We are hitting 95p a litre in some areas now, soon we will be faced with
paying 1 a ltr.

Philip Hollsworth offered this good idea:

This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy petrol on a certain day"
campaign that was going around last April or May!

The oil companies just laughed at that because they knew we wouldn't
continue to hurt ourselves by refusing to buy petrol.

It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them.

BUT, whoever thought of this idea, has come up with a plan that can really
work.

Please read it and join in!

Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations have conditioned us to think
that the cost of a litre is CHEAP, we need to take aggressive action to
teach them that BUYERS control the marketplace not sellers.

With the price of petrol going up more each day, we consumers need to take
action.

The only way we are going to see the price of petrol come down is if we hit
someone in the pocket by not purchasing their Petrol!

And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. Here's the idea:

For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two biggest
oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.

If they are not selling any petrol, they will be inclined to reduce their
prices.

If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit.

But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of Esso and BP
petrol buyers.
It's really simple to do!!

Now, don't wimp out on me at this point... keep reading and I'll explain how
simple it is to reach millions of people!!

I am sending this note to a lot of people.
If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 = 300)... and those 300
send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 = 3,000) . and so on, by the time the
message reaches the sixth generation of people, we will have reached over
THREE MILLION consumers!

If those three million get excited and pass this on to ten friends each,
then 30 million people will have been contacted!

If it goes one level further, you guessed it... .. THREE HUNDRED MILLION
PEOPLE!!!

Again, all You have to do is send this to 10 people.
That's all.(and not buy at ESSO/BP)

How long would all that take? If each of us sends this email out to ten more
people within one day of receipt, all 300 MILLION people could conceivably
be contacted within the next 8 days!!!

I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you!

Acting together we can make a difference.
If this makes sense to you, please pass this message on.

PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE 69p a LITRE RANGE

It's easy to make this happen.

Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
i.e. boycott BP and Esso.

is Shell not part of BP as my work fuel card allows me to buy fuel in either
stations???

Martin
"Raymond"  wrote in message
news:4308d081$0$22945$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...

>
> We are hitting 95p a litre in some areas now, soon we will be faced with
> paying 1 a ltr.
>
> Philip Hollsworth offered this good idea:
>
> This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy petrol on a certain day"
> campaign that was going around last April or May!
>
> The oil companies just laughed at that because they knew we wouldn't
> continue to hurt ourselves by refusing to buy petrol.
>
> It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them.
>
> BUT, whoever thought of this idea, has come up with a plan that can really
> work.
>
> Please read it and join in!
>
> Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations have conditioned us to
think
> that the cost of a litre is CHEAP, we need to take aggressive action to
> teach them that BUYERS control the marketplace not sellers.
>
> With the price of petrol going up more each day, we consumers need to take
> action.
>
> The only way we are going to see the price of petrol come down is if we
hit
> someone in the pocket by not purchasing their Petrol!
>
> And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. Here's the idea:
>
> For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two biggest
> oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.
>
> If they are not selling any petrol, they will be inclined to reduce their
> prices.
>
> If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit.
>
> But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of Esso and BP
> petrol buyers.
> It's really simple to do!!
>
> Now, don't wimp out on me at this point... keep reading and I'll explain
how
> simple it is to reach millions of people!!
>
> I am sending this note to a lot of people.
> If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 = 300)... and those
300
> send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 = 3,000) . and so on, by the time
the
> message reaches the sixth generation of people, we will have reached over
> THREE MILLION consumers!
>
> If those three million get excited and pass this on to ten friends each,
> then 30 million people will have been contacted!
>
> If it goes one level further, you guessed it... .. THREE HUNDRED MILLION
> PEOPLE!!!
>
> Again, all You have to do is send this to 10 people.
> That's all.(and not buy at ESSO/BP)
>
> How long would all that take? If each of us sends this email out to ten
more
> people within one day of receipt, all 300 MILLION people could conceivably
> be contacted within the next 8 days!!!
>
> I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you!
>
> Acting together we can make a difference.
> If this makes sense to you, please pass this message on.
>
> PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE 69p a LITRE RANGE
>
> It's easy to make this happen.
>
> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Raymond  wrote:


> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.


Prick.

This kind of shit is only forwarded by people who don't know how the
petroleum retail industry works.

(Your starter for 10....... BP supply Morrisons)
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

"SteveH"  wrote in message 
news:1h1nuzo.1r2rj8k1gn5hvaN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...

