My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
school.
We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
serves content.
Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
them at school to access programs and files securely.
At first sight this looks like thin client.
Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
parameters?
What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
sort of work would be restricted.
At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
expectancy for thin client devices?
Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP is talking about looking at. The software 
never leaves your servers with this kind of solution, all that is sent is 
(essentially) screen shots of what is happening in the terminal, and all 
that is received back from the laptop is mouse and keyboard actions.

On 12 May, 09:27, "Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net>
wrote:
> [snip]> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> > school.
>
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of
> copyright.
>
> For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the
> network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a
> network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I
> suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on
> software would still be an issue.

As well as the comments that Robert has said I would also say that you
*don't* have to put the CC3 client on every machine. That is what you
pay for, not for just connecting it to your network. A CC3 network
does not mean the *every* machine has to have the client on ... it is
a good idea but there are ways around it. If the students have their
own laptops they can connect to a section of the network the is
sectioned off to the rest of it (like a wireless hoptspot) but then
use terminal services to connect to a server and run programs. This
way you can control th enumber of licences used and not have to worry
about the administration of hundreds of laptops too.

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:19:21 -0700, GrumbleDook wrote:


> 
> Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
> still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
> good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

> Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
> staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend this
> to students next year. We are actually putting something in between now
> ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global desktop as the
> front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking with MS TS.

Sun's Global desktop is an interesting solution. It enables Windows or
Linux programmes to be run from servers in the school in a terminal that
runs a java enabled web browser. Any platform for the client as long as it
has a java enabled browser. Its less expensive than Citrix and more
versatile than terminal services as you don't need Windows clients but can
still run Windows apps - licensing is another issue. 

If you can teach students to get the best from free generic resources and
the web as far as possible you can move to a position where the
license issue will be a lot less significant. If you can't afford it you
can't do it anyway so you might as well do what you can afford to do. But
that requires a change in attitudes to what is "essential" in using IT to
support learning. That in itself is a significant learning curve for most
people but then again maths and computing specialist schools have a remit
to provide leadership in new ways of doing things.

> Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that very
> successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard work.
> 
> If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
> EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Tony Sheppard
-- 
Ian
New QCA accredited ICT qualifications
Suitable for primary and secondary schools
www.theINGOTs.org

On 11 May, 13:12, achilles  wrote:
> My school is a specialist Maths and Computing school. I would like to
> extend the use of our resources which are scandalously under used. The
> first thing is to allow students full access to their school network
> drives for opening and saving work to from outside of school.
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
> We use a VLE (moodle) which does something to help, but it essentially
> serves content.
> Additionaly, those students who have laptops should be able to use
> them at school to access programs and files securely.
> At first sight this looks like thin client.
> Does anyone have experience in deploying a system with these
> parameters?
> What are the problems associated with thin client networks and what
> sort of work would be restricted.
> At the moment we have 400 computers with 900 students the number is
> rising but the replacement is going to be difficult to finance if you
> assume a life of 3-4 years. Am I right in assuming a longer life
> expectancy for thin client devices?
> Can anyone suggest a supplier/technology

Looking at what you have at the moment and what you can do to make the
most of it for the longest time ... you have a number of options.

Firstly ... Moodle is extremely good, and making as many resoures
available is important. I would be interested in hearing how
successful you have been getting complete courses available for online
learning. There are additional modules to allow wedDAV access that
some schools have tried. Moodle.org can give more info about this.

Secondly ... terminal services is a strong option in this, whether you
still have the fat client laptop or go for thin client desktops it is
good. Likewise Citrix is an option but for some the cost is not right.

Thirdly ... we are improving our remote access which presently is for
staff only. We use MS terminal services over the 'Net and will extend
this to students next year. We are actually putting something in
between now ... we are going for Sun servers and using secure global
desktop as the front end for the terminal servers ... but sticking
with MS TS.

Previously I have set up WebDAV folders for everyone and found that
very successful, but I would now prefer for our server to do the hard
work.

If you want information on the suppliers the email me, or pop over to
EduGeek.net for more information about thin clients.

HTH

Tony Sheppard

[snip]
> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
> school.
[snip]

If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
copyright.

For that reason, we allow them to access our Internet facilities but not the 
network itself.  We have an RM network and we would have to pay for a 
network licence for each laptop if we allowed access to the network.  I 
suppose other network setups might not have this cost but the copyright on 
software would still be an issue.

"Liz J" <thejordanschangethistoanatsignclara.net> wrote in message 
news:1178958451.15589.0@damia.uk.clara.net...
> [snip]
>> Secondly is to allow them to use the programs that are used at
>> school.
> [snip]
>
> If the laptops are not owned by the school this would break all sorts of 
> copyright.

Not with thin client, which the OP i