I seem to remember someone from Wizards last year requesting feedback
from Nats. Thought I would try and pre-empt that this time.

The tournament seemed to run smoothly and quickly. The transition from
constructed to limited was impressively quick, as was the time between
rounds.

Food - expensive and s****. Really not impressed. Not much change out
of a fiver for cake/snack + drink. Please put a water dispenser(s) in
the venue as they do at PTs. Easy to maintain and not too expensive I
imagine (though obv this takes money away from the caterers).

Judging - (not really to do with the TOs) What was all the nonsense
about foils for? Presumably it stemmed from Figure of Destiny Release
foils being playable and was something they wanted to crack down on. I
heard of multiple warnings, forced drops from events etc. There's so
little deck manipulation in the format that as long as your opp
shuffles/cuts sufficiently there shouldn't be an opportunity to cut to
a specific (marked) card. Maybe I'm being harsh and should be pleased
that the rules are being enforced but when I hear about judges not
understanding that a player who targets a creature with a Makeshift
Manequin counter on it with a Cryptic Command, then that player
shouldn't draw a card; or when a player targets a creature with
Peppersmoke, has no faeries in play, and the controller of the
creature lets it resolve, then the controller of the peppersmoke
cannot activate Mutavault then draw, Intent or no. I am glad that the
drafts were enforced, with some DQs for peeking.

Sorry for the rant, perhaps this is just my perception - any other
opinions?

On Aug 18, 12:19 pm, Guy  wrote:
> I seem to remember someone from Wizards last year requesting feedback
> from Nats. Thought I would try and pre-empt that this time.
>
> The tournament seemed to run smoothly and quickly. The transition from
> constructed to limited was impressively quick, as was the time between
> rounds.
>
> Food - expensive and s****. Really not impressed. Not much change out
> of a fiver for cake/snack  drink. Please put a water dispenser(s) in
> the venue as they do at PTs. Easy to maintain and not too expensive I
> imagine (though obv this takes money away from the caterers).
>
> Judging - (not really to do with the TOs) What was all the nonsense
> about foils for? Presumably it stemmed from Figure of Destiny Release
> foils being playable and was something they wanted to crack down on. I
> heard of multiple warnings, forced drops from events etc. There's so
> little deck manipulation in the format that as long as your opp
> shuffles/cuts sufficiently there shouldn't be an opportunity to cut to
> a specific (marked) card. Maybe I'm being harsh and should be pleased
> that the rules are being enforced but when I hear about judges not
> understanding that a player who targets a creature with a Makeshift
> Manequin counter on it with a Cryptic Command, then that player
> shouldn't draw a card; or when a player targets a creature with
> Peppersmoke, has no faeries in play, and the controller of the
> creature lets it resolve, then the controller of the peppersmoke
> cannot activate Mutavault then draw, Intent or no. I am glad that the
> drafts were enforced, with some DQs for peeking.
>
> Sorry for the rant, perhaps this is just my perception - any other
> opinions?

Oh, no Legacy events sucked too.

Congrats to the team btw.

Re the food, I'm sure it's gone up since last year, but still could be worse 
given the venue - remember Donington? <shudder>

Foils are not a problem in isolation, but when you play with bent cards 
(usually foil) it's pretty obvious which they are. When these also happen to 
be your two biggest threats, it's game loss time.

As a general feedback, I think numbers were down due in part to the timing 
of the price rise for entry to events, especially during a time of financial 
uncertainty. On the back of seeing the entry fees, several people in the 
local shop I play the odd game in decided not to bother travelling.

Nats seemed well run (other than a little confusion over card numbers in 
draft one and some issues with the clock)

I'd be happy to go back to the same venue next year.

Well done to the team, and Russ our hero alternate, plus Paul G for being a 
type I hero.

"Guy"  wrote in message 
news:949b1cc6-611f-4450-8beb-ec9be5d5b17a@k7g2000hsd.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 18, 12:19 pm, Guy  wrote:
> I seem to remember someone from Wizards last year requesting feedback
> from Nats. Thought I would try and pre-empt that this time.
>
> The tournament seemed to run smoothly and quickly. The transition from
> constructed to limited was impressively quick, as was the time between
> rounds.
>
> Food - expensive and s****. Really not impressed. Not much change out
> of a fiver for cake/snack + drink. Please put a water dispenser(s) in
> the venue as they do at PTs. Easy to maintain and not too expensive I
> imagine (though obv this takes money away from the caterers).
>
> Judging - (not really to do with the TOs) What was all the nonsense
> about foils for? Presumably it stemmed from Figure of Destiny Release
> foils being playable and was something they wanted to crack down on. I
> heard of multiple warnings, forced drops from events etc. There's so
> little deck manipulation in the format that as long as your opp
> shuffles/cuts sufficiently there shouldn't be an opportunity to cut to
> a specific (marked) card. Maybe I'm being harsh and should be pleased
> that the rules are being enforced but when I hear about judges not
> understanding that a player who targets a creature with a Makeshift
> Manequin counter on it with a Cryptic Command, then that player
> shouldn't draw a card; or when a player targets a creature with
> Peppersmoke, has no faeries in play, and the controller of the
> creature lets it resolve, then the controller of the peppersmoke
> cannot activate Mutavault then draw, Intent or no. I am glad that the
> drafts were enforced, with some DQs for peeking.
>
> Sorry for the rant, perhaps this is just my perception - any other
> opinions?

