Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever. It's
either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other way around and
the bills still turn out high. Is it a 'fool yourself' system? I'd say
turning things off manually gives you better control of your energy bills.

Waddaya think folks?

Edith.

"The Traveller"  wrote in message
news:ieL9e.113725$Vf.4185090@news000.worldonline.dk...

> Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever. It's
> either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other way around
and
> the bills still turn out high. Is it a 'fool yourself' system? I'd say
> turning things off manually gives you better control of your energy bills.
>
> Waddaya think folks?
>
> Edith.
>


We have eight storage heaters, two little ones in the downstairs loo and
upstairs
in the bathroom on full, the big ones in the lounge and hall are set at 2,
the medium
radiator in the kitchen is set at 2 and the three bedroom radiators are
always off.

We adjust the lounge and hall radiators to 4 when it snows, we have no other
heating unless you include the cooker during baking.

If it is a hot summer then we turn the big radiators off.

The cost of all electricity is around 50 a month throughout the year.


INRI

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 12:27:22 +0200, "The Traveller" 
wrote:


>Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever. It's
>either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other way around and
>the bills still turn out high. Is it a 'fool yourself' system? I'd say
>turning things off manually gives you better control of your energy bills.
>
>Waddaya think folks?
>
>Edith.
>

If you heat by electric then its going to cost you,plain and simple.
Think about it another way. Plough some investment into insulating
your home. It would be a once only expenditure. This way your bills
would reduce and they would be reuced all the time. As it is now,and
with your current insulation spec,you will keep on spending to
generate a level of comfort which just continually leaks out of your
home.

"INRI"  wrote in message
news:MdQ9e.114$Y46.3@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...

>
> "The Traveller"  wrote in message
> news:ieL9e.113725$Vf.4185090@news000.worldonline.dk...
> > Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever. It's
> > either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other way around
> and
> > the bills still turn out high. Is it a 'fool yourself' system? I'd say
> > turning things off manually gives you better control of your energy
bills.
> >
> > Waddaya think folks?
> >
> > Edith.
> >
>
> We have eight storage heaters, two little ones in the downstairs loo and
> upstairs
> in the bathroom on full, the big ones in the lounge and hall are set at 2,
> the medium
> radiator in the kitchen is set at 2 and the three bedroom radiators are
> always off.
>
> We adjust the lounge and hall radiators to 4 when it snows, we have no
other
> heating unless you include the cooker during baking.
>
> If it is a hot summer then we turn the big radiators off.
>
> The cost of all electricity is around 50 a month throughout the year.
>
>
> INRI
>

Thank you INRI. That's not bad.
Help me a little bit more please. Would GCH be cheaper and are water rates
50 month too? and is Council tax about 100 monthly? Would 200 a month
cover a two bed cottage do you think and about how much would insurance
cost.

Gees, say :- Just guessing .-

Rent.................400 a month ?
Water rates......050 a month ?
Council tax......100 a month ?
Insurance....?...030 a month ?

Looks to me like a person living alone in Cumbria would need 1000 a month
to survive. ????? That's staggering.

Edith.

"tarquinlinbin"  wrote in message
news:rnkf6191tbv9dv16tii94fdr2v37a96oed@4ax.com...

> On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 12:27:22 +0200, "The Traveller" 
> wrote:
>
> >Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever. It's
> >either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other way around
and
> >the bills still turn out high. Is it a 'fool yourself' system? I'd say
> >turning things off manually gives you better control of your energy
bills.
> >
> >Waddaya think folks?
> >
> >Edith.
> >
> If you heat by electric then its going to cost you,plain and simple.


I only have electricity. I turn it off as much as possible. With the price
of the maintenance which is 1/2 the price I pay, + how much electricity I
use, it all comes to around 1000 a year. I live alone and close off two
bedrooms during the long winters.My immersion heater is the only thing that
is on all the time. I have lots of wooly jumpers and long johns and rag
socks.


> Think about it another way. Plough some investment into insulating
> your home. It would be a once only expenditure. This way your bills
> would reduce and they would be reuced all the time. As it is now,and
> with your current insulation spec,you will keep on spending to
> generate a level of comfort which just continually leaks out of your
> home.


