I'm using fedora 11. The whole of the keyboard is working OK with the 
exception the left shift key is distinctly dodgy. If I press down (take 
up the slack) and the push some more I can get occasional normal 
operation. Just the casual press down does not work.

Are there any X windows settings that may cause this sort of a problem? 
Any diagnostic suggestions. Err does a keyboard need a driver?

I'd like to try to rule out o/s before complaining to dell.

Thanks andy

PS:When I removed the plastic surround from the keyboard the left shift 
key started to work partially.

On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 20:41:05 +0000, Andy Botterill wrote:

> I'm using fedora 11. The whole of the keyboard is working OK with the
> exception the left shift key is distinctly dodgy. If I press down (take up
> the slack) and the push some more I can get occasional normal operation.
> Just the casual press down does not work.

As far as anything outside of the keyboard is concerned, a key is either
pressed or not. There is no means of signalling "pressed hard". So this
is a keyboard problem.

> Are there any X windows settings that may cause this sort of a problem?

No. You can confirm this by trying it in a text console (ctrl-alt-F2 will
give you one, ctrl-alt-F7 will return to your X session).

> Any diagnostic suggestions. Err does a keyboard need a driver?

Yes, but it's a generic keyboard driver plus the USB drivers if
applicable. It's not responsible for the partial functioning of a key.

> I'd like to try to rule out o/s before complaining to dell.

Is this a laptop? If not, given the cost of manufacturing a keyboard these
days, they're likely to replace it without question. How old is it? Has it
always done this? You havn't spilled coffee onto it or anything such have
you?
 
> PS:When I removed the plastic surround from the keyboard the left shift
> key started to work partially.

This confirms it's a sticky key. Don't tell Dell you took it apart.

Regards, Ian

Ian Northeast wrote:
> On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 20:41:05 +0000, Andy Botterill wrote:
> 
>> I'm using fedora 11. The whole of the keyboard is working OK with the
>> exception the left shift key is distinctly dodgy. If I press down (take up
>> the slack) and the push some more I can get occasional normal operation.
>> Just the casual press down does not work.
> 
> As far as anything outside of the keyboard is concerned, a key is either
> pressed or not. There is no means of signalling "pressed hard". So this
> is a keyboard problem.
> 
>> Are there any X windows settings that may cause this sort of a problem?
> 
> No. You can confirm this by trying it in a text console (ctrl-alt-F2 will
> give you one, ctrl-alt-F7 will return to your X session).

I usually use command line stuff. But I will try this.
> 
>> Any diagnostic suggestions. Err does a keyboard need a driver?
> 
> Yes, but it's a generic keyboard driver plus the USB drivers if
> applicable. It's not responsible for the partial functioning of a key.

Just checking.
> 
>> I'd like to try to rule out o/s before complaining to dell.
> 
> Is this a laptop? If not, given the cost of manufacturing a keyboard these
> days, they're likely to replace it without question. How old is it? Has it

I'm glad tha they should replace it. Is it likely to be a we'll send 
someone round or please return to base. If it's return to base I'd 
better remove fedora and install windows (ugh).

> always done this? You havn't spilled coffee onto it or anything such have
> you?

The laptop is two weeks old. I haven't been spilling stuff on it.
>  
>> PS:When I removed the plastic surround from the keyboard the left shift
>> key started to work partially.
> 
> This confirms it's a sticky key. Don't tell Dell you took it apart.

This is the packing material. I haven't got around to taking the plastic 
strip off the screen yet.
> 
> Regards, Ian
Thank you andy

Andy Botterill wrote:

> Ian Northeast wrote:
>> always done this? You havn't spilled coffee onto it or anything such have
>> you?
> 
> The laptop is two weeks old. I haven't been spilling stuff on it.
>>  
>>> PS:When I removed the plastic surround from the keyboard the left shift
>>> key started to work partially.
>> 
>> This confirms it's a sticky key. Don't tell Dell you took it apart.
> 
> This is the packing material. I haven't got around to taking the plastic
> strip off the screen yet.

Then, definitely return it. It's not 'of merchantable quality'. This is part
of your statutory rights. If it's less 6 months old any fault is assumed to
have been there from the start unless otherwise proven by the vendor. After
6 months the onus is reversed to the buyer. This is true for all products
and is in addition to any warranty.

