My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as the wheel 
bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of grease on 
them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo 
themselves???

LittleBro wrote:


> My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as the wheel
> bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of grease on
> them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo
> themselves???


I suspect there will be a number of differing opinions on this....!

FWIW, one of the first things I do with a new car is remove the wheel nuts,
lightly coat the threads and mating faces with Copaslip, then tighten them
with a torque wrench. I've been doing this for over 30 years, have *never*
had a nut come loose and have *never* been unable to remove a wheel in an
emergency.

BTW, don't use ordinary grease, wheels get very hot and the result will be
messy wheels and not much grease where it's needed.

HTH

Chris
--
 
Remove prejudice to reply.

"LittleBro"  wrote in message 
news:4bacnfPIELcpsijfSa8jmw@karoo.co.uk...

> My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as the wheel 
> bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of grease on 
> them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo 
> themselves???


The industry standard guidelines (BSsomethingorother), states that the 
wheel/hub mounting surfaces and wheel nuts/studs should be free from 
paint/rust and given a coat off light oil(ie engine oil) during 
installation. The use off grease is not recommended.

The thinking behind it is, if you use grease, when you initially tighten the 
wheel, the grease creates a layer between the wheel and hub, which as soon 
as the hub/wheel warms up the grease will thin out and gradually move from 
between the wheel/hub resulting in the wheel loosening off. The oil doesn't 
have the same effect, and is forced out as soon as the wheel is tightened.

Also, grease on the nuts/studs can cause them to drag when tightened 
resulting in the wheels not being tightened properly.

"Moray Cuthill"  wrote in message
news:42b56e1a@news.greennet.net...

> "LittleBro"  wrote in message
> news:4bacnfPIELcpsijfSa8jmw@karoo.co.uk...
> > My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as the
wheel
> > bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of grease
on
> > them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo
> > themselves???
>
> The industry standard guidelines (BSsomethingorother), states that the
> wheel/hub mounting surfaces and wheel nuts/studs should be free from
> paint/rust and given a coat off light oil(ie engine oil) during
> installation. The use off grease is not recommended.


Maybe not, but same as Chris, I've always used Copperslip on wheel bolt/nut
threads, and head seatings, and never had any trouble removing them or had
any come loose.


> The thinking behind it is, if you use grease, when you initially tighten
the
> wheel, the grease creates a layer between the wheel and hub, which as soon
> as the hub/wheel warms up the grease will thin out and gradually move from
> between the wheel/hub resulting in the wheel loosening off. The oil
doesn't
> have the same effect, and is forced out as soon as the wheel is tightened.


I think that is complete nonsense as far as wheel nuts/bolts are concerned.
On large areas it's a valid point, but over small areas like those on nuts
and bolts, I don't think it's even worth considering.
A light smear of Copperslip ensures you wont be stuck at the side of the
road with a puncture, unable to change the wheel because the supplied
wheelbrace is not man enough to undo the wheel nuts.
Mike.

"Mike G"  wrote in message
news:42b579db$0$2414$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net...

>
> "Moray Cuthill"  wrote in message
> news:42b56e1a@news.greennet.net...
> > "LittleBro"  wrote in message
> > news:4bacnfPIELcpsijfSa8jmw@karoo.co.uk...
> > > My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as the
> wheel
> > > bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of
grease
> on
> > > them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo
> > > themselves???
> >
> > The industry standard guidelines (BSsomethingorother), states that the
> > wheel/hub mounting surfaces and wheel nuts/studs should be free from
> > paint/rust and given a coat off light oil(ie engine oil) during
> > installation. The use off grease is not recommended.
>
> Maybe not, but same as Chris, I've always used Copperslip on wheel
bolt/nut
> threads, and head seatings, and never had any trouble removing them or had
> any come loose.
>
> > The thinking behind it is, if you use grease, when you initially tighten
> the
> > wheel, the grease creates a layer between the wheel and hub, which as
soon
> > as the hub/wheel warms up the grease will thin out and gradually move
from
> > between the wheel/hub resulting in the wheel loosening off. The oil
> doesn't
> > have the same effect, and is forced out as soon as the wheel is
tightened.
>
> I think that is complete nonsense as far as wheel nuts/bolts are
concerned.
> On large areas it's a valid point, but over small areas like those on nuts
> and bolts, I don't think it's even worth considering.
> A light smear of Copperslip ensures you wont be stuck at the side of the
> road with a puncture, unable to change the wheel because the supplied
> wheelbrace is not man enough to undo the wheel nuts.
> Mike.
>

if the wheel nuts are torqued to the correct tightness and not done up by
some monkey keeping his finger pressed on the air gun till all the air has
run out of the compressor, then you shouldn't have any problems undoing the
wheel nuts with the supplied wheelbrace.

