Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k?
If so, what year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I should
look out for?
Thanks

mike <mike@mail.nomail> wrote:


> Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so, what
> year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I should look
> out for?
> Thanks


Bwahahahahaha.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

"mike" <mike@mail.nomail> wrote in message 
news:56jph19kqe6si03the04cbqe5p8mcl266s@4ax.com...

> Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k?


Nope... you'd probably struggle to get a half decent 80 Avant for that, too.

I doubt it's possible to get *any* A4 that's not salvage, for under 1k tbh.

-- 
JackH

>Any glaring things I should  look out for?


Worn control arms in the front suspension, has the cambelt been changed & is 
the aircon working if it has it.

I.

mike (mike@mail.nomail) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were
saying : 


> Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k?
> If so, what year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring
> things I should look out for?


For a grand's worth of A4 estate?

Four wheels would be an advantage, as would an engine.
Be careful around burnt-out cars, there's nasties that can kill you.

Oh, and if it's "just" nicked, the insurance company might want it back.

SteveH wrote:

> mike <mike@mail.nomail> wrote:
>
>> Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so,
>> what year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I
>> should look out for?
>> Thanks
>
> Bwahahahahaha.


Lol - Audi's are a waste of money, so says the boss of VW...

http://news.ft.com/cms/s/f78d7a4c-1504-11da-9df1-00000e2511c8.html


-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

The message <1h2fy5g.yp14iizct0tqN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:



> > Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so, what
> > year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I should look
> > out for?
> > Thanks

> Bwahahahahaha.


I got a very decent A6 shape A100 auto diesel estate for 1200.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

Tim S Kemp  wrote:


> SteveH wrote:
> > mike <mike@mail.nomail> wrote:
> >
> >> Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so,
> >> what year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I
> >> should look out for?
> >> Thanks
> >
> > Bwahahahahaha.
> 
> Lol - Audi's are a waste of money, so says the boss of VW...
> 
> http://news.ft.com/cms/s/f78d7a4c-1504-11da-9df1-00000e2511c8.html


He's right, you know.

Not so much since the Passat has been replaced by a Golf based car, but
over the last 10 years, if you wanted an Audi, you could save a stack of
money buying the VW or Skoda alternative. Suppose it still holds true
with the A3, though.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

Guy King  wrote:


> The message <1h2fy5g.yp14iizct0tqN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
> from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:
> 
> 
> > > Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so, what
> > > year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I should look
> > > out for?
> > > Thanks
> 
> > Bwahahahahaha.
> 
> I got a very decent A6 shape A100 auto diesel estate for 1200.


Yeah, but that's ancient. Based on the old 'aero' 100 from the early
80s.

You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 09:18:21 +0100, SteveH  wrote:


> Guy King  wrote:
>
>> The message <1h2fy5g.yp14iizct0tqN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
>> from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:
>>
>>
>> > > Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so,  
>> what
>> > > year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I  
>> should look
>> > > out for?
>> > > Thanks
>>
>> > Bwahahahahaha.
>>
>> I got a very decent A6 shape A100 auto diesel estate for 1200.
>
> Yeah, but that's ancient. Based on the old 'aero' 100 from the early
> 80s.
>
> You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.



Err no it's not , the Aero 100's 3 models ago. The 100/A6 replaced it.
Autotraders got plenty of A4 Avants for just under 2000

Duncanwood  wrote:


> On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 09:18:21 +0100, SteveH  wrote:
> 
> > Guy King  wrote:
> >
> >> The message <1h2fy5g.yp14iizct0tqN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
> >> from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:
> >>
> >>
> >> > > Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so,
> >> what
> >> > > year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I
> >> should look
> >> > > out for?
> >> > > Thanks
> >>
> >> > Bwahahahahaha.
> >>
> >> I got a very decent A6 shape A100 auto diesel estate for 1200.
> >
> > Yeah, but that's ancient. Based on the old 'aero' 100 from the early
> > 80s.
> >
> > You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.
> 
> 
> Err no it's not , the Aero 100's 3 models ago. The 100/A6 replaced it.
> Autotraders got plenty of A4 Avants for just under 2000


You do realise that the 2nd generation 100 / 1st generation A6 is just a
reskinned 'aero' type 100, don't you?