Oh, no Legacy events sucked too.

Congrats to the team btw.

The tournament:
Was really well run. there weren't any huge delays between rounds
barring 1 round of the Sunday PTQ. i was also very impressed with the
quality of the judging.
One thing that really doesn't work though is 4 round drafts. There
were far too many people with byes in round 7. There was even 1 person
who was 3-0 in his pod who ended up with a bye which just should not
happen. I'm not sure of the best way to fix this, but the current
situation is just silly. Going down to 12 rounds, or having 8 standard
rounds and 6 draft rounds, or having 3 drafts are the best I can come-
up with but none of these are ideal either.


The food:
My main problem with the food was that despite the fact that the
Sunday PTQ would be finishing around 2100, they shut the cafe at 1430!
I then went out to the Subway in the main building around 1800 and
when I came back to the venue, the security guard was *very* reluctant
to let me back in, claiming the hall was shutting at 2000 and so
nobody was allowed entry. (Like 2 hours isn't enough time for me to
get back out again).


The board games:
What happened to the giant Settlers? That was awesome. Last year there
was *lots* of choice of board games, this year there was barely
anything.

On 19 Aug, 10:53, "qqzmj...@googlemail.com" 
wrote:
> The tournament:
> Was really well run. there weren't any huge delays between rounds
> barring 1 round of the Sunday PTQ. i was also very impressed with the
> quality of the judging.
> One thing that really doesn't work though is 4 round drafts. There
> were far too many people with byes in round 7. There was even 1 person
> who was 3-0 in his pod who ended up with a bye which just should not
> happen. I'm not sure of the best way to fix this, but the current
> situation is just silly. Going down to 12 rounds, or having 8 standard
> rounds and 6 draft rounds, or having 3 drafts are the best I can come-
> up with but none of these are ideal either.
>
> The food:
> My main problem with the food was that despite the fact that the
> Sunday PTQ would be finishing around 2100, they shut the cafe at 1430!
> I then went out to the Subway in the main building around 1800 and
> when I came back to the venue, the security guard was *very* reluctant
> to let me back in, claiming the hall was shutting at 2000 and so
> nobody was allowed entry. (Like 2 hours isn't enough time for me to
> get back out again).
>
> The board games:
> What happened to the giant Settlers? That was awesome. Last year there
> was *lots* of choice of board games, this year there was barely
> anything.

If this is the same situation you talk about the reason the player on
3-0 had a bye was because his opponent was disqualified hardly his
fault or anyone elses.

I think in general it all went well.   Thought the numbers seemed down
on last year, but there did seem to be plenty to do if you were not
playing in the main event.  All this hepled to encourage other friends
that hadn't already qualified for the main event to go along a just
enjoy themseleves and made for a more social weekend.

Thought the food was pretty much the same as last year which was ok
and fairly in line with coffee shop prices.  Would have like to see a
few vegtables next time though, jamie oliver and his school diner crew
could do with giving some advice to the caterers.  They did have fruit
available thought so I supose some effort was made.

Think it was well run and hope it goes ahead again next year at the
same venue.

On 18 Aug, 12:19, Guy  wrote:
> I seem to remember someone from Wizards last year requesting feedback
> from Nats. Thought I would try and pre-empt that this time.
>
> The tournament seemed to run smoothly and quickly. The transition from
> constructed to limited was impressively quick, as was the time between
> rounds.
>
> Food - expensive and s****. Really not impressed. Not much change out
> of a fiver for cake/snack + drink. Please put a water dispenser(s) in
> the venue as they do at PTs. Easy to maintain and not too expensive I
> imagine (though obv this takes money away from the caterers).
>
> Judging - (not really to do with the TOs) What was all the nonsense
> about foils for? Presumably it stemmed from Figure of Destiny Release
> foils being playable and was something they wanted to crack down on. I
> heard of multiple warnings, forced drops from events etc. There's so
> little deck manipulation in the format that as long as your opp
> shuffles/cuts sufficiently there shouldn't be an opportunity to cut to
> a specific (marked) card. Maybe I'm being harsh and should be pleased
> that the rules are being enforced but when I hear about judges not
> understanding that a player who targets a creature with a Makeshift
> Manequin counter on it with a Cryptic Command, then that player
> shouldn't draw a card; or when a player targets a creature with
> Peppersmoke, has no faeries in play, and the controller of the
> creature lets it resolve, then the controller of the peppersmoke
> cannot activate Mutavault then draw, Intent or no. I am glad that the
> drafts were enforced, with some DQs for peeking.
>
> Sorry for the rant, perhaps this is just my perception - any other
> opinions?