ive never or had the need to put any kind of grease or releasing agent on
wheel nuts, the only time I use a small amount of copperslip is where the
wheels go onto the hub, especially with ally wheels as they corrode against
the hub & ive had wheels where ive had to literally beat them off with a
plastic dum dum hammer as they wont shift with corrosion.

"reg"  wrote in message
news:d93ufs$hge$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...

>
> "Mike G"  wrote in message
> news:42b579db$0$2414$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net...
> >
> > "Moray Cuthill"  wrote in message
> > news:42b56e1a@news.greennet.net...
> > > "LittleBro"  wrote in message
> > > news:4bacnfPIELcpsijfSa8jmw@karoo.co.uk...
> > > > My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as the
> > wheel
> > > > bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of
> grease
> > on
> > > > them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo
> > > > themselves???
> > >
> > > The industry standard guidelines (BSsomethingorother), states that the
> > > wheel/hub mounting surfaces and wheel nuts/studs should be free from
> > > paint/rust and given a coat off light oil(ie engine oil) during
> > > installation. The use off grease is not recommended.
> >
> > Maybe not, but same as Chris, I've always used Copperslip on wheel
> bolt/nut
> > threads, and head seatings, and never had any trouble removing them or
had
> > any come loose.
> >
> > > The thinking behind it is, if you use grease, when you initially
tighten
> > the
> > > wheel, the grease creates a layer between the wheel and hub, which as
> soon
> > > as the hub/wheel warms up the grease will thin out and gradually move
> from
> > > between the wheel/hub resulting in the wheel loosening off. The oil
> > doesn't
> > > have the same effect, and is forced out as soon as the wheel is
> tightened.
> >
> > I think that is complete nonsense as far as wheel nuts/bolts are
> concerned.
> > On large areas it's a valid point, but over small areas like those on
nuts
> > and bolts, I don't think it's even worth considering.
> > A light smear of Copperslip ensures you wont be stuck at the side of the
> > road with a puncture, unable to change the wheel because the supplied
> > wheelbrace is not man enough to undo the wheel nuts.
> > Mike.
> >
> if the wheel nuts are torqued to the correct tightness and not done up by
> some monkey keeping his finger pressed on the air gun till all the air has
> run out of the compressor, then you shouldn't have any problems undoing
the
> wheel nuts with the supplied wheelbrace.


Obviously opinions are divided.
From the POV of retaining the wheel, I don't think Copperslip increases the
chances of wheel nuts coming loose, which seems to be the main objection
against it's use. In the end it just comes down to personal choice IMO.
Mike.

The message 
from "LittleBro"  contains these words:


> Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo 
> themselves??? 


Yes and no. I use copper grease which was created for just this sort of thing.

-- 
Skipweasel.
Ivor Cutler - "Never knowingly understood."

"Guy King"  wrote in message
news:313030303432373942B5E59234@zetnet.co.uk...

> The message 
> from "LittleBro"  contains these words:
>
> > Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo
> > themselves???
>
> Yes and no. I use copper grease which was created for just this sort of
thing.
>
> --
> Skipweasel.
> Ivor Cutler - "Never knowingly understood."



" The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant that
leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier. Friction
modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt and cause false
torque readings."


>

The message <d94mjh$3eb$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>
from "reg"  contains these words:


> " The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
> lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant that
> leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier. Friction
> modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt and cause false
> torque readings."


OK, but over the years I've been fiddling with cars the only times I've
had trouble with wheelnuts have been either because they've been grossly
overtightened by a twat with an airspanner or because they've not been
off in years and are thoroughly stuck.

I'll use a light smear of copper grease and take my chances.

-- 
Skipweasel.
Ivor Cutler - "Never knowingly understood."