As for the A4s, 'plenty' = 4. Yes, that's the lot. All of which are a
less than desireable spec. (1.6 engine in a car that size, no thanks,
even the 1.8 is only barely up to the job).

The OP wanted a 'half decent' example - that means 1.8T as a minimum
engine size. Anything under 2k will most certainly not be 'half
decent'.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
were saying : 


>> > You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.

> As for the A4s, 'plenty' = 4. Yes, that's the lot.


<Has a look>
Four under "A4 Avant", yes, but 93 under "A4".

Amongst that lot, there's saloons with all engines up to 2.6, there's at 
least one TDi Avant and one 1.8 Avant.

There's also a lot of "non-runner", "just needs cambelt", "just needs..."

Adrian  wrote:


> SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
> were saying : 
> 
> >> > You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.
> 
> > As for the A4s, 'plenty' = 4. Yes, that's the lot.
> 
> <Has a look>
> Four under "A4 Avant", yes, but 93 under "A4".
> 
> Amongst that lot, there's saloons with all engines up to 2.6, there's at
> least one TDi Avant and one 1.8 Avant.
> 
> There's also a lot of "non-runner", "just needs cambelt", "just needs..."


Yeah, loads of saloons - mainly mega high miles or crappy spec. 1.6
Auto, I ask you......

2k is about the entry point for a decent, not startship miles saloon
with a decent engine. Add 500 to get a half decent Avant.

However, if the OP wants a larger A4 with a VW badge, then he'd almost
certainly get a decent estate for 2k.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 11:20:58 +0100, SteveH  wrote:


> Adrian  wrote:
>
>> SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
>> were saying :
>>
>> >> > You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.
>>
>> > As for the A4s, 'plenty' = 4. Yes, that's the lot.
>>
>> <Has a look>
>> Four under "A4 Avant", yes, but 93 under "A4".
>>
>> Amongst that lot, there's saloons with all engines up to 2.6, there's at
>> least one TDi Avant and one 1.8 Avant.
>>
>> There's also a lot of "non-runner", "just needs cambelt", "just  
>> needs..."
>
> Yeah, loads of saloons - mainly mega high miles or crappy spec. 1.6
> Auto, I ask you......
>
> 2k is about the entry point for a decent, not startship miles saloon
> with a decent engine. Add 500 to get a half decent Avant.
>
> However, if the OP wants a larger A4 with a VW badge, then he'd almost
> certainly get a decent estate for 2k.



I'm with you on that , a high mileage Passat with history's almost  
certainly a better buy for the same car.

On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 10:46:13 +0100, SteveH  wrote:


> Duncanwood  wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 09:18:21 +0100, SteveH   
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Guy King  wrote:
>> >
>> >> The message <1h2fy5g.yp14iizct0tqN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
>> >> from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > > Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If  
>> so,
>> >> what
>> >> > > year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I
>> >> should look
>> >> > > out for?
>> >> > > Thanks
>> >>
>> >> > Bwahahahahaha.
>> >>
>> >> I got a very decent A6 shape A100 auto diesel estate for 1200.
>> >
>> > Yeah, but that's ancient. Based on the old 'aero' 100 from the early
>> > 80s.
>> >
>> > You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.
>>
>>
>> Err no it's not , the Aero 100's 3 models ago. The 100/A6 replaced it.
>> Autotraders got plenty of A4 Avants for just under 2000
>
> You do realise that the 2nd generation 100 / 1st generation A6 is just a
> reskinned 'aero' type 100, don't you?
>


I've had both, it's not the difference between a Cortina & a Sierra but  
beyond the drivetrain there's not much in common.



> As for the A4s, 'plenty' = 4. Yes, that's the lot. All of which are a
> less than desireable spec. (1.6 engine in a car that size, no thanks,
> even the 1.8 is only barely up to the job).
>
> The OP wanted a 'half decent' example - that means 1.8T as a minimum
> engine size. Anything under 2k will most certainly not be 'half
> decent'.




