Hi Folks,

I have a circular-ish trip to do next week:

Sunday: Dumfries - Audley End (via London)
Monday: Audley End - Great Malvern
Wednesday: Great Malvern - Dumfries

Can anyone suggest a cunning combination of tickets to minimise the 
cost of this jaunt? I'm thinking of a saver from Dumfries to London, 
some sort of cheapish ticket from London to Audley End and back, then 
use the return bit of the saver from Paddington to Oxford, single from
Oxford to Great Malvern, single from Great Malvern to Birmingham and 
back home on the saver again. 

Ian
--

Ian Johnston wrote:

> 
> I'm thinking of a saver from Dumfries to London,
> some sort of cheapish ticket from London to Audley End and back, then
> use the return bit of the saver from Paddington to Oxford, single from
> Oxford to Great Malvern, single from Great Malvern to Birmingham and
> back home on the saver again.


Sounds about right to me. Map Cs gets you from Paddington to Preston via
Oxford and Banbury. It also appears to let you go from Oxford to Great
Malvern, but no further on that line than Hereford.

I can't see a way of getting from Great Malvern to Birmingham on your
ticket though. But it's difficult to check with the new-style Routeing
Guide because there are so many different maps to look at now, each
covering a relatively small chunk of the network..

I did wonder about trekking across from Carlisle to Newcastle, then
coming down the East Coast to Peterborough and heading for Audley End
via Cambridge. But that option seems to have been dropped from the RG
now.
-- 
Joyce Whitchurch, Stalybridge, UK
=================================
Do something amazing. Give blood.
<http://www.blood.co.uk/>

On Mon, 29 Aug 2005 12:12:35 UTC, Joyce Whitchurch 
 wrote:

: Sounds about right to me. Map Cs gets you from Paddington to Preston via
: Oxford and Banbury. It also appears to let you go from Oxford to Great
: Malvern, but no further on that line than Hereford.

Thanks. If I can use a London - Dumfries train to go Paddington - 
Oxford - Great Malvern, but not to Birmingham, how do they expect me 
to get north. Hereford - Shrewsbury - Crewe? If there's time, that 
might be fun, as might the discussion with the ticket collector!

: I can't see a way of getting from Great Malvern to Birmingham on your
: ticket though.

That's not really a worry, as it's dead cheap.

: I did wonder about trekking across from Carlisle to Newcastle, then
: coming down the East Coast to Peterborough and heading for Audley End
: via Cambridge. But that option seems to have been dropped from the RG
: now.

There were Dumfries - London via Newcastle tickets available last time
I checked, but it doesn't matter this time becausethe Sunday service 
means I really have to go down the WCML. Still, that means I get to 
travel on a Pendolino. Wheee!

Many thanks for your suggestions and help.

Ian

Ian Johnston wrote:

> 
> Thanks. If I can use a London - Dumfries train to go Paddington - 
> Oxford - Great Malvern, but not to Birmingham, how do they expect me 
> to get north.


I don't think they /do/ expect you to continue north. Map CS seems to be
a way of getting from Paddington to Hereford, or to Birmingham, but not
both. I think. It's not very clear.


> Many thanks for your suggestions and help.


That's OK - but I'm taking no responsibility!

Have a look at <http://www.atoc.org/rsp/Routeing%20Guide/enrg.htm> and
see if you can make any more sense of it than I can.
-- 
Joyce Whitchurch, Stalybridge, UK
=================================
Do something amazing. Give blood.
<http://www.blood.co.uk/>

Ian Johnston wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
> I have a circular-ish trip to do next week:
>
> Sunday: Dumfries - Audley End (via London)
> Monday: Audley End - Great Malvern
> Wednesday: Great Malvern - Dumfries
>
> Can anyone suggest a cunning combination of tickets to minimise the
> cost of this jaunt? I'm thinking of a saver from Dumfries to London,
> some sort of cheapish ticket from London to Audley End and back, then
> use the return bit of the saver from Paddington to Oxford, single from
> Oxford to Great Malvern, single from Great Malvern to Birmingham and
> back home on the saver again.
>
> Ian
> --


Using the saver (on return) to Birmingham (BOJ) and travelling from
there to Great Malvern and back might be cheaper and not much slower.
Maybe even quicker with a good connection.

Whether there is a cheapish ticket from London to Audley End is another
matter - often there isn't one on this type of suburban journey if you
are not making a day return journey. Worth investigating a 'route
London' saver from Dumfries - to Cambridge if need be.

>
> Sunday: Dumfries - Audley End (via London)
> Monday: Audley End - Great Malvern
> Wednesday: Great Malvern - Dumfries
>
> Can anyone suggest a cunning combination of tickets to minimise the
> cost of this jaunt? I'm thinking of a saver from Dumfries to London,
> some sort of cheapish ticket from London to Audley End and back, then
> use the return bit of the saver from Paddington to Oxford, single from
> Oxford to Great Malvern, single from Great Malvern to Birmingham and
> back home on the saver again.
>


I always thought break of journey was not allowed with Savers, such as
the break between Oxford and Birmingham you are proposing.

