Lets face it the Police have lost the control of the streets to gangs of 
thugs. Home Office figures show 7 out of 10 knife crimes are committed by 
unemployed immigrants mainly black and Eastern European. The Island streets 
are just as bad. Hooded armed gangs roaming the streets a lot under the age 
of 16, drunk and totally unconcerned about the police as they know they 
cannot be touched by the law, because the police have lost all their powers 
to the PC brigade. Try walking alone along the Strand in Ryde on a Friday 
night after 8 pm if you dare! Drunken gangs of yobs everywhere.Its time that 
people armed themselves and be prepared to have to protect themselves. THE 
POLICE cant protect them anymore.Stab vest being issued to all hospital 
staff and teachers!  That's how bad its getting. Me , I have just imported 
pepper spray from the USA and carry it with me and I will use it if attacked 
sod the law, it cant protect me so Ill do it myself. The whole Country has 
had it.Time to take up arms ourselves!

john wrote:
> Lets face it the Police have lost the control of the streets to gangs of 
> thugs. Home Office figures show 7 out of 10 knife crimes are committed by 
> unemployed immigrants mainly black and Eastern European. The Island streets 
> are just as bad. Hooded armed gangs roaming the streets a lot under the age 
> of 16, drunk and totally unconcerned about the police as they know they 
> cannot be touched by the law, because the police have lost all their powers 
> to the PC brigade. Try walking alone along the Strand in Ryde on a Friday 
> night after 8 pm if you dare! Drunken gangs of yobs everywhere.Its time that 
> people armed themselves and be prepared to have to protect themselves. THE 
> POLICE cant protect them anymore.Stab vest being issued to all hospital 
> staff and teachers!  That's how bad its getting. Me , I have just imported 
> pepper spray from the USA and carry it with me and I will use it if attacked 
> sod the law, it cant protect me so Ill do it myself. The whole Country has 
> had it.Time to take up arms ourselves! 
> 
> 
you really are a dick.  Your figures are lies, and your generalisations 
gross.

In certain areas the Police have problems and in a majority of these 
cases it is WHITE gangs and third generation Black gangs.

Comparing the situation to Ryde is just scare tactics.  Yes I do walk 
about Ryde on a Friday and Saturdasy night and not once have I done so 
with fear.  Yes there are groups of WHITE youths (chavs) who are 
drinking and who may scare a few grannies who read the Daily Mail and 
shit like you post, but to comapre them to London, Liverpool or 
Birminham gangs (for example) is nonsense.

The police will never win the war against street crime gangs whilst they 
are protected by relatives and friends and rubbish like your post just 
spreads fear and lies

On 6 Jul, 23:24, "john"  wrote:
> Lets face it the Police have lost the control of the streets to gangs of
> thugs. Home Office figures show 7 out of 10 knife crimes are committed by
> unemployed immigrants mainly black and Eastern European. The Island streets
> are just as bad. Hooded armed gangs roaming the streets a lot under the age
> of 16, drunk and totally unconcerned about the police as they know they
> cannot be touched by the law, because the police have lost all their powers
> to the PC brigade. Try walking alone along the Strand in Ryde on a Friday
> night after 8 pm if you dare! Drunken gangs of yobs everywhere.Its time that
> people armed themselves and be prepared to have to protect themselves. THE
> POLICE cant protect them anymore.Stab vest being issued to all hospital
> staff and teachers!  That's how bad its getting. Me , I have just imported
> pepper spray from the USA and carry it with me and I will use it if attacked
> sod the law, it cant protect me so Ill do it myself. The whole Country has
> had it.Time to take up arms ourselves!

Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously three
too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
enough.

Rob

Rob wrote:
> On 6 Jul, 23:24, "john"  wrote:
>> Lets face it the Police have lost the control of the streets to gangs of
>> thugs. Home Office figures show 7 out of 10 knife crimes are committed by
>> unemployed immigrants mainly black and Eastern European. The Island streets
>> are just as bad. Hooded armed gangs roaming the streets a lot under the age
>> of 16, drunk and totally unconcerned about the police as they know they
>> cannot be touched by the law, because the police have lost all their powers
>> to the PC brigade. Try walking alone along the Strand in Ryde on a Friday
>> night after 8 pm if you dare! Drunken gangs of yobs everywhere.Its time that
>> people armed themselves and be prepared to have to protect themselves. THE
>> POLICE cant protect them anymore.Stab vest being issued to all hospital
>> staff and teachers!  That's how bad its getting. Me , I have just imported
>> pepper spray from the USA and carry it with me and I will use it if attacked
>> sod the law, it cant protect me so Ill do it myself. The whole Country has
>> had it.Time to take up arms ourselves!
> 
> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously three
> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
> enough.
> 
> Rob
we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on our 
streets