> Raymond  wrote:
>
>> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
>> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
>> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.
>
> Prick.
>
> This kind of shit is only forwarded by people who don't know how the
> petroleum retail industry works.
>
> (Your starter for 10....... BP supply Morrisons)
> -- 

and a fair share of other supermarkets
the fact of the matter is that the goverment makes us the most expensive 
petrol after all the tax and shit
if we were to buy fuel with no tax on it it's the cheapest in europe
but because brown has overestimated the growth of the ecomony (3-3.5% rather 
than 1.6% in reality) he's fucked and can't do what the french have done by 
rebating the fuel duty

readup on it ;)



> Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
> http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
> Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
> BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC # 

The message <deajp0$9co$1@nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com>
from "Marty1a"  contains these words:


> is Shell not part of BP as my work fuel card allows me to buy fuel in either
> stations???


No. Though places like Tesco probably buy their fuel from all sorts of
places, some of which likely include BP and Shell so the idea's a bit of
a non-starter.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

> and a fair share of other supermarkets
> the fact of the matter is that the goverment makes us the most expensive 
> petrol after all the tax and shit
> if we were to buy fuel with no tax on it it's the cheapest in europe
> but because brown has overestimated the growth of the ecomony (3-3.5% 
> rather than 1.6% in reality) he's fucked and can't do what the french have 
> done by rebating the fuel duty


The governmint aren't stupid - the more we tell them how much we rely on our 
cars to get to work and stuff, the more they know they've a guaranteed 
income regardless how high the cost/litre rises.  It's the governmint we 
need to target, not the oil companies...

Darren

"Darren Jarvis"  wrote in message 
news:Jp5Oe.88$k4.41@newsfe3-gui.ntli.net...

>> and a fair share of other supermarkets
>> the fact of the matter is that the goverment makes us the most expensive 
>> petrol after all the tax and shit
>> if we were to buy fuel with no tax on it it's the cheapest in europe
>> but because brown has overestimated the growth of the ecomony (3-3.5% 
>> rather than 1.6% in reality) he's fucked and can't do what the french 
>> have done by rebating the fuel duty
>
> The governmint aren't stupid - the more we tell them how much we rely on 
> our cars to get to work and stuff, the more they know they've a guaranteed 
> income regardless how high the cost/litre rises.  It's the governmint we 
> need to target, not the oil companies...
>

Spot on mate. However I would like to see some alternative to the car. We 
pollute the planet far too much at present anyhow so it would be kind of 
good if the government would spend our petrol tax on something like a decent 
subsidised pubic transport system.

-- 
Malc

"Your mother can't climb stairs"
Dalek playground taunt

"Darren Jarvis"  wrote in message
news:Jp5Oe.88$k4.41@newsfe3-gui.ntli.net...

> > and a fair share of other supermarkets
> > the fact of the matter is that the goverment makes us the most expensive
> > petrol after all the tax and shit
> > if we were to buy fuel with no tax on it it's the cheapest in europe
> > but because brown has overestimated the growth of the ecomony (3-3.5%
> > rather than 1.6% in reality) he's fucked and can't do what the french
have
> > done by rebating the fuel duty
>
> The governmint aren't stupid - the more we tell them how much we rely on
our
> cars to get to work and stuff, the more they know they've a guaranteed
> income regardless how high the cost/litre rises.  It's the governmint we
> need to target, not the oil companies...
>


If the increase in fuel duty and Vat isn't enough for Gordon, then as the
oil companies profit margins increase they have consequently to pay more in
taxation, no prizes for guessing who the lucky recipient is.. ain't
capitalism wonderful!



> Darren
>
>

"Raymond"  wrote in message 
news:4308d081$0$22945$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...

>
> We are hitting 95p a litre in some areas now, soon we will be faced with
> paying 1 a ltr.


<snip>

Won't work. What would work is if everyone filled up their car tomorrow and 
drove off without paying for it. That would be really funny, and cause fuel 
prices to plummet quite quickly :)

Hellraiser.............>

Raymond wrote:


> For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two
> biggest oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.


that's ok, I use optimax.


> I am sending this note to a lot of people.


no kidding


> If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 = 300)... and
> those 300 send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 = 3,000) . and so
> on, by the time the message reaches the sixth generation of people,
> we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers!


Except there'll be lots of redundancy and duplication, probably only reach 
about 5000 people in six generations and even then only maybe one in a 
hundred will bother - so that's 50 people not being BP/Esso fuels - that's 
really gonna change the world.


> If it goes one level further, you guessed it... .. THREE HUNDRED
> MILLION PEOPLE!!!


Probably more like 6000.


> I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you!


Potential, yes, potentially. Reality is something else.


> PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE 69p a LITRE RANGE


Yeahhhhh right. The government could make this happen tomorrow. They won't.


> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.


My morrisons get its fuel from Esso.

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

"Tim S Kemp"  wrote in message 
news:-rKdnZ2dnZ0ZS-CXnZ2dncZyld6dnZ2dRVn-yp2dnZ0@karoo.co.uk...

