher.

Its no wonder they're a nation of cabbages that  thinks gambling on the
stock exchange or "service  industries" constitute some sort  of   replacement  
for manufacturing actual goods and trading them.

Or perhaps they  think that becoming an a nation composed of  criminal
refugees will save them?