Guy King  wrote in message
:


>The message <d94mjh$3eb$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>
>from "reg"  contains these words:
>
>> " The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
>> lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant that
>> leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier. Friction
>> modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt and cause false
>> torque readings."
>
>OK, but over the years I've been fiddling with cars the only times I've
>had trouble with wheelnuts have been either because they've been grossly
>overtightened by a twat with an airspanner or because they've not been
>off in years and are thoroughly stuck.
>
>I'll use a light smear of copper grease and take my chances.


Me too, I've not had a wheel come loose in 20+ years of playing around
with cars and I always use a smear of coppaslip.

In article <d94mjh$3eb$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>,
   reg  wrote:

> " The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
> lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant
> that leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier.
> Friction modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt
> and cause false torque readings."


Wheel bolts or studs are vastly over specified - they *have* to be for the
average tyre changing monkey. So the extra tension produced with a greased
one being torqued to the correct setting is neither here nor there.

And I'm definitely in the use copper grease camp. And on the back of alloy
wheels.

-- 
*Why is it called tourist season if we can't shoot at them?

    Dave Plowman        dave@davenoise.co.uk           London SW
                  To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 00:18:05 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)" 
wrote:


>In article <d94mjh$3eb$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>,
>   reg  wrote:
>> " The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
>> lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant
>> that leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier.
>> Friction modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt
>> and cause false torque readings."
>
>Wheel bolts or studs are vastly over specified - they *have* to be for the
>average tyre changing monkey. So the extra tension produced with a greased
>one being torqued to the correct setting is neither here nor there.
>
>And I'm definitely in the use copper grease camp. And on the back of alloy
>wheels.


Ok just to keep this thread going :-) isn't copperGrease XYZ for use where heat
is involved eg exhaust manifold nuts? Why Cu grease rather than non-Cu for wheel
nuts?

"dave" <dave@blankety.blank> wrote in message
news:oemeb11vkcn1mna4ujc710k60chldod1dt@4ax.com...

> On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 00:18:05 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"

> wrote:
>
> >In article <d94mjh$3eb$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>,
> >   reg  wrote:
> >> " The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
> >> lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant
> >> that leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier.
> >> Friction modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt
> >> and cause false torque readings."
> >
> >Wheel bolts or studs are vastly over specified - they *have* to be for
the
> >average tyre changing monkey. So the extra tension produced with a
greased
> >one being torqued to the correct setting is neither here nor there.
> >
> >And I'm definitely in the use copper grease camp. And on the back of
alloy
> >wheels.
>
> Ok just to keep this thread going :-) isn't copperGrease XYZ for use where
heat
> is involved eg exhaust manifold nuts? Why Cu grease rather than non-Cu for
wheel
> nuts?


An interesting point.
Of course copper based grease is also promoted as an anti-sieze grease,
which possibly makes it a little more suitable for wheel nuts, where it's
possibly better than ordinary grease at preventing a pickup on the mating
tapers. Also wheel hubs can get quite hot, so maybe a copper based grease is
less likely to melt away.
Dunno really. I'm just fishing for reasons. Maybe someone has a more
scientifically based one.:-)
Mike.

The message 
from dave <dave@blankety.blank> contains these words:


> Ok just to keep this thread going :-) isn't copperGrease XYZ for use
> where heat
> is involved eg exhaust manifold nuts? Why Cu grease rather than non-Cu
> for wheel
> nuts?


Copper grease is for anywhere [1] where threads might seize. It works
well on threads which get hot, but it also works just fine on threads
which don't.

Wheels, of course, can get quite hot!

-- 
Skipweasel.
Ivor Cutler - "Never knowingly understood."