-- 
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

SteveH wrote:

> 
> Duncanwood  wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 09:18:21 +0100, SteveH  wrote:
> >
> > > Guy King  wrote:
> > >
> > >> The message <1h2fy5g.yp14iizct0tqN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
> > >> from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> > > Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k? If so,
> > >> what
> > >> > > year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring things I
> > >> should look
> > >> > > out for?
> > >> > > Thanks
> > >>
> > >> > Bwahahahahaha.
> > >>
> > >> I got a very decent A6 shape A100 auto diesel estate for 1200.
> > >
> > > Yeah, but that's ancient. Based on the old 'aero' 100 from the early
> > > 80s.
> > >
> > > You'd struggle to get any A4 worth having for 2k.
> >
> >
> > Err no it's not , the Aero 100's 3 models ago. The 100/A6 replaced it.
> > Autotraders got plenty of A4 Avants for just under 2000
> 
> You do realise that the 2nd generation 100 / 1st generation A6 is just a
> reskinned 'aero' type 100, don't you?
> 
> As for the A4s, 'plenty' = 4. Yes, that's the lot. All of which are a
> less than desireable spec. (1.6 engine in a car that size, no thanks,
> even the 1.8 is only barely up to the job).


There was even an Aero 100 with 1.6 engine 60-75bhp and 4 gears. But maybe
not sold in the UK market.

On 06 Sep 2005 06:59:17 GMT, Adrian  wrote:


>mike (mike@mail.nomail) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were
>saying : 
>
>> Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k?
>> If so, what year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring
>> things I should look out for?
>
>For a grand's worth of A4 estate?
>
>Four wheels would be an advantage, as would an engine.
>Be careful around burnt-out cars, there's nasties that can kill you.
>
>Oh, and if it's "just" nicked, the insurance company might want it back.


Twit! The curse of a broken cambelt and bent value is now forever upon you and
the bwahahahahaha's...
You sensibile others are ok. Ta.

btw I also have a bmw 325i but want something to cart stuff about in. Just
happen to like the "old" A4 shape.

The message <1h2gn5q.1az02sn1wvuc2eN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:


> > I got a very decent A6 shape A100 auto diesel estate for 1200.

> Yeah, but that's ancient. 


Goes like a train and doesn't have too many "sophisticated" things to go
wrong. And still got around 45mpg on a week's touring Cornwall. Not as
good as the Montego, but still very acceptable.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

mike (mike@mail.nomail) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were
saying : 


>>> Is it possible to get a half-decent Audi A4 estate for 1k?
>>> If so, what year could I hope to get for that price. Any glaring
>>> things I should look out for?

>>For a grand's worth of A4 estate?
>>
>>Four wheels would be an advantage, as would an engine.
>>Be careful around burnt-out cars, there's nasties that can kill you.
>>
>>Oh, and if it's "just" nicked, the insurance company might want it
>>back. 

> Twit! The curse of a broken cambelt and bent value is now forever upon
> you and the bwahahahahaha's...
> You sensibile others are ok. Ta.


I think you may be missing the point.

<slowly>
The answer to your first question is "Not a fucking chance".

SteveH wrote:


> He's right, you know.
>
> Not so much since the Passat has been replaced by a Golf based car,
> but over the last 10 years, if you wanted an Audi, you could save a
> stack of money buying the VW or Skoda alternative. Suppose it still
> holds true with the A3, though.


You still can, the Superb is longitudonal and better value than an A4/A6.

Best bargains will be 3-5 yr old Phaetons - I'm waiting!

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

The message 
from "Tim S Kemp"  contains these words:


> Best bargains will be 3-5 yr old Phaetons - I'm waiting!


Nah - no estate version.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 18:17:45 +0100, Guy King  wrote:


> The message 
> from "Tim S Kemp"  contains these words:
>
>> Best bargains will be 3-5 yr old Phaetons - I'm waiting!
>
> Nah - no estate version.
>



Dire isn't it, I really fancy an A8L estate.

Guy King wrote:

> The message 
> from "Tim S Kemp"  contains these words:
>
>> Best bargains will be 3-5 yr old Phaetons - I'm waiting!
>
> Nah - no estate version.


fit a towbar

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

Guy King (guy.king@zetnet.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they 
were saying :


>> Best bargains will be 3-5 yr old Phaetons - I'm waiting!

> Nah - no estate version.


There's always the Toerag? (Or the LT...)

Duncan Wood wrote:

> On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 18:17:45 +0100, Guy King 
> wrote:
>> The message 
>> from "Tim S Kemp"  contains these words:
>>
>>> Best bargains will be 3-5 yr old Phaetons - I'm waiting!
>>
>> Nah - no estate version.
>>
>
>
> Dire isn't it, I really fancy an A8L estate.


