Obviously the Circle Line has been suspended since the incidents on
07/07, with only Hammersmith running to Paddington.

So what does LU do with all the traincrew in situations like this (and
e.g. the Central line suspension for several days a couple of years
back). Rotate days in for driving on what is left ? All have to report
as rostered and then go home if not needed ? Arrange training /
refreshers / optional training that otherwise gets put back or put off
and missed out ?

Presumably there must have been several C69/C77 trains stranded between
Edgware Road and Aldgate between the two incidents. What have they done
with these, left them stabled in tunnels and stations (i.e. west of
Baker Street) or moved them out via the Metropolitan (assuming they are
cleared) ?

--
Nick

On 20 Jul 2005 12:40:59 -0700, "D7666"  wrote:


>Presumably there must have been several C69/C77 trains stranded between
>Edgware Road and Aldgate between the two incidents. What have they done
>with these, left them stabled in tunnels and stations (i.e. west of
>Baker Street) or moved them out via the Metropolitan (assuming they are
>cleared) ?


There are/were 3 in the sidings east of Farringdon - visible from a
passing Met train. None visible in the Circle platforms at Baker
Street.

yyOn Wed, 20 Jul 2005 22:07:09 +0100, asdf <invalid@invalid.invalid>
wrote:


>On 20 Jul 2005 12:40:59 -0700, "D7666"  wrote:
>
>>Presumably there must have been several C69/C77 trains stranded between
>>Edgware Road and Aldgate between the two incidents. What have they done
>>with these, left them stabled in tunnels and stations (i.e. west of
>>Baker Street) or moved them out via the Metropolitan (assuming they are
>>cleared) ?
>
>There are/were 3 in the sidings east of Farringdon - visible from a
>passing Met train. None visible in the Circle platforms at Baker
>Street.


If Neasden is still used for over-night stabling of C stock then that
is possibly where any "trapped" trains have gone, remaining "in bed"
until further notice. Repatriation to other locations would be
available via Harrow, Rayners Lane and the Uxbridge end of the
Piccadilly Line which was originally District Line and still
occasionally traversed by non-passenger-carrying surface stock.

> >There are/were 3 in the sidings east of Farringdon - visible from a
> >passing Met train. None visible in the Circle platforms at Baker
> >Street.



None I noted this week seen from Thameslink trains (but via City TL,
not Moorgate, so not a direct view).


> Repatriation to other locations would be
> available via Harrow, Rayners Lane and the Uxbridge end of the
> Piccadilly Line which was originally District Line



OK I forgot about that way.


--
Nick

>If Neasden is still used for over-night stabling of C stock then that
>is possibly where any "trapped" trains have gone, remaining "in bed"
>until further notice. Repatriation to other locations would be
>available via Harrow, Rayners Lane and the Uxbridge end of the
>Piccadilly Line which was originally District Line and still
>occasionally traversed by non-passenger-carrying surface stock.



I don't think Neasden has been used for C stock for a few years.
However, the sidings at Barking are now almost entirely for C stock
rather than District Line stuff, which probably makes up for it.

I did notice that there were two trains of Metropolitan A stock stuck
in the terminating platforms at Aldgate which it must be awkward to get
out of.

Impossible, I would have thought, until the line via Liverpool Street
reopens.  Aren't A-stock banned from the "bottom" side of the Circle?

M

yyOn 21 Jul 2005 05:10:25 -0700, "MIG" 
wrote:


>>If Neasden is still used for over-night stabling of C stock then that
>>is possibly where any "trapped" trains have gone, remaining "in bed"
>>until further notice. Repatriation to other locations would be
>>available via Harrow, Rayners Lane and the Uxbridge end of the
>>Piccadilly Line which was originally District Line and still
>>occasionally traversed by non-passenger-carrying surface stock.
>
>
>I don't think Neasden has been used for C stock for a few years.
>However, the sidings at Barking are now almost entirely for C stock
>rather than District Line stuff, which probably makes up for it.
>
>I did notice that there were two trains of Metropolitan A stock stuck
>in the terminating platforms at Aldgate which it must be awkward to get
>out of.

There's a list of banned/conditional routes WRT foreign stock
somewhere in the last few years of the LURS journals but IIRC A stock
could come back via the south side of the Circle Line but would need
to be "walked" through various locations, i.e. certainly not to be
done during traffic hours. I have a nasty feeling that the "banned"
part of the Circle Line might be the bit between Aldgate and Tower
Hill so if the trains cannot do a double-shuffle to reach Aldgate East
then they're stuck for the present, although that might not be much
longer.

>There's a list of banned/conditional routes WRT foreign stock
>somewhere in the last few years of the LURS journals but IIRC A stock
>could come back via the south side of the Circle Line but would need
>to be "walked" through various locations, i.e. certainly not to be
>done during traffic hours. I have a nasty feeling that the "banned"
>part of the Circle Line might be the bit between Aldgate and Tower
>Hill so if the trains cannot do a double-shuffle to reach Aldgate East
>then they're stuck for the present, although that might not be much
>longer.



While the route is cut short, they probably aren't needed anyway.  I am
wondering if, even if they could get out via Aldgate East, they could
actually be any better placed than they are when the full service
starts again.