I put it to the comity this year to insulate the two massive outer walls (4
flights) It was entered into the protocol under maintenance so it will be
done, probably not in my time. Instead a communal  'thingie' project was
voted for to reduce our electric bills :0(  I can't reduce my electricity
bill any more than I freeze to death.I'm good at it too. I use the same
amount of electricity having four rooms and kitchen has my neighbours who
fly south every winter for 6 months of the year and the flat beside me that
has only two rooms and kitchen.

Am I good or am I good.

Edith

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 12:27:22 +0200, The Traveller wrote:


> Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever. 
> It's either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other 
> way around and the bills still turn out high.


That sounds like typical night storage heating to me. I used to share  
a flat with NS heating. Never liked it, no proper control. They'd dump 
the heat into the flat during the day when we were all at work and run 
out in the evening when we were all back. If there was a sudden cold 
snap run out of heat in the middle of the afternoon or when it warmed 
up you'd roast in the evening...

These were just dumb NS heaters, an heat input control and a heat 
output one that operated a flap over the bricks via a bimetal strip to 
very vaugely maintain the room temp. I Think you can get NS heaters 
that have timers so they don't seriously release their stored heat 
until you tell 'em to via the timer. 

You could of course go around adjusting the heat controls every day, 
be good if you could predict the weather to get the heat input 
correct.

-- 
Cheers                                              new5pam@howhill.com
Dave.                                             pam is missing e-mail

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 19:46:05 퍭, The Traveller wrote:


> Help me a little bit more please. Would GCH be cheaper 


Probably, how much is gas per kW/hr in Norway? The capital outlay is 
higher for a wet cental heating system but you gain control and if gas 
is cheaper than 'lectric then overall you are going to win.


> Rent.................£400 a month ?


Own the place, no mortgage.  B-)


> Water rates......£050 a month ?


£180 a year  a few quid, unmetered supply only, we have a septic 
tank. Mains drainage would be another £180 on top. 


> Council tax......£100 a month ?


I wish, £225/month for 10 months of the year.  B-(  That is two bills for historical reasons on a large property. I must do battle with 
getting the place reassesed but even then I think the bill would be 
£1800ish/year.


> Insurance....?...£030 a month ?


I guess, the other half does that (Or she better be!)


> Looks to me like a person living alone in Cumbria would need £1000 a> month to survive. ????? That's staggering.


£1000 should enable you to eat as well as pay all the bills.

-- 
Cheers                                              new5pam@howhill.com
Dave.                                             pam is missing e-mail

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 20:11:30 +0200, "The Traveller" 
wrote:


>I only have electricity. I turn it off as much as possible. With the price
>of the maintenance which is 1/2 the price I pay, + how much electricity I
>use, it all comes to around 1000 a year. I live alone and close off two
>bedrooms during the long winters.My immersion heater is the only thing that
>is on all the time. I have lots of wooly jumpers and long johns and rag
>socks.
>
>> Think about it another way. Plough some investment into insulating
>> your home. It would be a once only expenditure. This way your bills
>> would reduce and they would be reuced all the time. As it is now,and
>> with your current insulation spec,you will keep on spending to
>> generate a level of comfort which just continually leaks out of your
>> home.
>
>I put it to the comity this year to insulate the two massive outer walls (4
>flights) It was entered into the protocol under maintenance so it will be
>done, probably not in my time. Instead a communal  'thingie' project was
>voted for to reduce our electric bills :0(  I can't reduce my electricity
>bill any more than I freeze to death.I'm good at it too. I use the same
>amount of electricity having four rooms and kitchen has my neighbours who
>fly south every winter for 6 months of the year and the flat beside me that
>has only two rooms and kitchen.
>
>Am I good or am I good.
>
>Edith
>


What with the collapsing veh....you seem to have a real peachy place there.
helpful hints are numbered below:

1) Why not add a layer of insulation to the inside of your flat (dry
lining)?  You'll be able to heat it with a 100W bulb.