I reckon the R class will be a depreciation shock, in Mercedes terms, after 
all anyone who wants something that oddball can afford it new. That'll be 
the big estate car bargain in 5 yrs time.
-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

>> Not so much since the Passat has been replaced by a Golf based car,
>> but over the last 10 years, if you wanted an Audi, you could save a
>> stack of money buying the VW or Skoda alternative. Suppose it still
>> holds true with the A3, though.
>
> You still can, the Superb is longitudonal and better value than an A4/A6.
>
> Best bargains will be 3-5 yr old Phaetons - I'm waiting!


Nah, they won't be proper cheap until 5-10 years old.  Cheapest W12 (the 
only one to have IMHO, and that's even including the V10 TDI) on Autotrader 
when I looked last week was an 03 plater at 28k.  5 years old they'll still 
be 10-15k.  I wouldn't call something like that a bargain until it's down 
to under 5k.

-- 
Peter

"You're not a real UKRCMer until you've had your big end bearings go."

AstraVanMan (Peter@Whataloadofforeskinbollocks.co.uk) gurgled happily,
sounding much like they were saying : 


> Cheapest W12
> (the only one to have IMHO, and that's even including the V10 TDI) on
> Autotrader when I looked last week was an 03 plater at 28k.


<whimper, checks Parkers>
Two years ago, that was a 68-73k car. BEFORE options.
(Four seats cost more than five...).

So, in two years, it's dropped somewhere around 60% of it's value.

Or, to look at it another way, over twenty grand per year.

Tim S Kemp (news@timkemp.karoo.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much
like they were saying : 


> I reckon the R class will be a depreciation shock, in Mercedes terms,
> after all anyone who wants something that oddball can afford it new.
> That'll be the big estate car bargain in 5 yrs time.


And... right on cue... in today's batch of industry press releases...

<fanfare of pretentious wanky music>

'Vision R 63 AMG': World premiere at the 61st Frankfurt Motor Show
Presentation of a dynamic, near-series interpretation of the Mercedes-
Benz R-Class

* Sporting interpretation of the Grand Sports Tourer
* Powered by an all-new 6.3-litre AMG V8 engine
* Output rated at 510 hp and 630 Nm
* Luxury, performance and four-wheel drive for six occupants

At the 61st Frankfurt Motor Show (IAA), Mercedes-AMG is presenting the 
'Vision R 63 AMG', a particularly dynamic, near-series interpretation of 
the new Mercedes-Benz R-Class, the Grand Sports Tourer. Powered by the 
all-new, completely independently developed AMG 6.3-litre V8 engine with 
an output of 510 hp and a maximum torque of 630 Nm, the 'Vision R 63 
AMG' represents an unprecedented combination of unique, sporty driving 
pleasure, outstanding spaciousness and top-class comfort for up to six 
occupants.

Alongside the series-production version of the new Mercedes-Benz R-
Class, whose short wheelbase variant is celebrating its world premiere 
at the show, the 'Vision R 63 AMG' with a long wheelbase, an avant-garde 
design and an extravagantly styled interior, will appear in the role of 
a sporty and dynamic trendsetter. This Mercedes-AMG interpretation of 
the Grand Sports Tourer confirms its exceptional position in the 
automotive market right from the very first glance. Externally, numerous 
details distinguish the muscular showcar from the series-production R-
Class. The bodywork of the 'Vision R 63 AMG' is resplendent in 'dark 
titanium grey', whilst the trim is in matt titanium grey. 

Newly designed front and rear aprons in the typical AMG look, bi-xenon 
headlamps with titanium-coated reflectors and the two twin chromed 
tailpipes of the AMG sports exhaust system convey unmistakable dynamism. 
Massive, matt titanium-painted 21-inch AMG light-alloy wheels in a 5-
spoke design with 265/40 R 21 wide-base tyres all-round lend a striking 
effect to the side view of the almost 5.20-metre long Grand Sports 
Tourer. Behind the spokes of the AMG light-alloy wheels it is possible 
to discern the generously dimensioned AMG high-performance braking 
system, which ensures extremely short braking distances. 