> Raymond wrote:
>
>> For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two
>> biggest oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.
>
> that's ok, I use optimax.
>
>> I am sending this note to a lot of people.
>
> no kidding
>
>> If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 = 300)... and
>> those 300 send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 = 3,000) . and so
>> on, by the time the message reaches the sixth generation of people,
>> we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers!
>
> Except there'll be lots of redundancy and duplication, probably only reach 
> about 5000 people in six generations and even then only maybe one in a 
> hundred will bother - so that's 50 people not being BP/Esso fuels - that's 
> really gonna change the world.
>
>> If it goes one level further, you guessed it... .. THREE HUNDRED
>> MILLION PEOPLE!!!
>
> Probably more like 6000.
>
>> I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you!
>
> Potential, yes, potentially. Reality is something else.
>
>> PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE 69p a LITRE RANGE
>
> Yeahhhhh right. The government could make this happen tomorrow. They 
> won't.
>
>> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
>> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
>> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.
>
> My morrisons get its fuel from Esso.
>

spoilsport :p


> -- 
> re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion
>
> 

" dojj"  wrote in message 
news:deakb5$pkb$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...

>
> "SteveH"  wrote in message 
> news:1h1nuzo.1r2rj8k1gn5hvaN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...
>> Raymond  wrote:
>>
>>> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
>>> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
>>> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.
>>
>> Prick.
>>
>> This kind of shit is only forwarded by people who don't know how the
>> petroleum retail industry works.
>>
>> (Your starter for 10....... BP supply Morrisons)
>> -- 
> and a fair share of other supermarkets
> the fact of the matter is that the goverment makes us the most expensive 
> petrol after all the tax and shit
> if we were to buy fuel with no tax on it it's the cheapest in europe
> but because brown has overestimated the growth of the ecomony (3-3.5% 
> rather than 1.6% in reality) he's fucked and can't do what the french have 
> done by rebating the fuel duty
>
> readup on it ;)
>
>
>> Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
>> http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
>> Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
>> BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #
>
>


This wont work. I am self employed , and I need to look at every penny. I 
pass three or four petrol stations on my way out onto the motorway netwrok. 
I note the cheapest and fill up for following day on way back. Just 2p a 
litre equates to 9p a gallon. I get 30mpg average. In an average wwk I do a 
shade under 3000 miles. Thats around 100 Gallons or 900p or 9 a week if 
petrol is 2p a gallon cheaper just down the road. In a year that is 450. So 
the bottom line is that I buy wher eit is cheapest

Just today I saw a garage at 89.9p so in i went and filled up. 5 mile sdown 
the road same chain 96.9p

I spent 45 on fuel ch is 50 litres. Times that by the 7p difference and 
saving of 3.50 today.

people will carry on buying at the price they can afford.

"Big Brian"  wrote in message
news:Sp6Oe.12438$Il.3557@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...

>
> " dojj"  wrote in message
> news:deakb5$pkb$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > "SteveH"  wrote in message
> > news:1h1nuzo.1r2rj8k1gn5hvaN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...
> >> Raymond  wrote:
> >>
> >>> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
> >>> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
> >>> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.
> >>
> >> Prick.
> >>
> >> This kind of shit is only forwarded by people who don't know how the
> >> petroleum retail industry works.
> >>
> >> (Your starter for 10....... BP supply Morrisons)
> >> --


Buy at Tesco. They have an instore refinery.

Steve

The message <deas9s$9a3$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>
from "shazzbat"  contains these words:


> Buy at Tesco. They have an instore refinery.


Where they waft the smell of petrol across the road to make you want to
rush in and buy some - like coffee shops and bakeries.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

> Spot on mate. However I would like to see some alternative to the car. We 
> pollute the planet far too much at present anyhow so it would be kind of 
> good if the government would spend our petrol tax on something like a 
> decent subsidised pubic transport system.


I think we need to be putting more effort into electric vehicles.  They're 
no good for work where we drive 1000+ miles/week (nor for people like myself 
who tow a caravan), but most of our people commute in from less than 20 
miles so they'd be fine for that.  Okay, so you still need to generate 
electricity to charge them, but this can be done in a variety of ways and 
not of all which are 'dirty'.

As you said, subsidised public transport could be done (they already 
subsidise trains and planes, but not buses I'm told), but it would need 
expanding to cover a much wider area than it currently does and with more 
frequency, which of course increases fuel use, congestion and pollution...

I think the only real long-term solution is to make people work from home 
where possible, rather than having to go to a specific building.  Obviously 
this won't work for many jobs, but for sales people, etc. it is becoming a 
reality with the improvements in broadband, video conferencing, etc.

Darren

Darren Jarvis  wrote:


> I think the only real long-term solution is to make people work from home
> where possible, rather than having to go to a specific building.  Obviously
> this won't work for many jobs, but for sales people, etc. it is becoming a
> reality with the improvements in broadband, video conferencing, etc.


