Well reported elsewhere, but nothing about it here, today's 17:49 departure 
from Victoria to Ramsgate and Dover will be the last ever run of a 12-CEP.

We won't be slamming for too much longer, even on SouthEastern Trains!!


-- 
Bob

Bob Wood wrote:

> Well reported elsewhere, but nothing about it here, today's 17:49 departure 
> from Victoria to Ramsgate and Dover will be the last ever run of a 12-CEP.
> 
> We won't be slamming for too much longer, even on SouthEastern Trains!!


Might be controversial to say this, but living next to the railway 
between Canterbury West and Ramsgate as I do, it'll be nice to see the 
back of the old trains - they make a lot more noise when passing the house.

-- 
Jonathan Stott
Canterbury Weather: http://www.canterburyweather.co.uk/
Reverse my e-mail address to reply by e-mail

On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 06:07:21 GMT, "Bob Wood" 
wrote:


>Well reported elsewhere, but nothing about it here, today's 17:49 departure 
>from Victoria to Ramsgate and Dover will be the last ever run of a 12-CEP.
>
>We won't be slamming for too much longer, even on SouthEastern Trains!!


Hurrahhh!! About bloody time!

oxo99@nospam.btinternet.com wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 06:07:21 GMT, "Bob Wood" 
> wrote:
> 
> 
>>Well reported elsewhere, but nothing about it here, today's 17:49 departure 
> 
>>from Victoria to Ramsgate and Dover will be the last ever run of a 12-CEP.
> 
>>We won't be slamming for too much longer, even on SouthEastern Trains!!
> 
> 
> Hurrahhh!! About bloody time!


Argh, missed the last one!

I noticed the 12 coach rake parked away in Victoria carriage shed last 
night around 1810 - presumably the 1749 was plastic or cancelled due to 
the lineside fire?

Aaaaah well, still CIGs and VEPS left on Southern.... but even they have 
been few and far between this week!

Steve M

> >>Well reported elsewhere, but nothing about it here, today's 17:49 departure
> >
> >>from Victoria to Ramsgate and Dover will be the last ever run of a 12-CEP.


SR EMU fan that I am, and done much mileage with Cep stock, before as
well as after 1980s refurbishment, it is well past the time when those
should have been withdrawn.

They are well past their sell by date, having lasted much longer than
BR ever ever planned Mk.1 vehicles to last - 40 years underframe only
with complete rebody (no refurb) at mid-life was the plan - and (I
think, without checking) 2 of the last 3 units are Phase 1 so date from
1959 and the 3rd is Phase 2 of 1961/62 build.

Electrostars rule the south east and will do so for the next three
decades.

--
Nick

D7666 wrote:


>>>>Well reported elsewhere, but nothing about it here, today's 17:49 departure
>>>
>>>>from Victoria to Ramsgate and Dover will be the last ever run of a 12-CEP.
> 
> 
> SR EMU fan that I am, and done much mileage with Cep stock, before as
> well as after 1980s refurbishment, it is well past the time when those
> should have been withdrawn.
> 
> They are well past their sell by date, having lasted much longer than
> BR ever ever planned Mk.1 vehicles to last - 40 years underframe only
> with complete rebody (no refurb) at mid-life was the plan - and (I
> think, without checking) 2 of the last 3 units are Phase 1 so date from
> 1959 and the 3rd is Phase 2 of 1961/62 build.
> 
> Electrostars rule the south east and will do so for the next three
> decades.
> 
> --
> Nick
> 


Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge fan of the Electrostars (not to mention 
their wonderful aircon) but I'd always wanted to "do" the last CEP run 
as a farewell to the old order. I managed a ride a couple of weeks ago 
from Vic to Bromley South though, so that'll have to do me.

Another load of Southern slammer diagrams are being culled from Monday. 
Does anyone know when the last passenger runs will be on both SC and SET?

Cheers,

Steve M

"Steve M"  wrote

> >
> >>Well reported elsewhere, but nothing about it here, today's 17:49
departure
> >
> >>from Victoria to Ramsgate and Dover will be the last ever run of a
12-CEP.
> >
> >>We won't be slamming for too much longer, even on SouthEastern Trains!!
> >
> >
> > Hurrahhh!! About bloody time!
>
> Argh, missed the last one!
>

Saw it running through Longfield, on time and under clear signals. Over 46
years since they started running Victoria - Ramsgate/Dover.