(Storage heaters are really only for background heating, with a radient or
fan heater for roasting your toes. The modern ones have fans in them and
programmers, as well as on-peak top up circuits.)

2) Encourage your neighbours to stay for the winter, then you might have a
warm wall to cuddle up to?

3) move to a warmer climate.
( You are living in one of the coldest and most expensive (exclusive)
countries in Europe

J. (out of suggestions)

"Dave Liquorice"  wrote in message
news:nyyfbegfubjuvyypbz.ifbp1q1.pminews@news.howhill.com...

> On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 12:27:22 +0200, The Traveller wrote:
>
> > Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever.
> > It's either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other
> > way around and the bills still turn out high.
>
> That sounds like typical night storage heating to me. I used to share
> a flat with NS heating. Never liked it, no proper control. They'd dump
> the heat into the flat during the day when we were all at work and run
> out in the evening when we were all back. If there was a sudden cold
> snap run out of heat in the middle of the afternoon or when it warmed
> up you'd roast in the evening...


That's it. I could never get an even warmth out of that system. I prefer one
of those electric coal looking fires on a low notch left on all the time in
the winter with all the doors open (except to the hall and the kitchen.) so
the stairs up to1st floor would have to lead up from the living room.

>
> These were just dumb NS heaters, an heat input control and a heat
> output one that operated a flap over the bricks via a bimetal strip to
> very vaugely maintain the room temp. I Think you can get NS heaters
> that have timers so they don't seriously release their stored heat
> until you tell 'em to via the timer.


Sounds like what my mother had in her little flat.Never got an even heat in
there. It was either too hot or too cold. Mam would use a coin to screw the
heat up, then I would try my luck, then someone else would have a go when I
was gone, to save electricity, and it would all turn out as one big
pan-chite. (sorry) If  this system should automatically follow the Cumbrian
outside temperature, weather being what it is, they would be plugging in all
the time and the bill would be enormous

>
> You could of course go around adjusting the heat controls every day,
> be good if you could predict the weather to get the heat input
> correct.


That's when the plan goes all hay wire.A constant fight agains stone houses,
damp and a lack of sunshine.

Thanks Dave.
Edith airs out her house every day - here.

"Dave Liquorice"  wrote in message
news:nyyfbegfubjuvyypbz.ifbpjk2.pminews@news.howhill.com...
snip:-

> Council tax......100 a month ?


I wish, 225/month for 10 months of the year.  B-(  That is two bills
for historical reasons on a large property. I must do battle with
getting the place reassesed but even then I think the bill would be
1800ish/year.

2250 yearly????? Jesus wept!


> Looks to me like a person living alone in Cumbria would need 1000 a
> month to survive. ????? That's staggering.


1000 should enable you to eat as well as pay all the bills.

Yes, I was thinking in that direction, Dave. Thank you again.

Edith.

"The Traveller"  wrote in message 
news:eb2ae.113851$Vf.4185787@news000.worldonline.dk...

>
> "Dave Liquorice"  wrote in message
> news:nyyfbegfubjuvyypbz.ifbp1q1.pminews@news.howhill.com...
>> On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 12:27:22 +0200, The Traveller wrote:
>>
>> > Can anyone explain it for me. I haven't had any luck with it, ever.
>> > It's either too cold in the day and too hot at night or the other
>> > way around and the bills still turn out high.
>>
>> That sounds like typical night storage heating to me. I used to share
>> a flat with NS heating. Never liked it, no proper control. They'd dump
>> the heat into the flat during the day when we were all at work and run
>> out in the evening when we were all back. If there was a sudden cold
>> snap run out of heat in the middle of the afternoon or when it warmed
>> up you'd roast in the evening...
>
> That's it. I could never get an even warmth out of that system. I prefer 
> one
> of those electric coal looking fires on a low notch left on all the time 
> in
> the winter with all the doors open (except to the hall and the kitchen.) 
> so
> the stairs up to1st floor would have to lead up from the living room.
>>
>> These were just dumb NS heaters, an heat input control and a heat
>> output one that operated a flap over the bricks via a bimetal strip to
>> very vaugely maintain the room temp. I Think you can get NS heaters
>> that have timers so they don't seriously release their stored heat
>> until you tell 'em to via the timer.
>
> Sounds like what my mother had in her little flat.Never got an even heat 
> in
> there. It was either too hot or too cold. Mam would use a coin to screw 
> the
> heat up, then I would try my luck, then someone else would have a go when 
> I
> was gone, to save electricity, and it would all turn out as one big
> pan-chite. (sorry) If  this system should automatically follow the 
> Cumbrian
> outside temperature, weather being what it is, they would be plugging in 
> all
> the time and the bill would be enormous
>>
>> You could of course go around adjusting the heat controls every day,
>> be good if you could predict the weather to get the heat input
>> correct.
>
> That's when the plan goes all hay wire.A constant fight agains stone 
> houses,
> damp and a lack of sunshine.
>
> Thanks Dave.
> Edith airs out her house every day - here.
>
>