Sports-car performance from the 'Vision R 63 AMG'
The new AMG 6.3-litre V8 engine provides the performance characteristics 
of a thoroughbred sports car. With an output of 510 hp and 630 Nm of 
torque, the newly-developed, large-displacement naturally aspirated AMG 
eight-cylinder engine makes for a supremely assured and dynamic driving 
experience. The 'Vision R 63 AMG' accelerates to 62 mph in approximately 
five seconds and has a maximum speed of 155 mph (electronically 
limited). Power is transferred by an AMG SPEEDSHIFT automatic 
transmission with steering wheel gearshift paddles and a DIRECT SELECT 
shift lever. A combination of permanent all-wheel drive with a torque 
distribution of 40:60 between the front and rear axles, and an AMG 
sports suspension based on the AIRMATIC air suspension with Adaptive 
Damping System ensures the greatest possible handling safety and -- at 
the touch of a button -- allows a dynamic or more sporty style of 
driving. 

The interior of the 'Vision R 63 AMG' is impressively spacious, with a 
stylish colour scheme and luxurious appointments. Two-tone nappa 
leather, AMG sports seats in the first two seat rows, the AMG ergonomic 
sports steering wheel with gearshift paddles and the AMG instrument 
cluster convey sporty flair. Matching the exterior of the AMG showcar, 
most of the decorative trim in the interior features a matt titanium 
grey finish -- complemented by trim in black piano lacquer on the front 
centre console. Thanks to a DVD player, passengers in the second and 
third rows are able to enjoy their own programme of entertainment in the 
'Vision R 63 AMG'. Four 7-inch TFT flat-screen monitors are integrated 
into the head restraints of the front seats. For optimum convenience and 
a relaxed journey there are two folding tables for the individual centre 
seats, as well as the multi-zone Luxury Climate Control system which 
ensures a pleasant interior climate for all six occupants.

"SteveH"  wrote in message
news:1h2gn3p.gfb2qb7rv1yoN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...

>
> Not so much since the Passat has been replaced by a Golf based car <SNIP>


Steve

Do you mean the current (new) model Passat has reverted to the Golf
platform? Are these all using transverse mounted engines? 'cos previously
the Passats from around 97 onwards had their engines mounted longitudinally,
like their Audi cousins.

"Douglas Hall" <@> wrote:


> "SteveH"  wrote in message
> news:1h2gn3p.gfb2qb7rv1yoN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...
> >
> > Not so much since the Passat has been replaced by a Golf based car <SNIP>
> 
> Steve
> 
> Do you mean the current (new) model Passat has reverted to the Golf
> platform? Are these all using transverse mounted engines? 'cos previously
> the Passats from around 97 onwards had their engines mounted longitudinally,
> like their Audi cousins.


Yeah, the new model Passat has gone back to transverse engines -
probably because people realised the Passat was a cheaper way in to
A4/A6 ownership (it straddles the 2 in size and shares bits with both,
although it looks closer to an A6 than an A4, IYSWIM).

-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

"SteveH"  wrote in message
news:1h2iw0j.72o454plaoyN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...

> "Douglas Hall" <@> wrote:
>
> > "SteveH"  wrote in message
> > news:1h2gn3p.gfb2qb7rv1yoN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...
> > >
> > > Not so much since the Passat has been replaced by a Golf based car
<SNIP>
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > Do you mean the current (new) model Passat has reverted to the Golf
> > platform? Are these all using transverse mounted engines? 'cos
previously
> > the Passats from around 97 onwards had their engines mounted

longitudinally,

> > like their Audi cousins.
>
> Yeah, the new model Passat has gone back to transverse engines -
> probably because people realised the Passat was a cheaper way in to
> A4/A6 ownership (it straddles the 2 in size and shares bits with both,
> although it looks closer to an A6 than an A4, IYSWIM).


Steve

Thanks for the info.

Wonder why they've done that - in the time they've platform shared the
Passat with the mid range Audis, Passats must surely have peaked in their
popularity. And as something of a bigger car, I would have thought the
Passat more naturally sits with the Audi models in terms of size.

Still... I'm sure they've got their reasons, and I guess now they've got the
Phaeton for the upper end of the VW range <shrug>

"Douglas Hall" <@> wrote:


> Still... I'm sure they've got their reasons, and I guess now they've got the
> Phaeton for the upper end of the VW range <shrug>


Oooh, Paeton.