"KJ"  wrote in message 
news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...
> Rob wrote:
>> On 6 Jul, 23:24, "john"  wrote:
>>> Lets face it the Police have lost the control of the streets to gangs of
>>> thugs. Home Office figures show 7 out of 10 knife crimes are committed 
>>> by
>>> unemployed immigrants mainly black and Eastern European. The Island 
>>> streets
>>> are just as bad. Hooded armed gangs roaming the streets a lot under the 
>>> age
>>> of 16, drunk and totally unconcerned about the police as they know they
>>> cannot be touched by the law, because the police have lost all their 
>>> powers
>>> to the PC brigade. Try walking alone along the Strand in Ryde on a 
>>> Friday
>>> night after 8 pm if you dare! Drunken gangs of yobs everywhere.Its time 
>>> that
>>> people armed themselves and be prepared to have to protect themselves. 
>>> THE
>>> POLICE cant protect them anymore.Stab vest being issued to all hospital
>>> staff and teachers!  That's how bad its getting. Me , I have just 
>>> imported
>>> pepper spray from the USA and carry it with me and I will use it if 
>>> attacked
>>> sod the law, it cant protect me so Ill do it myself. The whole Country 
>>> has
>>> had it.Time to take up arms ourselves!
>>
>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously three
>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>> enough.
>>
>> Rob
> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on our 
> streets

Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the attack on 
the bus driver by *white* yobs.

Richard_G wrote:
> 
> "KJ"  wrote in message 
> news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...
>> Rob wrote:
>>> On 6 Jul, 23:24, "john"  wrote:
>>>> Lets face it the Police have lost the control of the streets to 
>>>> gangs of
>>>> thugs. Home Office figures show 7 out of 10 knife crimes are 
>>>> committed by
>>>> unemployed immigrants mainly black and Eastern European. The Island 
>>>> streets
>>>> are just as bad. Hooded armed gangs roaming the streets a lot under 
>>>> the age
>>>> of 16, drunk and totally unconcerned about the police as they know they
>>>> cannot be touched by the law, because the police have lost all their 
>>>> powers
>>>> to the PC brigade. Try walking alone along the Strand in Ryde on a 
>>>> Friday
>>>> night after 8 pm if you dare! Drunken gangs of yobs everywhere.Its 
>>>> time that
>>>> people armed themselves and be prepared to have to protect 
>>>> themselves. THE
>>>> POLICE cant protect them anymore.Stab vest being issued to all hospital
>>>> staff and teachers!  That's how bad its getting. Me , I have just 
>>>> imported
>>>> pepper spray from the USA and carry it with me and I will use it if 
>>>> attacked
>>>> sod the law, it cant protect me so Ill do it myself. The whole 
>>>> Country has
>>>> had it.Time to take up arms ourselves!
>>>
>>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
>>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously three
>>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
>>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>>> enough.
>>>
>>> Rob
>> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on 
>> our streets
> 
> Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the attack 
> on the bus driver by *white* yobs.
all the attacks on the Island are by White yobs, our ethnic friends are 
too civilised

X-No-Archive: yes

"KJ"  wrote in message 
news:Lv2dnauGjZ7eLe7VnZ2dnUVZ8umdnZ2d@bt.com...
> Richard_G wrote:
>>
>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>> news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...


>>>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
>>>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>>>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously three
>>>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
>>>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>>>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>>>> enough.
>>>>
>>>> Rob
>>> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on our 
>>> streets


>> Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the attack 
>> on the bus driver by *white* yobs.


> all the attacks on the Island are by White yobs, our ethnic friends are 
> too civilised