                       Foil figures should certainly be playable -
otherwise they've lured people to the release tournaments under false
pretences.However,I thought that if you shuffled your opponent's deck,
[which you want to do and are obliged to do] then they got to cut it
last of all - which could present a problem unless you call in a judge
to do it.

Seems u can play foils if your name is Timmy and playing in FNM ...

Do it at anything more important and then you run the risk of
problems.

I enjoyed M Fest though found kept going to time even in draft and
actually gettting food another issue entirely...... lunch break ?

The food menu was pretty much the same as last year, expensive but
then again it was the NEC and have paid more for less in the past.


On 19 Aug, 17:32, "nonteadrin...@yahoo.co.uk"
 wrote:
> On 18 Aug, 12:19, Guy  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > I seem to remember someone from Wizards last year requesting feedback
> > from Nats. Thought I would try and pre-empt that this time.
>
> > The tournament seemed to run smoothly and quickly. The transition from
> > constructed to limited was impressively quick, as was the time between
> > rounds.
>
> > Food - expensive and s****. Really not impressed. Not much change out
> > of a fiver for cake/snack  drink. Please put a water dispenser(s) in
> > the venue as they do at PTs. Easy to maintain and not too expensive I
> > imagine (though obv this takes money away from the caterers).
>
> > Judging - (not really to do with the TOs) What was all the nonsense
> > about foils for? Presumably it stemmed from Figure of Destiny Release
> > foils being playable and was something they wanted to crack down on. I
> > heard of multiple warnings, forced drops from events etc. There's so
> > little deck manipulation in the format that as long as your opp
> > shuffles/cuts sufficiently there shouldn't be an opportunity to cut to
> > a specific (marked) card. Maybe I'm being harsh and should be pleased
> > that the rules are being enforced but when I hear about judges not
> > understanding that a player who targets a creature with a Makeshift
> > Manequin counter on it with a Cryptic Command, then that player
> > shouldn't draw a card; or when a player targets a creature with
> > Peppersmoke, has no faeries in play, and the controller of the
> > creature lets it resolve, then the controller of the peppersmoke
> > cannot activate Mutavault then draw, Intent or no. I am glad that the
> > drafts were enforced, with some DQs for peeking.
>
> > Sorry for the rant, perhaps this is just my perception - any other
> > opinions?
>
>                        Foil figures should certainly be playable -
> otherwise they've lured people to the release tournaments under false
> pretences.However,I thought that if you shuffled your opponent's deck,
> [which you want to do and are obliged to do] then they got to cut it
> last of all - which could present a problem unless you call in a judge
> to do it.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

One criticism is that the cafeteria didn't open each day until _after_
the main event had started, making it somewhat difficult to have
breakfast...

Roy

"Guy"  wrote in message 
news:53bedfdd-aa32-4e02-b065-4432a8424c17@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> Food - expensive and s****. Really not impressed. Not much change out
> of a fiver for cake/snack + drink. Please put a water dispenser(s) in
> the venue as they do at PTs. Easy to maintain and not too expensive I
> imagine (though obv this takes money away from the caterers).

I didn't go this year, couldn't quite spare the time.  Is this all in the 
same place (Pavillion, was it?) as last year?  I thought the food last year 
was fairly respectable for such a place.

> Judging - (not really to do with the TOs) What was all the nonsense
> about foils for?

Again, having missed the event, I've no idea what this is all about, anyone 
care to expand upon it?

Who was HJ?  I'll admit, I've never seen anywhere near the anti-foil 
sentiment amongst judges worldwide as I have amongst some UK judges.

On 21 Aug, 07:52, "Simon Cooper"  wrote:
> "Guy"  wrote in message
>
> news:53bedfdd-aa32-4e02-b065-4432a8424c17@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Food - expensive and s****. Really not impressed. Not much change out
> > of a fiver for cake/snack + drink. Please put a water dispenser(s) in
> > the venue as they do at PTs. Easy to maintain and not too expensive I
> > imagine (though obv this takes money away from the caterers).
>
> I didn't go this year, couldn't quite spare the time.  Is this all in the
> same place (Pavillion, was it?) as last year?  I thought the food last year
> was fairly respectable for such a place.
>
> > Judging - (not really to do with the TOs) What was all the nonsense
> > about foils for?
>
> Again, having missed the event, I've no idea what this is all about, anyone
> care to expand upon it?
>
> Who was HJ?  I'll admit, I've never seen anywhere near the anti-foil
> sentiment amongst judges worldwide as I have amongst some UK judges.