<drool>

-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

Douglas Hall wrote:


> Wonder why they've done that - in the time they've platform shared the
> Passat with the mid range Audis, Passats must surely have peaked in
> their popularity. And as something of a bigger car, I would have
> thought the Passat more naturally sits with the Audi models in terms
> of size.


Indeed, but think about cost - there's a fair few more Golf  (octavia / leon 
/ TT /) platform drivetrains manufactured than A4 platform (A4 / superb) 
making a mass production cost benefit, and the transverse engine gives 
better packaging (less bonnet, more passenger space) and according to Volvo 
and Saab better frontal crash protection.

Means the 4WD versions will now be Haldex instead of Quattro based but 
that's no big deal to 99.999% of passat buyers anyway.


-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
were saying : 


>> Still... I'm sure they've got their reasons, and I guess now they've
>> got the Phaeton for the upper end of the VW range <shrug>

> Oooh, Phaeton.
> 
> <drool>


Umm, why?

It's a steel A8 hit with the ugly stick and in SERIOUS need of a diet.

A8 - Ally, 1,700kg.
Phaeton - Steel, 2,300kg.

Tim S Kemp wrote:

> 
> Douglas Hall wrote:
> 
> > Wonder why they've done that - in the time they've platform shared the
> > Passat with the mid range Audis, Passats must surely have peaked in
> > their popularity. And as something of a bigger car, I would have
> > thought the Passat more naturally sits with the Audi models in terms
> > of size.
> 
> Indeed, but think about cost - there's a fair few more Golf  (octavia / leon
> / TT /) platform drivetrains manufactured than A4 platform (A4 / superb)
> making a mass production cost benefit, and the transverse engine gives
> better packaging (less bonnet, more passenger space) and according to Volvo
> and Saab better frontal crash protection.


The only disadvantage is that the the transverse layout inevitably means
McPherson struts front suspension, whereas the traditional layout allows
more advanced front suspension. Whether this is actually employed in the
A4 I don't know. Whether it matters in a repmobile, I don't know.

The message <1h2j3wb.1ev4xw9w99cjeN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:


> Oooh, Paeton.


When come back, bring Phaeton!

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

Guy King  wrote:


> The message <1h2j3wb.1ev4xw9w99cjeN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
> from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:
> 
> > Oooh, Paeton.
> 
> When come back, bring Phaeton!


Argh!
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

Adrian  wrote:


> SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
> were saying : 
> 
> >> Still... I'm sure they've got their reasons, and I guess now they've
> >> got the Phaeton for the upper end of the VW range <shrug>
> 
> > Oooh, Phaeton.
> > 
> > <drool>
> 
> Umm, why?


I don't know, really. I just fancy a W12, that's all.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

Johannes (johs@spam-no-chance-sizefitter.com) gurgled happily, sounding
much like they were saying : 


> The only disadvantage is that the the transverse layout inevitably
> means McPherson struts front suspension, whereas the traditional
> layout allows more advanced front suspension.


While most transverse layouts certainly DO use MacStruts - which are, 
indeed, shit - it certainly isn't "inherent", and it's certainly possible 
to use far better (whether "more advanced" or not) layouts with a 
transverse lump - it's been done many times in the past.

The fact that VAG choose not to shows either complete poverty of 
imagination or the rule of the bean-counter.

SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they 
were saying :


>> > Oooh, Phaeton.
>> > 
>> > <drool>

>> Umm, why?

> I don't know, really. I just fancy a W12, that's all.


So why not have it in an A8?

(Or, indeed, in something else... a friend of mine should be taking 
delivery of his W12-powered four-door soon, I think he said this week... 
It's coming from Crewe...)

Adrian  wrote:


> SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
> were saying :
> 
> >> > Oooh, Phaeton.
> >> > 
> >> > <drool>
> 
> >> Umm, why?
> 
> > I don't know, really. I just fancy a W12, that's all.
> 
> So why not have it in an A8?


Much as I like the A8, I actually prefer the styling of the Phaeton.

Not to mention the fact that Phaetons will be stupidly cheap in a few
years.
 

> (Or, indeed, in something else... a friend of mine should be taking 
> delivery of his W12-powered four-door soon, I think he said this week...
> It's coming from Crewe...)


Nasty. Why pay that much money for a VW?