:)
One explanation *might* be that there are very few, proportionately, ethnic 
friends here kevin......
Without appearing whatsoever politically incorrect, there ar not many black 
people living on the Island...let alone young black people.
I doubt if there are too many 'yoof'  europeans either ...  young working 
age, twenty/thirty somethings but not too many 14/17 year olds.
.....lots of  white 'yoofs' though....!
Not sure what that demonstrates, if anything...  in black inner city areas, 
no doubt,  the main transgressors might well  be black/asian 'yoofs' ..... 
with guns AND knives!!
Indeed, without drawing any parallels whatsoever,  there is an enormous 
disparity in the US  where blacks account for around 12% of the total 
population but have over 45% of the total prison population....
One crude way of interpreting those figures might be to say that black 
people are more disposed to criminal behaviour.  Of course, if one regards 
crime as  much a social issue as a personal one then other explanations come 
into play.  Discrimination, poor pay, inner city depravity, poor housing, 
gang culture etc. etc. etc. create an environment of haves and have nots 
(visible clearly under  the true US philosophy of taking care of yourself, 
no welfare type culture..) and an environment where crime can flourish..
Here in the UK we have almost a media hysteria - albeit supported by the 
growing sad reality - that young people (...in gangs often) are carrying 
knives and using them.
It's a breakdown in community and society values as much as individual 
actions where people don't understand the repercussions, don't think they 
will be caught (..years of invisible policemen, high profile traffic police 
interested only in tracking down speeding cars, camera surveillance that 
just doesn't work, asbo's, overcrowded prisons resulting in magistrates 
reluctant to pass confining sentences, et al.) are confronted endlessly in 
films, music, culture and youtube with acts of gratuitous violence.... is 
anyone surprised that there is a detachment from reality as they push a 
knife blade into the body of another human being...?
This isn't about colour or race or culture.... it's about a lost youth 
frankly... heading into the prospect of a future here, on earth, that ain't 
going to be much fun in the years ahead frankly...



Mark

mark wrote:
> X-No-Archive: yes
> 
> "KJ"  wrote in message 
> news:Lv2dnauGjZ7eLe7VnZ2dnUVZ8umdnZ2d@bt.com...
>> Richard_G wrote:
>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>> news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...
> 
> 
>>>>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
>>>>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>>>>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously three
>>>>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
>>>>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>>>>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>>>>> enough.
>>>>>
>>>>> Rob
>>>> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on our 
>>>> streets
> 
> 
>>> Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the attack 
>>> on the bus driver by *white* yobs.
> 
> 
>> all the attacks on the Island are by White yobs, our ethnic friends are 
>> too civilised
> 
> :)
> One explanation *might* be that there are very few, proportionately, ethnic 
> friends here kevin......
> Without appearing whatsoever politically incorrect, there ar not many black 
> people living on the Island...let alone young black people.
> I doubt if there are too many 'yoof'  europeans either ...  young working 
> age, twenty/thirty somethings but not too many 14/17 year olds.
> .....lots of  white 'yoofs' though....!
> Not sure what that demonstrates, if anything...  in black inner city areas, 
> no doubt,  the main transgressors might well  be black/asian 'yoofs' ..... 
> with guns AND knives!!
> Indeed, without drawing any parallels whatsoever,  there is an enormous 
> disparity in the US  where blacks account for around 12% of the total 
> population but have over 45% of the total prison population....
> One crude way of interpreting those figures might be to say that black 
> people are more disposed to criminal behaviour.  Of course, if one regards 
> crime as  much a social issue as a personal one then other explanations come 
> into play.  Discrimination, poor pay, inner city depravity, poor housing, 
> gang culture etc. etc. etc. create an environment of haves and have nots 
> (visible clearly under  the true US philosophy of taking care of yourself, 
> no welfare type culture..) and an environment where crime can flourish..
> Here in the UK we have almost a media hysteria - albeit supported by the 
> growing sad reality - that young people (...in gangs often) are carrying 
> knives and using them.
> It's a breakdown in community and society values as much as individual 
> actions where people don't understand the repercussions, don't think they 
> will be caught (..years of invisible policemen, high profile traffic police 
> interested only in tracking down speeding cars, camera surveillance that 
> just doesn't work, asbo's, overcrowded prisons resulting in magistrates 
> reluctant to pass confining sentences, et al.) are confronted endlessly in 
> films, music, culture and youtube with acts of gratuitous violence.... is 
> anyone surprised that there is a detachment from reality as they push a 
> knife blade into the body of another human being...?
> This isn't about colour or race or culture.... it's about a lost youth 
> frankly... heading into the prospect of a future here, on earth, that ain't 
> going to be much fun in the years ahead frankly...
> 
> 
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
your figures are quite correct on face value....however when you compare 
the % of white and black crime from families below the poverty line the 
figure is about the same and in fact leans slightly in favour of 
non-black criminals (white & hispanic US, White & Asian UK)

Again the problem is not race it is poverty.

I have every hope for a bright future...these scare headlines have been 
appearing in British Press for over 100 years. In the 1860/70 society 
was going to collapse because of the gin house gangs and victims.. in 
the 1950's Teddy Boys were the social paria, in the 60's the Mods, 70,s 
the punks, 80's the skinheads and football fans,( I saw more knife 
crimes first hand than I would ever believe possible..but no media 
interest) 90's/00's Chavs.

Now we have mass media available to the lowest scum  so they can self 
promote, soon the opponents (likely to be mothers and wives as in the 
anti IRA marches)will embrace the technology.