The Head Judge was Falko Level 3 from Germany. It seems this fuss with
Foil Figure of Destiny originated from the Irish Nationals and other
events where they were treated as marked cards because they were very
bent. I must say however that Falko was very lenient about this and
there was no witch hunt on Foil cards. In other events such as LCQ
with another Head Judge this may not have been the case.

From the Collected Witterings of boomerangguy1@googlemail.com, volume 23:

> The Head Judge was Falko Level 3 from Germany. It seems this fuss with
> Foil Figure of Destiny originated from the Irish Nationals and other
> events where they were treated as marked cards because they were very
> bent.

To be more precise, they were bent to the point where you could visibly pick 
them out just by looking at the deck.  In such cases I was able to cut 
directly to a foil Figure at will, and shuffle one to the top of the deck 
every time.  I'm sure you can understand why we couldn't allow people to 
play with cards in that condition.

However, the Figures couldn't be replaced as the dealers all sold out by 
Thursday afternoon, and they couldn't be proxied as they hadn't been damaged 
in the course of play.  The only option left in the rules was to replace 
them with a basic land - and of course it stuffs speed aggro decks royally 
when they lose their best one-drops for four extra lands.  In effect we had 
to ask a number of players to withdraw from events before we were forced to 
DQ them, when the difficulty was mostly not of their making.   It was a 
rotten situation for all concerned, but there simply wasn't anything else we 
could do.

On 21 Aug, 15:16, "David Chapman"  wrote:
> From the Collected Witterings of boomerangg...@googlemail.com, volume 23:
>
> > The Head Judge was Falko Level 3 from Germany. It seems this fuss with
> > Foil Figure of Destiny originated from the Irish Nationals and other
> > events where they were treated as marked cards because they were very
> > bent.
>
> To be more precise, they were bent to the point where you could visibly pick
> them out just by looking at the deck.  In such cases I was able to cut
> directly to a foil Figure at will, and shuffle one to the top of the deck
> every time.  I'm sure you can understand why we couldn't allow people to
> play with cards in that condition.
>
> However, the Figures couldn't be replaced as the dealers all sold out by
> Thursday afternoon, and they couldn't be proxied as they hadn't been damaged
> in the course of play.  The only option left in the rules was to replace
> them with a basic land - and of course it stuffs speed aggro decks royally
> when they lose their best one-drops for four extra lands.  In effect we had
> to ask a number of players to withdraw from events before we were forced to
> DQ them, when the difficulty was mostly not of their making.   It was a
> rotten situation for all concerned, but there simply wasn't anything else we
> could do.

Couldn't you just perhaps, bend the card the other way?

Oh and turn out was probably down because the last few sets have been
shit

> Couldn't you just perhaps, bend the card the other way?

Yes. Flattening a bent card to ensure it's indistinguishable from the
rest of the deck is acceptable. When I was asked about foils at M-
Fest, I certainly advised players to ensure they were flat and that
they may need to do so before every game. However, you can understand
that if a bent foil is obvious in a current game/match, then we must
penalise for Marked Cards.

From a judge perspective, this isn't a "foil" issue.  It's a Marked
Cards issue. Foils will not be treated as marked any more than non-
foils would, however, due to their composition, foils are more likely
to become marked. Ensuring they are flat before every game is an
acceptable method to ensure they're not marked (presuming that they
aren't marked in another way, of course).

>Judging

Thank you for the praise for the judge staff. I was very proud of our
judges this year, they were exemplary. I'd ask critics to remember
that judges are volunteers and have no formal training.  Given that
judging for most is effectively a hobby, I certainly feel that their
level of commitment and professionalism is outstanding. All told, I'm
guessing M-Fest would have been significantly worse off without the
judges...

Incidentally, if you have any advice or recommendations for the judge
staff, I'll gladly hear them (nick@dcijudge.co.uk).

Cheers

Nick Sephton
DCI Judge Coordinator UK & Ireland
DCI Judge Level 3

Bad Points

Bad Clash with another event some Quilting event for Women, took out
most off the local hotel accomodation unless you booked 6 months
ahead.

Expensive side and main events

Knock out drafts at £9 each don't exactly encourage people to sign up
for drafts.  Limited events at £22.50 expensive

Good Points

Well run (bit too fast if anything)

Complementary Carrier bag (contained Mfest schedule, Score pad, Pen
and 1 or 2 boosters) but no T - Shirt

Okay Points

Food not too expensive but quality was pretty poor

If they want to encourage attendence outside of the main event, either
go back to the one free draft a day or reduce prices for side and
scheduled events

Attendance was definitely down on previous years, and i think higher
prices for side events must be a contributing factor. I'm left
wondering if this is a result of budgetary cuts for the event?
Obviously, hall hire and judge/admin team costs have to be met
somehow, but previous nationals seem to have been much more generous
to side event players. Can anyone shed light on this? Jason? I believe
that the main reason for amalgamating English, Scottish and Welsh Nats
into GB was budgetary, and was told the change would allow Wizards to
run a much better Nationals.

