I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer with 
xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a step or 
two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from scratch again, 
but this couple are newbies to computers.

Dave

Dave wrote:
> I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer
> with xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a
> step or two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from
> scratch again, but this couple are newbies to computers.

System Restore via the Start button then Help and Support (on the right 
of the page that opens, it's marked "Undo changes to your computer with 
System Restore")

John of Aix wrote:

> Dave wrote:
> 
>>I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer
>>with xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a
>>step or two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from
>>scratch again, but this couple are newbies to computers.
> 
> 
> System Restore via the Start button then Help and Support (on the right 
> of the page that opens, it's marked "Undo changes to your computer with 
> System Restore") 
> 
> 
Many thanks, but I have taken a look at the system tonight and it is so 
screwed up, I am going to provide him with a 98 boot floppy, so he can 
boot from xp pro CD and re install xp.

His system looks so screwed up that I can't understand what he has done 
with it. Apparently, one of his sons has done something to it and he and 
I can not figure it out. I can't spend too much time holding his hand, 
so the best thing is to let him format and do a re install. When I gave 
him/her the computer, I created  the only hard drive into 2 partitions 
20 gigs and 60 gigs and explained that any data should be saved to drive 
D along with any apps they loaded, so that they did not lose any data 
when wondoze has done what it did the other day.

Can anyone remind me how to get to a command prompt to get to FORMAT in 
wiondoze xp, or did I get to it from a 98 floppy?

Dave

John of Aix wrote:

> Dave wrote:
> 
>>I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer
>>with xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a
>>step or two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from
>>scratch again, but this couple are newbies to computers.
> 
> 
> System Restore via the Start button then Help and Support (on the right 
> of the page that opens, it's marked "Undo changes to your computer with 
> System Restore") 
> 
> 
Yes, I found that and I will print it out for my fragile old mind  :-)

Dave

Dave  wrote in 
news:NPudnVlSNZhpogzanZ2dnUVZ8tOmnZ2d@bt.com:

> Can anyone remind me how to get to a command prompt to get to FORMAT in 
> wiondoze xp, or did I get to it from a 98 floppy?

If it's a full XP CD as opposed to a restore disk it should be bootable. 
No need for a floppy, just make sure the system is set in BIOS to boot 
from cd first. Power on, insert CD and follow the instructions onscreen.

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 David ~ Lincoln UK
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dave wrote:
> John of Aix wrote:
>
>> Dave wrote:
>>
>>> I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer
>>> with xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a
>>> step or two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from
>>> scratch again, but this couple are newbies to computers.
>>
>>
>> System Restore via the Start button then Help and Support (on the
>> right of the page that opens, it's marked "Undo changes to your
>> computer with System Restore")
>>
>>
> Many thanks, but I have taken a look at the system tonight and it is
> so screwed up, I am going to provide him with a 98 boot floppy, so he
> can boot from xp pro CD and re install xp.

As Groove says, you should be able to boot on a CD and if you start in 
'DOS'  (either via the CD or via the F8 key just after booting, to get 
the startup menu) you should be able to copy the docs off before 
blitzing them with a new Install. Type Copy /? to get the different copy 
options (there's a space before the /) and don't forget that long files 
names have to be between inverted commas, so you could use something 
like:   Copy *.* c:\"documents and settings"\username\"mydocuments" d: 
for instance.

> His system looks so screwed up that I can't understand what he has
> done with it. Apparently, one of his sons has done something to it
> and he and I can not figure it out. I can't spend too much time
> holding his hand, so the best thing is to let him format and do a re
> install. When I gave him/her the computer, I created  the only hard
> drive into 2 partitions 20 gigs and 60 gigs and explained that any
> data should be saved to drive D along with any apps they loaded, so
> that they did not lose any data when wondoze has done what it did the
> other day.

You can set it so that the System folders (My documents etc) are 
automatically on the D drive. I'm blowed if I can remember how to do it 
by hand this morning (my head is thick with a cold) but Tweakui (a 
windows programme) can do it or you'll probably find instructions on the 
net fairly easily. Then when the person says save, the D disk will be 
used.