Now, there's an idea.

Send the CCTV coverage down my ADSL connection and give me a live link
to the tannoy, and I'd be sorted :-)
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

"Guy King"  wrote in message
news:31303030343237394309062678@zetnet.co.uk...

> The message <deas9s$9a3$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>
> from "shazzbat"  contains these words:
>
> > Buy at Tesco. They have an instore refinery.
>
> Where they waft the smell of petrol across the road to make you want to
> rush in and buy some - like coffee shops and bakeries.
>

Reminds me of an old song Guy, "In an instore refinery where God paints the
scenery".. I'll collect me coat on the way out :o(



> -- 
> Skipweasel.
> In the beginning was the word.
> And the word was Aardvark.
>
>

"Darren Jarvis"  wrote in message
news:OM6Oe.73$NT6.21@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...

> > Spot on mate. However I would like to see some alternative to the car.
We
> > pollute the planet far too much at present anyhow so it would be kind of
> > good if the government would spend our petrol tax on something like a
> > decent subsidised pubic transport system.
>
> I think we need to be putting more effort into electric vehicles.  They're
> no good for work where we drive 1000+ miles/week (nor for people like
myself
> who tow a caravan), but most of our people commute in from less than 20
> miles so they'd be fine for that.  Okay, so you still need to generate
> electricity to charge them, but this can be done in a variety of ways and
> not of all which are 'dirty'.
>
> As you said, subsidised public transport could be done (they already
> subsidise trains and planes, but not buses I'm told),


well to go by plane from norwich to newcastle-upon-tyne costs over 400,,,
by train over 75,, by car there and back 65

i know which one i prefer

aussie bongo  wrote:


> > As you said, subsidised public transport could be done (they already
> > subsidise trains and planes, but not buses I'm told),
> 
> well to go by plane from norwich to newcastle-upon-tyne costs over 400,,,
> by train over 75,, by car there and back 65
> 
> i know which one i prefer


You're looking at the wrong airlines, then.

Most internal UK flights can be got for well under 100.

In fact, the last one I looked at was 48 return from Cardiff to
Newcastle.
-- 
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 2.0 TSpark Lusso - Passat 1.8 Turbo SE -  COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

In message <6F5Oe.93517$G8.21213@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Malc 
 writes


>Spot on mate. However I would like to see some alternative to the car. We
>pollute the planet far too much at present anyhow so it would be kind of
>good if the government would spend our petrol tax on something like a decent
>subsidised pubic transport system.


Where there is enough demand to run full buses, there are already bus 
services. Where there isn't, there aren't. Further subsidies would make 
it economically viable to drive nearly empty buses round at 8 miles per 
gallon, most of them kicking filthy particulates out. I don't actually 
see how that helps the environment.

-- 
Steve Walker

"SteveH"  wrote in message
news:1h1o2up.1nh1zui1kk5olcN%steve@italiancar.co.uk...

> aussie bongo  wrote:
>
> > > As you said, subsidised public transport could be done (they already
> > > subsidise trains and planes, but not buses I'm told),
> >
> > well to go by plane from norwich to newcastle-upon-tyne costs over
400,,,
> > by train over 75,, by car there and back 65
> >
> > i know which one i prefer
>
> You're looking at the wrong airlines, then.
>
> Most internal UK flights can be got for well under 100.
>
> In fact, the last one I looked at was 48 return from Cardiff to
> Newcastle.
> --
> Steve H


the only plane from norwich to newcastle-upon-tyne goes to amsterdam first
:(

So when is drive off day?  They don't persue drive offs do they?


> Won't work. What would work is if everyone filled up their car tomorrow 
> and drove off without paying for it. That would be really funny, and cause 
> fuel prices to plummet quite quickly :)
>
> Hellraiser.............>
> 

The message <Qk7Oe.9739$jr4.9054@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk>
from "Rich"  contains these words:


> So when is drive off day?  They don't persue drive offs do they?


They do round here in Telford.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

Darren Jarvis wrote:

>> Spot on mate. However I would like to see some alternative to the
>> car. We pollute the planet far too much at present anyhow so it
>> would be kind of good if the government would spend our petrol tax
>> on something like a decent subsidised pubic transport system.
>
> I think we need to be putting more effort into electric vehicles.



Hybrids are the next generation before full electric / fuel cell / 
whatever - the Lexus RX430 is faster than the petrol version but recently 
tested at 61mpg in town.

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

SteveH wrote:

> Darren Jarvis  wrote:
>
>> I think the only real long-term solution is to make people work from
>> home where possible, rather than having to go to a specific
>> building.  Obviously this won't work for many jobs, but for sales
>> people, etc. it is becoming a reality with the improvements in
>> broadband, video conferencing, etc.
>
> Now, there's an idea.
>
> Send the CCTV coverage down my ADSL connection and give me a live link
> to the tannoy, and I'd be sorted :-)


but...


but...


but...