If it is higher prices that kept players away, might it make
commercial sense to lower them and improve turnout?

The M-fest feeder events seem like a great idea in principal,
improving local TO's promotability and drawing people in, but is there
a way the rewards for attendance can be improved (e.g. free drafts)?

Another way of improving attendance might be to increase the number of
LCQ slots available. In the past we have had Sealed Deck flights and 8-
man Standard offering slots well into Thursday night. These both
encourage those keen to play in Nationals, but not yet made it, to
actually show up, and they offer the bonus of £££'s of entry fees to
the organisers. If people make the effort to turn up for LCQ's, they
are a captive market for the entire weekend!

In fact, i wonder if overall attendance might be boosted by offering
more places through Nationals Qualifiers too. We used to have huge
nationals when 8  1 for every 8 qualified, and people would drop from
Nats and play side events on days 2 and 3. Perhaps 1 for every 8 or
part 8 would allow more people to experience Nationals? Perhaps more
people in the main event would see them bringing their friends along
for side events?

As a (would-be) competitive player i was glad to see PTQ's and GP
trials with travel awards each day. These are EXACTLY the side events
i want to play in. Whilst the 'win a gadget' events seemed like good
value, the only other event i would like to see is a 'cash prize'
sealed event (which has proved very popular in the past).

Food was expensive. Water cooler is an excellent idea.

Judges seemed to be doing a great job. Was impressed with Oli Bird's
HJ'ing. Admin team seemed smooth as clockwork.

I overheard the foil problem was specific to promo Figure of Destiny,
which has a double layer of foil. I don't understand why they couldn't
be proxied though?

Music between rounds of the main event was coool. Saw Glenn dance-a-
cising round the hall at regular intervals, and others tapping,
jigging, drumming and shaking their booty (Marco).

It would be nice to hear the views of the organisers on the event, in
this thread or elsewhere.

On Aug 30, 9:11 am, magicbusmark  wrote:
> Attendance was definitely down on previous years, and i think higher
> prices for side events must be a contributing factor. I'm left
> wondering if this is a result of budgetary cuts for the event?
> Obviously, hall hire and judge/admin team costs have to be met
> somehow, but previous nationals seem to have been much more generous
> to side event players. Can anyone shed light on this? Jason? I believe
> that the main reason for amalgamating English, Scottish and Welsh Nats
> into GB was budgetary, and was told the change would allow Wizards to
> run a much better Nationals.
>
> If it is higher prices that kept players away, might it make
> commercial sense to lower them and improve turnout?
>
> The M-fest feeder events seem like a great idea in principal,
> improving local TO's promotability and drawing people in, but is there
> a way the rewards for attendance can be improved (e.g. free drafts)?
>
> Another way of improving attendance might be to increase the number of
> LCQ slots available. In the past we have had Sealed Deck flights and 8-
> man Standard offering slots well into Thursday night. These both
> encourage those keen to play in Nationals, but not yet made it, to
> actually show up, and they offer the bonus of £££'s of entry fees to
> the organisers. If people make the effort to turn up for LCQ's, they
> are a captive market for the entire weekend!
>
> In fact, i wonder if overall attendance might be boosted by offering
> more places through Nationals Qualifiers too. We used to have huge
> nationals when 8  1 for every 8 qualified, and people would drop from
> Nats and play side events on days 2 and 3. Perhaps 1 for every 8 or
> part 8 would allow more people to experience Nationals? Perhaps more
> people in the main event would see them bringing their friends along
> for side events?
>
> As a (would-be) competitive player i was glad to see PTQ's and GP
> trials with travel awards each day. These are EXACTLY the side events
> i want to play in. Whilst the 'win a gadget' events seemed like good
> value, the only other event i would like to see is a 'cash prize'
> sealed event (which has proved very popular in the past).
>
> Food was expensive. Water cooler is an excellent idea.
>
> Judges seemed to be doing a great job. Was impressed with Oli Bird's
> HJ'ing. Admin team seemed smooth as clockwork.
>
> I overheard the foil problem was specific to promo Figure of Destiny,
> which has a double layer of foil. I don't understand why they couldn't
> be proxied though?
>
> Music between rounds of the main event was coool. Saw Glenn dance-a-
> cising round the hall at regular intervals, and others tapping,
> jigging, drumming and shaking their booty (Marco).
>
> It would be nice to hear the views of the organisers on the event, in
> this thread or elsewhere.

Have they not had enough time to develop a method of foiling that
doesn't cause the cards to warp as they still seem to be doing?

If this was a known problem specific to figure of destiny, was it
announced prior to people handing in their decksheets what would be
done, at lease giving people the opportunity to play a different card
instead?