-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

Johannes wrote:


> The only disadvantage is that the the transverse layout inevitably
> means McPherson struts front suspension, whereas the traditional
> layout allows more advanced front suspension. Whether this is
> actually employed in the A4 I don't know. Whether it matters in a
> repmobile, I don't know.


true, ish. Doesn't Honda manage to fit full double wishbone in its 
transverse cars?

As for it mattering, no, it doesn't, again to the huge majority of passat 
owners. The Passat, like the Vectra and the Mondeo, is a very very good all 
round mid price car, it doesn't have to excel in anything.

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

Adrian wrote:

> SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like
> they were saying :
>
>>>> Oooh, Phaeton.
>>>>
>>>> <drool>
>
>>> Umm, why?
>
>> I don't know, really. I just fancy a W12, that's all.
>
> So why not have it in an A8?
>
> (Or, indeed, in something else... a friend of mine should be taking
> delivery of his W12-powered four-door soon, I think he said this
> week... It's coming from Crewe...)


Isn't that just another A8 / Phaeton clone but with less rear space?

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

"Tim S Kemp"  wrote in message 
news:26idnZ2dnZ2h0IaSnZ2dnX-9gt6dnZ2dRVn-zZ2dnZ0@karoo.co.uk...

> Johannes wrote:
>
>> The only disadvantage is that the the transverse layout inevitably
>> means McPherson struts front suspension, whereas the traditional
>> layout allows more advanced front suspension. Whether this is
>> actually employed in the A4 I don't know. Whether it matters in a
>> repmobile, I don't know.
>
> true, ish. Doesn't Honda manage to fit full double wishbone in its 
> transverse cars?
>
> As for it mattering, no, it doesn't, again to the huge majority of passat 
> owners. The Passat, like the Vectra and the Mondeo, is a very very good 
> all round mid price car, it doesn't have to excel in anything.


It's why I bought one this week... TDI, naturally. ;-)

Very nice it is, too. :-)

-- 
JackH

SteveH (steve@italiancar.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they 
were saying :


>> (Or, indeed, in something else... a friend of mine should be taking 
>> delivery of his W12-powered four-door soon, I think he said this week...
>> It's coming from Crewe...)

> Nasty. 


Oh, I dunno. I would.


> Why pay that much money for a VW?


Because he'll do the same as he did with his early-production Conti - keep 
it for a few months, and sell it on for a price that will make a little 
profit, even counting the cost of financing it...

Tim S Kemp (news@timkemp.karoo.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like 
they were saying :


>> (Or, indeed, in something else... a friend of mine should be taking
>> delivery of his W12-powered four-door soon, I think he said this
>> week... It's coming from Crewe...)

> Isn't that just another A8 / Phaeton clone but with less rear space?


The A8 and Phaeton don't shove a pair of turbos onto the W12...

Adrian wrote:

> Tim S Kemp (news@timkemp.karoo.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much
> like they were saying :
>
>>> (Or, indeed, in something else... a friend of mine should be taking
>>> delivery of his W12-powered four-door soon, I think he said this
>>> week... It's coming from Crewe...)
>
>> Isn't that just another A8 / Phaeton clone but with less rear space?
>
> The A8 and Phaeton don't shove a pair of turbos onto the W12...


Wonder if it'll all fit in a Passat - that'd give some people a fright.

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

Tim S Kemp  wrote:


> Adrian wrote:
> > Tim S Kemp (news@timkemp.karoo.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much
> > like they were saying :
> >
> >>> (Or, indeed, in something else... a friend of mine should be taking
> >>> delivery of his W12-powered four-door soon, I think he said this
> >>> week... It's coming from Crewe...)
> >
> >> Isn't that just another A8 / Phaeton clone but with less rear space?
> >
> > The A8 and Phaeton don't shove a pair of turbos onto the W12...
> 
> Wonder if it'll all fit in a Passat - that'd give some people a fright.


Don't think so - that's why the Passat got a W8.

-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

Tim S Kemp (news@timkemp.karoo.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like 
they were saying :


>> The A8 and Phaeton don't shove a pair of turbos onto the W12...

> Wonder if it'll all fit in a Passat 


If it'd fit in the new one, it'd fit in the Golf... <evil cackle>


> that'd give some people a fright.


Not least the driver, I'd imagine.