On Jan 19, 12:13 am, Dave  wrote:
> John of Aix wrote:
> > Dave wrote:
>
> >>I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer
> >>with xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a
> >>step or two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from
> >>scratch again, but this couple are newbies to computers.
>
> > System Restore via the Start button then Help and Support (on the right
> > of the page that opens, it's marked "Undo changes to your computer with
> > System Restore")
>
> Yes, I found that and I will print it out for my fragile old mind  :-)

System restore isn't normally cleaned with a regular scanner regime in
Normal Mode, so you won't be restoring a clean computer. Go into Safe
after getting whatever you can to update security-ware-wise.

You will find the Command console in there too. It is the best place
to do cleanups as there is considerably less going on in Safe Mode.

Afterwards all the restore points in System Restore will be clean if
the scans were allowed to work properly. If not, the Reinstall option
on the OS disk will act as a system restore but may upset some later
settings such as third party installs. You may have to reinstall them.
ISP stuff is very prone to that.

I use this method for scanning for nasties if I think I have a
problem:

SmitFraudFix (which I have to reinstall from time to time as it keeps
getting misidentified as malware.) This opens Disk-Cleaner.

Then in this order:
CWShredder, SpyBot, AdAware, AVG Antispyware and AVG. (I have AVG
rootkit cleaner too but that only works in Normal Mode.)

Then back in Normal I get the updates and give it a sweep again.
It is a long winded route but you have to be sure you clobbered
everything. Then update registry protectors such as SpywareBlaster and
WinPatrol or SpywareGuard.

Tell them to do that and they won't go too far wrong on their own. If
their kids put something wrong on the box they can find it with HjT.
That leaves the only other problem of having too much security.

If they have two firewalls and two Antiviruses there could be a cross
matching problem. You can have any amount of the other stuff.

On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 10:05:23 +0100, "John of Aix" 
wrote:

>As Groove says, you should be able to boot on a CD and if you start in 
>'DOS'  (either via the CD or via the F8 key just after booting, to get 
>the startup menu) you should be able to copy the docs off before 
>blitzing them with a new Install. Type Copy /? to get the different copy 
>options (there's a space before the /) and don't forget that long files 
>names have to be between inverted commas, so you could use something 
>like:   Copy *.* c:\"documents and settings"\username\"mydocuments" d: 
>for instance.

  For this job XCOPY is a much more flexible and powerful
command line alternative to COPY.

C:\>XCOPY /?

to get an idea of the wide range of parameters it allows.

-- 

Jim.

On Jan 19, 7:45 pm, Jim  wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 10:05:23 +0100, "John of Aix" 
> wrote:
>
> >As Groove says, you should be able to boot on a CD and if you start in
> >'DOS'  (either via the CD or via the F8 key just after booting, to get
> >the startup menu) you should be able to copy the docs off before
> >blitzing them with a new Install. Type Copy /? to get the different copy
> >options (there's a space before the /) and don't forget that long files
> >names have to be between inverted commas, so you could use something
> >like:   Copy *.* c:\"documents and settings"\username\"mydocuments" d:
> >for instance.
>
>   For this job XCOPY is a much more flexible and powerful
> command line alternative to COPY.
>
> C:\>XCOPY /?
>
> to get an idea of the wide range of parameters it allows.

Is there a list of all these XP command prompts anywhere?

On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 18:49:04 -0800 (PST), Weatherlawyer
 wrote:

>On Jan 19, 7:45 pm, Jim  wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 10:05:23 +0100, "John of Aix" 
>> wrote:
>>
>> >As Groove says, you should be able to boot on a CD and if you start in
>> >'DOS'  (either via the CD or via the F8 key just after booting, to get
>> >the startup menu) you should be able to copy the docs off before
>> >blitzing them with a new Install. Type Copy /? to get the different copy
>> >options (there's a space before the /) and don't forget that long files
>> >names have to be between inverted commas, so you could use something
>> >like:   Copy *.* c:\"documents and settings"\username\"mydocuments" d:
>> >for instance.
>>
>>   For this job XCOPY is a much more flexible and powerful
>> command line alternative to COPY.
>>
>> C:\>XCOPY /?
>>
>> to get an idea of the wide range of parameters it allows.
>
>Is there a list of all these XP command prompts anywhere?
In DOS type Help and press enter to get the list

For individual commands try the command with no parameters or with /? as
the only parameter.