On 30 Aug, 09:11, magicbusmark  wrote:
> Attendance was definitely down on previous years, and i think higher
> prices for side events must be a contributing factor. I'm left
> wondering if this is a result of budgetary cuts for the event?
> Obviously, hall hire and judge/admin team costs have to be met
> somehow, but previous nationals seem to have been much more generous
> to side event players. Can anyone shed light on this? Jason? I believe
> that the main reason for amalgamating English, Scottish and Welsh Nats
> into GB was budgetary, and was told the change would allow Wizards to
> run a much better Nationals.
>
> If it is higher prices that kept players away, might it make
> commercial sense to lower them and improve turnout?
>
> The M-fest feeder events seem like a great idea in principal,
> improving local TO's promotability and drawing people in, but is there
> a way the rewards for attendance can be improved (e.g. free drafts)?
>
> Another way of improving attendance might be to increase the number of
> LCQ slots available. In the past we have had Sealed Deck flights and 8-
> man Standard offering slots well into Thursday night. These both
> encourage those keen to play in Nationals, but not yet made it, to
> actually show up, and they offer the bonus of £££'s of entry fees to
> the organisers. If people make the effort to turn up for LCQ's, they
> are a captive market for the entire weekend!
>
> In fact, i wonder if overall attendance might be boosted by offering
> more places through Nationals Qualifiers too. We used to have huge
> nationals when 8  1 for every 8 qualified, and people would drop from
> Nats and play side events on days 2 and 3. Perhaps 1 for every 8 or
> part 8 would allow more people to experience Nationals? Perhaps more
> people in the main event would see them bringing their friends along
> for side events?
>
> As a (would-be) competitive player i was glad to see PTQ's and GP
> trials with travel awards each day. These are EXACTLY the side events
> i want to play in. Whilst the 'win a gadget' events seemed like good
> value, the only other event i would like to see is a 'cash prize'
> sealed event (which has proved very popular in the past).
>
> Food was expensive. Water cooler is an excellent idea.
>
> Judges seemed to be doing a great job. Was impressed with Oli Bird's
> HJ'ing. Admin team seemed smooth as clockwork.
>
> I overheard the foil problem was specific to promo Figure of Destiny,
> which has a double layer of foil. I don't understand why they couldn't
> be proxied though?
>
> Music between rounds of the main event was coool. Saw Glenn dance-a-
> cising round the hall at regular intervals, and others tapping,
> jigging, drumming and shaking their booty (Marco).
>
> It would be nice to hear the views of the organisers on the event, in
> this thread or elsewhere.

The reason the Foils could not be proxied is that Judges are ONLY
allowed to proxy cards that have been damaged during an event. Promo
foils tend to get bent because they are shipped in large numbers
together. There apparently was prior warning on a newsgroup about the
problem of these and other foils. I understand player`s frustration`s
about this but we had little alternative in some cases. I once again
emphasis that there was no witch hunt for foils and never will be.
Cards are either marked or not regardless of whether they are foils or
otherwise.

A prior warning on a newsgroup, how handy! Why not put it on the
wizards website, or if it is too late for that tell each player when
they sign up. At least give them a chance to play cards that won't get
them into trouble.

On 31 Aug, 15:42, "boomerangg...@googlemail.com"
 wrote:
> On 30 Aug, 09:11, magicbusmark  wrote:
>
>
>
> > Attendance was definitely down on previous years, and i think higher
> > prices for side events must be a contributing factor. I'm left
> > wondering if this is a result of budgetary cuts for the event?
> > Obviously, hall hire and judge/admin team costs have to be met
> > somehow, but previous nationals seem to have been much more generous
> > to side event players. Can anyone shed light on this? Jason? I believe
> > that the main reason for amalgamating English, Scottish and Welsh Nats
> > into GB was budgetary, and was told the change would allow Wizards to
> > run a much better Nationals.
>
> > If it is higher prices that kept players away, might it make
> > commercial sense to lower them and improve turnout?
>
> > The M-fest feeder events seem like a great idea in principal,
> > improving local TO's promotability and drawing people in, but is there
> > a way the rewards for attendance can be improved (e.g. free drafts)?
>
> > Another way of improving attendance might be to increase the number of
> > LCQ slots available. In the past we have had Sealed Deck flights and 8-
> > man Standard offering slots well into Thursday night. These both
> > encourage those keen to play in Nationals, but not yet made it, to
> > actually show up, and they offer the bonus of £££'s of entry fees to
> > the organisers. If people make the effort to turn up for LCQ's, they
> > are a captive market for the entire weekend!
>
> > In fact, i wonder if overall attendance might be boosted by offering
> > more places through Nationals Qualifiers too. We used to have huge
> > nationals when 8  1 for every 8 qualified, and people would drop from
> > Nats and play side events on days 2 and 3. Perhaps 1 for every 8 or
> > part 8 would allow more people to experience Nationals? Perhaps more
> > people in the main event would see them bringing their friends along
> > for side events?
>
> > As a (would-be) competitive player i was glad to see PTQ's and GP
> > trials with travel awards each day. These are EXACTLY the side events
> > i want to play in. Whilst the 'win a gadget' events seemed like good
> > value, the only other event i would like to see is a 'cash prize'
> > sealed event (which has proved very popular in the past).
>
> > Food was expensive. Water cooler is an excellent idea.
>
> > Judges seemed to be doing a great job. Was impressed with Oli Bird's
> > HJ'ing. Admin team seemed smooth as clockwork.
>
> > I overheard the foil problem was specific to promo Figure of Destiny,
> > which has a double layer of foil. I don't understand why they couldn't
> > be proxied though?
>
> > Music between rounds of the main event was coool. Saw Glenn dance-a-
> > cising round the hall at regular intervals, and others tapping,
> > jigging, drumming and shaking their booty (Marco).
>
> > It would be nice to hear the views of the organisers on the event, in
> > this thread or elsewhere.
>
> The reason the Foils could not be proxied is that Judges are ONLY
> allowed to proxy cards that have been damaged during an event. Promo
> foils tend to get bent because they are shipped in large numbers
> together. There apparently was prior warning on a newsgroup about the
> problem of these and other foils. I understand player`s frustration`s
> about this but we had little alternative in some cases. I once again
> emphasis that there was no witch hunt for foils and never will be.
> Cards are either marked or not regardless of whether they are foils or
> otherwise.