Might be worth asking the booking clerk for the cheapest way as they
can be very knowledgeable. I believe some sort of split the difference
Saver is available for a triangular journey.

For example, I once tried to book Birmingham - Southampton outward via
Reading return via London. I had assumed I would need to purchase a via
London Saver as this was the most expensive all route ticket. In fact,
I was able to book outward ticket via Reading and return via London at
a split the difference price.

Incidentally, to my surprise, via London was the cheaper ticket.

On 29 Aug 2005 09:39:33 -0700, "allan tracy"
 wrote:


>I always thought break of journey was not allowed with Savers, such as
>the break between Oxford and Birmingham you are proposing.


It is valid for break of journey on the return portion only.


>Might be worth asking the booking clerk for the cheapest way as they
>can be very knowledgeable. I believe some sort of split the difference
>Saver is available for a triangular journey.


Not any more, sadly.  However, you *can* do an XS to use a cheaper
route in one direction and a more expensive one in the other, provided
a single routed ticket exists for each.  This is what your example
did.

Neil

-- 
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
When replying please use neil at the above domain
'wensleydale' is a spam trap and is not read.

On Mon, 29 Aug 2005 16:35:28 UTC, dtren@my-deja.com wrote:

: 
: Ian Johnston wrote:

 > I have a circular-ish trip to do next week:
: >
: > Sunday: Dumfries - Audley End (via London)
: > Monday: Audley End - Great Malvern
: > Wednesday: Great Malvern - Dumfries
: >
: > Can anyone suggest a cunning combination of tickets to minimise the
: > cost of this jaunt?

: Using the saver (on return) to Birmingham (BOJ) and travelling from
: there to Great Malvern and back might be cheaper and not much slower.
: Maybe even quicker with a good connection.

Sound thinking, that man! Many thanks.

: Whether there is a cheapish ticket from London to Audley End is another
: matter - often there isn't one on this type of suburban journey if you
: are not making a day return journey. Worth investigating a 'route
: London' saver from Dumfries - to Cambridge if need be.

I have a feeling that there isn't a saver from Dumfries to Cambridge 
via London - I've made that trip before. But I shall certainly check.

Ian
: 


--

On Mon, 29 Aug 2005 16:39:33 UTC, "allan tracy" 
 wrote:

: I always thought break of journey was not allowed with Savers, such as
: the break between Oxford and Birmingham you are proposing.

Break of journey on the return is fine. I'm not quite as sure about 
"gap in journey" ...

Ian


--

On 29 Aug 2005 16:45:48 GMT, "Ian Johnston"
 wrote:


>Break of journey on the return is fine. I'm not quite as sure about 
>"gap in journey" ...


I fail to see how it can[1] be enforced, so long as you don't do
something odd like swap between unconnected routes.

[1] Cue people saying how - but in reality it wouldn't be.

Neil

-- 
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
When replying please use neil at the above domain
'wensleydale' is a spam trap and is not read.

On 29 Aug 2005 09:35:28 -0700, dtren@my-deja.com wrote:


>Using the saver (on return) to Birmingham (BOJ) and travelling from
>there to Great Malvern and back might be cheaper and not much slower.
>Maybe even quicker with a good connection.
>
>Whether there is a cheapish ticket from London to Audley End is another
>matter - often there isn't one on this type of suburban journey if you
>are not making a day return journey. Worth investigating a 'route
>London' saver from Dumfries - to Cambridge if need be.


An 'Any Permitted' SVR (to Audley End) is available, and 10p more
expensive than a 'Not London' one. (I thus presume it's valid via
London but haven't checked the RG.)

On the return journey, you could use the direct Audley End to
Birmingham service, break the journey there and buy a return to Great
Malvern.

Also, no one's mentioned VV advance tickets yet - if they're available
and you don't mind being tied to particular trains, they could well
end up being cheaper.

On Mon, 29 Aug 2005, Ian Johnston wrote:


> On Mon, 29 Aug 2005 12:12:35 UTC, Joyce Whitchurch 
>  wrote:
> 
> : Sounds about right to me. Map Cs gets you from Paddington to Preston via
> : Oxford and Banbury. It also appears to let you go from Oxford to Great
> : Malvern, but no further on that line than Hereford.
> 
> Thanks. If I can use a London - Dumfries train to go Paddington - 
> Oxford - Great Malvern, but not to Birmingham, how do they expect me 
> to get north.