Mike G wrote:

> "dave" <dave@blankety.blank> wrote in message
> news:oemeb11vkcn1mna4ujc710k60chldod1dt@4ax.com...
> 
>>On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 00:18:05 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
> 
> 
> 
>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>>In article <d94mjh$3eb$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>,
>>>  reg  wrote:
>>>
>>>>" The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
>>>>lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant
>>>>that leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier.
>>>>Friction modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt
>>>>and cause false torque readings."
>>>
>>>Wheel bolts or studs are vastly over specified - they *have* to be for
> 
> the
> 
>>>average tyre changing monkey. So the extra tension produced with a
> 
> greased
> 
>>>one being torqued to the correct setting is neither here nor there.
>>>
>>>And I'm definitely in the use copper grease camp. And on the back of
> 
> alloy
> 
>>>wheels.
>>
>>Ok just to keep this thread going :-) isn't copperGrease XYZ for use where
> 
> heat
> 
>>is involved eg exhaust manifold nuts? Why Cu grease rather than non-Cu for
> 
> wheel
> 
>>nuts?
> 
> 
> An interesting point.
> Of course copper based grease is also promoted as an anti-sieze grease,
> which possibly makes it a little more suitable for wheel nuts, where it's
> possibly better than ordinary grease at preventing a pickup on the mating
> tapers. Also wheel hubs can get quite hot, so maybe a copper based grease is
> less likely to melt away.
> Dunno really. I'm just fishing for reasons. Maybe someone has a more
> scientifically based one.:-)
> Mike.
> 
> 

Copper Based greases are fine for heat based applications
as the copper particles suspended in the grease helps to
dissepate the heat to other surfaces which helps the grease
to remain a solid.

One word of warning though, dont be tempted to use it on
valve stems when assembling cyinder heads. I've witnessed it
seize the valve into the valve guide by stopping the engine oil
getting to the valve.

DJ_Crazy_Frog

The message <6BYte.54139$G8.26764@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>
from DJ_Crazy_Frog  contains these words:


> Copper Based greases are fine for heat based applications
> as the copper particles suspended in the grease helps to
> dissepate the heat to other surfaces which helps the grease
> to remain a solid.


What on earth are you on about? If two bits of metal are at nC then the
film of grease between 'em is going to be a nC too. There's nowhere for
the heat to go to that isn't already at the same temperature.

The copper is there because it's a soft metal which forms a fine film
over the surface of the threads. You'll find the threads of things like
G-cramps are often copper plated for the same reasons.

-- 
Skipweasel.
Ivor Cutler - "Never knowingly understood."

In article <6BYte.54139$G8.26764@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>,
   DJ_Crazy_Frog  wrote:

> One word of warning though, dont be tempted to use it on
> valve stems when assembling cyinder heads. I've witnessed it
> seize the valve into the valve guide by stopping the engine oil
> getting to the valve.


It should never be used as a substitute for a lubricant. It's an
anti-seize compound - that's all.

-- 
*When the going gets tough, the tough take a coffee break *

    Dave Plowman        dave@davenoise.co.uk           London SW
                  To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"DJ_Crazy_Frog"  wrote in message
news:6BYte.54139$G8.26764@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...


> Copper Based greases are fine for heat based applications
> as the copper particles suspended in the grease helps to
> dissepate the heat to other surfaces which helps the grease
> to remain a solid.


I think you need to check that statement.


> One word of warning though, dont be tempted to use it on
> valve stems when assembling cyinder heads. I've witnessed it
> seize the valve into the valve guide by stopping the engine oil
> getting to the valve.


Are there no limits to the mistakes mechanical wallies can make?
Don't they even bother to read the labels on products.
Mike.

The message <42b8bdb3$0$2392$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net>
from "Mike G"  contains these words:


> > One word of warning though, dont be tempted to use it on
> > valve stems when assembling cyinder heads. I've witnessed it
> > seize the valve into the valve guide by stopping the engine oil
> > getting to the valve.

> Are there no limits to the mistakes mechanical wallies can make?
> Don't they even bother to read the labels on products.


Apparently people have been known to use it on clutch release bearings.
There are dire warnings in the packet about not being covered by the
guarantee if they find copper dust in the balls.

-- 
Skipweasel.
Ivor Cutler - "Never knowingly understood."

"Guy King"  wrote in message
news:313030303432373942B91F5333@zetnet.co.uk...

> The message <42b8bdb3$0$2392$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net>
> from "Mike G"  contains these words:
>
> > > One word of warning though, dont be tempted to use it on
> > > valve stems when assembling cyinder heads. I've witnessed it
> > > seize the valve into the valve guide by stopping the engine oil
> > > getting to the valve.
>
> > Are there no limits to the mistakes mechanical wallies can make?
> > Don't they even bother to read the labels on products.
>
> Apparently people have been known to use it on clutch release bearings.
> There are dire warnings in the packet about not being covered by the
> guarantee if they find copper dust in the balls.


