Tenuous link to DIY is that I am doing *some* of the work myself  :o)

We're renovating my mum's victorian mid-terraced house that we inherited 
when she died last year, with a view to renting it out. For various reasons 
it was recommended to us that, rather than hang a patterned wallpaper, we 
should hang a thick lining paper and then emulsion that in a neutral 
colour - so that's what we're doing.

I've never been a landlord before and I'm obviously very naive - for that 
reason alone my wife and I have decided that we should let the property 
through an agency rather than doing it ourselves.

Anyway, I suppose it'll be my responsibility as landlord to redecorate the 
house so, given the method of decoration (lining paper/emulsion), what would 
be considered a reasonable timescale for redecoration? Every 2 years? 
Longer? Shorter?

TIA,

Mogweed.

Mogweed  wrote:

> Tenuous link to DIY is that I am doing *some* of the work myself  :o)
> 
> We're renovating my mum's victorian mid-terraced house that we inherited 
> when she died last year, with a view to renting it out. For various reasons 
> it was recommended to us that, rather than hang a patterned wallpaper, we 
> should hang a thick lining paper and then emulsion that in a neutral 
> colour - so that's what we're doing.
<snip>
> Anyway, I suppose it'll be my responsibility as landlord to redecorate the 
> house so, given the method of decoration (lining paper/emulsion), what would 
> be considered a reasonable timescale for redecoration? Every 2 years? 
> Longer? Shorter?


Count the layers, and divide by 100?

Mogweed wrote:

> Tenuous link to DIY is that I am doing *some* of the work myself  :o)
>
> We're renovating my mum's victorian mid-terraced house that we
> inherited when she died last year, with a view to renting it out. For
> various reasons it was recommended to us that, rather than hang a
> patterned wallpaper, we should hang a thick lining paper and then
> emulsion that in a neutral
> colour - so that's what we're doing.
>
> I've never been a landlord before and I'm obviously very naive - for
> that reason alone my wife and I have decided that we should let the
> property through an agency rather than doing it ourselves.
>
> Anyway, I suppose it'll be my responsibility as landlord to
> redecorate the house so, given the method of decoration (lining
> paper/emulsion), what would be considered a reasonable timescale for
> redecoration? Every 2 years? Longer? Shorter?
>
> TIA,
>
> Mogweed.


As far as I'm aware PL's decorate the house once per each new tenant and
it's up to the tenant to keep it in a reasonable habitable condition.

Mogweed wrote:
[snip]

> I've never been a landlord before and I'm obviously very naive - for
> that reason alone my wife and I have decided that we should let the
> property through an agency rather than doing it ourselves.
>


Do you mean they are going to be the go between for you? i.e they look
after the doings where letting and upkeep of the property is concerned.

I wouldn't do that if I had property believe me.
Going back sometime I vacated a flat that I rented for 4 years till I
bought my own, however this letting agency let the place go to rack and
ruin the windows got smashed, the interior got totally destroyed and all
because the agency never bothered to board it up immediatly after I vacated
the flat.
So alls I can say to you is beware and check the property at least once a
month just as a drive by way.

"ben"  wrote in message 
news:FHhXe.110936$G8.49685@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...

> Mogweed wrote:
> [snip]
>> I've never been a landlord before and I'm obviously very naive - for
>> that reason alone my wife and I have decided that we should let the
>> property through an agency rather than doing it ourselves.
>>
>
> Do you mean they are going to be the go between for you? i.e they look
> after the doings where letting and upkeep of the property is concerned.
>
> I wouldn't do that if I had property believe me.
> Going back sometime I vacated a flat that I rented for 4 years till I
> bought my own, however this letting agency let the place go to rack and
> ruin the windows got smashed, the interior got totally destroyed and all
> because the agency never bothered to board it up immediatly after I 
> vacated
> the flat.
> So alls I can say to you is beware and check the property at least once a
> month just as a drive by way.
>


Good point Ben but hopefully there shouldn't be a problem. The agency we 
intend to use was recommended by a friend who has used them for the last 15 
years and apparently they vet the prospective tenants, do 'spot-checks' 
every so often to make sure things are all alright etc., etc., and generally 
seem very efficient and professional. I'm not sure what they do when the 
place is empty and between tenants but I'll certainly make a point of 
finding out now - thanks.