No-no, CS+LM was an allowed routeing, and map CS sure allows you to go 
Oxford - Brum

This digression about Hereford arose, I presume, because map CS *also* 
has a branch heading off from Oxford to Hereford - but there's no way 
to get on to map LM from it, so it's no use to you if you're following 
CS+LM.  And I didn't spot map CS in any of the other combinations.  
But there's well over a dozen map combinations listed, and some of 
them involve five maps!!!  By the time we'd discussed and agreed the 
possible routes, they'd have revised the routeing guide yet again, and 
we'd have to restart the discussion from square 1.

Unless you'd already bought the tickets on the basis of the 
then-existing version of the guide, and had a good lawyer...

>Ian Johnston wrote:
>> Thanks. If I can use a London - Dumfries train to go Paddington - 
>> Oxford - Great Malvern, but not to Birmingham, how do they expect me 
>> to get north.


Joyce Whitchurch wrote:

>I don't think they /do/ expect you to continue north. Map CS seems to be
>a way of getting from Paddington to Hereford, or to Birmingham, but not
>both. I think. It's not very clear.


The only permitted routes for journeys *to or from* Hereford involving
Map CS are all to the south[1]; they obviously don't want you to use
that map for journeys via Hereford.

[1] Map CS is used for journeys from Hereford to:- 
Ascot (Berks) 
Ash Vale 
Ashford Intl 
Banbury Group 
Basingstoke 
Beckenham Jn 
Brentford 
Brighton Group 
Bromley South Group 
Chatham Group 
Clapham Junction 
Croydon Group 
Crystal Palace 
Didcot Parkway 
Dorking Group 
Dover Priory 
Epsom 
Farnborough Group 
Faversham 
Ford Group 
Greenford Und 
Guildford 
Hastings Group 
Havant 
Horsham 
Kingston 
Lewes 
London Group 
Maidstone Group 
Mitcham Junction 
Oxford 
Portsmouth Group 
Ramsgate 
Reading Group 
Redhill Group 
Richmond London 
Slough 
Southampton Group 
Staines 
Streatham Group 
Surbiton 
Sutton London 
Swanley 
Swindon (Wilts) 
Three Bridges 
Tonbridge 
Westbury Group 
Weymouth Group 
Wimbledon 
Woking 
Wokingham 
Worcester Group 

Neil Sunderland
-- 
Braunton, Devon
Please observe the Reply-To address.

NP: Del Amitri - High Times (from the album 'Some Other Sucker's Parade')

> : Using the saver (on return) to Birmingham (BOJ) and travelling from
> : there to Great Malvern and back might be cheaper and not much slower.
> : Maybe even quicker with a good connection.
>
> Sound thinking, that man! Many thanks.
>
> : Whether there is a cheapish ticket from London to Audley End is another
> : matter - often there isn't one on this type of suburban journey if you
> : are not making a day return journey. Worth investigating a 'route
> : London' saver from Dumfries - to Cambridge if need be.
>
> I have a feeling that there isn't a saver from Dumfries to Cambridge
> via London - I've made that trip before. But I shall certainly check.
>

NR seem to think there is only 4 quid more

On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 08:51:34 UTC, "Thomas"  wrote:

: > I have a feeling that there isn't a saver from Dumfries to Cambridge
: > via London - I've made that trip before. But I shall certainly check.
: >
: NR seem to think there is only 4 quid more 

Yee-hah. That will do very nicely!

Ian

"Ian Johnston"  wrote:


> Hi Folks,
>
> I have a circular-ish trip to do next week:
>
> Sunday: Dumfries - Audley End (via London)
> Monday: Audley End - Great Malvern
> Wednesday: Great Malvern - Dumfries


I wonder if *that* Virgin ticket person will be on duty? ;-)

If so, you should suddenly remember that trip you need to make on Thursday.

Kirton Lindsey to Reddish South, with a bike and a wheelchair user.

Paid for by 'Shredded Wheat Rail Offer' tokens.

 Discounted by seventy-eight eighty-fourths by one of Joe's Child Priv First
Class thingies.

Route 'The Mound'.

With Plus Bus.

Chris

On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 22:02:31 UTC, "Chris Read" 
 wrote:

: 
: "Ian Johnston"  wrote:
: 
: > Hi Folks,
: >
: > I have a circular-ish trip to do next week:
: >
: > Sunday: Dumfries - Audley End (via London)
: > Monday: Audley End - Great Malvern
: > Wednesday: Great Malvern - Dumfries
: 
: I wonder if *that* Virgin ticket person will be on duty? ;-)
: 
: If so, you should suddenly remember that trip you need to make on Thursday.
: 
: Kirton Lindsey to Reddish South, with a bike and a wheelchair user.
: 
: Paid for by 'Shredded Wheat Rail Offer' tokens.
: 
:  Discounted by seventy-eight eighty-fourths by one of Joe's Child Priv First
: Class thingies.
: 
: Route 'The Mound'.
: 
: With Plus Bus.

"Thanks. Oh, hang on a  minute, it's for Wednesday, not Thursday."

Ian