X-No-Archive: yes

"KJ"  wrote in message 
news:hdydnaC4S6LFU-7VnZ2dnUVZ8rednZ2d@bt.com...
> mark wrote:
>> X-No-Archive: yes
>>
>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>> news:Lv2dnauGjZ7eLe7VnZ2dnUVZ8umdnZ2d@bt.com...
>>> Richard_G wrote:
>>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>>> news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...
>>
>>
>>>>>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
>>>>>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>>>>>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously 
>>>>>> three
>>>>>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
>>>>>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>>>>>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>>>>>> enough.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rob
>>>>> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on 
>>>>> our streets
>>
>>
>>>> Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the 
>>>> attack on the bus driver by *white* yobs.
>>
>>
>>> all the attacks on the Island are by White yobs, our ethnic friends are 
>>> too civilised
>>
>> :)
>> One explanation *might* be that there are very few, proportionately, 
>> ethnic friends here kevin......
>> Without appearing whatsoever politically incorrect, there ar not many 
>> black people living on the Island...let alone young black people.
>> I doubt if there are too many 'yoof'  europeans either ...  young working 
>> age, twenty/thirty somethings but not too many 14/17 year olds.
>> .....lots of  white 'yoofs' though....!
>> Not sure what that demonstrates, if anything...  in black inner city 
>> areas, no doubt,  the main transgressors might well  be black/asian 
>> 'yoofs' ..... with guns AND knives!!
>> Indeed, without drawing any parallels whatsoever,  there is an enormous 
>> disparity in the US  where blacks account for around 12% of the total 
>> population but have over 45% of the total prison population....
>> One crude way of interpreting those figures might be to say that black 
>> people are more disposed to criminal behaviour.  Of course, if one 
>> regards crime as  much a social issue as a personal one then other 
>> explanations come into play.  Discrimination, poor pay, inner city 
>> depravity, poor housing, gang culture etc. etc. etc. create an 
>> environment of haves and have nots (visible clearly under  the true US 
>> philosophy of taking care of yourself, no welfare type culture..) and an 
>> environment where crime can flourish..
>> Here in the UK we have almost a media hysteria - albeit supported by the 
>> growing sad reality - that young people (...in gangs often) are carrying 
>> knives and using them.
>> It's a breakdown in community and society values as much as individual 
>> actions where people don't understand the repercussions, don't think they 
>> will be caught (..years of invisible policemen, high profile traffic 
>> police interested only in tracking down speeding cars, camera 
>> surveillance that just doesn't work, asbo's, overcrowded prisons 
>> resulting in magistrates reluctant to pass confining sentences, et al.) 
>> are confronted endlessly in films, music, culture and youtube with acts 
>> of gratuitous violence.... is anyone surprised that there is a detachment 
>> from reality as they push a knife blade into the body of another human 
>> being...?
>> This isn't about colour or race or culture.... it's about a lost youth 
>> frankly... heading into the prospect of a future here, on earth, that 
>> ain't going to be much fun in the years ahead frankly...


> your figures are quite correct on face value....however when you compare 
> the % of white and black crime from families below the poverty line the 
> figure is about the same and in fact leans slightly in favour of non-black 
> criminals (white & hispanic US, White & Asian UK)

Yes.   I think I was inferring that society is as much to contribute to 
these issues as individuality...

> Again the problem is not race it is poverty.

Absolutely.....


> I have every hope for a bright future...these scare headlines have been 
> appearing in British Press for over 100 years. In the 1860/70 society was 
> going to collapse because of the gin house gangs and victims.. in the 
> 1950's Teddy Boys were the social paria, in the 60's the Mods, 70,s the 
> punks, 80's the skinheads and football fans,( I saw more knife crimes 
> first hand than I would ever believe possible..but no media interest) 
> 90's/00's Chavs.

Couldn't agree more...  you need to have lived through some of this stuff to 
really comprehend the 'generational'  evil, as promoted by the popular 
press.




> Now we have mass media available to the lowest scum  so they can self 
> promote, soon the opponents (likely to be mothers and wives as in the anti 
> IRA marches)will embrace the technology.