Mogweed.

Mogweed wrote:
[snip]

>
> Good point Ben but hopefully there shouldn't be a problem. The agency
> we intend to use was recommended by a friend who has used them for
> the last 15 years and apparently they vet the prospective tenants, do
> 'spot-checks' every so often to make sure things are all alright
> etc., etc., and generally seem very efficient and professional. I'm
> not sure what they do when the place is empty and between tenants but
> I'll certainly make a point of finding out now - thanks.
>
> Mogweed.


Good luck anyway.

p.s the agency is a reputable one, they have offices up'n'down the country.

ben wrote:

> As far as I'm aware PL's decorate the house once per each new tenant and
> it's up to the tenant to keep it in a reasonable habitable condition.


Dunno what a PL is - some sort of landlord? - but the above advice is 
nonsensical... a typical assured shorthold tenancy (AST) may be as 
little as 6 months, you certainly shouldn't need to redecorate 
throughout twice a year unless the place had been trashed.

And as for a long term let, where routine redecoration is required 
during a tenancy, it simply depends on the terms of the AST agreement 
who is responsible: could be either landlord or tenant.

David

Lobster wrote:

> ben wrote:
>> As far as I'm aware PL's decorate the house once per each new tenant
>> and it's up to the tenant to keep it in a reasonable habitable
>> condition.
>
> Dunno what a PL is - some sort of landlord? - but the above advice is
> nonsensical... a typical assured shorthold tenancy (AST) may be as
> little as 6 months, you certainly shouldn't need to redecorate
> throughout twice a year unless the place had been trashed.
>
> And as for a long term let, where routine redecoration is required
> during a tenancy, it simply depends on the terms of the AST agreement
> who is responsible: could be either landlord or tenant.
>
> David


PL : Private Landlord

There is no such term agreements as "long term", thats why its short term,
you renew the agreement after six months.
As for redecoration the landlord is not responsible to redecorate the flat
dwelling that the occupant has access to except hallways i.e outside of the
flat, inside the flat the occupant is responsible for the upkeep, i.e
should he choose to redecorate he has to ask permission from the landlord.
The landlord has to decorate if the property is in need of a lick of paint
after the last occupancy.

When you occupy a council flat/house will they come around a redecorate for
you?

This is not nonsensical,(been there done that).

Mogweed wrote:

> Anyway, I suppose it'll be my responsibility as landlord to redecorate the 
> house so, given the method of decoration (lining paper/emulsion), what would 
> be considered a reasonable timescale for redecoration? Every 2 years? 
> Longer? Shorter?


Depends how quickly you go through tenants, and how much damage the 
tenants do.

A lot of landlords are now offering 2-year shorthold tenancies as this 
hopefully reduces void periods and attracts a more stable type of 
tenant. The property shouldn't need any decoration during the tenancy, 
but after two years would probably need some freshening up.

Every 2-3 years for paintwork and a new kitchen every 5 years is 
probably what you should budget for. Remember that some expenses will be 
set-offable against tax, so keep receipts.

Owain

Mogweed wrote:

> We're renovating my mum's victorian mid-terraced house that we inherited 
> when she died last year, with a view to renting it out.


You are going to be *letting* it, not renting it.



> For various reasons 
> it was recommended to us that, rather than hang a patterned wallpaper, we 
> should hang a thick lining paper and then emulsion that in a neutral 
> colour - so that's what we're doing.
> 
> I've never been a landlord before and I'm obviously very naive - for that 
> reason alone my wife and I have decided that we should let the property 
> through an agency rather than doing it ourselves.


Ooh argh. Make sure the agency speak English, and look in their
T&Cs very carefully. I think it is well worth having a soliciter
specialising in property advise on this - if this costs a few
hundred, it is money well spent in the grand scheme of things
(especially considering what your estate agent will charge). Don't
let them sub-let, e.g. to a council, you can do that far far
better yourself, and your house won't be filled with lbooyd
asylum seekers.



> Anyway, I suppose it'll be my responsibility as landlord to redecorate the 
> house so, given the method of decoration (lining paper/emulsion), what would 
> be considered a reasonable timescale for redecoration? Every 2 years? 
> Longer? Shorter?