I doubt Dell will quibble even if you left Fedora on it.

-- 
The email address is a spam trap. I rarely use it.

On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 22:50:28 +0000, Ian Northeast
 wrote:

>On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 20:41:05 +0000, Andy Botterill wrote:
>
>> I'm using fedora 11. The whole of the keyboard is working OK with the
>> exception the left shift key is distinctly dodgy. If I press down (take up
>> the slack) and the push some more I can get occasional normal operation.
>> Just the casual press down does not work.
>
>As far as anything outside of the keyboard is concerned, a key is either
>pressed or not. There is no means of signalling "pressed hard". So this
>is a keyboard problem.
>
>> Are there any X windows settings that may cause this sort of a problem?
>
>No. You can confirm this by trying it in a text console (ctrl-alt-F2 will
>give you one, ctrl-alt-F7 will return to your X session).
>
>> Any diagnostic suggestions. Err does a keyboard need a driver?
>
>Yes, but it's a generic keyboard driver plus the USB drivers if
>applicable. It's not responsible for the partial functioning of a key.
>
>> I'd like to try to rule out o/s before complaining to dell.
>
>Is this a laptop? If not, given the cost of manufacturing a keyboard these
>days, they're likely to replace it without question. How old is it? Has it
>always done this? You havn't spilled coffee onto it or anything such have
>you?
> 
>> PS:When I removed the plastic surround from the keyboard the left shift
>> key started to work partially.
>
>This confirms it's a sticky key. Don't tell Dell you took it apart.

Dell recently replaced  defective £700 TV that failed after two months without
question. I had a replacement 7 days after reporting that the TV was dead. 
-- 

Martin

On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 09:30:18 +0000, Chris  wrote:

>Andy Botterill wrote:
>
>> Ian Northeast wrote:
>>> always done this? You havn't spilled coffee onto it or anything such have
>>> you?
>> 
>> The laptop is two weeks old. I haven't been spilling stuff on it.
>>>  
>>>> PS:When I removed the plastic surround from the keyboard the left shift
>>>> key started to work partially.
>>> 
>>> This confirms it's a sticky key. Don't tell Dell you took it apart.
>> 
>> This is the packing material. I haven't got around to taking the plastic
>> strip off the screen yet.
>
>Then, definitely return it. It's not 'of merchantable quality'. This is part
>of your statutory rights. If it's less 6 months old any fault is assumed to
>have been there from the start unless otherwise proven by the vendor. After
>6 months the onus is reversed to the buyer. This is true for all products
>and is in addition to any warranty.
>
>I doubt Dell will quibble even if you left Fedora on it.

Dell delivered me a new TV to replace the broken TV via DHL, and collected the
broken TV via UPS all without charge.
-- 

Martin

On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 22:50:28 +0000, Ian Northeast wrote:

> 
> No. You can confirm this by trying it in a text console (ctrl-alt-F2
> will give you one, ctrl-alt-F7 will return to your X session).
>
These aren't necessarily the same on all distros and/or hardware.

Ctrl-Alt-F2 switches to text console, but its Ctrl-Alt-F1 to get back, 
not  Ctrl-Alt-F7.

Fedora 10/Gnome running on a Thinkpad R61i. Default key assignments 
except that I remapped caps lock to shift+capslock.


-- 
martin@   | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org       |

In article ,
	Martin wrote:

> Dell recently replaced  defective £700 TV that failed after two
> months without question. I had a replacement 7 days after reporting
> that the TV was dead.

I didn't know Dell made TVs.

PS. Trim your quotes.

-- 
Paul Martin

On 30/10/2009 06:52, Andy Botterill wrote:

...

> I'm glad tha they should replace it. Is it likely to be a we'll send 
> someone round or please return to base. If it's return to base I'd 
> better remove fedora and install windows (ugh).

Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the 
laptop. Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their 
laptops with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on 
instead?

Frank

On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 16:03:08 +0000, Paul Martin  wrote:

>In article ,
>	Martin wrote:
>
>> Dell recently replaced  defective £700 TV that failed after two
>> months without question. I had a replacement 7 days after reporting
>> that the TV was dead.
>
>I didn't know Dell made TVs.