Adrian wrote:

> Tim S Kemp (news@timkemp.karoo.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much
> like they were saying :
>
>>> The A8 and Phaeton don't shove a pair of turbos onto the W12...
>
>> Wonder if it'll all fit in a Passat
>
> If it'd fit in the new one, it'd fit in the Golf... <evil cackle>


If we were talking BMW instead of VW then Hartge would have done it by now.

V12 3 series compact anyone?

Now, back to the evil designs for a W12 lupo...

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

Tim S Kemp  wrote:


> > If it'd fit in the new one, it'd fit in the Golf... <evil cackle>
> 
> If we were talking BMW instead of VW then Hartge would have done it by now.
> 
> V12 3 series compact anyone?
> 
> Now, back to the evil designs for a W12 lupo...


I suspect that would have to be mid engined.

Nice.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

>> Still... I'm sure they've got their reasons, and I guess now they've got 
>> the
>> Phaeton for the upper end of the VW range <shrug>
>
> Oooh, Paeton.
>
> <drool>


Today, we watch SteveH lose his 'h' key in the excitement resulting from 
thinking about the VW Phaeton.

-- 
Peter

"You're not a real UKRCMer until you've had your big end bearings go."

SteveH wrote:

> 
> Guy King  wrote:
> 
> > The message <1h2j3wb.1ev4xw9w99cjeN%steve@italiancar.co.uk>
> > from steve@italiancar.co.uk (SteveH) contains these words:
> >
> > > Oooh, Paeton.
> >
> > When come back, bring Phaeton!
> 
> Argh!


<trivia>
Joan Collins drives a Phaeton, courtesy of VW I think.

SteveH wrote:

> Tim S Kemp  wrote:
>
>>> If it'd fit in the new one, it'd fit in the Golf... <evil cackle>
>>
>> If we were talking BMW instead of VW then Hartge would have done it
>> by now.
>>
>> V12 3 series compact anyone?
>>
>> Now, back to the evil designs for a W12 lupo...
>
> I suspect that would have to be mid engined.
>



All over enghined?

"AstraVanMan"  wrote in message
news:okGTe.839$Q%2.741@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...

> Today, we watch SteveH lose his 'h' key in the excitement resulting from
> thinking about the VW Phaeton.


LOL! He's just called Steve now    :o)

>> Today, we watch SteveH lose his 'h' key in the excitement resulting from
>> thinking about the VW Phaeton.
>
> LOL! He's just called Steve now    :o)


LOL!

-- 
Peter

"You're not a real UKRCMer until you've had your big end bearings go."

SteveH wrote:

> Tim S Kemp  wrote:
>
>>> If it'd fit in the new one, it'd fit in the Golf... <evil cackle>
>>
>> If we were talking BMW instead of VW then Hartge would have done it
>> by now.
>>
>> V12 3 series compact anyone?
>>
>> Now, back to the evil designs for a W12 lupo...
>
> I suspect that would have to be mid engined.
>
> Nice.


be one up from the 3 litre Lupo they made a while ago...

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

PC Paul wrote:

> SteveH wrote:
>> Tim S Kemp  wrote:
>>
>>>> If it'd fit in the new one, it'd fit in the Golf... <evil cackle>
>>>
>>> If we were talking BMW instead of VW then Hartge would have done it
>>> by now.
>>>
>>> V12 3 series compact anyone?
>>>
>>> Now, back to the evil designs for a W12 lupo...
>>
>> I suspect that would have to be mid engined.
>>
>
>
> All over enghined?


http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/new_cars/technology_glossary/w12

quote:

     Despite its 5998cc capacity, the 420PS W12 is just over 50cm long, and 
around 70cm high and wide.

So, anyone got a Lupo and a tape measure?


-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

Tim S Kemp (news@timkemp.karoo.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much
like they were saying : 


> Despite its 5998cc capacity, the 420PS W12 is just over 50cm long, and 
> around 70cm high and wide.
> 
> So, anyone got a Lupo and a tape measure?


I don't think a Lupo bonnet's 70cm long. Don't forget all the other stuff 
you've got to squeeze in there - like, oooh, rad/plumbing/steering...

I had a Mk3 VR6 Golf - and that was bloody *crammed* - the battery wore a 
space blanket, and the bonnet heat insulation was about 2" thick.