I'm no expert at warming places up as it is too bloody hot here.  I notice 
that nobody mentions reverse cycle heat pumps.  Aren't they used there?

"JH"  wrote in message
news:hn2g611oui49j3vt1unerg5cl27j16l9ss@4ax.com...

> On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 20:11:30 +0200, "The Traveller" 
> wrote:
>
> >I only have electricity. I turn it off as much as possible. With the
price
> >of the maintenance which is 1/2 the price I pay, + how much electricity I
> >use, it all comes to around 1000 a year. I live alone and close off two
> >bedrooms during the long winters.My immersion heater is the only thing
that
> >is on all the time. I have lots of wooly jumpers and long johns and rag
> >socks.
> >
> >> Think about it another way. Plough some investment into insulating
> >> your home.


I asked about this when I had laminat laid. The leader said we may insulate
the outer wall with time so I didn't draw the wall in and have it insulated.
Being at the top on a corner I have 3 cold outer walls. One betong which the
comity (our communal income must cover) and two wooden walls (planks) that
are easy to remove to insulate them. I don't have the money for this at the
moment. I came to Cumbria for a 10 day holiday. It costed 600 for a week in
a cottage + 3 nights in B&B That's because cottages rent out only for the
weekend - two nights or one week at a time.Ken at Cumbrian Cottages jugles
it as well has he can but the owners aren't too willing to break up a week
to 3 days more leaving the cottage vacant for the following 4 days-if you
get my drift, so one has to pay for two weeks and stay there 10 nights, or
stay for one week pluss B&Bs. The 10 days being Orlando's free days from
work.


It would be a once only expenditure. This way your bills

> >> would reduce and they would be reuced all the time. As it is now,and
> >> with your current insulation spec,you will keep on spending to
> >> generate a level of comfort which just continually leaks out of your
> >> home.


I know. I remember the big old house, all wood. Oil central heating. I took
a mortgage on the house to insulate all the walls, new doors, windows etc,
got the cost down by 100 then the price of oil went up and I was back to
square one.

> >
> >I put it to the comity this year to insulate the two massive outer walls
(4
> >flights) It was entered into the protocol under maintenance so it will be
> >done, probably not in my time. Instead a communal  'thingie' project was
> >voted for to reduce our electric bills :0(  I can't reduce my electricity
> >bill any more than I freeze to death.I'm good at it too. I use the same
> >amount of electricity having four rooms and kitchen has my neighbours who
> >fly south every winter for 6 months of the year and the flat beside me
that
> >has only two rooms and kitchen.
> >
> >Am I good or am I good.
> >
> >Edith
> >
>
> What with the collapsing veh....you seem to have a real peachy place
there.
> helpful hints are numbered below:
>
> 1) Why not add a layer of insulation to the inside of your flat (dry
> lining)?  You'll be able to heat it with a 100W bulb.


I'll try that, J. I'll buy those big sheets of something or other and just
stick them up against the wall, border them then do a big painting on
them.This way i can remove them when the outer wall gets done.

>
> (Storage heaters are really only for background heating, with a radient or
> fan heater for roasting your toes. The modern ones have fans in them and
> programmers, as well as on-peak top up circuits.)


I still don't care for them, honest. My loss perhaps.