The far right are marginals..... they probably will be so for eternity..
I suspect that is the frustration for them..  they cannot tap into the 
consciousness of the average voter or man/woman in the street because their 
values and beliefs are just myopically, and inanely,  unjust.
However, there's no serious supporters in here....  ;-)     they are wind up 
merchants and trolls that have the intelligence capability of  an amoeba..
best, kevin


Mark

by the way...who were the young stones tribute band in the hipshaker tent 
around the same time as the Police were on........  they were very good..?

mark wrote:
> X-No-Archive: yes
> 
> "KJ"  wrote in message 
> news:hdydnaC4S6LFU-7VnZ2dnUVZ8rednZ2d@bt.com...
>> mark wrote:
>>> X-No-Archive: yes
>>>
>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>> news:Lv2dnauGjZ7eLe7VnZ2dnUVZ8umdnZ2d@bt.com...
>>>> Richard_G wrote:
>>>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>>>> news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...
>>>
>>>>>>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand without
>>>>>>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>>>>>>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously 
>>>>>>> three
>>>>>>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for police
>>>>>>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>>>>>>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>>>>>>> enough.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rob
>>>>>> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on 
>>>>>> our streets
>>>
>>>>> Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the 
>>>>> attack on the bus driver by *white* yobs.
>>>
>>>> all the attacks on the Island are by White yobs, our ethnic friends are 
>>>> too civilised
>>> :)
>>> One explanation *might* be that there are very few, proportionately, 
>>> ethnic friends here kevin......
>>> Without appearing whatsoever politically incorrect, there ar not many 
>>> black people living on the Island...let alone young black people.
>>> I doubt if there are too many 'yoof'  europeans either ...  young working 
>>> age, twenty/thirty somethings but not too many 14/17 year olds.
>>> .....lots of  white 'yoofs' though....!
>>> Not sure what that demonstrates, if anything...  in black inner city 
>>> areas, no doubt,  the main transgressors might well  be black/asian 
>>> 'yoofs' ..... with guns AND knives!!
>>> Indeed, without drawing any parallels whatsoever,  there is an enormous 
>>> disparity in the US  where blacks account for around 12% of the total 
>>> population but have over 45% of the total prison population....
>>> One crude way of interpreting those figures might be to say that black 
>>> people are more disposed to criminal behaviour.  Of course, if one 
>>> regards crime as  much a social issue as a personal one then other 
>>> explanations come into play.  Discrimination, poor pay, inner city 
>>> depravity, poor housing, gang culture etc. etc. etc. create an 
>>> environment of haves and have nots (visible clearly under  the true US 
>>> philosophy of taking care of yourself, no welfare type culture..) and an 
>>> environment where crime can flourish..
>>> Here in the UK we have almost a media hysteria - albeit supported by the 
>>> growing sad reality - that young people (...in gangs often) are carrying 
>>> knives and using them.
>>> It's a breakdown in community and society values as much as individual 
>>> actions where people don't understand the repercussions, don't think they 
>>> will be caught (..years of invisible policemen, high profile traffic 
>>> police interested only in tracking down speeding cars, camera 
>>> surveillance that just doesn't work, asbo's, overcrowded prisons 
>>> resulting in magistrates reluctant to pass confining sentences, et al.) 
>>> are confronted endlessly in films, music, culture and youtube with acts 
>>> of gratuitous violence.... is anyone surprised that there is a detachment 
>>> from reality as they push a knife blade into the body of another human 
>>> being...?
>>> This isn't about colour or race or culture.... it's about a lost youth 
>>> frankly... heading into the prospect of a future here, on earth, that 
>>> ain't going to be much fun in the years ahead frankly...
> 
> 
>> your figures are quite correct on face value....however when you compare 
>> the % of white and black crime from families below the poverty line the 
>> figure is about the same and in fact leans slightly in favour of non-black 
>> criminals (white & hispanic US, White & Asian UK)
> 
> Yes.   I think I was inferring that society is as much to contribute to 
> these issues as individuality...
> 
>> Again the problem is not race it is poverty.
> 
> Absolutely.....
> 
> 
>> I have every hope for a bright future...these scare headlines have been 
>> appearing in British Press for over 100 years. In the 1860/70 society was 
>> going to collapse because of the gin house gangs and victims.. in the 
>> 1950's Teddy Boys were the social paria, in the 60's the Mods, 70,s the 
>> punks, 80's the skinheads and football fans,( I saw more knife crimes 
>> first hand than I would ever believe possible..but no media interest) 
>> 90's/00's Chavs.
> 
> Couldn't agree more...  you need to have lived through some of this stuff to 
> really comprehend the 'generational'  evil, as promoted by the popular 
> press.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> Now we have mass media available to the lowest scum  so they can self 
>> promote, soon the opponents (likely to be mothers and wives as in the anti 
>> IRA marches)will embrace the technology.
> 
> The far right are marginals..... they probably will be so for eternity..
> I suspect that is the frustration for them..  they cannot tap into the 
> consciousness of the average voter or man/woman in the street because their 
> values and beliefs are just myopically, and inanely,  unjust.
> However, there's no serious supporters in here....  ;-)     they are wind up 
> merchants and trolls that have the intelligence capability of  an amoeba..
> best, kevin
> 
> 
> Mark
> 
> by the way...who were the young stones tribute band in the hipshaker tent 
> around the same time as the Police were on........  they were very good..?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
They are called the Bog Rolling Stones..they were supposed to play last 
year on the same slot as the Rolling Stones, but Mick couldn't take the 
competition