I imagine there is. It sounds quite painful.
Mike.

In article , Guy King
<URL:mailto:guy.king@zetnet.co.uk> wrote:

> The message <d94mjh$3eb$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>
> from "reg"  contains these words:
> 
> > " The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps to
> > lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a lubricant that
> > leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction modifier. Friction
> > modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel nut and bolt and cause false
> > torque readings."
> 
> OK, but over the years I've been fiddling with cars the only times I've
> had trouble with wheelnuts have been either because they've been grossly
> overtightened by a twat with an airspanner or because they've not been
> off in years and are thoroughly stuck.
> 
> I'll use a light smear of copper grease and take my chances.
> 


So, having eliminated the two causes of the problem as you perceive it, you
still have to add the grease... unless you are the twat with the wrench and
don't plan to remove your wheels for years...

That's logical.


Allan Bennett
Not a fan of the grossly overtight


--

The message 
from Allan Bennett  contains these words:


> So, having eliminated the two causes of the problem as you perceive it, you
> still have to add the grease... unless you are the twat with the wrench and
> don't plan to remove your wheels for years...


I can go two or three years without removing wheels. I can get 50,000
miles out of a set of tyres and I've never replaced a set of brake pads
that I've worn out myself.

-- 
Skipweasel.
Ivor Cutler - "Never knowingly understood."

dave wrote:


>
> Ok just to keep this thread going :-) isn't copperGrease XYZ for use where heat
> is involved eg exhaust manifold nuts? Why Cu grease rather than non-Cu for wheel nuts?


We use it in the hospital to stop the bolts holding the head of our
linear accelerators from sticking. The heads weigh around 1/2 tonne and
have to be removed annually (fortunately, only annually) to check the
components behind for wear. As you've got patients underneath, these
bolts are tightened fairly firmly so you don't want them to sieze.
Neither can you use a normal grease because the high levels of
radiation would cause the grease to solidify. Cu grease is ideal
because it won't congeal, it forms a low friction film.

-- 
Malc

In article ,
   Allan Bennett  wrote:

> > > " The bolt threads should be clean and free of rust. While it helps
> > > to lubricate the threads with light penetrating oil, never use a
> > > lubricant that leaves a heavy oil film or that contains a friction
> > > modifier. Friction modifiers reduce the friction between the wheel
> > > nut and bolt and cause false torque readings."
> > 
> > OK, but over the years I've been fiddling with cars the only times
> > I've had trouble with wheelnuts have been either because they've been
> > grossly overtightened by a twat with an airspanner or because they've
> > not been off in years and are thoroughly stuck.
> > 
> > I'll use a light smear of copper grease and take my chances.
> > 

> So, having eliminated the two causes of the problem as you perceive it,
> you still have to add the grease... unless you are the twat with the
> wrench and don't plan to remove your wheels for years...


And you have positive proof the wheel nut torque settings are given with
absolutely dry threads?

-- 
*No word in the English language rhymes with month, orange, silver,purple

    Dave Plowman        dave@davenoise.co.uk           London SW
                  To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"reg"  wrote in message
news:d93ufs$hge$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...

>
> "Mike G"  wrote in message
> news:42b579db$0$2414$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net...
> >
> > "Moray Cuthill"  wrote in message
> > news:42b56e1a@news.greennet.net...
> > > "LittleBro"  wrote in message
> > > news:4bacnfPIELcpsijfSa8jmw@karoo.co.uk...
> > > > My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as the
> > wheel
> > > > bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of
> grease
> > on
> > > > them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo
> > > > themselves???
> > >
> > > The industry standard guidelines (BSsomethingorother), states that the
> > > wheel/hub mounting surfaces and wheel nuts/studs should be free from
> > > paint/rust and given a coat off light oil(ie engine oil) during
> > > installation. The use off grease is not recommended.
> >
> > Maybe not, but same as Chris, I've always used Copperslip on wheel
> bolt/nut
> > threads, and head seatings, and never had any trouble removing them or
had
> > any come loose.
> >
> > > The thinking behind it is, if you use grease, when you initially
tighten
> > the
> > > wheel, the grease creates a layer between the wheel and hub, which as
> soon
> > > as the hub/wheel warms up the grease will thin out and gradually move
> from
> > > between the wheel/hub resulting in the wheel loosening off. The oil
> > doesn't
> > > have the same effect, and is forced out as soon as the wheel is
> tightened.
> >
> > I think that is complete nonsense as far as wheel nuts/bolts are
> concerned.
> > On large areas it's a valid point, but over small areas like those on
nuts
> > and bolts, I don't think it's even worth considering.
> > A light smear of Copperslip ensures you wont be stuck at the side of the
> > road with a puncture, unable to change the wheel because the supplied
> > wheelbrace is not man enough to undo the wheel nuts.
> > Mike.
> >
> if the wheel nuts are torqued to the correct tightness and not done up by
> some monkey keeping his finger pressed on the air gun till all the air has
> run out of the compressor, then you shouldn't have any problems undoing
the
> wheel nuts with the supplied wheelbrace.
>