When it needs it. This will depend to a large extent on the tenant.
If you can paint rather than line, this will help maintenance a
little, as holes in the lining are a bit of a PITA. However, if
lining is done right, and adheres well, it won't be too much of
an issue.

Mogweed wrote:


> Tenuous link to DIY is that I am doing *some* of the work myself  :o)
>
> We're renovating my mum's victorian mid-terraced house that we inherited
> when she died last year, with a view to renting it out. For various reasons
> it was recommended to us that, rather than hang a patterned wallpaper, we
> should hang a thick lining paper and then emulsion that in a neutral
> colour - so that's what we're doing.
>
> I've never been a landlord before and I'm obviously very naive - for that
> reason alone my wife and I have decided that we should let the property
> through an agency rather than doing it ourselves.


Thats your profit margin gone. All those little jobs you could easily
do theyll get someone in who charges rip off prices, probably a
relative.



> Anyway, I suppose it'll be my responsibility as landlord to redecorate the
> house so, given the method of decoration (lining paper/emulsion), what would
> be considered a reasonable timescale for redecoration? Every 2 years?
> Longer? Shorter?



Theres no simple answer other than when needed. I've seen paintwork in
need of redoing after 2 years, and other paintwork in the same house
fine after over 20 years. Using decent emulsion will help greatly -
avoid trade crap, go for dulux or leyland.

In fact I dont think painting with crap is legal these days.


NT

Mogweed  wrote in message
news:3p5jrlF8mp1uU1@individual.net...
<snip>

> Anyway, I suppose it'll be my responsibility as landlord to redecorate the
> house so, given the method of decoration (lining paper/emulsion), what
would
> be considered a reasonable timescale for redecoration? Every 2 years?
> Longer? Shorter?


   That depends party on the letting value and type of tenants but normally
at the change of tenant or only when it really needs it.
If you are a virgin landlord and depending on the value of the property you
should also consider leasing to a council or housing group normally a 3/5
year term at about 80% market value, but no fees or hassle and a guaranteed
income.
Downside is you will probably need to completely refurbish the house at the
end of the lease, but the cost is negotiable.
Also if you were a company you can enter into a maintenance contract with
the lease which can bring the income up to 110% of market letting value.


-

ben wrote:

> Lobster wrote:
> 
>>ben wrote:
>>
>>>As far as I'm aware PL's decorate the house once per each new tenant
>>>and it's up to the tenant to keep it in a reasonable habitable
>>>condition.
>>
>>Dunno what a PL is - some sort of landlord? - but the above advice is
>>nonsensical... a typical assured shorthold tenancy (AST) may be as
>>little as 6 months, you certainly shouldn't need to redecorate
>>throughout twice a year unless the place had been trashed.
>>
>>And as for a long term let, where routine redecoration is required
>>during a tenancy, it simply depends on the terms of the AST agreement
>>who is responsible: could be either landlord or tenant.

> PL : Private Landlord
> 
> There is no such term agreements as "long term", thats why its short term,
> you renew the agreement after six months.


You don't need to renew a six-month AST, after 6 months it automatically 
reverts to a 'periodic' tenancy without any further documentation 
required (ie, essentially 1 months' notice required from tenant, 2 
months' notice required from landlord).  That can persist indefinitely 
(ie long-term), and there is no categorically no requirement for the 
landlord to come in every six months to redecorate during that time.


> As for redecoration the landlord is not responsible to redecorate the flat
> dwelling that the occupant has access to except hallways i.e outside of the
> flat, inside the flat the occupant is responsible for the upkeep, i.e
> should he choose to redecorate he has to ask permission from the landlord.


Depends entirely on the wording of the tenancy agreement.


> The landlord has to decorate if the property is in need of a lick of paint
> after the last occupancy.


Sure, but entirely up to him if he considers it necessary, and whether 
its needed to attract new tenants.  But personally I'd be pretty unhappy 
if a property of mine needed completely redecorating after just one 
six-month tenancy.


> When you occupy a council flat/house will they come around a redecorate for
> you?


No; but irrelevant because that's a different type of tenancy and a 
completely different scenario.

David

ben wrote:

> p.s the agency is a reputable one, they have offices up'n'down the country.


That means nothing :-)

And many of the letting agency chains are franchise, so you are dealing 
with a franchisee not a big business.