On Aug 31, 9:59 pm, nickx  wrote:
> A prior warning on a newsgroup, how handy! Why not put it on the
> wizards website, or if it is too late for that tell each player when
> they sign up. At least give them a chance to play cards that won't get
> them into trouble.

You can find everything you need in the Penalty Guidelines or other
Policy Documentation, all of which is available at the DCI Document
Centre! http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dci/doccenter/home

Hmm... perhaps that's not the most helpful answer :)

This isn't an issue with Foil Figures of Destiny, it's an issue with
Marked Cards. If players were playing *FLAT* unmarked Foil Figures in
their decks, there wouldn't have been a problem. So a warning about
Foil Figures would be relatively unhelpful to those that got penalties
for their marked foil Demigods (etc) - and it seems a little biased to
warn for one card and not another.

Hope this helps

Nick Sephton
DCI Judge Coordinator UK & Ireland
DCI Judge Level 3

It just happens to be that Foils these are more often than not marked
cards, however doesn't go well for Wizards you can play in any event
with Foils as long as they aren't marked

Q.E.D



On 1 Sep, 08:24, nickseph...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Aug 31, 9:59 pm, nickx  wrote:
>
> > A prior warning on a newsgroup, how handy! Why not put it on the
> > wizards website, or if it is too late for that tell each player when
> > they sign up. At least give them a chance to play cards that won't get
> > them into trouble.
>
> You can find everything you need in the Penalty Guidelines or other
> Policy Documentation, all of which is available at the DCI Document
> Centre!http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dci/doccenter/home
>
> Hmm... perhaps that's not the most helpful answer :)
>
> This isn't an issue with Foil Figures of Destiny, it's an issue with
> Marked Cards. If players were playing *FLAT* unmarked Foil Figures in
> their decks, there wouldn't have been a problem. So a warning about
> Foil Figures would be relatively unhelpful to those that got penalties
> for their marked foil Demigods (etc) - and it seems a little biased to
> warn for one card and not another.
>
> Hope this helps
>
> Nick Sephton
> DCI Judge Coordinator UK & Ireland
> DCI Judge Level 3

On 1 Sep, 08:24, nickseph...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Aug 31, 9:59 pm, nickx  wrote:
>
> > A prior warning on a newsgroup, how handy! Why not put it on the
> > wizards website, or if it is too late for that tell each player when
> > they sign up. At least give them a chance to play cards that won't get
> > them into trouble.
>
> You can find everything you need in the Penalty Guidelines or other
> Policy Documentation, all of which is available at the DCI Document
> Centre!http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dci/doccenter/home
>
> Hmm... perhaps that's not the most helpful answer :)
>
> This isn't an issue with Foil Figures of Destiny, it's an issue with
> Marked Cards. If players were playing *FLAT* unmarked Foil Figures in
> their decks, there wouldn't have been a problem. So a warning about
> Foil Figures would be relatively unhelpful to those that got penalties
> for their marked foil Demigods (etc) - and it seems a little biased to
> warn for one card and not another.
>
> Hope this helps
>
> Nick Sephton
> DCI Judge Coordinator UK & Ireland
> DCI Judge Level 3

I didn't mean just on Figures, maybe just a reminder to players to
check their foils before the tournament as there were concerns about
some of the foils in previous tournaments?