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=88496012

"mark"  wrote in message 
news:bL6dnXx5xP-uS-7VnZ2dnUVZ8j6dnZ2d@bt.com...
> X-No-Archive: yes
>
> "KJ"  wrote in message 
> news:hdydnaC4S6LFU-7VnZ2dnUVZ8rednZ2d@bt.com...
>> mark wrote:
>>> X-No-Archive: yes
>>>
>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>> news:Lv2dnauGjZ7eLe7VnZ2dnUVZ8umdnZ2d@bt.com...
>>>> Richard_G wrote:
>>>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>>>> news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand 
>>>>>>> without
>>>>>>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>>>>>>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously 
>>>>>>> three
>>>>>>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for 
>>>>>>> police
>>>>>>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>>>>>>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>>>>>>> enough.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rob
>>>>>> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on 
>>>>>> our streets
>>>
>>>
>>>>> Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the 
>>>>> attack on the bus driver by *white* yobs.
>>>
>>>
>>>> all the attacks on the Island are by White yobs, our ethnic friends are 
>>>> too civilised
>>>
>>> :)
>>> One explanation *might* be that there are very few, proportionately, 
>>> ethnic friends here kevin......
>>> Without appearing whatsoever politically incorrect, there ar not many 
>>> black people living on the Island...let alone young black people.
>>> I doubt if there are too many 'yoof'  europeans either ...  young 
>>> working age, twenty/thirty somethings but not too many 14/17 year olds.
>>> .....lots of  white 'yoofs' though....!
>>> Not sure what that demonstrates, if anything...  in black inner city 
>>> areas, no doubt,  the main transgressors might well  be black/asian 
>>> 'yoofs' ..... with guns AND knives!!
>>> Indeed, without drawing any parallels whatsoever,  there is an enormous 
>>> disparity in the US  where blacks account for around 12% of the total 
>>> population but have over 45% of the total prison population....
>>> One crude way of interpreting those figures might be to say that black 
>>> people are more disposed to criminal behaviour.  Of course, if one 
>>> regards crime as  much a social issue as a personal one then other 
>>> explanations come into play.  Discrimination, poor pay, inner city 
>>> depravity, poor housing, gang culture etc. etc. etc. create an 
>>> environment of haves and have nots (visible clearly under  the true US 
>>> philosophy of taking care of yourself, no welfare type culture..) and an 
>>> environment where crime can flourish..
>>> Here in the UK we have almost a media hysteria - albeit supported by the 
>>> growing sad reality - that young people (...in gangs often) are carrying 
>>> knives and using them.
>>> It's a breakdown in community and society values as much as individual 
>>> actions where people don't understand the repercussions, don't think 
>>> they will be caught (..years of invisible policemen, high profile 
>>> traffic police interested only in tracking down speeding cars, camera 
>>> surveillance that just doesn't work, asbo's, overcrowded prisons 
>>> resulting in magistrates reluctant to pass confining sentences, et al.) 
>>> are confronted endlessly in films, music, culture and youtube with acts 
>>> of gratuitous violence.... is anyone surprised that there is a 
>>> detachment from reality as they push a knife blade into the body of 
>>> another human being...?
>>> This isn't about colour or race or culture.... it's about a lost youth 
>>> frankly... heading into the prospect of a future here, on earth, that 
>>> ain't going to be much fun in the years ahead frankly...
>
>
>> your figures are quite correct on face value....however when you compare 
>> the % of white and black crime from families below the poverty line the 
>> figure is about the same and in fact leans slightly in favour of 
>> non-black criminals (white & hispanic US, White & Asian UK)
>
> Yes.   I think I was inferring that society is as much to contribute to 
> these issues as individuality...
>
>> Again the problem is not race it is poverty.
>
> Absolutely.....
>
>
>> I have every hope for a bright future...these scare headlines have been 
>> appearing in British Press for over 100 years. In the 1860/70 society was 
>> going to collapse because of the gin house gangs and victims.. in the 
>> 1950's Teddy Boys were the social paria, in the 60's the Mods, 70,s the 
>> punks, 80's the skinheads and football fans,( I saw more knife crimes 
>> first hand than I would ever believe possible..but no media interest) 
>> 90's/00's Chavs.
>
> Couldn't agree more...  you need to have lived through some of this stuff 
> to really comprehend the 'generational'  evil, as promoted by the popular 
> press.
>
>
>
>
>> Now we have mass media available to the lowest scum  so they can self 
>> promote, soon the opponents (likely to be mothers and wives as in the 
>> anti IRA marches)will embrace the technology.
>
> The far right are marginals..... they probably will be so for eternity..
> I suspect that is the frustration for them..  they cannot tap into the 
> consciousness of the average voter or man/woman in the street because 
> their values and beliefs are just myopically, and inanely,  unjust.
> However, there's no serious supporters in here....  ;-)     they are wind 
> up merchants and trolls that have the intelligence capability of  an 
> amoeba..
> best, kevin
>
>
> Mark
>
> by the way...who were the young stones tribute band in the hipshaker tent 
> around the same time as the Police were on........  they were very good..?
>
>
>
>
> Again the problem is not race it is poverty.
can anyone explain this comment, it would appear that if you are poor you 
possibly will stab someone i dont see the connection, as i see it you may 
stab someone if you are that type of arsehole irrespective of whether you 
are poor or well off, there are tens of thousands of poor people that would 
never think of harming another person indeed, they would try to help you if 
you needed it