Dell don't make TVs. They do sell them.
They sell other things they don't make too.
-- 

Martin

On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 18:44:45 +0000, FP  wrote:

>On 30/10/2009 06:52, Andy Botterill wrote:
>
>...
>
>> I'm glad tha they should replace it. Is it likely to be a we'll send 
>> someone round or please return to base. If it's return to base I'd 
>> better remove fedora and install windows (ugh).
>
>Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
>an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the 
>laptop. Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their 
>laptops with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on 
>instead?

Why do you think they don't know already?
-- 

Martin

FP wrote:
> 
> Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
> an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the 
> laptop. Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their 
> laptops with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on 
> instead?
> 
> Frank
I spoke to the technical help line. They straight away offered to send 
an engineer round. Very convenient. No questions about os. I'm pleased. Andy

On Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:27:54 +0000, Andy Botterill 
wrote:

>FP wrote:
>> 
>> Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
>> an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the 
>> laptop. Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their 
>> laptops with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on 
>> instead?
>> 
>> Frank
>I spoke to the technical help line. They straight away offered to send 
>an engineer round. Very convenient. No questions about os. I'm pleased. Andy

I hope he brings a new laptop with him.
-- 

Martin

"Andy Botterill"  wrote in message 
news:4af3192b$0$7411$bed64819@gradwell.net...
> FP wrote:
>>
>> Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
>> an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the laptop. 
>> Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their laptops 
>> with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on instead?
>>
>> Frank
> I spoke to the technical help line. They straight away offered to send an 
> engineer round. Very convenient. No questions about os. I'm pleased. Andy

"Engineer" - pah! Surely they mean "repair man" :)

-- 
Geoff

On Fri, 6 Nov 2009 09:23:05 -0000, "Geoffrey Clements"
 wrote:

>"Andy Botterill"  wrote in message 
>news:4af3192b$0$7411$bed64819@gradwell.net...
>> FP wrote:
>>>
>>> Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
>>> an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the laptop. 
>>> Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their laptops 
>>> with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on instead?
>>>
>>> Frank
>> I spoke to the technical help line. They straight away offered to send an 
>> engineer round. Very convenient. No questions about os. I'm pleased. Andy
>
>"Engineer" - pah! Surely they mean "repair man" :)

The DHL/UPS delivery man, surely?
-- 

Martin

In article ,
	Geoffrey Clements wrote:
> "Andy Botterill"  wrote in message 
> news:4af3192b$0$7411$bed64819@gradwell.net...
>> FP wrote:
>>>
>>> Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
>>> an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the laptop. 
>>> Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their laptops 
>>> with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on instead?
>>>
>>> Frank
>> I spoke to the technical help line. They straight away offered to send an 
>> engineer round. Very convenient. No questions about os. I'm pleased. Andy

> "Engineer" - pah! Surely they mean "repair man" :)

Board swapper.

-- 
Paul Martin

Paul Martin wrote:
> In article ,
> 	Geoffrey Clements wrote:
>> "Andy Botterill"  wrote in message 
>> news:4af3192b$0$7411$bed64819@gradwell.net...

>>> I spoke to the technical help line. They straight away offered to send an 
>>> engineer round. Very convenient. No questions about os. I'm pleased. Andy
> 
>> "Engineer" - pah! Surely they mean "repair man" :)
> 
> Board swapper.
> 
The man swapped the keyboard and everything worked. No arguments about 
o/s. My toy is working OK. The customer support people were useless. 
They did not reply to my e-mails. On the whole I am happy. Andy

On 30/10/2009 23:31, Martin wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Oct 2009 18:44:45 +0000, FP  wrote:
> 
> 
>>On 30/10/2009 06:52, Andy Botterill wrote:
>>
>>...
>>
>>
>>>I'm glad tha they should replace it. Is it likely to be a we'll send 
>>>someone round or please return to base. If it's return to base I'd 
>>>better remove fedora and install windows (ugh).
>>
>>Now, why would you do that? Keys only working when you thump them is not 
>>an OS issue, so it shouldn't make any difference to replacing the 
>>laptop. Surely it would do Dell good to know that people who buy their 
>>laptops with Windows are actually wiping them and putting another OS on 
>>instead?
> 
> 
> Why do you think they don't know already?

Well, if all the machines they see, which have been in the hands of 
customers, have Windows on them, surely they would take that as meaning 
that their customers use Windows so they don't need to support anything 
else? I don't see why anyone would put themselves to extra trouble, just 
to reinforce that view.

FP