.... how you gonna stack them shelves?


;)


-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

aussie bongo wrote:


> well to go by plane from norwich to newcastle-upon-tyne costs over
> 400,,, by train over 75,, by car there and back 65
>
> i know which one i prefer


Plus by plane for four people is 1600, train 300, car still 65. Even if you 
took total costs of the car into consideration it's still likely to be less 
than 50p/mile, the 500 mile round trip at 250 quid is still cheaper than the 
train or plane for four people. On your own it's less of a bargain...

-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

SteveH wrote:



> Most internal UK flights can be got for well under 100.


Unless that includes aberdeen.


-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

aussie bongo wrote:

> "SteveH"  wrote in message
>>
>> You're looking at the wrong airlines, then.
>>
>> Most internal UK flights can be got for well under 100.
>>
>> In fact, the last one I looked at was 48 return from Cardiff to
>> Newcastle.
>> --
>> Steve H
>
> the only plane from norwich to newcastle-upon-tyne goes to amsterdam
> first :(


Last time I flew from Inverness to Birmingham my *luggage* went via 
Amsterdam. I didn't. :-(

Guy King wrote:

> The message <Qk7Oe.9739$jr4.9054@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk>
> from "Rich"  contains these words:
>
>> So when is drive off day?  They don't persue drive offs do they?
>
> They do round here in Telford.


heh - organise mass drive offs - everyone fills up at 12:00 and drives off 
together
-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

PC Paul wrote:


> Last time I flew from Inverness to Birmingham my *luggage* went via
> Amsterdam. I didn't. :-(


Ahh yes Inverness, INV... my colleagues luggage ended up in INN on my last 
trip (that's innsbruk... (sp))


-- 
re-configure the solar matrix in parallel for endothermic propulsion

The message 
from "Tim S Kemp"  contains these words:


> Hybrids are the next generation before full electric / fuel cell / 
> whatever - the Lexus RX430 is faster than the petrol version but recently 
> tested at 61mpg in town.


This is where electric vehicles are getting it all wrong. 

I reckon what's needed is a thing like one of those little Vauxhall
Rascal vans. 40 mile range would be more than enough, max speed of 60mph
would be fine, three rows of double seats, back two pairs removeable. In
effect, much like a miniature electric Espace. Charging time, perhaps
two hours, so if you've been out all morning going here there and
everywhere you can still get it recharged in time for the afternoon
school run[2].

The target market would be the second car/carryall area. It'd be ideal
for the school run[1], nipping up to the shops, running the dog to the
vet, that sort of thing. Most cars have far higher performance than they
need for tootling round town or to the local village. If you need
anything more, you take the other car.

[1] OK, so I know there's going to be people for whom it wouldn't be
suitable, but look at the use to which vast numbers of things like
elderly Fiestas and 205s get put and this'd be a great replacement.

[2] Actually, we don't do a school run, both kids have always walked to
school.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

In article <4308d081$0$22945$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net>, 
Raymond says...


> And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. Here's the idea:
> 
> For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two biggest
> oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.
> 

Raymond....

Obviously you've not got a clue where petrol comes from and neither has 
the fuckwit who came up with the scheme.

In order to achieve the above, you'd have to make sure you didn't buy 
any petrol that came from Shell/Esso refineries. Problem is, its not 
only Shell tankers that fill up there but Asda, Tesco, Esso, BP - all 
of the brands in the area.

So for your idea to work, nobody in the North West of England would 
have to buy any petrol from anywhere in that area for a year because it 
all comes out of Shells refinery at Stanlow.


-- 
Conor

If Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened 
rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic 
music.

In article , Hellraiser says...

> 
> "Raymond"  wrote in message 
> news:4308d081$0$22945$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...
> >
> > We are hitting 95p a litre in some areas now, soon we will be faced with
> > paying 1 a ltr.
> 
> <snip>
> 
> Won't work. What would work is if everyone filled up their car tomorrow and 
> drove off without paying for it. That would be really funny, and cause fuel 
> prices to plummet quite quickly :)
> 
> Hellraiser.............> 
> 

Yet another fuckwit who doesn't understand supply chains.

Clue dumbass - the petrol companies don't own the petrol stations.


-- 
Conor

If Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened 
rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic 
music.

In article , Tim S Kemp says...

> Guy King wrote:
> > The message <Qk7Oe.9739$jr4.9054@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk>
> > from "Rich"  contains these words:
> >
> >> So when is drive off day?  They don't persue drive offs do they?
> >
> > They do round here in Telford.
> 
> heh - organise mass drive offs - everyone fills up at 12:00 and drives off 
> together
> 

Leaving the poor bastard retailer to cop for it. The petrol companies 
will make the retailers pay for the fuel.