Owain

meow2222@care2.com wrote:

> Mogweed wrote:
>>I've never been a landlord before and I'm obviously very naive - for that
>>reason alone my wife and I have decided that we should let the property
>>through an agency rather than doing it ourselves.
> 
> Thats your profit margin gone. All those little jobs you could easily
> do theyll get someone in who charges rip off prices, probably a
> relative.


You have to tell them that *you're* doing the maintenance, then all will
be well. Make sure it's in writing, and that the "who to contact first"
path is known and workable.

Mark wrote:

> If you are a virgin landlord and depending on the value of the property you
> should also consider leasing to a council or housing group normally a 3/5
> year term at about 80% market value, but no fees or hassle and a guaranteed
> income.
> Downside is you will probably need to completely refurbish the house at the
> end of the lease, but the cost is negotiable.


The council are approachable and have seen it all before. Make
sure that your property's condition has been described and noted.
Discrepancies can be dealt with at the end of the let. They have
seen it all before, and as long as yyour procedures/approach are
right, it will work out well.

On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 18:46:31 GMT, Lobster
 wrote:


>ben wrote:
>> As far as I'm aware PL's decorate the house once per each new tenant and
>> it's up to the tenant to keep it in a reasonable habitable condition.
>
>Dunno what a PL is - some sort of landlord? - but the above advice is 
>nonsensical... a typical assured shorthold tenancy (AST) may be as 
>little as 6 months, you certainly shouldn't need to redecorate 
>throughout twice a year unless the place had been trashed.


Friends parents let bedsits and they would "re-decorate" with every
new tenant, even if they were only there for three months.

Usually this'd involve emulsion painting the walls, wiping down the
gloss paint and steam cleaning the carpets.

sponix

Lobster wrote:

> ben wrote:
>> Lobster wrote:
>>
>>> ben wrote:
>>>
>>>> As far as I'm aware PL's decorate the house once per each new
>>>> tenant and it's up to the tenant to keep it in a reasonable
>>>> habitable condition.
>>>
>>> Dunno what a PL is - some sort of landlord? - but the above advice
>>> is nonsensical... a typical assured shorthold tenancy (AST) may be
>>> as little as 6 months, you certainly shouldn't need to redecorate
>>> throughout twice a year unless the place had been trashed.
>>>
>>> And as for a long term let, where routine redecoration is required
>>> during a tenancy, it simply depends on the terms of the AST
>>> agreement who is responsible: could be either landlord or tenant.
>
>> PL : Private Landlord
>>
>> There is no such term agreements as "long term", thats why its short
>> term, you renew the agreement after six months.
>
> You don't need to renew a six-month AST, after 6 months it
> automatically reverts to a 'periodic' tenancy without any further
> documentation required (ie, essentially 1 months' notice required
> from tenant, 2 months' notice required from landlord).  That can
> persist indefinitely (ie long-term), and there is no categorically no
> requirement for the landlord to come in every six months to
> redecorate during that time.
>


If the tenant is still occupying the property after six months and has not
signed the aggreement for a further six months the landlord can throw
him/her out should he want to sell the property, whereas if the occupant
had signed the aggreement for a further six months the landlord could not
touch the tenant.

I did not say the landlord has to come in every six months to redecorate.

[quote]
The landlord has to decorate if the property is in need of a lick of paint
after the last occupancy.
[unquote]

depends if the previous occupant was dirty, i.e a heavy smoker or just
plain filthy.


>> As for redecoration the landlord is not responsible to redecorate
>> the flat dwelling that the occupant has access to except hallways
>> i.e outside of the flat, inside the flat the occupant is responsible
>> for the upkeep, i.e should he choose to redecorate he has to ask
>> permission from the landlord.
>
> Depends entirely on the wording of the tenancy agreement.
>
>> The landlord has to decorate if the property is in need of a lick of
>> paint after the last occupancy.
>
> Sure, but entirely up to him if he considers it necessary, and whether
> its needed to attract new tenants.  But personally I'd be pretty
> unhappy if a property of mine needed completely redecorating after
> just one six-month tenancy.
>
>> When you occupy a council flat/house will they come around a
>> redecorate for you?
>
> No; but irrelevant because that's a different type of tenancy and a
> completely different scenario.
>
> David