Richard Bird wrote:
> "mark"  wrote in message 
> news:bL6dnXx5xP-uS-7VnZ2dnUVZ8j6dnZ2d@bt.com...
>> X-No-Archive: yes
>>
>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>> news:hdydnaC4S6LFU-7VnZ2dnUVZ8rednZ2d@bt.com...
>>> mark wrote:
>>>> X-No-Archive: yes
>>>>
>>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>>> news:Lv2dnauGjZ7eLe7VnZ2dnUVZ8umdnZ2d@bt.com...
>>>>> Richard_G wrote:
>>>>>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>>>>>> news:CuKdnaNKx8Aj6-7VnZ2dnUVZ8tHinZ2d@bt.com...
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well I was in Ryde two weeks ago, and walked along the Strand 
>>>>>>>> without
>>>>>>>> incident, seemed most unthreatening. As far as I can tell there have
>>>>>>>> been three stabbing incidents on the island this year, obviously 
>>>>>>>> three
>>>>>>>> too many but I wouldnt cower in my house on that basis. As for 
>>>>>>>> police
>>>>>>>> being powerless to do anything, well they have the power to arrest
>>>>>>>> anyone carrying an offensive weapon, I would think that was power
>>>>>>>> enough.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Rob
>>>>>>> we have more to worry about with idiots with illegal pepper spray on 
>>>>>>> our streets
>>>>
>>>>>> Interesting that the BNP faction are keeping very quiet about the 
>>>>>> attack on the bus driver by *white* yobs.
>>>>
>>>>> all the attacks on the Island are by White yobs, our ethnic friends are 
>>>>> too civilised
>>>> :)
>>>> One explanation *might* be that there are very few, proportionately, 
>>>> ethnic friends here kevin......
>>>> Without appearing whatsoever politically incorrect, there ar not many 
>>>> black people living on the Island...let alone young black people.
>>>> I doubt if there are too many 'yoof'  europeans either ...  young 
>>>> working age, twenty/thirty somethings but not too many 14/17 year olds.
>>>> .....lots of  white 'yoofs' though....!
>>>> Not sure what that demonstrates, if anything...  in black inner city 
>>>> areas, no doubt,  the main transgressors might well  be black/asian 
>>>> 'yoofs' ..... with guns AND knives!!
>>>> Indeed, without drawing any parallels whatsoever,  there is an enormous 
>>>> disparity in the US  where blacks account for around 12% of the total 
>>>> population but have over 45% of the total prison population....
>>>> One crude way of interpreting those figures might be to say that black 
>>>> people are more disposed to criminal behaviour.  Of course, if one 
>>>> regards crime as  much a social issue as a personal one then other 
>>>> explanations come into play.  Discrimination, poor pay, inner city 
>>>> depravity, poor housing, gang culture etc. etc. etc. create an 
>>>> environment of haves and have nots (visible clearly under  the true US 
>>>> philosophy of taking care of yourself, no welfare type culture..) and an 
>>>> environment where crime can flourish..
>>>> Here in the UK we have almost a media hysteria - albeit supported by the 
>>>> growing sad reality - that young people (...in gangs often) are carrying 
>>>> knives and using them.
>>>> It's a breakdown in community and society values as much as individual 
>>>> actions where people don't understand the repercussions, don't think 
>>>> they will be caught (..years of invisible policemen, high profile 
>>>> traffic police interested only in tracking down speeding cars, camera 
>>>> surveillance that just doesn't work, asbo's, overcrowded prisons 
>>>> resulting in magistrates reluctant to pass confining sentences, et al.) 
>>>> are confronted endlessly in films, music, culture and youtube with acts 
>>>> of gratuitous violence.... is anyone surprised that there is a 
>>>> detachment from reality as they push a knife blade into the body of 
>>>> another human being...?
>>>> This isn't about colour or race or culture.... it's about a lost youth 
>>>> frankly... heading into the prospect of a future here, on earth, that 
>>>> ain't going to be much fun in the years ahead frankly...
>>
>>> your figures are quite correct on face value....however when you compare 
>>> the % of white and black crime from families below the poverty line the 
>>> figure is about the same and in fact leans slightly in favour of 
>>> non-black criminals (white & hispanic US, White & Asian UK)
>> Yes.   I think I was inferring that society is as much to contribute to 
>> these issues as individuality...
>>
>>> Again the problem is not race it is poverty.
>> Absolutely.....
>>
>>
>>> I have every hope for a bright future...these scare headlines have been 
>>> appearing in British Press for over 100 years. In the 1860/70 society was 
>>> going to collapse because of the gin house gangs and victims.. in the 
>>> 1950's Teddy Boys were the social paria, in the 60's the Mods, 70,s the 
>>> punks, 80's the skinheads and football fans,( I saw more knife crimes 
>>> first hand than I would ever believe possible..but no media interest) 
>>> 90's/00's Chavs.
>> Couldn't agree more...  you need to have lived through some of this stuff 
>> to really comprehend the 'generational'  evil, as promoted by the popular 
>> press.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Now we have mass media available to the lowest scum  so they can self 
>>> promote, soon the opponents (likely to be mothers and wives as in the 
>>> anti IRA marches)will embrace the technology.
>> The far right are marginals..... they probably will be so for eternity..
>> I suspect that is the frustration for them..  they cannot tap into the 
>> consciousness of the average voter or man/woman in the street because 
>> their values and beliefs are just myopically, and inanely,  unjust.
>> However, there's no serious supporters in here....  ;-)     they are wind 
>> up merchants and trolls that have the intelligence capability of  an 
>> amoeba..
>> best, kevin
>>
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> by the way...who were the young stones tribute band in the hipshaker tent 
>> around the same time as the Police were on........  they were very good..?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Again the problem is not race it is poverty.
> can anyone explain this comment, it would appear that if you are poor you 
> possibly will stab someone i dont see the connection, as i see it you may 
> stab someone if you are that type of arsehole irrespective of whether you 
> are poor or well off, there are tens of thousands of poor people that would 
> never think of harming another person indeed, they would try to help you if 
> you needed it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
THe level set at which poverty is claimed is fairly arbitary, depending 
on your view of standard of living.