Richard
Web pages: http://www.caravanningnow.co.uk/ for caravanning,
http://www.rcole.org/ for my personal web site and
http://www.homeindorset.co.uk because I love the email address.
-- 
Top 20 Replies by Programmers When Their Programs Don't Work: 2.
"Where were you when the program blew up?"

Grooove wrote:
> Dave  wrote in 
> news:NPudnVlSNZhpogzanZ2dnUVZ8tOmnZ2d@bt.com:
> 
> 
>>Can anyone remind me how to get to a command prompt to get to FORMAT in 
>>wiondoze xp, or did I get to it from a 98 floppy?
> 
> 
> If it's a full XP CD as opposed to a restore disk it should be bootable. 
> No need for a floppy, just make sure the system is set in BIOS to boot 
> from cd first. Power on, insert CD and follow the instructions onscreen.
> 
He did that and when I asked if he had done a repair or a reinstall, he 
said a reinstall. When I asked him if it had done a format of the drive 
first, he said no, which I found unusual. That was when I went for the 
format drive option, as I have seen my computer go bits up just before 
Christmas.

Dave

John of Aix wrote:

> Dave wrote:
> 
>>John of Aix wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Dave wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer
>>>>with xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a
>>>>step or two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from
>>>>scratch again, but this couple are newbies to computers.
>>>
>>>
>>>System Restore via the Start button then Help and Support (on the
>>>right of the page that opens, it's marked "Undo changes to your
>>>computer with System Restore")
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Many thanks, but I have taken a look at the system tonight and it is
>>so screwed up, I am going to provide him with a 98 boot floppy, so he
>>can boot from xp pro CD and re install xp.
> 
> 
> As Groove says, you should be able to boot on a CD and if you start in 
> 'DOS'  (either via the CD or via the F8 key just after booting, to get 
> the startup menu) you should be able to copy the docs off before 
> blitzing them with a new Install. Type Copy /? to get the different copy 
> options (there's a space before the /) and don't forget that long files 
> names have to be between inverted commas, so you could use something 
> like:   Copy *.* c:\"documents and settings"\username\"mydocuments" d: 
> for instance.
> 
> 
>>His system looks so screwed up that I can't understand what he has
>>done with it. Apparently, one of his sons has done something to it
>>and he and I can not figure it out. I can't spend too much time
>>holding his hand, so the best thing is to let him format and do a re
>>install. When I gave him/her the computer, I created  the only hard
>>drive into 2 partitions 20 gigs and 60 gigs and explained that any
>>data should be saved to drive D along with any apps they loaded, so
>>that they did not lose any data when wondoze has done what it did the
>>other day.
> 
> 
> You can set it so that the System folders (My documents etc) are 
> automatically on the D drive. I'm blowed if I can remember how to do it 
> by hand this morning (my head is thick with a cold) but Tweakui (a 
> windows programme) can do it or you'll probably find instructions on the 
> net fairly easily. Then when the person says save, the D disk will be 
> used. 
> 
> 
Printed and noted thanks.

Dave

Jim wrote:

> On Sat, 19 Jan 2008 10:05:23 +0100, "John of Aix" 
> wrote:
> 
> 
>>As Groove says, you should be able to boot on a CD and if you start in 
>>'DOS'  (either via the CD or via the F8 key just after booting, to get 
>>the startup menu) you should be able to copy the docs off before 
>>blitzing them with a new Install. Type Copy /? to get the different copy 
>>options (there's a space before the /) and don't forget that long files 
>>names have to be between inverted commas, so you could use something 
>>like:   Copy *.* c:\"documents and settings"\username\"mydocuments" d: 
>>for instance.
> 
> 
>   For this job XCOPY is a much more flexible and powerful
> command line alternative to COPY.
> 
> C:\>XCOPY /?
> 
> to get an idea of the wide range of parameters it allows.
> 
Yes, I still have my 3 inch thick book about DOS. It's a shame that 
windoze dropped some of the great things that DOS could do.