-- 
Conor

If Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened 
rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic 
music.

Conor (conor.turton@gmail.com) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
were saying : 


> Clue dumbass - the petrol companies don't own the petrol stations.


Actually, a lot do seem to be owned centrally by the petrol companies 
themselves.

"Darren Jarvis"  wrote in message 
news:OM6Oe.73$NT6.21@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...


> miles so they'd be fine for that.  Okay, so you still need to generate 
> electricity to charge them, but this can be done in a variety of ways and 
> not of all which are 'dirty'.
>


OK I bite: What ways are less dirty?  Nuclear energy?  What about 
transmission efficiencies?  Or just buy energy from France?


> As you said, subsidised public transport could be done (they already 
> subsidise trains and planes, but not buses I'm told), but it would need 
> expanding to cover a much wider area than it currently does and with more 
> frequency, which of course increases fuel use, congestion and pollution...
>


When are planes subsidised?  There are taxes for the privilege of taking off 
and landing called "security tax".


> I think the only real long-term solution is to make people work from home 
> where possible, rather than having to go to a specific building. 
> Obviously this won't work for many jobs, but for sales people, etc. it is 
> becoming a reality with the improvements in broadband, video conferencing, 
> etc.


Most travelling is done around cities where public transport is available 
and subsidised.  They very nature of say London encourages people to live 
away form the centre and commute in and out.  It's laughable it's cost 
effective to commute from Swindon into London.  Reduce subsidises and you 
get less commuting.  QED

Agree encourage people to move or work from home.


>
> Darren
> 

In message <4309c11c$0$24315$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
<Fred@n0spam.c0m> writes

>
>When are planes subsidised?  There are taxes for the privilege of taking off
>and landing called "security tax".
>

The duty on aviation fuel is much less than the duty on fuel for road 
vehicles. It could be said that it amounts to a subsidy.

-- 
Paul Giverin

British Jet Engine Website    http://www.britjet.co.uk

"Paul Giverin"  wrote in message 
news:qSLCjdAHRdCDFwSk@10.0.0.3...

> In message <4309c11c$0$24315$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
> <Fred@n0spam.c0m> writes
>>
>>When are planes subsidised?  There are taxes for the privilege of taking 
>>off
>>and landing called "security tax".
>>
> The duty on aviation fuel is much less than the duty on fuel for road 
> vehicles. It could be said that it amounts to a subsidy.
>
> -- 
> Paul Giverin
>
> British Jet Engine Website    http://www.britjet.co.uk


?? The duty on fuel for buses is even lower.  Trains don't pay any duty on 
fuel either.  I see there IS duty on aviation fuel though.

In message <4309e18b$0$18200$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
<Fred@n0spam.c0m> writes

>
>?? The duty on fuel for buses is even lower.


No it isn't.


>  Trains don't pay any duty on
>fuel either.


I think they do albeit a nominal amount.


>  I see there IS duty on aviation fuel though.
>
>

No there isn't.


-- 
Paul Giverin

British Jet Engine Website    http://www.britjet.co.uk

You mean 'hexorbintant' don't you?

By the way BP isn't part of the middle east oil cartel is it? So why can't 
it undercut their prices?

"Paul Giverin"  wrote in message 
news:gwjgrzAlQfCDFwQe@10.0.0.3...

> In message <4309e18b$0$18200$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
> <Fred@n0spam.c0m> writes
>>
>>?? The duty on fuel for buses is even lower.
>
> No it isn't.
>
>>  Trains don't pay any duty on
>>fuel either.
>
> I think they do albeit a nominal amount.
>
>>  I see there IS duty on aviation fuel though.
>>
>>
> No there isn't.
>
>


For internal flights - are you sure?

In message <430a1df0$0$21381$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred 
<Fred@n0spam.c0m> writes

>
>"Paul Giverin"  wrote in message
>news:gwjgrzAlQfCDFwQe@10.0.0.3...
>> In message <4309e18b$0$18200$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk>, Fred
>> <Fred@n0spam.c0m> writes
>>>
>>>?? The duty on fuel for buses is even lower.
>>
>> No it isn't.
>>
>>>  Trains don't pay any duty on
>>>fuel either.
>>
>> I think they do albeit a nominal amount.
>>
>>>  I see there IS duty on aviation fuel though.
>>>
>>>
>> No there isn't.
>>
>>
>
>For internal flights - are you sure?
>
>

Yes.

-- 
Paul Giverin

British Jet Engine Website    http://www.britjet.co.uk

>> >> So when is drive off day?  They don't persue drive offs do they?
>> >
>> > They do round here in Telford.
>>
>> heh - organise mass drive offs - everyone fills up at 12:00 and drives 
>> off
>> together
>>
> Leaving the poor bastard retailer to cop for it. The petrol companies
> will make the retailers pay for the fuel.