Peter

Peter Masson wrote:


>>>>We won't be slamming for too much longer, even on SouthEastern Trains!!

> Saw it running through Longfield, on time and under clear signals. Over 46
> years since they started running Victoria - Ramsgate/Dover.


SET are still running a fair amount of slam-door stock - about 1/3rd of 
trains past my house this evening have been slam-doors (just east of 
Canterbury West).

They are noticable by their rather feeble-sounding horn (as I live near 
a whistle board) - the new trains' horns can be heard from several miles 
away.

-- 
Jonathan Stott
Canterbury Weather: http://www.canterburyweather.co.uk/
Reverse my e-mail address to reply by e-mail

"Jonathan Stott"  wrote

>
> SET are still running a fair amount of slam-door stock - about 1/3rd of
> trains past my house this evening have been slam-doors (just east of
> Canterbury West).
>

They still have quite a few 423s (VEPs). AIUI all their 375s and 376s have
been delivered, but the 465s released by the 376s have gone away to be
'refreshed' (including provision of first class sections). When these come
back they are put on mid-distance services (Charing Cross -
Ashford/Tunbridge Wells, and Victoria - Maidstone/Ashford/Faversham). When
they're all back the last of the slammers will go, but this may not be
before September. It's likely that SET will be the last TOC to operate
slam-door emus, apart from the two on SWT's Lymington - Brockenhurst.

Peter

Peter Masson wrote:

> "Jonathan Stott"  wrote
>>SET are still running a fair amount of slam-door stock - about 1/3rd of
>>trains past my house this evening have been slam-doors (just east of
>>Canterbury West).
> They still have quite a few 423s (VEPs). AIUI all their 375s and 376s have
> been delivered, but the 465s released by the 376s have gone away to be
> 'refreshed' (including provision of first class sections). When these come
> back they are put on mid-distance services (Charing Cross -
> Ashford/Tunbridge Wells, and Victoria - Maidstone/Ashford/Faversham). When
> they're all back the last of the slammers will go, but this may not be
> before September. It's likely that SET will be the last TOC to operate
> slam-door emus, apart from the two on SWT's Lymington - Brockenhurst.


There has been some station work on the Canterbury West line to make the 
stations able to accommodate class 376 stock - they are working at 
Canterbury West this month (not been there for a few weeks) on the 
platforms. Don't know if this has anything to do with the still large 
proportion of slammers on this line.

-- 
Jonathan Stott
Canterbury Weather: http://www.canterburyweather.co.uk/
Reverse my e-mail address to reply by e-mail

"Jonathan Stott"  wrote

>
> There has been some station work on the Canterbury West line to make the
> stations able to accommodate class 376 stock - they are working at
> Canterbury West this month (not been there for a few weeks) on the
> platforms. Don't know if this has anything to do with the still large
> proportion of slammers on this line.
>

It'll be 375s down there, not the suburban 376s. I don't know about the
Ashford - Ramsgate line, but some platfroms have been extended between
Otford, Maidstone East and Ashford to take 6 cars - 465+466.

Peter

In news:dbkukr$ik6$1@oheron.kent.ac.uk,
Jonathan Stott  typed:


>  it'll be nice to see the
> back of the old trains - they make a lot more noise when passing the
> house.


And later:


> They are noticable by their rather feeble-sounding horn (as I live
> near a whistle board) - the new trains' horns can be heard from
> several miles away.



mmmm!



-- 
Bob

In news:dbmfvs$lu4$1@oheron.kent.ac.uk,
Jonathan Stott  typed:


> There has been some station work on the Canterbury West line to make
> the stations able to accommodate class 376 stock - they are working at
> Canterbury West this month (not been there for a few weeks) on the
> platforms.


376 is suburban stock and is not due to come even as far as Ashford, 
although I am sure that some will 'escape' as far as there from time to 
time.  The refurbished Networkers  -  465/9s  -  are due to run to Ashford 
and therefore it is safe to presume that they will in turn occasionally 
'escape' to Canterbury West and possibly Ramsgate.  However 376 stock has 
the same outline as 375 stock which already goes through Canterbury; 465 
stock has the same outline as the 365 which used to go through Canterbury 
before it moved north, so Canterbury West should already be able to 
accommodate both  -  and length would be no problem either.

I'm left wondering what it is that they are doing at Canterbury West 
therefore.