On 21 Jul 2005 16:13:37 -0700, "MIG" 
wrote:


>>There's a list of banned/conditional routes WRT foreign stock
>>somewhere in the last few years of the LURS journals but IIRC A stock
>>could come back via the south side of the Circle Line but would need
>>to be "walked" through various locations, i.e. certainly not to be
>>done during traffic hours. I have a nasty feeling that the "banned"
>>part of the Circle Line might be the bit between Aldgate and Tower
>>Hill so if the trains cannot do a double-shuffle to reach Aldgate East
>>then they're stuck for the present, although that might not be much
>>longer.
>
>While the route is cut short, they probably aren't needed anyway.  I am
>wondering if, even if they could get out via Aldgate East, they could
>actually be any better placed than they are when the full service
>starts again.


The centre roads at Aldgate were seen to be used for overnight
stabling when I was on a salvage mission in the signal box some years
ago so if that's still going on with Met trains then moving them would
seem to be unnecessary. Another possible aspect is that if the route
to the west of Aldgate remains blocked for much longer then any
trapped A stock could double as a temporary reserve for the East
London Line.

>The centre roads at Aldgate were seen to be used for overnight
>stabling when I was on a salvage mission in the signal box some years
>ago so if that's still going on with Met trains then moving them would
>seem to be unnecessary. Another possible aspect is that if the route
>to the west of Aldgate remains blocked for much longer then any
>trapped A stock could double as a temporary reserve for the East
>London Line.



That would depend on whether they were double-ended units.  Since the
introduction of OPO, more than half the A stock units only have the
door operating equipment etc at one end and can't be run as single
units, as required on the East London Line.

"MIG"  wrote in message
news:1121947825.295792.51410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

>
> I did notice that there were two trains of Metropolitan A stock stuck
> in the terminating platforms at Aldgate which it must be awkward to get
> out of.


Not to mention the double-ended units currently stranded on the ELL, with no
way back to Neasden for maintenance. Normally some units are exchanged on a
daily basis.

Jack Taylor wrote:


> Not to mention the double-ended units currently stranded on the ELL, with no
> way back to Neasden for maintenance. Normally some units are exchanged on a
> daily basis.


I think this also applies to all C69/C77 stock except that as first
isolated west of Paddington after 07/07 as it is all based AIUI for
maintenance at Hammersmith. There are 10 C stock trains on District
workings but I think those also are Hammersmith based for anything more
than can be done at overnight berth points. They can of course get to
Ealing Common depot but I doubt they would have that much capacity to
spare.

--
Nick

D7666 wrote:


> > >There are/were 3 in the sidings east of Farringdon

> None I noted this week seen from Thameslink trains (but via City TL,
> not Moorgate, so not a direct view).


Now that I remembered to look out [from TL trains] they are there, two
trains looking like they been stopped for sometime.

--
Nick

On 31 Jul 2005 17:58:46 -0700, D7666 wrote:


> Now that I remembered to look out [from TL trains] they are there, two
> trains looking like they been stopped for sometime.


What in their appearance led you to think that?
-- 
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p9683773.html
(144 013 at Harrogate, 29 May 1999)

Chris Tolley wrote:

> 
> On 31 Jul 2005 17:58:46 -0700, D7666 wrote:
> 
> > Now that I remembered to look out [from TL trains] they are there, two
> > trains looking like they been stopped for sometime.
> 
> What in their appearance led you to think that?


Maybe it was the size of the cobwebs?

-- 
John Ray, London UK.

John Ray wrote:



> Chris Tolley wrote:
> > What in their appearance led you to think that?


> Maybe it was the size of the cobwebs?



Dried dirty rain water streaks down the front windows that would not be
there if in service as the wipers would clear it.


This is a pretty basic means used to identify whether a berthed EMU has
been moved in the last few days.


--
Nick

"D7666"  wrote

>
> Dried dirty rain water streaks down the front windows that would not be
> there if in service as the wipers would clear it.
>
> This is a pretty basic means used to identify whether a berthed EMU has
> been moved in the last few days.
>

LUL are now saying a full Hammersmith & City service tomorrow, but a few
more days before the Circle is restored. Presumably this is because of a
backlog of maintenance of trains which were stranded away from Hammersmith
depot, as track and signalling would all appear to be repaired.

Earlier this evening the BBC were saying that the Piccadilly line will be
reopened through Kings Cross on Thursday, though I can't see any
confirmation on the TfL (or BBC) websites. If true, this would seem to be
excellent work on the part of those who have been repairing the tunnel,
track and signalling.

Peter

Peter Masson wrote:


> Earlier this evening the BBC were saying that the Piccadilly line will be
> reopened through Kings Cross on Thursday, though I can't see any
> confirmation on the TfL (or BBC) websites. If true, this would seem to be
> excellent work on the part of those who have been repairing the tunnel,
> track and signalling.



Indeed good work if it be true.

But alternatively perhaps the damage was never as extensive as has been
claimed.


--
Nick

In article ,
D7666  writes

>
>Peter Masson wrote:
>
>> Earlier this evening the BBC were saying that the Piccadilly line will be
>> reopened through Kings Cross on Thursday, though I can't see any
>> confirmation on the TfL (or BBC) websites. If true, this would seem to be
>> excellent work on the part of those who have been repairing the tunnel,
>> track and signalling.
>
>
>Indeed good work if it be true.
>
>But alternatively perhaps the damage was never as extensive as has been
>claimed.
>
>
>--
>Nick
>


Where and what would the blast force damage?. Does the tube at that
location use cast iron lining rings and if it does surely the ground
behind those would absorb the blast and if it was a rucksack bomb surely
it wouldn't have done that much damage with the amount of home-made
stuff. 

Still any ex services people here who might have knocked things down for
a profession who know better?...
-- 
Tony Sayer