Dave

Weatherlawyer wrote:

> On Jan 19, 12:13 am, Dave  wrote:
> 
>>John of Aix wrote:
>>
>>>Dave wrote:
>>
>>>>I can't even remember what it is called. I gave someone a computer
>>>>with xp pro on it and they are having problems and want to go back a
>>>>step or two. Mysaelf, I ususally flatten my system and start from
>>>>scratch again, but this couple are newbies to computers.
>>
>>>System Restore via the Start button then Help and Support (on the right
>>>of the page that opens, it's marked "Undo changes to your computer with
>>>System Restore")
>>
>>Yes, I found that and I will print it out for my fragile old mind  :-)
> 
> 
> System restore isn't normally cleaned with a regular scanner regime in
> Normal Mode, so you won't be restoring a clean computer. Go into Safe
> after getting whatever you can to update security-ware-wise.
> 
> You will find the Command console in there too. It is the best place
> to do cleanups as there is considerably less going on in Safe Mode.
> 
> Afterwards all the restore points in System Restore will be clean if
> the scans were allowed to work properly. If not, the Reinstall option
> on the OS disk will act as a system restore but may upset some later
> settings such as third party installs. You may have to reinstall them.
> ISP stuff is very prone to that.
> 
> I use this method for scanning for nasties if I think I have a
> problem:
> 
> SmitFraudFix (which I have to reinstall from time to time as it keeps
> getting misidentified as malware.) This opens Disk-Cleaner.
> 
> Then in this order:
> CWShredder, SpyBot, AdAware, AVG Antispyware and AVG. (I have AVG
> rootkit cleaner too but that only works in Normal Mode.)
> 
> Then back in Normal I get the updates and give it a sweep again.
> It is a long winded route but you have to be sure you clobbered
> everything. Then update registry protectors such as SpywareBlaster and
> WinPatrol or SpywareGuard.
> 
> Tell them to do that and they won't go too far wrong on their own. If
> their kids put something wrong on the box they can find it with HjT.
> That leaves the only other problem of having too much security.
> 
> If they have two firewalls and two Antiviruses there could be a cross
> matching problem. You can have any amount of the other stuff.

Noted and prited thanks

Dave

Dave  wrote in
news:R5Wdnd7riuB8qwfanZ2dnUVZ8tzinZ2d@bt.com: 

> He did that and when I asked if he had done a repair or a reinstall,
> he said a reinstall. When I asked him if it had done a format of the
> drive first, he said no, which I found unusual. That was when I went
> for the format drive option, as I have seen my computer go bits up
> just before Christmas.
> 

I believe that the majority (if not all) restore disks use a disk image 
system. What they call a reinstall is in reality just like rolling a 
Norton Ghost image back onto the harddisk. This replaces everything on 
the disk and puts it back to factory bland.
In effect this IS a format and reinstall.


-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 David ~ Lincoln UK
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Grooove wrote:

> Dave  wrote in
> news:R5Wdnd7riuB8qwfanZ2dnUVZ8tzinZ2d@bt.com: 
> 
> 
>>He did that and when I asked if he had done a repair or a reinstall,
>>he said a reinstall. When I asked him if it had done a format of the
>>drive first, he said no, which I found unusual. That was when I went
>>for the format drive option, as I have seen my computer go bits up
>>just before Christmas.
>>
> 
> 
> I believe that the majority (if not all) restore disks use a disk image 
> system. What they call a reinstall is in reality just like rolling a 
> Norton Ghost image back onto the harddisk. This replaces everything on 
> the disk and puts it back to factory bland.
> In effect this IS a format and reinstall.

So are you saying that it wipes the C drive?

Dave

No experience on this, I only deal with the local free copies of windoze 
  :-)

Dave

On Sat, 26 Jan 2008 21:40:04 +0000, Dave  wrote:

>Grooove wrote:
>
>> Dave  wrote in
>> news:R5Wdnd7riuB8qwfanZ2dnUVZ8tzinZ2d@bt.com: 
>> 
>> 
>>>He did that and when I asked if he had done a repair or a reinstall,
>>>he said a reinstall. When I asked him if it had done a format of the
>>>drive first, he said no, which I found unusual. That was when I went
>>>for the format drive option, as I have seen my computer go bits up
>>>just before Christmas.
>>>
>> 
>> 
>> I believe that the majority (if not all) restore disks use a disk image 
>> system. What they call a reinstall is in reality just like rolling a 
>> Norton Ghost image back onto the harddisk. This replaces everything on 
>> the disk and puts it back to factory bland.
>> In effect this IS a format and reinstall.
>
>So are you saying that it wipes the C drive?