And after a while they'd knock it on the head, leaving the petrol companies 
with lots of fuel they can't sell :)

Hellraiser..........>

>> Won't work. What would work is if everyone filled up their car tomorrow 
>> and
>> drove off without paying for it. That would be really funny, and cause 
>> fuel
>> prices to plummet quite quickly :)
>>
>> Hellraiser.............>
>>
> Yet another fuckwit who doesn't understand supply chains.
>
> Clue dumbass - the petrol companies don't own the petrol stations.


A lorry driver calling me a fuckwit?  Least my knuckles don't catch on the 
ground when I leave the car. So, all these Esso, BP and Shell garages are 
owned by who exactly?

Hellraiser............>

"Steve Walker"  wrote in message 
news:0XybpcFptPCDFww+@otolith.demon.co.uk...

> In message <6F5Oe.93517$G8.21213@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Malc 
>  writes
>
>>Spot on mate. However I would like to see some alternative to the car. We
>>pollute the planet far too much at present anyhow so it would be kind of
>>good if the government would spend our petrol tax on something like a 
>>decent
>>subsidised pubic transport system.
>
> Where there is enough demand to run full buses, there are already bus 
> services. Where there isn't, there aren't. Further subsidies would make it 
> economically viable to drive nearly empty buses round at 8 miles per 
> gallon, most of them kicking filthy particulates out. I don't actually see 
> how that helps the environment.
>

If there were buses covering more routes at reasonable prices then more 
people would use them or trains or trams. The bus fare from my house to 
Cheltenham costs about 1.50 or there about and it's only 6 miles. Plus to 
add insult to injury, you can't get a return before 9am so most commuting is 
done at about double the cost available to shoppers.

I can't get a train to Bristol where I work, at a reasonable time, nor a bus 
either, so I have to use the car. A bus doing 8 mpg would only have to carry 
6 people to make it more cost effective than my car.

-- 
Malc

"Your mother can't climb stairs"
Dalek playground taunt

On Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:09:30 +0100, Hellraiser  
 wrote:


>
>>> Won't work. What would work is if everyone filled up their car tomorrow
>>> and
>>> drove off without paying for it. That would be really funny, and cause
>>> fuel
>>> prices to plummet quite quickly :)
>>>
>>> Hellraiser.............>
>>>
>> Yet another fuckwit who doesn't understand supply chains.
>>
>> Clue dumbass - the petrol companies don't own the petrol stations.
>
> A lorry driver calling me a fuckwit?  Least my knuckles don't catch on  
> the
> ground when I leave the car. So, all these Esso, BP and Shell garages are
> owned by who exactly?
>
> Hellraiser............>
>
>



http://www.franchisebusiness.co.uk/esso/

> OK I bite: What ways are less dirty?  Nuclear energy?  What about
> transmission efficiencies?  Or just buy energy from France?


Solar power is a clean form of generation, as are wind turbines though they 
can be noisy.  At the moment they don't put out a great deal of power and 
are expensive, but most things are (including the electric vehicles 
themselves) until demand for them kicks off...




> When are planes subsidised?  There are taxes for the privilege of taking 
> off and landing called "security tax".


YOU may have to pay taxes, but that doesn't mean the operator isn't 
subsidised.  I went for a interview as a bus driver a year or so ago and 
they told me there that buses were not subsidised like trains and planes. 
Maybe they were lying?




> Agree encourage people to move or work from home.


Such a thought would horrify the government!  Do you know how much revenue 
they'd lose if we all used our cars half as much as we do!?  As for moving, 
few jobs are 'for life' nowadays and unless you live on your own there's a 
high chance your partner/spouse/co-habitator work too (and probably 
somewhere totally different) - would you be willing to move in that 
situation?

Darren

The message 
from "Hellraiser"  contains these words:


> So, all these Esso, BP and Shell garages are 
> owned by who exactly?


Mostly they're franchises.

-- 
Skipweasel.
In the beginning was the word.
And the word was Aardvark.

"Conor"  wrote in message 
news:MPG.1d751ac2a4141ccb98a8a2@news.individual.net...

> In article , Hellraiser says...
>
>> > Clue dumbass - the petrol companies don't own the petrol stations.
>>
>> A lorry driver calling me a fuckwit?  Least my knuckles don't catch on 
>> the
>> ground when I leave the car.
>
> Neither do mine. Put my academic qualifications up against yours any
> day.


That's easily done on the net though - I'm a BSc, MSc, PhD, MCSE, CCNA, CNE, 
etc etc....


>> So, all these Esso, BP and Shell garages are
>> owned by who exactly?
>>
> Franchisees.