-- 
Bob

In news:3k7kefFt92ajU1@individual.net,
Steve M  typed:



> Argh, missed the last one!
>
> I noticed the 12 coach rake parked away in Victoria carriage shed last
> night around 1810 - presumably the 1749 was plastic or cancelled due
> to the lineside fire?
>
> Aaaaah well, still CIGs and VEPS left on Southern.... but even they
> have been few and far between this week!



Lineside fires affected the service on both Monday and Tuesday.  It would 
have been Monday when you saw the rake in the carriage shed.  The 17:49 was 
cancelled and the 12-CEP finally made it back to Ramsgate on the 00:03 from 
Victoria.

Tuesday, the train left on time but another lineside fire caused it to be 50 
minutes late on the later parts of its journey.

My note to the group has been interpreted as the complete end of the CEPs. 
In fact, two  of the units have another two days to go (mmm, 1 now!!). 
Today, and presumably tomorrow, the 06:12 from Ramsgate and the 17:49 return 
was/will be formed 8CEP+4VEP.

But tomorrow is the end for the CEPs.  And the VEPs probably have less than 
two months left.  With all of the new stock now delivered, it will 
interesting to see how they manage to stretch it around all of the services 
now covered by these units that people seem so keen to see the back of. 
Cancelled trains?  Short-formed trains?   We'll see!





-- 
Bob

Bob Wood wrote:

> In news:dbmfvs$lu4$1@oheron.kent.ac.uk,
> Jonathan Stott  typed:
>
> > There has been some station work on the Canterbury West line to make
> > the stations able to accommodate class 376 stock - they are working at
> > Canterbury West this month (not been there for a few weeks) on the
> > platforms.
>
> 376 is suburban stock and is not due to come even as far as Ashford,
> although I am sure that some will 'escape' as far as there from time to
> time.  The refurbished Networkers  -  465/9s  -  are due to run to Ashford
> and therefore it is safe to presume that they will in turn occasionally
> 'escape' to Canterbury West and possibly Ramsgate.  However 376 stock has
> the same outline as 375 stock which already goes through Canterbury; 465
> stock has the same outline as the 365 which used to go through Canterbury
> before it moved north, so Canterbury West should already be able to
> accommodate both  -  and length would be no problem either.
>
> I'm left wondering what it is that they are doing at Canterbury West
> therefore.



I am wondering if we are waiting for all the 465/9s to be delivered
before they move out to replace the remaining slam-door stock.

I have seen trains of two 465/9s coupled to a regular 466 on what I
think are peak services from Tunbridge Wells to Charing Cross.  This is
equivalent to when they used to use a 2 EPB to extend the Tunbridge
Wells trains to ten coaches (after the 2 HAPs were made into 4 CAPs and
there were no posh twos).

But in the meantime, I've seen regular Networkers going to Ashford
(which they had been doing already) and also 465/9s on regular
Networker duties, ie stopping services to Sevenoaks and Hayes.  People
haven't been squeamish about using the supposedly first class areas.

In other words, they aren't doing much that Networkers weren't already
doing.

"Bob Wood"  wrote in message 
news:PRIDe.5666$jo3.482@newsfe5-win.ntli.net...

>
> My note to the group has been interpreted as the complete end of the CEPs. 
> In fact, two  of the units have another two days to go (mmm, 1 now!!). 
> Today, and presumably tomorrow, the 06:12 from Ramsgate and the 17:49 
> return was/will be formed 8CEP+4VEP.
>
> But tomorrow is the end for the CEPs.  And the VEPs probably have less 
> than two months left.  With all of the new stock now delivered, it will 
> interesting to see how they manage to stretch it around all of the 
> services now covered by these units that people seem so keen to see the 
> back of. Cancelled trains?  Short-formed trains?   We'll see!
>
> -- 
> Bob


The 17.49 was indeed 4VEP + 8CEP tonight - the VEP was leading, 1699 in the 
middle and 1697 at the rear.  1697 will therefore have worked to Dover.

If the rear unit is a CEP again tomorrow, then the Dover portion will be the 
last CEP in traffic as it takes longer to get there than for the front 
portion to reach Broadstairs.

I *think* that the Dover portion subsequently works Dover - Ramsgate in 
service - anyone know if that's right and which train? 20.15?

Stuart

On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 08:32:22, Jonathan Stott  wrote:

>
>Might be controversial to say this, but living next to the railway 
>between Canterbury West and Ramsgate as I do, it'll be nice to see the 
>back of the old trains - they make a lot more noise when passing the house.