On Sep 2, 12:25 am, nickx  wrote:
> I didn't mean just on Figures, maybe just a reminder to players to
> check their foils before the tournament as there were concerns about
> some of the foils in previous tournaments?- Hide quoted text -

Ah, I see.  I believe this was done on the main event, although I'd
have to check with Falko to be certain. I know it was discussed at
least.  To be honest, you probably have a better idea than I do, the
main event wasn't really my concern that weekend, so it's entirely
possible I'm wrong.

I think it's generally considered that Magic players understand there
is a certain amount of "Bad Stuff" associated with playing foils.
While it would be nice to provide a more thorough education, I imagine
it will once again devolve into a garbled message such as - "If you
play foils, the judges will *get* you."!

I'll bear this in mind for next year however, presuming we have
another highly playable promo widely available.

Cheers

Nick Sephton
DCI Judge Coordinator UK & Ireland
DCI Judge Level 3

I think the issue may continue next year, dependent upon what rotates
etc.

Not only did we have the Foil Demigods and Figures of Destiny, we had
Gateway Faerie Conclave, Treetop Village and Mogg Fanatic, then we
have FNM Tormod's Crypt and Wall of Roots.

The foils coming out more recently have been much more playable and
attracts more players at a local level who eventually upgrade to
higher level events.

Players at my FNM's that were also M Fest Feeders could go to M Fest,
enter their first PTQ and their deck which they played with locally at
REL 1 is suddenly potentially marked.

Mark



On Sep 2, 8:10 am, nickseph...@gmail.com wrote:


> On Sep 2, 12:25 am, nickx  wrote:
>
> > I didn't mean just on Figures, maybe just a reminder to players to
> > check their foils before the tournament as there were concerns about
> > some of the foils in previous tournaments?- Hide quoted text -
>
> Ah, I see.  I believe this was done on the main event, although I'd
> have to check with Falko to be certain. I know it was discussed at
> least.  To be honest, you probably have a better idea than I do, the
> main event wasn't really my concern that weekend, so it's entirely
> possible I'm wrong.
>
> I think it's generally considered that Magic players understand there
> is a certain amount of "Bad Stuff" associated with playing foils.
> While it would be nice to provide a more thorough education, I imagine
> it will once again devolve into a garbled message such as - "If you
> play foils, the judges will *get* you."!
>
> I'll bear this in mind for next year however, presuming we have
> another highly playable promo widely available.
>
> Cheers
>
> Nick Sephton
> DCI Judge Coordinator UK & Ireland
> DCI Judge Level 3

On 2 Sep, 10:08, Wile Coyote Uk  wrote:
> I think the issue may continue next year, dependent upon what rotates
> etc.
>
> Not only did we have the Foil Demigods and Figures of Destiny, we had
> Gateway Faerie Conclave, Treetop Village and Mogg Fanatic, then we
> have FNM Tormod's Crypt and Wall of Roots.
>
> The foils coming out more recently have been much more playable and
> attracts more players at a local level who eventually upgrade to
> higher level events.
>
> Players at my FNM's that were also M Fest Feeders could go to M Fest,
> enter their first PTQ and their deck which they played with locally at
> REL 1 is suddenly potentially marked.
>
> Mark
>
> On Sep 2, 8:10 am, nickseph...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > On Sep 2, 12:25 am, nickx  wrote:
>
> > > I didn't mean just on Figures, maybe just a reminder to players to
> > > check their foils before the tournament as there were concerns about
> > > some of the foils in previous tournaments?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > Ah, I see.  I believe this was done on the main event, although I'd
> > have to check with Falko to be certain. I know it was discussed at
> > least.  To be honest, you probably have a better idea than I do, the
> > main event wasn't really my concern that weekend, so it's entirely
> > possible I'm wrong.
>
> > I think it's generally considered that Magic players understand there
> > is a certain amount of "Bad Stuff" associated with playing foils.
> > While it would be nice to provide a more thorough education, I imagine
> > it will once again devolve into a garbled message such as - "If you
> > play foils, the judges will *get* you."!
>
> > I'll bear this in mind for next year however, presuming we have
> > another highly playable promo widely available.
>
> > Cheers
>
> > Nick Sephton
> > DCI Judge Coordinator UK & Ireland
> > DCI Judge Level 3

good points:  getting drunk and having a great time with my mates
free food and drink all day in the monopoly part of the venue
the hot girls in the monopoly part of the venue
playing monopoly in the monopoly part of the venue
nearly making the monopoly nationals
coming 150th out of 150 at nats
generally moaning about magic and bad/draws and lucky topdecks

bad points: playing magic

:)

(seriously tho - magic makes more than any other game for wizards/
hasbro yet no free water - monopoly makes some sure yet free
sandwiches, bottled and hot drinks and biscuits etc.  there wasnt even
an entry fee to play although i guess they only gave away about 10
games of monopoly as prizes.)

see you all in grimsby for the regional!