^^^ You have never owned many cars where the wheelbrace has been the last
thing on the designers mind then.... Have a look at a Fiat Coupe or Citroen
Xantia and tell me if you think they were well designed....


> ive never or had the need to put any kind of grease or releasing agent on
> wheel nuts, the only time I use a small amount of copperslip is where the
> wheels go onto the hub, especially with ally wheels as they corrode
against
> the hub & ive had wheels where ive had to literally beat them off with a
> plastic dum dum hammer as they wont shift with corrosion.
>
>

"Will"  wrote in message
news:fWIue.2417$Ar5.1667@newsfe5-win.ntli.net...

> "reg"  wrote in message
> news:d93ufs$hge$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "Mike G"  wrote in message
> > news:42b579db$0$2414$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net...
> > >
> > > "Moray Cuthill"  wrote in message
> > > news:42b56e1a@news.greennet.net...
> > > > "LittleBro"  wrote in message
> > > > news:4bacnfPIELcpsijfSa8jmw@karoo.co.uk...
> > > > > My BigBrother was checking the brakes on my car and said that as
the
> > > wheel
> > > > > bolts/nuts were so manky that they should have a small amount of
> > grease
> > > on
> > > > > them. Is lubrication like this o.k. or will it help them to undo
> > > > > themselves???
> > > >
> > > > The industry standard guidelines (BSsomethingorother), states that
the
> > > > wheel/hub mounting surfaces and wheel nuts/studs should be free from
> > > > paint/rust and given a coat off light oil(ie engine oil) during
> > > > installation. The use off grease is not recommended.
> > >
> > > Maybe not, but same as Chris, I've always used Copperslip on wheel
> > bolt/nut
> > > threads, and head seatings, and never had any trouble removing them or
> had
> > > any come loose.
> > >
> > > > The thinking behind it is, if you use grease, when you initially
> tighten
> > > the
> > > > wheel, the grease creates a layer between the wheel and hub, which
as
> > soon
> > > > as the hub/wheel warms up the grease will thin out and gradually
move
> > from
> > > > between the wheel/hub resulting in the wheel loosening off. The oil
> > > doesn't
> > > > have the same effect, and is forced out as soon as the wheel is
> > tightened.
> > >
> > > I think that is complete nonsense as far as wheel nuts/bolts are
> > concerned.
> > > On large areas it's a valid point, but over small areas like those on
> nuts
> > > and bolts, I don't think it's even worth considering.
> > > A light smear of Copperslip ensures you wont be stuck at the side of
the
> > > road with a puncture, unable to change the wheel because the supplied
> > > wheelbrace is not man enough to undo the wheel nuts.
> > > Mike.
> > >
> > if the wheel nuts are torqued to the correct tightness and not done up
by
> > some monkey keeping his finger pressed on the air gun till all the air
has
> > run out of the compressor, then you shouldn't have any problems undoing
> the
> > wheel nuts with the supplied wheelbrace.
> >
>
> ^^^ You have never owned many cars where the wheelbrace has been the last
> thing on the designers mind then.... Have a look at a Fiat Coupe or
Citroen
> Xantia and tell me if you think they were well designed....
>


who in their right mind would own anything French or Italian ?  they are
ugly, expensive for parts and most of the time a bloody pain in the arse to
work on ! no wonder our local Renault dealership can't get any body to fill
their vacancies, for the reasons above !!!!!!