Perhaps if there was a "W" board near your house, you might be saying
the reverse (because of the Electrostar horns)!

Paul Harley

-- 
Remove "eeek" to contact me!

Bob Wood wrote:


> 
> But tomorrow is the end for the CEPs.  And the VEPs probably have less than 
> two months left.  With all of the new stock now delivered, it will 
> interesting to see how they manage to stretch it around all of the services 
> now covered by these units that people seem so keen to see the back of. 
> Cancelled trains?  Short-formed trains?   We'll see!
> 


Thanks Bob! We'll squeeze in a trip to Bromley South tomorrow evening 
before we pub crawl the 14 and 22 bus routes - it's the end of 
Routemaster operation on these tomorrow, leaving only the 13, 38 and 159.

Cheers,

Steve M

In news:oLRDe.9663$Fx3.9352@newsfe7-gui.ntli.net,
Stuart Pearce  typed:


> The 17.49 was indeed 4VEP + 8CEP tonight - the VEP was leading, 1699
> in the middle and 1697 at the rear.  1697 will therefore have worked
> to Dover.
> If the rear unit is a CEP again tomorrow, then the Dover portion will
> be the last CEP in traffic as it takes longer to get there than for
> the front portion to reach Broadstairs.
>
> I *think* that the Dover portion subsequently works Dover - Ramsgate
> in service - anyone know if that's right and which train? 20.15?


You have it exactly correct, Stuart.  20:15 from Dover Priory, arrives 
Ramsgate 20:59 having reversed at Minster.

I travelled from Victoria to Broadstairs on the 17:49 on Wednesday night, 
then did a three-train shuffle to get to Deal in time to intercept 1698 on 
the Dover-Ramsgate so i could return to Ramsgate on it.

Thursday night, the dogs just happened to want to go for a walk just  around 
20:30  -  so I took them to Ramsgate for their last ride on a CEP.

Tonight (Friday) is still in the planning.



-- 
Bob

In news:3kagdcFt8alnU1@individual.net,
Steve M  typed:


> Thanks Bob! We'll squeeze in a trip to Bromley South tomorrow evening
> before we pub crawl the 14 and 22 bus routes - it's the end of
> Routemaster operation on these tomorrow, leaving only the 13, 38 and
> 159.


Yes, I found about the 14 and 22 just a couple of hours ago  -  and the fact 
that there will be a lot of 'celebrity' buses out as well.  I had really 
planned to get some work done tomorrow and only intended to ride the last 
CEPS from Faversham at the most.  Now another Pricebusting trip up to London 
beckons.

Decisions, decisions!!


-- 
Bob

With all of the new stock now delivered, it will

> interesting to see how they manage to stretch it around all of the services 
> now covered by these units that people seem so keen to see the back of. 
> Cancelled trains?  Short-formed trains?   We'll see!
> 

Lots of both now on Southern and Thamelink.

Henry Law

"Stuart Pearce"  wrote

>
> If the rear unit is a CEP again tomorrow, then the Dover portion will be
the
> last CEP in traffic as it takes longer to get there than for the front
> portion to reach Broadstairs.
>

Friday evening it was 8CEP+4VEP, i.e. with the VEP trailing and running to
Dover, and the CEPs going to Broadstairs. Again on time and under clear
signals at Longfield.

Peter

>Lineside fires affected the service on both Monday and Tuesday.  It would
>have been Monday when you saw the rake in the carriage shed.  The 17:49 was
>cancelled and the 12-CEP finally made it back to Ramsgate on the 00:03 from
>Victoria.
>
>Tuesday, the train left on time but another lineside fire caused it to be 50
>minutes late on the later parts of its journey.
>
>My note to the group has been interpreted as the complete end of the CEPs.
>In fact, two  of the units have another two days to go (mmm, 1½ now!!).
>Today, and presumably tomorrow, the 06:12 from Ramsgate and the 17:49 return
>was/will be formed 8CEP.
>
>But tomorrow is the end for the CEPs.  And the VEPs probably have less than
>two months left.  With all of the new stock now delivered, it will
>interesting to see how they manage to stretch it around all of the services
>now covered by these units that people seem so keen to see the back of.
>Cancelled trains?  Short-formed trains?   We'll see!



Any more news on the end of the CEPs?  It's odd that they have been
kept in service longer than the fifteen years younger CIGs.  I thought
they had all gone, but on 18 August I saw one heading empty for Cannon
Street via Blackfriars coupled to two VEPs.

