In message , Jane Vernon 
 writes
[]
>Like Sid and others, I think the time might have come to call an end to 
>this thread.  There are no winners or losers in it.  The best we can

Agreed. But you - and I - can't help biting at its heels, can we ... (-:

>hope for is that we might all have ended up with a little more 
>understanding of those whose views we patently don't share.  I hope I

A good summary.

>have.  I'll never be a Tory, but am happy to have Tory friends.
>
We could do with dropping the term; it is unfortunate that 
"Conservative" is such a long word. Not that "Tory" in itself had 
negative meaning originally (I don't actually know its original precise 
meaning; it is an old word), but it has gained a negative taint in the 
last few decades. A long time ago, in a newsgroup far, far away (sorry, 
couldn't resist), I discussed that there isn't a similar term of abuse 
(or term that has come to be abusive) for Labour; the discussion 
suggested "socialist" was a parallel, but it isn't completely so (and is 
too long). We need a short, neutral, term for the party/ies of the 
right.

I tend to use "red" and "blue" - usually when I am being slightly 
jocular, and wish to indicate (in some discussion) that I don't attach 
too closely to either for the purpose of that discussion; however, even 
those aren't totally useful, because "red" has connotations from the 
cold war.

Incidentally, why don't we ever hear of the Whigs these days (-:?
-- 
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL(+++)IS-P--Ch+(p)Ar+T[?]H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
** http://www.soft255.demon.co.uk/G6JPG-PC/JPGminPC.htm for thoughts on PCs. **

"I never trust a woman until she rejects me" - Woody Allen, 1999

"J. P. Gilliver (John)"  writes:
>Anne Burgess  writes
>>> Incidentally, why don't we ever hear of the Whigs these days
>>> (-:?
>>They dropped the name and became Liberal, didn't they?

not really.  the liberal party governments were very different from
any whig ones that had gone before.

>Yes, I'm just curious as to how they managed to drop it (and to get 
>everyone else to as well), unlike "Tory".

interestingly, the change from "tory" to "conservative" (done in
peel's wilderness years) was just as radical.  but there are people on
the right wing who are justifiably called "tories", so it's hard to
shift the moniker.
-- 
Robin Fairbairns, Cambridge