> 
> who in their right mind would own anything French or Italian ?  they are
> ugly, expensive for parts and most of the time a bloody pain in the arse to
> work on ! no wonder our local Renault dealership can't get any body to fill
> their vacancies, for the reasons above !!!!!!


You obviously don't know what you're doing then. I've had no bother 
working on any of Cit BX/Pug309/Renault25/Cit ZX or had parts that have 
been any more expensive than for brit makes. And I'm by no means a 
clueful mechanic.

Eejit.

Cheers,
-- 
James Dore,
IT Officer,
New College
james.dore@new / it-support@new

"James Dore"  wrote in message
news:MPG.1d29d0bc939f8f5e989ca5@news.ox.ac.uk...

>
> >
> > who in their right mind would own anything French or Italian ?  they are
> > ugly, expensive for parts and most of the time a bloody pain in the arse
to
> > work on ! no wonder our local Renault dealership can't get any body to
fill
> > their vacancies, for the reasons above !!!!!!
>
> You obviously don't know what you're doing then. I've had no bother
> working on any of Cit BX/Pug309/Renault25/Cit ZX or had parts that have
> been any more expensive than for brit makes. And I'm by no means a
> clueful mechanic.
>
> Eejit.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> James Dore,
> IT Officer,
> New College
> james.dore@new / it-support@new


no obviously not ! 24 years in the trade, full city & guilds accreditation,
on going training all the time, you never stop learning so with all due
respect I think im qualified to know what im doing and saying !

>reg"  wrote in message 
>news:d9pisu$gp3$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "James Dore"  wrote in message
> news:MPG.1d29d0bc939f8f5e989ca5@news.ox.ac.uk...
>>
>> >
>> > who in their right mind would own anything French or Italian ?  they 
>> > are
>> > ugly, expensive for parts and most of the time a bloody pain in the 
>> > arse
> to
>> > work on ! no wonder our local Renault dealership can't get any body to
> fill
>> > their vacancies, for the reasons above !!!!!!
>>
>> You obviously don't know what you're doing then. I've had no bother
>> working on any of Cit BX/Pug309/Renault25/Cit ZX or had parts that have
>> been any more expensive than for brit makes. And I'm by no means a
>> clueful mechanic.

> no obviously not ! 24 years in the trade, full city & guilds 
> accreditation,
> on going training all the time, you never stop learning so with all due
> respect I think im qualified to know what im doing and saying !


It's interesting how many garages run away screaming from hydraulic cits, 
because they're a bit different. In fact once you get your head round the 
fact that things run via pipes, not big obvious springs and such, they're 
actually quite easy to work on.

Are you one of these people?

cheers,
clive

"Clive George"  wrote in message
news:42c05651$0$30797$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...

> >reg"  wrote in message
> >news:d9pisu$gp3$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "James Dore"  wrote in message
> > news:MPG.1d29d0bc939f8f5e989ca5@news.ox.ac.uk...
> >>
> >> >
> >> > who in their right mind would own anything French or Italian ?  they
> >> > are
> >> > ugly, expensive for parts and most of the time a bloody pain in the
> >> > arse
> > to
> >> > work on ! no wonder our local Renault dealership can't get any body
to
> > fill
> >> > their vacancies, for the reasons above !!!!!!
> >>
> >> You obviously don't know what you're doing then. I've had no bother
> >> working on any of Cit BX/Pug309/Renault25/Cit ZX or had parts that have
> >> been any more expensive than for brit makes. And I'm by no means a
> >> clueful mechanic.
>
> > no obviously not ! 24 years in the trade, full city & guilds
> > accreditation,
> > on going training all the time, you never stop learning so with all due
> > respect I think im qualified to know what im doing and saying !
>
> It's interesting how many garages run away screaming from hydraulic cits,
> because they're a bit different. In fact once you get your head round the
> fact that things run via pipes, not big obvious springs and such, they're
> actually quite easy to work on.
>
> Are you one of these people?
>
> cheers,
> clive
>

no Clive im not one of those people, I work in an independent garage and
have worked in the same garage since I left school & followed in my fathers
footsteps, we work on all sorts even Renaults, Citroens ect, in fact ive
just started to strip a Renault Megan with a head gasket gone & I'll stand
by my original statement they are a pain in the arse to work on !