It would have arrived at Cannon Street between 1745 and 1750, perhaps
to become the 1804 to Ashford via Tonbridge (CEP at rear).  Can anyone
confirm?

On 19 Aug 2005 02:20:20 -0700, "MIG" 
wrote:


>Any more news on the end of the CEPs?  It's odd that they have been
>kept in service longer than the fifteen years younger CIGs.  I thought
>they had all gone, but on 18 August I saw one heading empty for Cannon
>Street via Blackfriars coupled to two VEPs.


They *had* all gone, but recently SET suddenly realised they'd
scrapped too many VEPs to be able to provide a full service, so the
one remaining CEP they had still lying around has been brought back
into service.


>It would have arrived at Cannon Street between 1745 and 1750, perhaps
>to become the 1804 to Ashford via Tonbridge (CEP at rear).  Can anyone
>confirm?


I believe it currently works the 0638 Ashford to Cannon Street and
1804 return, so you would be correct.

>They *had* all gone, but recently SET suddenly realised they'd
>scrapped too many VEPs to be able to provide a full service, so the
>one remaining CEP they had still lying around has been brought back
>into service.
>
>>It would have arrived at Cannon Street between 1745 and 1750, perhaps
>>to become the 1804 to Ashford via Tonbridge (CEP at rear).  Can anyone
>>confirm?
>
>I believe it currently works the 0638 Ashford to Cannon Street and
>1804 return, so you would be correct.



Something about the colour made me think it was one that had been on
SWT.  Is this correct?  Didn't see the number.

"MIG"  wrote in message 
news:1124444483.407061.144110@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

> >They *had* all gone, but recently SET suddenly realised they'd
>>scrapped too many VEPs to be able to provide a full service, so the
>>one remaining CEP they had still lying around has been brought back
>>into service.
>>
>>>It would have arrived at Cannon Street between 1745 and 1750, perhaps
>>>to become the 1804 to Ashford via Tonbridge (CEP at rear).  Can anyone
>>>confirm?
>>
>>I believe it currently works the 0638 Ashford to Cannon Street and
>>1804 return, so you would be correct.
>
>
> Something about the colour made me think it was one that had been on
> SWT.  Is this correct?  Didn't see the number.
>


What 'special duties only' is the single SWT 4VEP (3417) going to be used 
for, shown at
http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/SWTrains/TravelInformation/Our+trains.htm
The 2 refurbished 3-CIG are presumably adequate for the Lymington Branch.

Paul

"MIG"  wrote in message
news:1124444483.407061.144110@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

>
> Something about the colour made me think it was one that had been on
> SWT.  Is this correct?  Didn't see the number.


That would be correct. 1697/8/9 (the last three) were ex-SWT and fitted with
Mark 6 motor bogies (ex-REP IIRC). 1698 is the sole survivor and is expected
to take part in "The Southern Belle" railtour on 17th September, together
with a CIG and a VEP.

Route:- Ramsgate(05.58) - Deal (p/u) Dover Priory (06.23) - Ashford (06.58)
Maidstone East (07.18) - Bromley South (07.45) - Waterloo (08.15/0825) -
Then via Arun Valley to Southampton - Bournemouth and Weymouth (approx 1
hour) - Bournemouth - Southampton - Woking - Clapham Jn (18.06) - Fast run
via Chatham to Ramsgate (19.30)

Bookings to be sent to Southern Electric Group Railtours, St Annes, East
Hill Road, Otford, Kent, TN15 6YB.   Cheques payable to Southern Electric
Group. All Profits for this tour will go to Kent Air Ambulance, Railway
Children and SEG.

As said elsewhere, it is an ex-SWT set. Rumours I have heard indicate
that the CEP will finish on 3 September. Once the Dover - Folkestone
blockade is lifted that weekend, SET will require fewer units (as short
shuttles use more units than longer distance workings).

For the photographers, you can get a very good shot of this train
leaving Cannon Street from the adjoining Southwark Bridge. The unit
runs ECS from Grove Park depot to Cannon Street reversing at
Blackfriars sidings at about 1730 (visible from Blackfriars Bridge) so
if it remains at the "country" end leaving Cannon Street, it should
also be photographable while reversing at Blackfriars sidings (you need
to be at the south end of the bridge and not the station end) and you
can then walk to Southwark Bridge and get a shot of it at Cannon Street!