>
> 2) Encourage your neighbours to stay for the winter, then you might have a
> warm wall to cuddle up to?


They can't wait to get out of here during the winter months which are 6
months of the year. They follow the sun.
That little bu88er beside me who would not let me open the outer hall window
to let the smoke out (blu88y egoist) inherrited his father's house and has
moved-at our last meeting I asked if someone could go into his flat to make
sure everything was safe has I had a bad feeling about it. It was done and
what they found was something awful mucky so I am glad to see him go. he has
been given warning to have the flat cleaned before selling it, but nothing
has happened yet. I'm not a religious person but I am praying for a nice
cosy none smoking neighbour.

>
> 3) move to a warmer climate.
> ( You are living in one of the coldest and most expensive (exclusive)
> countries in Europe


Someone said :-

Coldest and expensive, yes, but leave out the exclusive. That's all on the
surface and only for the rich. People here are unessesarily held down and
back because of a greedy political system where the government sits on the
golden egg and let it grow and grow, instead of letting some of the oil
money or a fair % of it help people up to a more worthy life. You wouldn't
believe the thing that go on here. Most of the people are still living as in
the after years of WW2, counting their pennies, hoping they'll have enough
to get buy. Everyone has a worried look on their face. A couple of weeks ago
a man was refused eccential medicine for cancer that would keep him alive,
because the medicine was too expensive they said. I believe the amount
mentioned was 1500. The roads are disgusting compaired to other countries,
where here they have more than enough oil and puck needed to repair all the
roads in the country.They think on a small scale all the time and study ways
to take back what they have given in the most unworthy ways. Toll bars
everywhere. This country is stifling. But they put up a good face, smile and
donate money to various foreign products, which is good has they can buy
international friends that way, while they  give less and less to the
Councils here, forcing them to cut costs leaving the people who need help
most without it.They close down schools and hospitals and old folks homes,
step on human rights in a slick way, knowing that people won't go to court
against them because they can't afford it. I could go on and on. Never vote
for a religious leader. They have one track minds, no scope and a false
fasade to hide behind.

Speakers Corner.

"Ray Ingham"  wrote in message
news:3q2ae.19667$5F3.18749@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Big snip.

> > That's when the plan goes all hay wire.A constant fight agains stone
> > houses,
> > damp and a lack of sunshine.
> >
> > Thanks Dave.
> > Edith airs out her house every day - here.
> >
> >
> I'm no expert at warming places up as it is too bloody hot here.  I notice
> that nobody mentions reverse cycle heat pumps.  Aren't they used there?
>

 reverse cycle heat pumps.That sounds good. Will we all get salmonella or
whatever it's called and DIE?

Recycled Edith - now cycling like mad off to town to ask the bank to loan me
some more money, eheheh oh blimey.......:0(

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 10:11:42 퍭, The Traveller wrote:


> £2250 yearly????? Jesus wept!


Perzackerly, when you look at it like that it's 'orrible two bills of 
£100 each/month doesn't look so bad. Where *did* those forms go....


>> £1000 should enable you to eat as well as pay all the bills.
> 
> Yes, I was thinking in that direction, Dave. Thank you again.


If you are working full time and only getting £12k/year you'd probablybe entitled to another 2 or 3,000 Working Tax Credit. Any children 
means you get Child Tax Credit, most families are entitled to that. 
Household income of £55k before it stops...

-- 
Cheers                                              new5pam@howhill.com
Dave.                                             pam is missing e-mail

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 08:17:03 GMT, Ray Ingham wrote:


> I'm no expert at warming places up as it is too bloody hot here.  I 
> notice that nobody mentions reverse cycle heat pumps.  Aren't they 
> used there? 


Not very common in the UK. More recent self build places sometimes put 
in a ground source heat pump or if the have a large enough river close 
by water source. 

Installed domestic air con is fairly thin on the ground so air sourced 
heat pumps are similary rare. Most of the DIY sheds are selling 
portable air con units now but many are evaporative rather than a heat 
pump.

-- 
Cheers                                              new5pam@howhill.com
Dave.                                             pam is missing e-mail