  As he says, in effect, yes. Acronis True Image, which I use,
deletes the partition you're going to put the image on, although
it doesn't physically wipe it in the same way that a format would.
 
-- 

Jim.

Jim wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Jan 2008 21:40:04 +0000, Dave  wrote:
> 
> 
>>Grooove wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Dave  wrote in
>>>news:R5Wdnd7riuB8qwfanZ2dnUVZ8tzinZ2d@bt.com: 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>He did that and when I asked if he had done a repair or a reinstall,
>>>>he said a reinstall. When I asked him if it had done a format of the
>>>>drive first, he said no, which I found unusual. That was when I went
>>>>for the format drive option, as I have seen my computer go bits up
>>>>just before Christmas.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>I believe that the majority (if not all) restore disks use a disk image 
>>>system. What they call a reinstall is in reality just like rolling a 
>>>Norton Ghost image back onto the harddisk. This replaces everything on 
>>>the disk and puts it back to factory bland.
>>>In effect this IS a format and reinstall.
>>
>>So are you saying that it wipes the C drive?
> 
> 
>   As he says, in effect, yes. Acronis True Image, which I use,
> deletes the partition you're going to put the image on, although
> it doesn't physically wipe it in the same way that a format would.

Thanks for the answers.  :-)

Dave

Jim  wrote in
news:rs7pp39o9bnqvqmc1nfm9n01sbr0fic0k8@4ax.com: 

>   As he says, in effect, yes. Acronis True Image, which I use,
> deletes the partition you're going to put the image on, although
> it doesn't physically wipe it in the same way that a format would.
>  

I use Acronis as well. The way I understand it is that when you do a 
restore of a disk image it actually does a bit by bit replacement, which 
includes the MBR and file tables.
So in effect it redefines the disk contents. However, this will not 
necessarily overwrite all of the disk and FBI-level tools could almost 
certainly recover some data.
But then, a format is no different in that way. It certainly doesn't 
zeroise the disk. You need a special tool to do that.



-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 David ~ Lincoln UK
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On Mon, 28 Jan 2008 18:22:41 -0600, Grooove  wrote:

>Jim  wrote in
>news:rs7pp39o9bnqvqmc1nfm9n01sbr0fic0k8@4ax.com: 
>
>>   As he says, in effect, yes. Acronis True Image, which I use,
>> deletes the partition you're going to put the image on, although
>> it doesn't physically wipe it in the same way that a format would.
>>  
>
>I use Acronis as well. The way I understand it is that when you do a 
>restore of a disk image it actually does a bit by bit replacement, which 
>includes the MBR and file tables.
>So in effect it redefines the disk contents. However, this will not 
>necessarily overwrite all of the disk and FBI-level tools could almost 
>certainly recover some data.
>But then, a format is no different in that way. It certainly doesn't 
>zeroise the disk. You need a special tool to do that.

  Doesn't FORMAT C /U overwrite the whole disc?

  I'm aware of the Gutmann paper and the possibility of recovering
data many "layers" deep, but the data to be recovered would have
to be extremely important for anyone to go to the expense involved
in doing that.

  As I understand it, you have to overwrite the data to be shredded
at least 30 times to defeat that sort of analysis. So, if you have
something to hide wipe the file rather the drive!

-- 

Jim.

Jim  wrote in 
news:5qoup3pf43dhqoip266i05uu1gmksd2noi@4ax.com:


>   Doesn't FORMAT C /U overwrite the whole disc?

A quick format deletes the MFT and or MBR typically. A regular format 
does the same, in addition to writing a FileSystem indentifier on the 
block's that will require them. Data really isn't overwritten on the 
whole disk but just where necessary data flags and bits are needed.





-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
 David ~ Lincoln UK
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~