The figures for Black/white crime in given as a pecentage of the 
relevent population, whereas the areas that show high % of black crime 
also show the highest levels of poverty.  Where there are higher levels 
of white crime they also make up the highest levels of poverty

X-No-Archive: yes

"Richard Bird"  wrote in message 
news:Fm_ck.261$Zm1.176@newsfe27.ams2...
>
> "mark"  wrote in message 
> news:bL6dnXx5xP-uS-7VnZ2dnUVZ8j6dnZ2d@bt.com...
>> X-No-Archive: yes
>>
>> "KJ"  wrote in message 
>> news:hdydnaC4S6LFU-7VnZ2dnUVZ8rednZ2d@bt.com...


>> Again the problem is not race it is poverty.


> can anyone explain this comment, it would appear that if you are poor you 
> possibly will stab someone i dont see the connection, as i see it you may 
> stab someone if you are that type of arsehole irrespective of whether you 
> are poor or well off, there are tens of thousands of poor people that 
> would never think of harming another person indeed, they would try to help 
> you if you needed it


Before I attempt that, can you please let us know if you believe that crime 
derives from individuality (a personal choice only)  or from plurality 
(there are many factors that impact upon ones actions)..?
It's quite important to understand that the society and culture*one* lives 
in, or is brought up among,  shapes who we are and how we behave.
For extreme examples of this watch some of the anthropological type 
programmes such as 'Tribe'  or 'Tribal Wives' to see the enormous behavoural 
differences as the cultures rub up against each other.
Closer to home,  think about the generalised differences of say the French 
to the Americans or the Italians, their attitudes, their character etc.,
Then ask yourself why the more affluent geographical areas of the UK tend to 
produce the least amount of criminals whilst the poorer, deprived areas 
produce the most...
Then ask yourself if educational opportunities influence peoples lives and 
whether wealthier parents who can provide security, structure and activities 
influence their offspring..?
There's much more but if, after considering some of the above,  you still 
think that each individual is purely that, an individual, then there's not 
much point attempting to answer your question.. it will be an inane "yes it 
is"....  "no it isn't"    type of discussion.



Mark