I always thought Shell owned their own and the rest of the companies 
franchised them?

Hellraiser.............>

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "Raymond"
 saying something like:


>Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
>Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
>i.e. boycott BP and Esso.


Ah, that clueless idea - again.
-- 

Dave
SE6a

In article , Hellraiser says...

> 
> "Conor"  wrote in message 
> news:MPG.1d751ac2a4141ccb98a8a2@news.individual.net...
> > In article , Hellraiser says...
> >
> >> > Clue dumbass - the petrol companies don't own the petrol stations.
> >>
> >> A lorry driver calling me a fuckwit?  Least my knuckles don't catch on 
> >> the
> >> ground when I leave the car.
> >
> > Neither do mine. Put my academic qualifications up against yours any
> > day.
> 
> That's easily done on the net though - I'm a BSc, MSc, PhD, MCSE, CCNA, CNE, 
> etc etc....
> 

Quite happy to provide physical proof.


> >> So, all these Esso, BP and Shell garages are
> >> owned by who exactly?
> >>
> > Franchisees.
> 
> I always thought Shell owned their own and the rest of the companies 
> franchised them?
> 

Wonder how my dads mate managed to buy the Shell one at Kirkburn from 
the previous owner who alos owned the one at Staxton....

-- 
Conor

The child is grown, the dream is gone.
I have become comfortably numb. - Pink Floyd

In article , Hellraiser says...


> > Clue dumbass - the petrol companies don't own the petrol stations.
> 
> A lorry driver calling me a fuckwit?  Least my knuckles don't catch on the 
> ground when I leave the car.


Neither do mine. Put my academic qualifications up against yours any 
day.


> So, all these Esso, BP and Shell garages are 
> owned by who exactly?
> 

Franchisees. 

-- 
Conor

The child is grown, the dream is gone.
I have become comfortably numb. - Pink Floyd

Conor wrote:

> In article <4308d081$0$22945$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net>,
> Raymond says...
>
> > And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. Here's the idea:
> >
> > For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two biggest
> > oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.
> >
> Raymond....
>
> Obviously you've not got a clue where petrol comes from and neither has
> the fuckwit who came up with the scheme.
>

It's noticeable that he hasn't replied to any of the criticism. Some
plonker in the caving club I belong to sent me one of these things a
couple of years ago. He got quite irate when I told him he was a
spamming know nothing.

-- 
Malc

And esso/BP supply only their own garages do they? - thy don't supply the 
supermarkets perhaps?

"Raymond"  wrote in message 
news:4308d081$0$22945$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...

>
> We are hitting 95p a litre in some areas now, soon we will be faced with
> paying 1 a ltr.
>
> Philip Hollsworth offered this good idea:
>
> This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy petrol on a certain day"
> campaign that was going around last April or May!
>
> The oil companies just laughed at that because they knew we wouldn't
> continue to hurt ourselves by refusing to buy petrol.
>
> It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them.
>
> BUT, whoever thought of this idea, has come up with a plan that can really
> work.
>
> Please read it and join in!
>
> Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations have conditioned us to 
> think
> that the cost of a litre is CHEAP, we need to take aggressive action to
> teach them that BUYERS control the marketplace not sellers.
>
> With the price of petrol going up more each day, we consumers need to take
> action.
>
> The only way we are going to see the price of petrol come down is if we 
> hit
> someone in the pocket by not purchasing their Petrol!
>
> And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. Here's the idea:
>
> For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two biggest
> oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.
>
> If they are not selling any petrol, they will be inclined to reduce their
> prices.
>
> If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit.
>
> But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of Esso and BP
> petrol buyers.
> It's really simple to do!!
>
> Now, don't wimp out on me at this point... keep reading and I'll explain 
> how
> simple it is to reach millions of people!!
>
> I am sending this note to a lot of people.
> If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 = 300)... and those 
> 300
> send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 = 3,000) . and so on, by the time 
> the
> message reaches the sixth generation of people, we will have reached over
> THREE MILLION consumers!
>
> If those three million get excited and pass this on to ten friends each,
> then 30 million people will have been contacted!
>
> If it goes one level further, you guessed it... .. THREE HUNDRED MILLION
> PEOPLE!!!
>
> Again, all You have to do is send this to 10 people.
> That's all.(and not buy at ESSO/BP)
>
> How long would all that take? If each of us sends this email out to ten 
> more
> people within one day of receipt, all 300 MILLION people could conceivably
> be contacted within the next 8 days!!!
>
> I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you!
>
> Acting together we can make a difference.
> If this makes sense to you, please pass this message on.
>
> PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE 69p a LITRE RANGE
>
> It's easy to make this happen.
>
> Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco,
> Sainsburys, Morrisons Jet etc.
> i.e. boycott BP and Esso.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>